new Joy Division 7"s boxset called "+ -"

I'm a total sucker for this sort of thing. Just ordered the deluxe version. Obviously don't need it, i just know i'll be pissed off when it sells out and i didn't get one. Bet the mastering is rubbish though!

Flogging a dead corpse.

Hey, here's a novel idea - how about a New Order CD singles box? You know, properly done.

I keep forgetting my username and having to sign up on the rare occasion that something does pop up that I want to comment on!

Not sure I get the dead corpse comment. We've all benefited and enjoyed Recycle which was a most excellent look back at the bands works.... seems a bit of double standards, ok for it to be done without the bands consent but the band do it and it's flogging a dead corpse. hmm... i guess if you were in a band you'd just stop working with what you've got yea?

I might not buy this, probably not the deluxe one anyway but i am interested in hearing it so i'll probably look at buying the itunes lp. If it sounds good I may then invest in the hard copy! £75 is a lot of money but then Petre Saville is also now designing the england shirts, so who knows what it's worth. Either way... looks like a better effort than the new order collectors!!!

hmm just wanted to apologise, that sounded a bit ranty now i read it back!! wasn't mean to be per se, just raising an issue which seems obvious.....

why the fcuk shell out £75 just to look at summat when Jeb n the team av done a better job for the total completist. beggars belief

Chesty wrote: hmm just wanted to apologise, that sounded a bit ranty now i read it back!! wasn't mean to be per se, just raising an issue which seems obvious.....

What I meant was they just keep revisitng Joy Division over and over. Hello, they were a different band for 25 years! And I daresay that band was far more influential than their first one.

Also, no one is begigng for vinyl from this lot. This is an obvious collector cash grab and not something the fans have been begging for, vocally, for years.

Andrew Sayer wrote: why the fcuk shell out £75 just to look at summat when Jeb n the team av done a better job for the total completist. beggars belief

Probably some silly notion that the actual band might make some money out of it, you know.

My order is (dunkenly) in.

i got the impression the timing was for the 30th anniversary of ic's death? (well not exactly the anniversary, but 30 years) anyway, tis on my xmas list

The whole thing is another shameless attempt to try to get money from us. The insult goes on and on and on ...

I really have no (other) words for it.

Besides that: I am REALLY glad that we have proper versions of all the J.D. and N.O. singles now. thanks to Jeb and his Recycle-team. What a great job that was ... eternally thankful I am.

All anyone needs is the 2 studio albums,the stand alone singles, and 'still'. Nothing else should matter.

£50 Note wrote:

Chesty wrote: hmm just wanted to apologise, that sounded a bit ranty now i read it back!! wasn't mean to be per se, just raising an issue which seems obvious.....

What I meant was they just keep revisitng Joy Division over and over. Hello, they were a different band for 25 years! And I daresay that band was far more influential than their first one.

Also, no one is begigng for vinyl from this lot. This is an obvious collector cash grab and not something the fans have been begging for, vocally, for years.

To be honest... you say this but what people , definitely me and also seemingly yourself are interested in is the careful looking after of the bands catalogue. to that end surely this is a positive step - if what warner Bros is saying is true, i.e saville involved, stephen remastering, surely its a good thing???

for someone who clearly has got all the oks from members of the band to do recycle i fail to see why you are so keen to detract from the bands own efforts!

so, you have to buy 7"s to get free mp3s of tracks already available on CD and remastered freely (recycle)!!

missed.the.boat.

Chesty wrote: for someone who clearly has got all the oks from members of the band to do recycle i fail to see why you are so keen to detract from the bands own efforts!

Vinyl.

Vinyl vinyl vinyl.

Did I mention vinyl?

This is not for playing, it's for sitting on a shelf. It's a bald-faced cash grab.

The original records were released on vinyl. If anything this is how they should be played!

If u choose not to open a box set and play it then that is your problem, i for one play all my vinyl still. Love the sound and whenever people are over, and now even when my kids have friends over, the record player is getting used. I might buy this now just because i've made such a point about it!

I couldn't find any mention of the track listing on this thread, so i've put this up, obviously we all knew what most of it would be. Isolation is now a single http://www.slicingupeyeballs.com/2010/11/02/joy-division-plus-minus-vinyl-box-set-7-inch/

Tracklist: Joy Division, +-

A. “Warsaw” B. “Leaders Of Men”

A: “‘No Love Lost” B: “Failures”

A: “Digital” B: “Glass”

A: “Autosuggestion” B: “From Safety To Where”

A: “Transmission” B: “Novelty”

A: “Atmosphere” B: “Dead Souls”

A: “Komakino” B1: “Incubation” B2: “As You Said”

A: “Love Will Tear Us Apart” B: “These Days”

A: “She’s Lost Control” (12-inch Version) B: “Love Will Tear Us Apart 2″ (Pennine Version)

A: “Isolation” B: “Heart and Soul”

It doesn't bother me that Warner are 'celebrating' JD in this way, though I can't help but think that an NO version of this concept would be more agreeable, at least then fans could have official versions of all the edits. Still, £50 Note and his team's excellent work met that demand brilliantly.

I'm a sucker for these kinds of things as well. Super deluxe seems expensive, nayone know what is on the 2 x CD's? If nothign worth getting will settle for the £50 one.

What a swiz. Nice concept and all that but I'm not going to shell out another penny more to Rhino or Warners to be fobbed off with potentially shoddy product that doesn't serve any DEFINITIVE or CONCLUSIVE purpose (especially where New Order are concerned).

Granted, the treatment of Joy Division back catalogue has been far better on the whole but the line needs to be drawn somewhere.

As we've already seen, it's taken a NOOLer to show their initiative and - through their meticulous enterprising spirit and generosity - provide us with the NO Recycle project. A truly fantastic achievement which should quite rightly put the morons at Warners, London and Rhino to shame.

I have now finally completed assembling the packaging of this amazing project and have photographed all 19 of my miniature 12" / CD sleeves - plus an exclusively re-created cover for Substance 1981-1990 which collects together all of these singles.

I will post up my efforts on here in due course.... :)

By 'Eck! My Neck! wrote: What a swiz. Nice concept and all that but I'm not going to shell out another penny more to Rhino or Warners to be fobbed off with potentially shoddy product that doesn't serve any DEFINITIVE or CONCLUSIVE purpose (especially where New Order are concerned).

Granted, the treatment of Joy Division back catalogue has been far better on the whole but the line needs to be drawn somewhere.

As we've already seen, it's taken a NOOLer to show their initiative and - through their meticulous enterprising spirit and generosity - provide us with the NO Recycle project. A truly fantastic achievement which should quite rightly put the morons at Warners, London and Rhino to shame.

I have now finally completed assembling the packaging of this amazing project and have photographed all 19 of my miniature 12" / CD sleeves - plus an exclusively re-created cover for Substance 1981-1990 which collects together all of these singles.

I will post up my efforts on here in due course.... :)

To be honest you are right...... recycle does have it all... ..

* top studio * top master sources * top engineer looking after the whole thing * fantasti artwork by someone who has worked with the band for decades * band support * supports the band back by paying royalties

thank god for recycle.

Nice item

and as shug so rightly says,mite be the ony opportunity to get our hands on sordide!

unfortunately i'm NOT in

The completeist in me is saying buy,but heart is saying no :(

http://neworderweb.piczo.com

£50 Note wrote: Flogging a dead corpse.

Hey, here's a novel idea - how about a New Order CD singles box? You know, properly done.

They dont give a toss about New Order anymore, seeing as anything with the JD moniker seems to be the only thing london pushes.

Does anyone have information on the Saville print included on the limited edition or better pictures of the boxset itself?

does anyone here actually have any contact with anyone at the label or at management or the band. i am interested to know because otherwise it doesn't matter what we all think, we are just speculating. someone find out who at London Records deals with th eband and lets call them!!

in others news, i just went to buy the box and it's sold out!

Chesty wrote: does anyone here actually have any contact with anyone at the label or at management or the band. i am interested to know because otherwise it doesn't matter what we all think, we are just speculating. someone find out who at London Records deals with th eband and lets call them!!

in others news, i just went to buy the box and it's sold out!

Yup, thought that might be the case (first 500 to disappear very quickly)... Luckily, I decided to order it before that happened! :)

Still intrigued to find out what's on the CDs, though?

Hélène's friend wrote: so, you have to buy 7"s to get free mp3s of tracks already available on CD and remastered freely (recycle)!!

for heaven's sake! give it a rest (joy division & ian) (literally)... :evil:

Nick King wrote:

Still intrigued to find out what's on the CDs, though?

For £25 more, you get the ten 7”s plus a piece of artwork signed by Saville and two CDs containing the same 20 tracks featured on the singles.

So this site says

Got mine ordered days ago.Hope it is a signed Saville print :)

Chesty wrote: does anyone here actually have any contact with anyone at the label or at management or the band. i am interested to know because otherwise it doesn't matter what we all think, we are just speculating. someone find out who at London Records deals with th eband and lets call them!!

in others news, i just went to buy the box and it's sold out!

Are you kidding me. This is a fan forum. Everyone here, including you, wants to put their 2 cents in. We all come here and either praise the band and their decisions or straight flame them. What does it matter if anyone on here knows the band or management; it's irrelevant. I could get a message through to Hooky for you, but frankly, I would speculate that he could care less about what you think! Thanks for the laugh thou…………….I will tell Hooky you were thinking about him………Lmfao

Cheers - they hadn't made that clear on the Rhino site! :)

I was assuming (but I could be completely wrong) that if you ordered the Deluxe version for 75 quid (or thereabouts), then you got the CDs, the Saville print, and the clamshell pack - that's the one that's limited to 500 copies...

So, I'm also assuming that the other 4,500 copies are the Standard version for 50 quid (i.e. no Cds, no Saville print, and no clamshell pack)?

Nick King wrote: Cheers - they hadn't made that clear on the Rhino site! :)

I was assuming (but I could be completely wrong) that if you ordered the Deluxe version for 75 quid (or thereabouts), then you got the CDs, the Saville print, and the clamshell pack - that's the one that's limited to 500 copies...

So, I'm also assuming that the other 4,500 copies are the Standard version for 50 quid (i.e. no Cds, no Saville print, and no clamshell pack)?

You get the clamshell pack with the £50 standard version too. The deluxe version at £75 , gets you the Saville print and the cds as extra. Plus they are edition numbered between 1-500. I gather it was only exclusive to Rhino UK , so expect to see them sell on ebay for alot of money.

:)

Darkman wrote:

Chesty wrote: does anyone here actually have any contact with anyone at the label or at management or the band. i am interested to know because otherwise it doesn't matter what we all think, we are just speculating. someone find out who at London Records deals with th eband and lets call them!!

in others news, i just went to buy the box and it's sold out!

Are you kidding me. This is a fan forum. Everyone here, including you, wants to put their 2 cents in. We all come here and either praise the band and their decisions or straight flame them. What does it matter if anyone on here knows the band or management; it's irrelevant. I could get a message through to Hooky for you, but frankly, I would speculate that he could care less about what you think! Thanks for the laugh thou…………….I will tell Hooky you were thinking about him………Lmfao

I am merely stating that ultimately no-one here knows anything but lots claim to be holier than thou........... well done, you can message Hooky, im sure i could too if i tried. my point is, ppl say things like 'they dont give a fuck about new order' but ultimately it's a joke because they are giving their 2 cents without being asked. i would happily call the label if someone gave me the name and numer of the person at London responsible for looking after Joy Order. ultimately i am looking here and seeing people who are big fans of recycle but hate the idea of th eband doing the same thing officially, so i do not get the hate. honestly.

Chesty wrote:

Darkman wrote:

Chesty wrote: does anyone here actually have any contact with anyone at the label or at management or the band. i am interested to know because otherwise it doesn't matter what we all think, we are just speculating. someone find out who at London Records deals with th eband and lets call them!!

in others news, i just went to buy the box and it's sold out!

Are you kidding me. This is a fan forum. Everyone here, including you, wants to put their 2 cents in. We all come here and either praise the band and their decisions or straight flame them. What does it matter if anyone on here knows the band or management; it's irrelevant. I could get a message through to Hooky for you, but frankly, I would speculate that he could care less about what you think! Thanks for the laugh thou…………….I will tell Hooky you were thinking about him………Lmfao

I am merely stating that ultimately no-one here knows anything but lots claim to be holier than thou........... well done, you can message Hooky, im sure i could too if i tried. my point is, ppl say things like 'they dont give a fuck about new order' but ultimately it's a joke because they are giving their 2 cents without being asked. i would happily call the label if someone gave me the name and numer of the person at London responsible for looking after Joy Order. ultimately i am looking here and seeing people who are big fans of recycle but hate the idea of th eband doing the same thing officially, so i do not get the hate. honestly.

Really, ultimately no-one here knows anything. So in your nine posts here, you have reached enlightenment. You have been here long enough to know who knows what. You a very perceptive person Chesty; I appalled you for your keep eye. It seems your the one who doesn’t know shit………….coming on this forum, talking about calling the record company…lol……..and what are you going to tell them Chesty; that your proud of them for choosing vinyl? That you demand more of them. Are you kidding me?

And as far as “NOOL Members giving their 2 cents without being asked”. Wow, is this your first time joining a forum for a band? A topic is posted and all the members chime in on how they feel about that topic…...It’s how this fan sites work. Nobody asked you for your opinion, but you don’t see anyone crying because you running your mouth. I’m confronting you, because I don’t agree with you. That how these forum’s work; especially here at NOOL.

We(the fans) having been chiming in for years about what we would like to see released; and the record company, and the band could care less. They are going to releases what they want to release bottom line. No fan is ever going to influence any release; bottom line.

And as far as fans here, “who are big fans of recycle but hate the idea of the band doing the same thing officially, so i do not get the hate. Honestly” It’s 50/50 here. Some fans are happy with all the official releases and new releases and others (it’s not hate) , I think it’s frustration. There are a lot of fans, that get upset that the band don’t do the catalog justice with new release or lack of new releases or lack of care and attention to detail of the back catalog. So with that said, a lot of people here are VERY gratefully for the amazing, dedicated, and very hard work that a very small circle of fans did with the Recycle. Those fans took it upon themselves, to take care of the fans, and that is why people here are loyal to them. I’m very gratefully to them as well; so you will not here me utter a foul word about them.

Now if you would have been a member here longer, you would understand that, opinions are like assholes; everyone’s got one. And you are entitled to your opinion like the next person; so welcome to the board………………..cheers

Glad I got my order in already. That Saville print is gonna look nice in a frame.

Chesty wrote: ultimately i am looking here and seeing people who are big fans of recycle but hate the idea of th eband doing the same thing officially, so i do not get the hate. honestly.

The very badly remastered versions of New Order first 5 albums have left a bitter taste with some fans.

I do collect any old tat NewOrder or Joy Division release . I have purchased this new boxset ,but it won't be anything I haven't heard already. I'd love London/Rhino to release some rare or live recordings ,or even put some effort into remastering old albums. But sadly they are in it for the money, not for the fans. From what I gather the members of New Order don't have a say in what gets released, it's all down to the marketing people. 50 Pound Note and his 'Recycle' project has shown how it should be done.

:)

Right well thats cleared that up but i would like to say... do we know officially that the record label does not care what fans think. has anyone actually ever spoken to them about it? i just dont see why ud work at a record label and not care about a release... i sell cars and i'd hate to feel that one of my motors was sold faulty. pride of work etc. the new order releases bother me because surely the band must have listened to them! ? i am sure i read an interview with hooky sayin that "it was great to hear the tracks again" !!?!

Darkman wrote:

Chesty wrote: does anyone here actually have any contact with anyone at the label or at management or the band. i am interested to know because otherwise it doesn't matter what we all think, we are just speculating. someone find out who at London Records deals with th eband and lets call them!!

in others news, i just went to buy the box and it's sold out!

Are you kidding me. This is a fan forum. Everyone here, including you, wants to put their 2 cents in. We all come here and either praise the band and their decisions or straight flame them. What does it matter if anyone on here knows the band or management; it's irrelevant. I could get a message through to Hooky for you, but frankly, I would speculate that he could care less about what you think! Thanks for the laugh thou…………….I will tell Hooky you were thinking about him………Lmfao

Darkman: And Hooky could care less what you think?

cranelane wrote:

Darkman wrote:

Chesty wrote: does anyone here actually have any contact with anyone at the label or at management or the band. i am interested to know because otherwise it doesn't matter what we all think, we are just speculating. someone find out who at London Records deals with th eband and lets call them!!

in others news, i just went to buy the box and it's sold out!

Are you kidding me. This is a fan forum. Everyone here, including you, wants to put their 2 cents in. We all come here and either praise the band and their decisions or straight flame them. What does it matter if anyone on here knows the band or management; it's irrelevant. I could get a message through to Hooky for you, but frankly, I would speculate that he could care less about what you think! Thanks for the laugh thou…………….I will tell Hooky you were thinking about him………Lmfao

Darkman: And Hooky could care less what you think?

Yes Sir................he could care less about what I think when it comes to JD and NO releases. For the record, he is a very nice guy. I think his heart is in the right place; with the "Unknown Pleasures" tour.......and any other endeavor he pursues. The band and record company are going to release what they want to release, regardless of how we (the fans) feel. No worries, JD is still my favorite band regardless.....of what ever they release now or in the future.

It looks like a nice item, but is of no interest to a lot of JD fans. What was exciting, was when "Substance" came out in 1988, with all this material compiled together on CD, that was only on vinyl and crappy bootlegs.22 years later, it feels like we are going backwards instead of forwards!

The fact that the deluxe edition has sold out means that at least 500 fans were interested so from a commercial point of view it has been a success,that's all that matters to the good people at Rhino.

I just want it to look at

They could have made the live "Ceremony" from Still as the last single b/w "The Sound of Music"... makes as much sense/lack of sense. Not sure the first EP deserved 20% of the set, they could have just done "Warsaw"/"No Love Lost". How about a fake single in honour of the first aborted album? Like "Shadowplay"/"Ice Age".

Really, a bit silly since so few of those are real reproductions. Hey, people want collectible vinyl... and JD can command the high price. Go for it if you like, I couldn't decide on the Deluxe version... too late now.

cranelane wrote: The fact that the deluxe edition has sold out means that at least 500 fans were interested so from a commercial point of view it has been a success,that's all that matters to the good people at Rhino.

Of course, and I would expect it to sell out as well. There are more than 1500 JD fans/collectors around the World. It does look like a nice item, which I don't think anyone here has said it's not. The negative side of it is, the entire release is padded out. Did "Ideal for living" really need to be spread across 2 7" singles? I know the obivous there, as I am a musician and have released many records, by doing it at 45rpm, you do have optium quality, but how much more optium are you going to get anyway on recordings like that? As "Isolation" was also never a single, this just underlines the "flogging" opinions.If there was at least ONE 7" that contained unreleased recordings (more of the Electric Circus gig) something of decent quality, then it makes it more justified.

condemnation wrote:

cranelane wrote: The fact that the deluxe edition has sold out means that at least 500 fans were interested so from a commercial point of view it has been a success,that's all that matters to the good people at Rhino.

Of course, and I would expect it to sell out as well. There are more than 1500 JD fans/collectors around the World. It does look like a nice item, which I don't think anyone here has said it's not. The negative side of it is, the entire release is padded out. Did "Ideal for living" really need to be spread across 2 7" singles? I know the obivous there, as I am a musician and have released many records, by doing it at 45rpm, you do have optium quality, but how much more optium are you going to get anyway on recordings like that? As "Isolation" was also never a single, this just underlines the "flogging" opinions.If there was at least ONE 7" that contained unreleased recordings (more of the Electric Circus gig) something of decent quality, then it makes it more justified.

I don't agree, if they'd put some exclusive material on it, we'd be back where we were with Peter Hook's limited version of How Not To Run A Club. I'll admit that I don't know who these box sets are for, certainly not me. I don't think its oso awful to put these things out, I mean every band seems to have one of these 7" boxes, I even remember seeing Velvet Underground's one, hardly a singles band. Someone mentioned above that all of this stuff was on Substance 1988, i don't see why Warner/Rhino/London can't re-issue that

Point of order;

the phrase is couldn't care less not could care less.

Thankyou.

James Thomas wrote: Point of order;

the phrase is couldn't care less not could care less.

Thankyou.

Some do say "could care less" in the USA. Always really confused me as a child, since it makes no sense.

http://www.worldwidewords.org/qa/qa-ico1.htm

I have not bothered with any of Rhino's increasingly bizarre JD releases since the "Heart and Soul" box (which was the only good JD/NO release Rhino have done).

However, I sprang for this Super Deluxe set straight away (despite the fact that it is incredibly silly). The fact is with only 500 released I will make money on it in a few years time. Think of JD as a new form of stamp collecting and it all makes sense. In fact I am beginning to think I should have bought more than one set !

I'm not interested in vinyl, but I don't care if others buy whatever they like.

Although I'll admit that the reasons I'm not interested in vinyl is that I don't own equipment to play it and I don't know anyone with the equipment, and I don't like the idea of buying two formats of music per album. But for those who want it, no one's stopping you.

Well,maybe the success of this boxset will lead Rhino to compile a similar box set of New Order material this time next year,not that it is likely to include any previously unreleased material which is what would make it a noteworthy event. I see they have Isolation/Heart And Soul as one of the singles,that seems a bit odd.

Adam Tate wrote: The fact is with only 500 released I will make money on it in a few years time. Think of JD as a new form of stamp collecting and it all makes sense. In fact I am beginning to think I should have bought more than one set !

Who says its all about the music!?

Adam Tate wrote: I have not bothered with any of Rhino's increasingly bizarre JD releases since the "Heart and Soul" box (which was the only good JD/NO release Rhino have done).

However, I sprang for this Super Deluxe set straight away (despite the fact that it is incredibly silly). The fact is with only 500 released I will make money on it in a few years time. Think of JD as a new form of stamp collecting and it all makes sense. In fact I am beginning to think I should have bought more than one set !

Same reason I bought it!

Darkman wrote:

Chesty wrote:

Darkman wrote:

Chesty wrote: does anyone here actually have any contact with anyone at the label or at management or the band. i am interested to know because otherwise it doesn't matter what we all think, we are just speculating. someone find out who at London Records deals with th eband and lets call them!!

in others news, i just went to buy the box and it's sold out!

Are you kidding me. This is a fan forum. Everyone here, including you, wants to put their 2 cents in. We all come here and either praise the band and their decisions or straight flame them. What does it matter if anyone on here knows the band or management; it's irrelevant. I could get a message through to Hooky for you, but frankly, I would speculate that he could care less about what you think! Thanks for the laugh thou…………….I will tell Hooky you were thinking about him………Lmfao

I am merely stating that ultimately no-one here knows anything but lots claim to be holier than thou........... well done, you can message Hooky, im sure i could too if i tried. my point is, ppl say things like 'they dont give a fuck about new order' but ultimately it's a joke because they are giving their 2 cents without being asked. i would happily call the label if someone gave me the name and numer of the person at London responsible for looking after Joy Order. ultimately i am looking here and seeing people who are big fans of recycle but hate the idea of th eband doing the same thing officially, so i do not get the hate. honestly.

Really, ultimately no-one here knows anything. So in your nine posts here, you have reached enlightenment. You have been here long enough to know who knows what. You a very perceptive person Chesty; I appalled you for your keep eye. It seems your the one who doesn’t know shit………….coming on this forum, talking about calling the record company…lol……..and what are you going to tell them Chesty; that your proud of them for choosing vinyl? That you demand more of them. Are you kidding me?

And as far as “NOOL Members giving their 2 cents without being asked”. Wow, is this your first time joining a forum for a band? A topic is posted and all the members chime in on how they feel about that topic…...It’s how this fan sites work. Nobody asked you for your opinion, but you don’t see anyone crying because you running your mouth. I’m confronting you, because I don’t agree with you. That how these forum’s work; especially here at NOOL.

We(the fans) having been chiming in for years about what we would like to see released; and the record company, and the band could care less. They are going to releases what they want to release bottom line. No fan is ever going to influence any release; bottom line.

And as far as fans here, “who are big fans of recycle but hate the idea of the band doing the same thing officially, so i do not get the hate. Honestly” It’s 50/50 here. Some fans are happy with all the official releases and new releases and others (it’s not hate) , I think it’s frustration. There are a lot of fans, that get upset that the band don’t do the catalog justice with new release or lack of new releases or lack of care and attention to detail of the back catalog. So with that said, a lot of people here are VERY gratefully for the amazing, dedicated, and very hard work that a very small circle of fans did with the Recycle. Those fans took it upon themselves, to take care of the fans, and that is why people here are loyal to them. I’m very gratefully to them as well; so you will not here me utter a foul word about them.

Now if you would have been a member here longer, you would understand that, opinions are like assholes; everyone’s got one. And you are entitled to your opinion like the next person; so welcome to the board………………..cheers

Before your time Darkman(what with you being less than a year old on ere') but you obviously forgot the furore on here when the Retro package was influened by us eh... too busy looking for 20 minute versions of Ceremony no doubt.

0_o wrote:

James Thomas wrote: Point of order;

the phrase is couldn't care less not could care less.

Thankyou.

Some do say "could care less" in the USA. Always really confused me as a child, since it makes no sense.

http://www.worldwidewords.org/qa/qa-ico1.htm

But then you lot do use abhorrent spellings such as color. Bet you don't know the correct use of borrow/lend eh. just saying

If the first 7" was the horrendous original pressing. and the second 7" was a repro on 7" of the 12" then I'd understand more.

However, this is just a bit of packaging. I won't buy it, and haven't bought a JD or NO release since the Glasgow DVD. If they want to stick out something I don't already have, or something that hasn't already been bootlegged to hell and back I'll buy it. But I'm not shelling out for old stuff I've owned for 20 years with a new picture on the cover. You might as well buy your favourite novels every time they update the cover!

Darkman

Gene wrote:

Adam Tate wrote: The fact is with only 500 released I will make money on it in a few years time. Think of JD as a new form of stamp collecting and it all makes sense. In fact I am beginning to think I should have bought more than one set !

Who says its all about the music!?

Please remember the value of your investment can go down as well as up and you may get back less than you invested!

cranelane wrote:

Gene wrote:

Adam Tate wrote: The fact is with only 500 released I will make money on it in a few years time. Think of JD as a new form of stamp collecting and it all makes sense. In fact I am beginning to think I should have bought more than one set !

Who says its all about the music!?

Please remember the value of your investment can go down as well as up and you may get back less than you invested!

...very true but the way stuff like this goes on eBay I strongly suspect I will get £130+ for the box in a few years time (especially if it is still sealed). Let's face it's a better rate of return than leaving the money in the bank!

Andrew Sayer wrote:

Darkman wrote:

Chesty wrote:

Darkman wrote:

Chesty wrote: does anyone here actually have any contact with anyone at the label or at management or the band. i am interested to know because otherwise it doesn't matter what we all think, we are just speculating. someone find out who at London Records deals with th eband and lets call them!!

in others news, i just went to buy the box and it's sold out!

Are you kidding me. This is a fan forum. Everyone here, including you, wants to put their 2 cents in. We all come here and either praise the band and their decisions or straight flame them. What does it matter if anyone on here knows the band or management; it's irrelevant. I could get a message through to Hooky for you, but frankly, I would speculate that he could care less about what you think! Thanks for the laugh thou…………….I will tell Hooky you were thinking about him………Lmfao

I am merely stating that ultimately no-one here knows anything but lots claim to be holier than thou........... well done, you can message Hooky, im sure i could too if i tried. my point is, ppl say things like 'they dont give a fuck about new order' but ultimately it's a joke because they are giving their 2 cents without being asked. i would happily call the label if someone gave me the name and numer of the person at London responsible for looking after Joy Order. ultimately i am looking here and seeing people who are big fans of recycle but hate the idea of th eband doing the same thing officially, so i do not get the hate. honestly.

Really, ultimately no-one here knows anything. So in your nine posts here, you have reached enlightenment. You have been here long enough to know who knows what. You a very perceptive person Chesty; I appalled you for your keep eye. It seems your the one who doesn’t know shit………….coming on this forum, talking about calling the record company…lol……..and what are you going to tell them Chesty; that your proud of them for choosing vinyl? That you demand more of them. Are you kidding me?

And as far as “NOOL Members giving their 2 cents without being asked”. Wow, is this your first time joining a forum for a band? A topic is posted and all the members chime in on how they feel about that topic…...It’s how this fan sites work. Nobody asked you for your opinion, but you don’t see anyone crying because you running your mouth. I’m confronting you, because I don’t agree with you. That how these forum’s work; especially here at NOOL.

We(the fans) having been chiming in for years about what we would like to see released; and the record company, and the band could care less. They are going to releases what they want to release bottom line. No fan is ever going to influence any release; bottom line.

And as far as fans here, “who are big fans of recycle but hate the idea of the band doing the same thing officially, so i do not get the hate. Honestly” It’s 50/50 here. Some fans are happy with all the official releases and new releases and others (it’s not hate) , I think it’s frustration. There are a lot of fans, that get upset that the band don’t do the catalog justice with new release or lack of new releases or lack of care and attention to detail of the back catalog. So with that said, a lot of people here are VERY gratefully for the amazing, dedicated, and very hard work that a very small circle of fans did with the Recycle. Those fans took it upon themselves, to take care of the fans, and that is why people here are loyal to them. I’m very gratefully to them as well; so you will not here me utter a foul word about them.

Now if you would have been a member here longer, you would understand that, opinions are like assholes; everyone’s got one. And you are entitled to your opinion like the next person; so welcome to the board………………..cheers

Before your time Darkman(what with you being less than a year old on ere') but you obviously forgot the furore on here when the Retro package was influened by us eh... too busy looking for 20 minute versions of Ceremony no doubt.

Actually I knew about that release; but I forgot to mention it because I have been looking every waking moment for the demo to “Mr. Disco” …….I heard the demo is straight corn flakes………

Adam Tate wrote: I strongly suspect I will get £130+ for the box in a few years time (especially if it is still sealed). Let's face it's a better rate of return than leaving the money in the bank!

Fooking 'ell. Are times that hard?

Gene wrote:

Adam Tate wrote: I strongly suspect I will get £130+ for the box in a few years time (especially if it is still sealed). Let's face it's a better rate of return than leaving the money in the bank!

Fooking 'ell. Are times that hard?

Well, it'll buy a couple of beers - Adam's right. At 500 copies, it was bound to sell out within a couple of days...

And there will be plenty of people willing to pay silly money in the future (I *WISHED* that I'd bought that back then), etc...

Yeah, all this moaning about how much it costs etc, all rubbish since you buy the thing, then sell it for more than you bought it for. Hardly something to complain about.

Ger Boy wrote: But sadly they are in it for the money, not for the fans.

The irony here is that only the fans will be buying this thing, almost all of which are probably on this forum.

Re-Member wrote:

Ger Boy wrote: But sadly they are in it for the money, not for the fans.

The irony here is that only the fans will be buying this thing, almost all of which are probably on this forum.

I certainly n.o.t. !

Re-Member wrote:

Ger Boy wrote: But sadly they are in it for the money, not for the fans.

The irony here is that only the fans will be buying this thing, almost all of which are probably on this forum.

I would have said that most of the publicity (i.e. people who bought the thing) would have been via the NME article - it sold out pretty quickly after it appeared there.

So, are the videos/interviews/tv performances/etc, going to be available on the CDs available in the Deluxe package, or just via iTunes?

Teenbeat Records, Band +/- Sue Factory Design Legend Peter Saville Over Joy Division Box Set

The video said that it contains a previously unreleased performance from 1979! It looked like the Apollo footage. Anyone know for sure..........

They should have put the complete "In a Lonely Place" in the set.

Tokoloshe Man wrote: Teenbeat Records, Band +/- Sue Factory Design Legend Peter Saville Over Joy Division Box Set

They should probably shut up, unless they were using this in 1988:

Nick King wrote: So, are the videos/interviews/tv performances/etc, going to be available on the CDs available in the Deluxe package, or just via iTunes?

An itunes LP is a unique thing and this is only available through itunes.

Tokoloshe Man wrote: Teenbeat Records, Band +/- Sue Factory Design Legend Peter Saville Over Joy Division Box Set

Just one difference between the two designs: the teenbeat thingy is crap, Saville's not.

Where did the title + - come from?

Joke

mark reed wrote: .......You might as well buy your favourite novels every time they update the cover!

Yeah I did exactly that with Deb's TOUCHING FROM THE DISTANCE !!:)

I think I'm on cover version number 5 now ....:D

"do we know officially that the record label does not care what fans think"

You don't need to speak to the record label to know that's the case. Thats just one of the reasons JD didn't sign with a major when they were asked to in 1978. We know major labels do not care about the fans or their acts. Neither Peter or Bernard can get Rhino/Warners to put out any of their new material so they don't care that much! Especially when they can make more money from rip offs, of the back catalogue like this.

The Smiths box set also from Rhino which contained 12 singles cost £25 so why is the Joy Division one being sold for £55 pure greed on behalf of the record company - the band don't need the money. Unfortunately the band having been on an indie that went bust (as with the Smiths) aren't in control of their back catalogue. They can choose whether to cooperate or promote a release but as they don't have any contract with them they can't stop any release.

I've nothing against limited editons , deluxe versions etc etc but ordinary fans who want stock copies of LWTUA or similar on a new 7" should not have to pay over £5 a pop for each single.

I would love to see a decent set of JD/New Order 7" Singles/ CD Singles box sets to go with my other sets by the Smiths/Clash/Jam etc. Unfortunately we will have to wait a little longer for those.

I did actually suggest the idea of such box sets and a rarities compilation to Hooky a couple of years ago and his words were

"In the words of the band you scratch my back I'll scratch yours"

which I took to mean he didn't think that it was that interesting an idea or more likely it would be a lot of hassle with the label to organise

Neither Peter or Bernard can get Rhino/Warners to put out any of their new material so they don't care that much! Especially when they can make more money from rip offs, of the back catalogue like this.

I don't think either really wanted to be on a major with their post-NO stuff. Signing away your music is not a good idea these days, and the inertia and problems that surround any JDNO release just shows this.

I've nothing against limited editons , deluxe versions etc etc but ordinary fans who want stock copies of LWTUA or similar on a new 7" should not have to pay over £5 a pop for each single.

...and you'll no doubt have bought the 2007 release of LWTUA?

Philip Nash wrote: "do we know officially that the record label does not care what fans think"

You don't need to speak to the record label to know that's the case. Thats just one of the reasons JD didn't sign with a major when they were asked to in 1978. We know major labels do not care about the fans or their acts. Neither Peter or Bernard can get Rhino/Warners to put out any of their new material so they don't care that much! Especially when they can make more money from rip offs, of the back catalogue like this.

The Smiths box set also from Rhino which contained 12 singles cost £25 so why is the Joy Division one being sold for £55 pure greed on behalf of the record company - the band don't need the money. Unfortunately the band having been on an indie that went bust (as with the Smiths) aren't in control of their back catalogue. They can choose whether to cooperate or promote a release but as they don't have any contract with them they can't stop any release.

I've nothing against limited editons , deluxe versions etc etc but ordinary fans who want stock copies of LWTUA or similar on a new 7" should not have to pay over £5 a pop for each single.

I would love to see a decent set of JD/New Order 7" Singles/ CD Singles box sets to go with my other sets by the Smiths/Clash/Jam etc. Unfortunately we will have to wait a little longer for those.

I did actually suggest the idea of such box sets and a rarities compilation to Hooky a couple of years ago and his words were

"In the words of the band you scratch my back I'll scratch yours"

which I took to mean he didn't think that it was that interesting an idea or more likely it would be a lot of hassle with the label to organise

i go back to my previous point and ask has anyone actually ever spoken to the record label !? it is always speculation. i also refuse to believe that the band has no input into these things!

Warner/Rhino can't just do what they want , the band have to sign off on it. This is a new product/concept, and the respective companies do not have permission to re-issue some items that have been reproduced in the boxset, without the consent of the band/management.

It's one thing having the license for "Unknown Pleasures","Closer", "Still" and "Substance", but you cant just go off making "Isolation" a single and reproducing deleted singles that they never issued. The band have to know and agreee to this, and obviously they did.

I'm not sure what the point you're all making is. The band were fully involved in the concept and mastering of this box set. It is a re-imagining of JD in 7" single form, not a reproduction of what was originally released. To reproduce the singles as they were has many financial and practical drawbacks since one crammed 4 tracks on a 7" and sounded awful, one was part of a 12" EP, one was part of a double set and hand wrapped in a poly sealed sleeve, LWTUA had two tracks on one side too. Only Transmission could easily be reproduced 'as was'.

It is its own thing, not a historical reproduction.

The members of the band were aware, involved and are very happy with the outcome! Done and dusted there.

Apparently the pairing of "Isolation" and "Heart & Soul" as a single was Steve's idea.

http://cgi.ebay.co.uk/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=250733164642

...here are the two CDs you'll be getting in the boxes, sent out as promos and now on eBay.

I do not believe that these are the deluxe cds - apparently the track listing kept changing when it was decided what was to be on the cds. It would be just plain daft if it was - as each of the box sets have download codes anyway.

My guess is that these are sets for reviewers and radio stations.

leefact25 wrote: I do not believe that these are the deluxe cds - apparently the track listing kept changing when it was decided what was to be on the cds. It would be just plain daft if it was - as each of the box sets have download codes anyway.

My guess is that these are sets for reviewers and radio stations.

If I was a betting man, I'd bet that they are...

The Smiths ones were the ones given out as promos, though I think there were slight differences.

I don't reckon they'd go to the trouble of producing two sets of CDs for this.

All I saying is, don't go mad getting these promos if you're one of the 500, you may well be throwing your money away.

taken from the rhino site

+- boxes are individually numbered 1-5000. Numbers 1-500 will be available as a super deluxe version and will contain a limited edition Peter Saville art piece as well as two exclusive promotional CD’s “+” and “-“.

why is this confusing anyone? obviously these are promotional.

ebay has removed the promo from their site

So if you buy the boxset, you get access to the iTunes LP, which includes all the extras? Or you only get the mp3s?

You get mp3s.

If you want the itunes LP you have to buy that seperately.

johnny james wrote: You get mp3s.

If you want the itunes LP you have to buy that seperately.

Ain't that some BULLSHIT!

Can anyone who has bought the iTunes LP give a brief rundown on what the digital artwork is like?

I've bought every album and compilation, even the box set. Saville fan too, and unless the Saville digital artwork portion is something special I'm giving this release a pass as buying the same material 5 times over is enough I think. Not to mention I've been listening to this stuff for 20 years now...getting a bit tired of it as great as it is.

In a recent Stephen Morris interview he stated the following re the Joy Division 7" boxset.

"Going through all the tapes and finding the best versions of each song was probably the most time consuming, as some of Martin's and our own notes and labelling were a bit wayward. It was really listening to a lot of stuff, including some versions I'd forgotten about and deciding what sounded the best"

Anyone notice anything different in any of the versions on this release?

didt buy it,, dont see the point realy, would have liked to have gone to the q/a session with steve , though not a lot new revealed?

what you gonna do when the novelty has gone.

im waiting on the quadraphonic box set

not ian wrote: im waiting on the quadraphonic box set

well....i'm waiting on the 8-track cartridge version

Is it true that the CDs that came with the deluxe edition is CDR:s and not factory pressed CDs?

Ruskprick wrote: Is it true that the CDs that came with the deluxe edition is CDR:s and not factory pressed CDs?

..yes it is true that they are Promotional CDRs not proper glass mastered CDs. The CDRs have some audio glitches as well.

Adam Tate wrote:

Ruskprick wrote: Is it true that the CDs that came with the deluxe edition is CDR:s and not factory pressed CDs?

..yes it is true that they are Promotional CDRs not proper glass mastered CDs. The CDRs have some audio glitches as well.

Did the advertisement on Rhinos web site mention this fact?

Ruskprick wrote:

Adam Tate wrote:

Ruskprick wrote: Is it true that the CDs that came with the deluxe edition is CDR:s and not factory pressed CDs?

..yes it is true that they are Promotional CDRs not proper glass mastered CDs. The CDRs have some audio glitches as well.

Did the advertisement on Rhinos web site mention this fact?

...I complained to the Rhino Project Manager about this very point. Gary said the original website called them Promotional discs. Gary offered to burn me a new set of CDRs without the glitches on blank discs. However, I passed on this as these would have not had the original disc labels.