Is it just me or does the original 1982 version of Temptation just sound more like a demo than the 1986 Substance version? I honestly don't see why so many people prefer the original version since it sounds very badly produced (though the snowball thing is a nice touch) in comparison with the later version. Sure, the original version has a much more "raw" sound, but it also sounds quite primitive and nowhere near the quality of their other early singles (though I think it was their first self-produced single, but I'm not sure). Is it just pointless nostalgia by you old people creating the undue reverence for the 1982 version, or is there something I've been missing all these years? I suppose the same goes for the early versions of Ceremony as well.
temptation '82: why the hard-on?
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the 87 version for me sounds a bit too perfect, too poppy. The earlier version seems more warm and cosy. 87 - for in a club 82 - a nice sit-down in your favourite chair ;)
The recorded versions of Ceremony never quite did it justice for me - Still or New order live for me.
you're right about the production values of the '87 version, but i enjoy both. the 1987 version is a better dance mix, but something about barney's voice draws me to the '82 version. it's deeper and i like the 'echo,' as well.
I agree with you, Pope. The 82 version is good, but sounds too outdated nowadays. There's something special about the '87 version. Sure it's cleaned up and polished, but I think the vocals are better.
You know, you may be on to something with the "demo" sound of the 82 version, but I like it anyway. I think it's all a matter of taste
The 87 version does sound like a polished version of the original, but the 82 Temp has a nice tone to it that is missing in subsequent takes.
I don't really like the 87 or subsequent versions. Suppose it all depends what you heard first - the original is firmly imprinted in my NO psyche and the other versions seem to pale into insignificance.
The original seems to capture the time very well, and at the same time remain timeless. I prefer Bernard's deadpan delivery in the original, as well as the more distinguishable layers of early sequencer which are so evident. The sequencer solo in the 12" version where Hooky's bass comes still gives me goosebumps.
I think the reason the 82 version is so revered is that it was so ahead of its time in 1982, both for them and the world in general. It's easy these days to take NO stuff for granted, with sequencer layers, guitar parts that happen when Bernard's not singing etc, with lead bass driving it on, but in late 81/early 82 it really was a case of "never heard anything quite like this before".
For me its the guitar (& synth) build up on the '82 12" version - it builds up so gradually (almost orchesteral) to the vocal & that build up is missing from later versions
fivehatessix got it spot on for me: "I prefer Bernard's deadpan delivery in the original, as well as the more distinguishable layers of early sequencer which are so evident. The sequencer solo in the 12" version where Hooky's bass comes still gives me goosebumps."
It was the first NO song I'd heard - I was outside the British Grand Prix and some lads had it blaring out of a Porsche stereo!
I remember being absolutely, totally stunned by it - it was the best thing I'd ever heard in my life, and still is. Being a fan of groups like OMD, Human League etc at the time, I was into electronic music, but this mixture of guitar AND synths, coupled with Barney's very 'European' vocals (not knowing who it was singing, I thought this must be a German group!)
That moment changed my life - that's why the '82 version remains my all-time favourite record, and why the '87 rehash means nowt to me, in comparison.
It's a bit like being at the Cup Winners Cup Final at Rotterdam in '91, compared to watching Barca '99 on the TV! ;)
Hi
can anyone tell me where i can find the 82 version, or please send me a copy on MP3.
Thank you in advance
The 1982 12" just has that something special that the 87 recording lack's. ok, the 87 version obviously has better vocals and is more polished but i think that is where it looses it's uniqueness. I gotta say though i think the 82 7" version really sounds like a demo.
I had never heard the 1982 version, or any version, prior to getting Substance when it was released. For me, Temptation IS the Substance version, and the 1982 version to me is vastly inferior.
Arlindo Czar wrote: Hi
can anyone tell me where i can find the 82 version, or please send me a copy on MP3.
Thank you in advance
7" only released as a single on vinyl only, as far as I am aware it has never been officially released on cd.
12" released as a single on vinyl only AND
1981 - FEP313 - 1982 (Factory canada mini lp and cassette) 1981 - FACTUS8 - 1982 (Factory US mini lp and cassette)
FEP313 was re-issued by Polygram (Canada) on CD in 1989. (also contains Hurt 12", Everything's Gone Green 12", Procession and Mesh. Mesh not available on cd elsewhere) Occasionally pops up on ebay for about £20 - £25
12" Also released on the Retro 5 or 4 CD Box set in 2002
Oh and its fuggin brilliant.
I love it so much not least because it was the first time I saw the band on tv, was it their first network tv show? I think so.
They also played Chosen Time on BBC2 Riverside.
Patrick wrote: I had never heard the 1982 version, or any version, prior to getting Substance when it was released. For me, Temptation IS the Substance version, and the 1982 version to me is vastly inferior.
Here here. Im in total agreement. The guitars on the 82 version sound way too tinny and much better played on 87 update. Also the vocals are much improved on 87 version.
I've never really liked the Substance version. Too polished and it lacks something from the original. There is magic in that 12" and that it what I heard first too.
But why do I love the 98 version so much? It's more like the live version and has a lot more life in it. The fact they rerecorded it again must point at the fact they weren't happy with the 87 version.
the '82 version is so damn dirty. the drums are primitive, the guitar work is sloppy, the bass is more like a warm, glowing layer rather than a line, the programmed synth line is always about to fall apart... it's the best thing they ever recorded. it is the first song they produced, and it shows. not that i dont like the fact that they got better at what they did, but early on, especially on temptation, blue monday and confusion, they were just flooded with ideas that, had they known better, or been less willing to believe in what they were doing, might have been ignored later on. from low life on, a sort of professionalism crept into their music, and while the creativity stuck around for quite a while, the cavalier attitude that made them innovators was slowly lost. later, only fine time and world in motion really show that "whatever, fuck it" attitude they took to dance music. it's what made them the greats that they are. new order + fuck up = dance innovation!
someone said something about the '98 version... is this the one on the "in session" album? i've been looking for a relatively cheap copy of that for years... can't seem to find it. it's a gaping hole in my heart.
Arlindo Czar wrote: Hi
can anyone tell me where i can find the 82 version, or please send me a copy on MP3.
Thank you in advance
you can find the 7" or 12" with hurt on eBay every once in a while; they aren't terribly expensive. also check used and rare record stores online.
digitalwaters wrote: Oh dear, got meself muddled - the 98 version is my fave too!!!
I like the punchiness of the 98 version, I just wish it weren't so damn short. If it had used the same extended blueprint as 87 it could have been nearly perfect.
I'm one of those who heard the 87 version first, and for me it remains the definitive version - Temptation is, in my eyes, a class pop song, so the more polished Substance rendition does it a greater justice IMO. But I actually prefer the 7" mix, with that cheeky bit of melodica at the start, and, to these ears the sequencer seems a lot crisper than on the 12" version (which, to be honest, I can take or leave...)
Which brings me to another point - does anyone else think NO's first batch of self-produced tracks (Temptation, Hurt) have the most godawful drum production? The snare sound is really compressed, sounding more like the syndrum used on SLC for their first Peel session. It's such a marked contrast to the clean, taut snare sound Hannett perfected. Although maybe this was a deliberate attempt to distance themselves from Hannett's signature sound and establish themselves as autonomous producers in their own right (and thus progress onto their BeMusic "careers").
In order of my fave Temptations-
'82 - something about it is just fookin' epic. The relentless electronic attack, with NO's instrumentation floating above it.
'98 - the perfect Single Mix of this track of all time.
-'94 live from the Electronic Ecstacy boot - just the first few seconds of the intro - so damn aggressive, that must have been a KILLER concert when it kicked in!
'87 - the Slick Rick mix. When Barney sings the "grey eyes" line, it's like he's trying to woo a pre-teen gal to snog. Oh, that was Trainspotting.
i like rawness in music and i usually don´t like overproduced stuff. 82 version in my opinion is better for that reason, the same reason why i like Let´s Go Original Lyrics better than the 94 one for example. it´s a personal thing. and i listened to the 82 version way after the 87 one, maybe 10 years difference, so i can´t say i was in love with it at the time it was released. i think it´s a matter of tastes really.
Well, Iam a Temptation freak and I find merits in all versions. I even gladly listen to the cover in the last Moby's album - can you believe it?
Now, I believe that the 1982 version is a true gem. It has something very particular because it's rough and straight, not well polished, somehow kidish in the way it has been put together but so real and spontaneous!
the '82 version is to me this incredible culmination of the greatest parts of Joy Division, and the greatest parts of New Order. the rawness bring so much power and energy to it. Its like listening to Iggy Pop and the stooges, and then somehow these electronic noises that should ruin the energy appear and just give the song more life. And that dirty aspect is why its so great, because to me thats real emotion in real music. I actually heard the '87 version first, but you know its not as interesting. And thats where the line is drawn, beauty and interested. thats why Joy Division, New Order, Public Image ltd (I just had to included them, they fit perfectly) were so great. Raw emotion, raw music, raw power. Sure its opinion, but I go for what gets my heart racing. And not much dance music does that, but the '82 temptation does! 
I can't believe I didn't mention the 1984 live version that is the best EVER!!!!! 
Shug will back me up on this (I think he concured when I stated earlier this year that it was my favorite version of Temptation).
But choosing between the '82 and '87 versions solely, I still like the '82 
Because the 1982 12" version is nearly the perfect song.
A May 1982 issue of NME devoted a page just to raving about how brilliant Temptation is/was.
The 1987 Substance track is just overproduced sugary pap designed for suburban America.
So, if a 2005 remix of EGG came out would some posters here slag off the "dated" 1981 Benulux 12" version?
Have to side with the minority and say I prefer the '87 version. Perfect, poppy and polished (even though the exact same drum sound is used for True Faith...recorded at the same session I gather..?). This was most likely cuz it was the first I've heard.
The 1982 version does sound more primitive, but the drums are murky and the sequencer sounds tinny and warbly. Barney's vocals are more robotic and '82 era sounding, which is a plus.
Best version, live or studio: Taras, Nov. 81...I get a "chill" moment when Barney, Hooky and Steve all start jamming at the same moment (3/4 way in) :D
I had a hard on and gave in to TEMPTATION in 1982,in fact that was the year that dr 
had his first "belly rub",ahh i remember it well.......
What was the topic about?
call '82 the first love-nothing is ever as sweet or as wonderful. It is also a milestone in the evolution of the band and an entire genre of music.
tho to be told when I finally made my own NO mix tape-I used the single edit of the '87 version.
I once told a friend that the reason why it seems the 80s stuff may seem "better" is that at their 80s peak, NO made music that defined and set a standard for electronic/dance/pop music. Quite a standard indeed
I personally love all the versions but the shitty '87 version that killed the whole emotion of the song.
I was lucky to happen to stumble across the 7 inch version first...hooray for me...
I quickly picked up the 12 inch version and loved that one too but there's something about the original 7 inch that has an edge even above the 12 inch version.
It clearly is my favorite song of all time from anyone anywhere and will remain so when I die...I wanna be buried with the 7 inch next to my 7 inch...hahahaha
Overall the song just touches every emotion like no other song can or will ever.
I can't even put a smiley to describe the mood!!!
((((e))))
Aleph via Krafty wrote: whic
Best version, live or studio: Taras, Nov. 81...I get a "chill" moment when Barney, Hooky and Steve all start jamming at the same moment (3/4 way in) :D
Agree that the Taras version is the best. Theres something special about the song in its embryonic stage, it shows the group slowly finding its way. A bit like watching an old home movie of a toddlers first steps.
To understand how good the 1982 versions were, you had to be a teenager in England at the time (I was 18).
I remember about 1985 giving a lift in my car to some friends. Temptation was on my cassette deck. They both said they remembered it, loved it, used to dance to it but had no idea who it was or what it was called. That has always stuck in my mind.
lowlife wrote: fivehatessix got it spot on for me: "I prefer Bernard's deadpan delivery in the original, as well as the more distinguishable layers of early sequencer which are so evident. The sequencer solo in the 12" version where Hooky's bass comes still gives me goosebumps."
I remember being absolutely, totally stunned by it - it was the best thing I'd ever heard in my life, and still is.
seconded. Thought it was the best song I'd ever heard back then, and still love it. The '87 version is a bit too slick, and misses the sequencer solo of the 82 12"(or the 'beepy bit' as I used to call it).
Only recently got a record player again after a decade without, finally listened to the old 7" again, for the first time on a decent stereo, and for the first time noticed what sounded like Gillian on backing vocals (or a processed Barny) very low in the mix (singing 'up down turn around', if I remember rightly)thoughout what I previously thought were purely instrumental bits.
PS, wasn't moby's recent cover version a huge disappointment. Dull semi-acoustic female vocal slowed-down version, what an unoriginal way to cover NO. I was hoping for some sort of weirded out aphex twin or sonic youth style thing. Come to think of it, I'd like to hear one of those acts do a cover of it.
Although it was ahead of it's time in 1982, Barney's voice grates on me. He sounds like an Eton boy trying to impersonate Ian Curtis on the toilet, while suffering constipation.
I've long thought that the first version of a song that you hear and like is the one you end up preferring, especially if another version takes a few years to arrive.
[edit - there's a downside to this, too. My wife spent most of the 1980s thinking Paul Young wrote LWTUA!]
That's what happened to me with Temptation - got the 12 inch first, with its beautiful marbled and embossed sleeve, then picked up the 7 inch after hearing a totally different take on the radio and wondering whether this was it...it was, and I love the way that the sleeve is part of the 12 inch sleeve...but the record played at 33rpm, which meant that the wide, loud grooves of the 12 inch always grabbed my attention first.
Yes, I made the "7 inch fading out, then 12 inch fading in" cassette, and I played that a lot on a succession of tape machines (you 'ad ter mek yer own compilations before Substance, tha knows) but that 12 inch version has always been the one for me.
A May 1982 issue of NME devoted a page just to raving about
how brilliant Temptation is/was!!!!
Does anyone have this NME feature.Im sure it was written by Paul Morley and was a brilliant read. 
ohupdownturnaroundtonightithinkillwalkaloneillfindmysoulasigohomeUPDOWNturnaroundPLEASEDONTLETMEHITTHEGROUNDtongihtithinkillwalkaloneillfindmysoulasigohome.
As someone with Brown Eyes, I've always felt left out of the temptation thing. What a song though. My favourite live.
It's funny, in some ways, even though my all time faves are the early 'Taras' LIVE '81 and both original 12" and 7", I can't help but LOVE all versions (and the legion of Live ones either). MILESTONE CLASSIC along EGG and BM
digitalwaters wrote: 1987. Like 1963 in 1994.
94? Do tou mean the one to "the shite of" or that one of 95? Anyway, original is far more elegant than these two.
