Should i watch 'Crash' the movie on Sky box office?

Getting a kick out of the posts so far. I didn't think Crash was all that great. A good one time watcher, but not this "great" movie it's been hyped up to be. The racism in the movie is sooo Hollywoodish and a typical story line for numerous major actors in one film. Enjoy it for what it is, but don't expect to leave the movie feeling any smarter onthe issue. , , ,it's NOT what I would call a deep story line, as all the hype would lead you to believe.

JHC

68 Pontiac wrote: Getting a kick out of the posts so far. I didn't think Crash was all that great. A good one time watcher, but not this "great" movie it's been hyped up to be. The racism in the movie is sooo Hollywoodish and a typical story line for numerous major actors in one film. Enjoy it for what it is, but don't expect to leave the movie feeling any smarter onthe issue. , , ,it's NOT what I would call a deep story line, as all the hype would lead you to believe.

JHC

what a relief to read a post from a person who disagrees with my take on the film but who doesn't hurl personal abuse like a three-year-old.

AgentWood wrote: what a relief to read a post from a person who disagrees with my take on the film but who doesn't hurl personal abuse like a three-year-old.

I do think that was the idea of the film. Get a decent storyline, place a topic that is easily argumentative as racism, and hype it up alot.The people thatlove the movie can talk as if they are experts on the "problem in the US with racism", and the people that don't care for the movie seem ignorant. Sincemost people have no desire to want to seem ignorant, many jump on the bandwagon, just to "fit in".

I'm not insulting anyone, but I think this was the marketing ploy for the movie. If so, well, it worked as it got a bunch of oscars.

JHC

Damn you Johnny, look what you've started ........... not another NOOL drama

I'm. Sooo. In. Love. With. This. Place.

68 Pontiac wrote:

AgentWood wrote: what a relief to read a post from a person who disagrees with my take on the film but who doesn't hurl personal abuse like a three-year-old.

I do think that was the idea of the film. Get a decent storyline, place a topic that is easily argumentative as racism, and hype it up alot.The people thatlove the movie can talk as if they are experts on the "problem in the US with racism", and the people that don't care for the movie seem ignorant. Sincemost people have no desire to want to seem ignorant, many jump on the bandwagon, just to "fit in".

I'm not insulting anyone, but I think this was the marketing ploy for the movie. If so, well, it worked as it got a bunch of oscars.

JHC

i just happened to like the film and thought it said a lot about racism in the US. granted, it's no 'do the right thing,' but i was moved by the film. i'm not an expert on racism in the US and i don't claim to be. i only know about the experiences i've had and what i've seen living in american cities. but to be told that i'm not thinking because i do like the film is no different than if i were to tell you that you were ignorant for disliking the film. if you didn't like it, that's fine. film is subjective, anyway. and that's an interesting point about marketing of the film.

however, if you like it or don't is immaterial. my problem is with the childish personal attacks and the 'only in america (would this film do well)' parroting bullshit.

AgentWood wrote:

he shot him because he thought the other guy was pulling a gun out of his pocket.

i realised that.

Al Jarvis wrote:

AgentWood wrote: as far as some of the incidents coming out of 'leftfield' perhaps that's part of what makes the film so 'american.' most americans who have seen it knew what was going to happen ages before it actually did. particularly the incident with the st. christopher statue. it was a disaster waiting to happen. and, yes, we are still dealing with race relations every day.

Er, I've seen the film. I think ANYONE who's seen the film knows that the young cop is gonna shoot the lad who's reaching for the St Christopher. Even the studio audience have no idea he's reaching for a statue and the whole thing is geared towards him supposedly reaching for a gun.

i disagree. everyone i've spoken to who have seen the film here in the states knew that he was going to reach for his statue, not a gun (because of the back story with the young man putting the statue on the car he helped hijack). but the young cop, falling for his own prejudices, jumped the gun (excuse the pun) and shot him.

when i saw the film, the second he got in the cop's car i knew something was going to happen. perhaps that's a flaw in the film (lack of surprise) or perhaps it's because in this country we're taught that cops in america and black people do not get along. i don't know.

AgentWood wrote: and martin, are you capable of constructive criticism and civilized discourse, or do you just appreciate hurling personal abuse at others whom you disagree with? ?

i have noticed that too.Fradley seems to like turning any argument personal and attacking the person he is arguing with instead of arguing the point

(The Good Doctor) Martin Fradley wrote:

AgentWood wrote: i bought it on DVD. it's fantastic--a very realistic testimony about race relations in modern-day america.

As opposed to glib, neo-liberal tripe which allows people to get their racists kicks and then gently disavow them 'cos, hey, everyones racist anyway, right?

Arse.

On the button, Doctor, on the button. It's about as edgy as a circle. Hollywood does racism and says ......it's bad.

The deafening silence from so many "liberal" posters on the racism which has been a feature of a few repugnant threads/posts on NOOL is far more interesting. So quick to sing the praises of a safe-as-fuck film, so slow to shout down retarded racits. Stand up and be counted for once.

GlasVegas wrote:

(The Good Doctor) Martin Fradley wrote:

AgentWood wrote: i bought it on DVD. it's fantastic--a very realistic testimony about race relations in modern-day america.

As opposed to glib, neo-liberal tripe which allows people to get their racists kicks and then gently disavow them 'cos, hey, everyones racist anyway, right?

Arse.

On the button, Doctor, on the button. It's about as edgy as a circle. Hollywood does racism and says ......it's bad.

The deafening silence from so many "liberal" posters on the racism which has been a feature of a few repugnant threads/posts on NOOL is far more interesting. So quick to sing the praises of a safe-as-fuck film, so slow to shout down retarded racits. Stand up and be counted for once.

i don't know what you are on about. we've had plenty of threads discussing racism where i and others have made our views known. you want my view again ok racism = bad.

Ronald Kirsch wrote:

GlasVegas wrote:

(The Good Doctor) Martin Fradley wrote:

AgentWood wrote: i bought it on DVD. it's fantastic--a very realistic testimony about race relations in modern-day america.

As opposed to glib, neo-liberal tripe which allows people to get their racists kicks and then gently disavow them 'cos, hey, everyones racist anyway, right?

Arse.

On the button, Doctor, on the button. It's about as edgy as a circle. Hollywood does racism and says ......it's bad.

The deafening silence from so many "liberal" posters on the racism which has been a feature of a few repugnant threads/posts on NOOL is far more interesting. So quick to sing the praises of a safe-as-fuck film, so slow to shout down retarded racits. Stand up and be counted for once.

i don't know what you are on about. we've had plenty of threads discussing racism where i and others have made our views known. you want my view again ok racism = bad.

Point missed completely. You sure you're not American?

GlasVegas wrote:

Ronald Kirsch wrote:

GlasVegas wrote:

(The Good Doctor) Martin Fradley wrote:

AgentWood wrote: i bought it on DVD. it's fantastic--a very realistic testimony about race relations in modern-day america.

As opposed to glib, neo-liberal tripe which allows people to get their racists kicks and then gently disavow them 'cos, hey, everyones racist anyway, right?

Arse.

On the button, Doctor, on the button. It's about as edgy as a circle. Hollywood does racism and says ......it's bad.

The deafening silence from so many "liberal" posters on the racism which has been a feature of a few repugnant threads/posts on NOOL is far more interesting. So quick to sing the praises of a safe-as-fuck film, so slow to shout down retarded racits. Stand up and be counted for once.

i don't know what you are on about. we've had plenty of threads discussing racism where i and others have made our views known. you want my view again ok racism = bad.

Point missed completely. You sure you're not American?

well if you must know, due to my cofused heritage i have give an affirmative answer to that.

Cruella wrote: Damn you Johnny, look what you've started ........... not another NOOL drama

:

yeah i better go and hide in my shed till it's all blown over (the argument i mean, not my shed)

GlasVegas wrote:

(The Good Doctor) Martin Fradley wrote:

AgentWood wrote: i bought it on DVD. it's fantastic.

--glib, neo-liberal tripe right. Arse.

button..it's bad.-- retarded racits. Stand up and be counted for once.

edit to shorten sorry. not sure of the heirarchy of liberaL- conservative posters :winkwinknudgenudge: but maybe the thinned out-thread contributers may also be due to Community 2 and that some may have noticed a thread about a movie not seen. and kept it simply at face -value.

simple. watch Crash on Sky box-office. fun to watch.

this make a movie, call it politically whatever you want to-& see if the masses get talking- connection...may work sometimes. but here- well made movie or not. would just rather pure entertainment.

no thanks, not going to get cranked up. has anyone else seen a different angle to this scenario with the almost visceraL hard- edge + irony in 1999' s Fight Club. and the better made The Game from a couple years earlier. of we can't do it on the streets so we'll do it in the cinema.

68 Pontiac wrote:

AgentWood wrote: .

the marketing ploy for the movie. worked. JHC

also see that this a couple of hours --ago.

GlasVegas wrote:

On the button, Doctor, on the button. It's about as edgy as a circle. Hollywood does racism and says ......it's bad.

The deafening silence from so many "liberal" posters on the racism which has been a feature of a few repugnant threads/posts on NOOL is far more interesting. So quick to sing the praises of a safe-as-fuck film, so slow to shout down retarded racits. Stand up and be counted for once.

Who did Mississippi Burning or Schindler's List or The Killing Fields if it wasnt 'Hollywood'? Those are just films I've seen that pricked my conscience, there are plenty of others in which racism is a recurring theme.

You're in the wrong place if you want people to be shouted down. If I were to stand up and talk about racism, I'd probably say the worst I have experienced was ten years living up your way with an English accent!

Er, can't we all just get along here?

Steve Lea wrote:

GlasVegas wrote:

On the button, Doctor, on the button. It's about as edgy as a circle. Hollywood does racism and says ......it's bad.

The deafening silence from so many "liberal" posters on the racism which has been a feature of a few repugnant threads/posts on NOOL is far more interesting. So quick to sing the praises of a safe-as-fuck film, so slow to shout down retarded racits. Stand up and be counted for once.

Who did Mississippi Burning or Schindler's List or The Killing Fields if it wasnt 'Hollywood'? Those are just films I've seen that pricked my conscience, there are plenty of others in which racism is a recurring theme.

lets not forget to kill a mockingbird. i have that on dvd. that story deeply affected me when we studied it at school, and then saw the film.

Ronald Kirsch wrote:

lets not forget to kill a mockingbird. i have that on dvd. that story deeply affected me when we studied it at school, and then saw the film.

Harper Lee did a fabulous job writing that book, and the movie with Gregory Peck was excellent. I give To Kill a Mockingbird an A+.

"Who did Mississippi Burning or Schindler's List or The Killing Fields if it wasnt 'Hollywood'? and lets not forget to kill a mockingbird"

Quite honestly, don't see how any of these movies are related to Crash???

"Mississippi Burning": Based on true events (but severly misrepresented and historically changed by Hollywood)

"Schindler's List: Again based on true events.

Kill a Mockingbird": taken from a novel thathad acclaim way before made into a movie.

All these were not Hollywood stories, Crash is. A timeless novel and extrodinary true events are of course going to do well, Hollywood may have adapted them, but they are NOT Hollywood originals. Crash is written and produced by Hollywood and thus the reasoning that it has been said that Crash full of Hollywoodism.

I'm not against anyone here, simply noticing that these were weak arguements.

JHC

Let's all have a heated debate!!!!!

68 Pontiac wrote: "Who did Mississippi Burning or Schindler's List or The Killing Fields if it wasnt 'Hollywood'? and lets not forget to kill a mockingbird"

Quite honestly, don't see how any of these movies are related to Crash???

"Mississippi Burning": Based on true events (but severly misrepresented and historically changed by Hollywood)

"Schindler's List: Again based on true events.

Kill a Mockingbird": taken from a novel thathad acclaim way before made into a movie.

All these were not Hollywood stories, Crash is. A timeless novel and extrodinary true events are of course going to do well, Hollywood may have adapted them, but they are NOT Hollywood originals. Crash is written and produced by Hollywood and thus the reasoning that it has been said that Crash full of Hollywoodism.

I'm not against anyone here, simply noticing that these were weak arguements.

JHC

The thread sidetracked to racism Hollywood style, and on that basis there is a clear link between the films mentioned. I havent seen the film to comment on how twee the racism portrayed in Crash is. Whether its an excuse to bang a drum or not I dont really care. Mississippi Burning is a strongly dramatised version of events, thats the kindest you can say about it. Schindler's Ark was only written because Thomas Keneally bumped into Pfefferburg in his shop in Beverley Hills! How Spielberged the end product was is just opinion, but you cant tell me its not been 'Hollywooded'. Its a fantastic film to me. Whether they were Hollywood originals or not wasnt the point.

And on a more positive note of equality...

AgentWood wrote: and martin, are you capable of constructive criticism and civilized discourse, or do you just appreciate hurling personal abuse at others whom you disagree with? is this how you treat your students when you show them sliver or robocop and they bring up alternate viewpoints?

There hasn't been any "personal abuse". Yet. Your line is that "Crash" is an incisive and accurate depiction of the state of play as regards race relations in America today, which is (a) how it was promoted and (b) why it won the Oscar. I'm still waiting to hear what your black friend (and that's BLACK friend, everyone) thought of it. Presumably that will be the final nail in my little coffin, eh?

On the other hand, "Crash" seems to me to be little more than slick-but-glib "why-can't-we'all-get-along?" waffle of the most insidious order. Living in North Staffs, I can't say I have any great insight into "race" in America; I do know a movie with dubious ideological undercurrents, though. Like Allen says, it's my job.

I don't think you're thinking, and what I think is especially dodgy about said film is that it doesn't require you to think much either: not challenging, just reassuring. Why confont your own racism when (so "Crash" claims) everyone else's prejudices are just as deeply anbd casually entrenched?

I use the word "fuck" as a matter of course, so nothing to get upset about there. Try being less sensitive. The film's a bit rubbish, that's all. No need to get your knickers in a twist. Speaking to a colleague who spend a lot of time in the States the other week - she was saying that a lot of her black colleagues on t'other side of the pond also rate "Crash" highly, which tells you little more than that no (wo)man is an island. Even BLACK ones.

Oh, and my students disagree with me all the time. That's the nature of the job. They're usually a whole lot more critically astute than you, mind.

Al Jarvis wrote:

AgentWood wrote: and martin, are you capable of constructive criticism and civilized discourse, or do you just appreciate hurling personal abuse at others whom you disagree with? is this how you treat your students when you show them sliver or robocop and they bring up alternate viewpoints?

Now, now, Christy. Pot. Kettle. Think about the 'personal abuse' you've dished out when people disagree with you.

Some of your arguments here in the past have bordered on the final lynchpin of 'you've studied stuff so you're right', well what does/did Fradders do for a living?! He's a bit of film expert isn't he, just check out his signature on this forum.

And as for him agreeing or disagreeing with any students, his are at least of an age where they can answer him back. Yours are not.

al, i'd think about your own responses on this site if i were you. yes, he is a film instructor, but that's no reason to be personally abusive (we can go into what happened last summer, but that's not going to help matters). and for the record, i encourage dissent in my classroom. i'm not there to teach students what to think but how to learn to think for themselves.

You know what i did last summer??? Er, I don't!! You'll have to remind me. And that's a great line about "encouraging dissent": did you spin that at the interview??!!??

Hey! Teacher!!! Leave them kids alone!!!!!!!!

(The Good Doctor) Martin Fradley wrote:

AgentWood wrote: and martin, are you capable of constructive criticism and civilized discourse, or do you just appreciate hurling personal abuse at others whom you disagree with? is this how you treat your students when you show them sliver or robocop and they bring up alternate viewpoints?

There hasn't been any "personal abuse". Yet. Your line is that "Crash" is an incisive and accurate depiction of the state of play as regards race relations in America today, which is (a) how it was promoted and (b) why it won the Oscar. I'm still waiting to hear what your black friend (and that's BLACK friend, everyone) thought of it. Presumably that will be the final nail in my little coffin, eh?

On the other hand, "Crash" seems to me to be little more than slick-but-glib "why-can't-we'all-get-along?" waffle of the most insidious order. Living in North Staffs, I can't say I have any great insight into "race" in America; I do know a movie with dubious ideological undercurrents, though. Like Allen says, it's my job.

I don't think you're thinking, and what I think is especially dodgy about said film is that it doesn't require you to think much either: not challenging, just reassuring. Why confont your own racism when (so "Crash" claims) everyone else's prejudices are just as deeply anbd casually entrenched?

I use the word "fuck" as a matter of course, so nothing to get upset about there. Try being less sensitive. The film's a bit rubbish, that's all. No need to get your knickers in a twist. Speaking to a colleague who spend a lot of time in the States the other week - she was saying that a lot of her black colleagues on t'other side of the pond also rate "Crash" highly, which tells you little more than that no (wo)man is an island. Even BLACK ones.

Oh, and my students disagree with me all the time. That's the nature of the job. They're usually a whole lot more critically astute than you, mind.

martin, if you don't like the film, that's your prerogative. but berating ME and asking me to think just for once is HIGHLY offensive to me; and saying i'm not critically astute is rather offensive, as well. it's difficult to get into a discussion about a film on a message board. i'm sure if we were talking about the film face to face it would be much different but, to be honest, my new meds (and shit if i'm not starting to sound like campbell here) have really fucked with me and making a coherent online point is like climbing mt. everest. i will only say this: you can call me ugly as the elephant man, but insulting my intelligence is very painful. i'm not going into why in this public forum, but i have my reasons.

as for what my black friend thought of it: she thought it was good but not great. she was moved by the storyline about the iranians, however, and said that that was the most accurate depiction she found in the film considering the climate in america today (i agree with her on that). her problem was that it wasn't surprising enough, because things like this happen everyday (as in the jittery cop (ryan philippe) shooting the hitchhiker), and they're so common that the movie should have done something more interesting and provocative with the storylines.

i did, however, show her this thread and she was pretty shocked at your responses (and not because she's my best friend, either. she calls them as she sees them.). she asked if you had ever been to america. i said yes. she was really surprised about that, particularly when you said that there were no urban jungles.

(The Good Doctor) Martin Fradley wrote: You know what i did last summer??? Er, I don't!! You'll have to remind me. And that's a great line about "encouraging dissent": did you spin that at the interview??!!??

Hey! Teacher!!! Leave them kids alone!!!!!!!!

what happened last summer had nothing to do with you, and you have no idea what my teaching style is like. i don't have to defend it to you, that's for sure.