I Really Like Republic. Is it Underrated?

Ive been listening to Republic a lot lately.

I know thats many New order fans slag this album off.....

BUT

It doesnt really sound liek New Order, true, it sounds more like a Bernard Sumner album with Peter Hook guesting ona few tracks (minus the singles anyways) but I really enjoy the hard dance direction NO took with this album.

Not only that, but I think that in terms of lyrics, republic may ahve over all the best lyrics of any New order album. Barney's lyrics here seem intense and personal, and some of the lyrics are quite poetic.

I dunno. Aside from Regret, RIAD, and World, republic doesnt so much feel like an NO album , I cant hear Stve's drumming everywhere, it all sounds programmed, Barney doesnt play much guitar, and Hooky is barely there...

But I think a lot of the songs are very dancey, have great melodies,a nd great lyrics.

I especially like the songs Special and Times Change, Beautiful, sad songs with great lyrics.

As a matter of fact, I think Special is an incredibly moving song and one of New orders best songs. Very melodic, catchy, sad and moving.....

Over all, I think Republic is underrated. I like it more than Brotherhood or Get Ready. Tough Crystal was an amazing song...

UNDERrated?

I adore Republic -- it was THE album that turned me from the "aware of New Order's existence" onto the "I actually really like this band New Order, gotta get all their records" kind of "fan". Then again, I never saw them live and my post count is waaaaaaaaay below 1000 so I suppose I can't call myself a True Fan? But I own the World In Motion re-released CD! Surely that counts too!

Republic is always cited as "the worst" of New Order. My feeling is it's pretty damn good, so the idea that it's the worst is less of an insult and more of a compliment (as in "If this is the worst New Order did, the best must be spectaclar because this kicks ass"). That's my beliefs about it, anyway.

It's the weakest album for me, only Regret stands out and Hooky bass is almost completely produced out of the mix. Definitely #8 out of 8.

Was listenin to it earlier and thinking "this really is better than I remember, and I remember it was pretty good, but I wish it had been a factory album, there's a bit of major label production there already". And that's the only useful thing I can bring to the debate, save to say that I imeadiately listened to bits of technique and confirmed my production suspicions.

Al Jarvis wrote: Best single New Order ever had.

Regret plus 10 b-sides.

Now THAT'S value for money!

What were all the b-sides?

"Hard dance"??? It wasn't exactly the pissing Prodigy or Khemikkkal Brudders now was it?

I'd say the album was blandsville central. The packaging of it pretty much summed up the contents - widescreen music for widescreen people - lavish video budgets (check the vids for World and Ruined - the latter could give Sting or Bono a run for their money! Blecch!) and expensively mediocre remixes (Sly and Robbie anyone?).

When the best track by several furlongs is the lead track and it's all downhill from there you're really talking about a band in crisis.

Al Jarvis wrote: Best single New Order ever had.

Regret plus 10 b-sides.

Now THAT'S value for money!

EXCELLENT that man! Couldn't have put it better myself!

Regret was a brilliant single. The rest of the album is horrible, however. The songs are well written but Hague's ultra-slick production drained the life out of the songs and ruined all but Regret. I do think the album would have turned out much better (possibly even rivaling Technique) had the band written the songs together w/o Hague's involvement and perhaps used a different producer.

I find this really to be an odd result, b/c I've always been a fan of Hague's work.

Rank it WAY above Get Ready for replay value. I initially hated "Liar", "Chemical" and "Young Offender", but love them now. It may be Barney's album, but it proves he is invaluable to the band.

Not a bad album, but as mentioned earlier, except for Regret, Hooky is either too low in the mix or not there at all. That makes for an Electronic Record.

Regret with a bunch of B sides. I like that one.

I think it's one of their best albums... decent lyrics, great melodies. Not much Hooky unfortunately... but there are some great dance tracks on the album. It ranks WAY above Get Ready and Brotherhood, and is also better than WFTSC too in my opinion.

Regret is superb , I like the album , good one to drive along listening in the car

most of the record sounds like a bland imitation of the Pet Shop Boys, and in retrospec half the record sounds like a Bernard solo album.

as for a "dance" album... at the time i was very sad how New Order pulled back from the at the time very thriving rave/ house/ techno scene which they helped create, and were now content to be bland imitators... very sad, actually boring for the most part :(

"Regret" is an absolutely beautiful song thou, worth the price of the record anyway... belongs on every one of their future "Best of" collections

I like sex with sheep. Is this wrong?

pumped full of drugs wrote: most of the record sounds like a bland imitation of the Pet Shop Boys, and in retrospec half the record sounds like a Bernard solo album.

as for a "dance" album... at the time i was very sad how New Order pulled back from the at the time very thriving rave/ house/ techno scene which they helped create, and were now content to be bland imitators... very sad, actually boring for the most part :(

I know what you mean there... it was a dance album, but more on the commercial side of things, rather than the mad rave/techno stuff that was around at the time.
More Pet Shop Boys than the Prodigy...

Al Jarvis wrote: Best single New Order ever had.

Regret plus 10 b-sides.

Now THAT'S value for money!

Special and RIAD are B-sides?

There is certainly a lot of questionable material on the album but I wouldn't go so far as to say that there is only one good song.

One thing I can say is: Republic's better than Get Ready and Movement.

I'm hoping that New Order's upcoming album will be in the top five, but regardless, I'm sure it will be great!

Here's my all time ranking of New Order Albums:

1. Brotherhood (2)

2. Substance (3)

3. Lowlife

4. PC&L

5. Technique

6. WFTSC (1)

7. Movement

8. 1981 EP (1)

9. Republic

10. Get Ready

() = number of top five all time songs included on release Note: Temptation appeared on both Substance and 1981 EP; and, BLT appeared on both Substance and Brotherhood

I think that Republic is an album which contains a few good songs (the singles plus Liar) but the rest is rather forgetable.

I didn't really like Get Ready all that much when it came out, but after I've been playing a lot of NO again since the brilliant WFTSC came out, I've been giving it quite a few spins again. Guess what, I found that I quite liked it. It's very different and much more guitar orientated and besides Someone like You the dance stuff is completely missing. Still, it's got some very good material. And although Republic has a couple of classic NO tracks (Regret and World) I think overall, as an album, Get Ready is much better.

Cheers, Ed

Republic wasn't an instant pull-me-in type album; it was a grower for me (If I remember correctly)and I think it's an excellent NO album that produced classics like "Regret" 'Ruined in a day" "World" The artwork seemd to betray the music because of it's spectacle-like, pretentious cover/artwork and it seemed out of place. IMO

Ally3000 wrote:

By 'Eck! My Neck! wrote: "Hard dance"??? It wasn't exactly the pissing Prodigy or Khemikkkal Brudders now was it?

I'd say the album was blandsville central. The packaging of it pretty much summed up the contents - widescreen music for widescreen people - lavish video budgets (check the vids for World and Ruined - the latter could give Sting or Bono a run for their money! Blecch!) and expensively mediocre remixes (Sly and Robbie anyone?).

When the best track by several furlongs is the lead track and it's all downhill from there you're really talking about a band in crisis.

Bollocks! (IMHO) The 'packaging' is some of New Order/Saville's very best. Out of all the albums aside from maybe Technique, the Republic era artwork is my favourite, whether that makes me a "widescreen person" (not sure what that means) I'm not sure. As for videos, well New Order have never exactly been pioneers in that field so that's an easy target. Although Regret, Ruined in a day, World and Spooky kick the shit out of the likes of Run2, Shellshock, and Crystal in my opinion (the videos).

As for the "expensively mediocre" remixes. Erm, no. You singled out the worst ones from that period (Sly & Robbie) and yes they are pretty dire, but Republic also produced the best remixes any New Order album has seen. From Reunited in a day to the Fire Island/Sabres of Paradise mixes of Regret and Paul Van Dyk's Spooky, there's a shitload of great mixes on the singles.

As for "going downhill" after Regret, well the music is either up your street or it isn't I think alot of New Order fans listen to Republic, detect it's had some money invested in it and turn off because it's not in the true "punk ethic" or something. A crap reason to dislike an album. I love New Order's earlier albums, the songs are immortal but the production is ageing horribly. Republic's production has aged mostly pretty well.

Ally.

Read what I put carefully again - did I at ANY point imply or say that the artwork was crap? I didn't did I? I never said anything of the sort. All I meant was that the artwork was inspired by film posters with the way the credits read like that.....that was the "widescreen" idea I was getting at. The whole package was a lavish production - but my own opinion is that this lavish production concealed some very weak music. That is all. I hated the Get Ready and WFTSC sleeve art though, very boring and uninspired - I never said anywhere that I disliked the Republic sleeve art or those of the singles that came off it - just some of the music was pretty moribund.

i didnt start this thread-wftsc is best album for me of last 3 albums..i reckon thats in about last 15 years? thats a guess.is brotherhood underated?its the one that makes me dance most with a few drinkies,its the bass i think

Ray wrote: Then again, I never saw them live and my post count is waaaaaaaaay below 1000 so I suppose I can't call myself a True Fan?

Nah, don't let a silly stat on a message board determine how much of a fan you are.

Number of posts DOES NOT = status symbol.

5,000 posts = New Order fan 50 posts = New Order fan

Jim

I love it. It helped me through a stay in hospital back in 93, when magicly the only tape I had in my cassette recorder was Republic.

I love it too; along with Substance and Tehcnique, it helped keep me sane while I was at college.

It took a while for me to appreciate it, Spooky, Chemical and World let it down a small bit in my opinion, but theres nothing embaressing there. I like it more than Brotherhood and the two albums that followed it.

After such a long wait for a new album I was psyched, even more when I heard the first song, but as the rest of the album unfolded I was bitterly disappointed - over-produced, missing Hooky bass, too many forgettable songs. I've hardly listened to it over the last few years. And I have to admit it is my least favourite NO album artwork ever - no subtlety, looked like an afternoon throw-away job.

Republic is a very good album, better than get ready or the new one imo, but the production is a bit bland? great lyrics though, particularly 'special'.no should have produced it themselves & got rid of hague(although i like what he did the psb) also, many of the songs on republic were mainly written by barney & probably intended for electronic. and hooky's absence on these tracks makes it seem like a barney solo album with avalanche tagged on at the end

I got to the HMV in Stoke at 5.30am the morning of release in order to queue up and be amongst the first to get a copy. I expected at least a few other hardy souls to do the same.

When they opened up at 8.45 I was still the only one there. I looked a right cunt.

Even more than usual.;)