Peter Hook: "New Odour, as I call them"

Peter Hook of New Order fame plays Toronto Sept. 19 While old bandmates Hook, Bernard Sumner, Stephen Morris and Gillian Gilbert continue their dispute, Hook tours with new band the Light

By: Ben Rayner Pop Music Critic, Published on Tue Sep 17 2013

The odds of New Order ever kissing and making up again seem pretty slim, as the ferocious war of words between bassist Peter Hook and former bandmates Bernard Sumner, Stephen Morris and Gillian Gilbert shows no sign of abating anytime soon.

Oh well, at least that part of it is entertaining. Meanwhile, fans are left with the unthinkable spectacle of New Order touring since its 2011 “reformation” without the man whose limber bass lines were the signature feature of its sound, and Peter Hook touring and playing guitar in a new band, the Light, that’s performing New Order’s first two albums, 1981’s Movement and 1983’s Power, Corruption & Lies, in their entirety on the road.

Hook and the Light — which also features his 24-year-old son, Jack, on bass and three gents from his old side project, Monaco — have already done a couple of tours performing Unknown Pleasures and Closer, the two classic albums left to us by Joy Division before frontman Ian Curtis committed suicide in 1980. Those jaunts were done, says Hook, to honour his old friend and bandmate’s legacy. This one seems to be at least partly about sticking it to New Order, but also about exhuming a lot of fabulous tunes that never had a chance to be heard from the stage. He’s already looking forward to doing Low-Life and Brotherhood next summer.

The Star rang Hook up last week on a phone that just happened to be wearing an Unknown Pleasures case. He plays the Hoxton on Thursday, Sept. 19.

Q. So are you just gonna run through the entire New Order catalogue now that you’ve got Unknown Pleasures and Closer out of the way?

A. No, I think the idea is to run through the Peter Hook catalogue. It struck me that I was having such fun playing all this stuff that had been ignored for years I may as well carry on going through all the other stuff that I was ignoring for years, as well; I suppose the idea being that you play every track that you’ve ever recorded at least once before you shuffle off this mortal coil and go and join Ian Curtis in the great band in the sky.

Q. There’s a lot of stuff that never got played live at all.

A. You know what, the strangest thing about it all is that every time you bring these songs up and you’ve not played them for 20 years, you’re like: “Oh my god.” Some of them are that great that you wonder why you wouldn’t play them for 20 years. . . . In New Order, before we split, there was always a certain reluctance, shall we say, on Bernard’s part and Stephen’s to revisit the past: not the Joy Division stuff, the old New Order stuff. You do take on board the fact that you’ve moved on, but it did seem rather a shame and the thing is, you ended up doing the same set, more or less, every night. And, I must admit, I’m delighted to see that in 2011 and 2012 they’ve kept up with that remit and changed the set very little from when it was 2006.

Q. It does seem like you’re having fun tearing into these tunes.

A. I suppose the odd thing was that, in New Order before we split up, there was a barrier to you doing it and now that that’s been removed it’s like being given the keys to a toy shop. You’re able to run in and grab them all. It’s fantastic.

Q. Is there any chance of a reconciliation between you guys?

A. We’re still no nearer an agreement, never mind a reconciliation. The fact that they did what they did behind my back without me knowing, without my knowledge or consent, is something that I’m still fighting. I don’t think it’s fair and I’m still looking for a legal remedy to that.

Q. As far as I’m concerned, it’s not New Order without Peter Hook. But surely you’re aware that there are others out there who don’t approve of what you’re doing, either.

A. It’s interesting for me because I’m not pretending to be something I’m not. It would be like me touring and saying I was Joy Division, in my eyes. In my opinion, it would be like me calling myself Joy Division and playing Unknown Pleasures. That’s how much of a travesty they are.

Q. It’s sad to see all fall apart like this.

A. It’s quite a unique happening, which I’m very proud of. I’m sure Rob (Gretton) and Tony Wilson and Martin Hannett would be very proud to see us doing it so publicly. We might as well have booked a boxing ring and sold tickets. This is like a verbal boxing ring, isn’t it?

Q. At least you get to play with your son in the Light.

A. My son learned to play bass much earlier than me, actually. He learned about 13 or 14 years old. And while his taste in music did not stretch to Joy Division or New Order — he’s much more into Queens of the Stone Age and Metallica and it was always him telling me to turn down my bloody racket — he became quite good at playing bass. He had his own group. So what happened was that when I decided to get the group together, he was in college and because I couldn’t get a singer, I then had to step into those rather big shoes and I needed a bass player and he was all too ready to volunteer. Unfortunately, I’ve gotten into very much trouble with his mother — his two mothers, actually — because he gave up college to come with me. I’ve shot myself in the foot. He’s becoming a very tough taskmaster, actually. He’s very, very enthusiastic. I keep having to remind him how old I am with the amount of work that he’s desperately trying to get me to do.

Q. I guess you didn’t get to tour much with New Order, either.

A. I am enjoying it, that’s the thing. In New Order, towards the end I don’t think there was very much enjoyment in it for anybody. I loved touring. Unfortunately, dragging a rather heavy load about became rather tiresome. This is what amuses me now with the new New Order — New Odour, as I call them — their love of touring. It’s like they’ve been kidnapped by aliens.

Q. Again, this all makes me very sad.

A. It’s a very odd situation. Because for me, as a businessman — which I have been and have had to be for a long time — it’s a hell of a way to do business. If you’re gonna come back and bring the group back from the dead, I would have thought that you’d want to make the way as smooth as possible and surround it with good vibes instead of the way that they’ve done it because you stand a very good chance of ostracizing the very people that you’re trying to appeal to because of your behaviour. I find it very strange, actually. But it’s not stranger than I found it when I was in New Order, so there you go.

Q. So the Light is it for the foreseeable future?

A. As long as there is somebody there to listen, I will be bitching away and playing away until the day that the Good Lord decides to shut me up forever.

http://www.thestar.com/entertainment/music/2013/09/17/peter_hook_of_new_order_fame_plays_toronto_sept_19.html#

He's going to carry on bitching away. Oh good, I was worried there for a moment!

Maybe they have their own personal reasons that make touring more convenient.... for example, family issues? And they are still New Order, IMO. They're not pretending to be anything they're not--- because they are New Order.

Tragic and embarrassing

Roger Waters regrets...

What year is it?

New Odour isnt even funny. Id have more respect if he just called them Wank Order, or Bunchacunts Order or something. New Odour sounds like someone unfunny trying to be funny and Hookys funny when he wants to be.

He really shouldn't be denigrating the name since he has a very vested interest in it, and continues to exploit it for his own ends.

Andy wrote: Roger Waters regrets...

I've always saw something familiar between Waters and the Floyds' struggle and this animosity with Hooky and his ex-band mates... I can imagine apologies from both sides in the future.

UpDownTurnAround wrote: Tragic and embarrassing

Dead right, pack it in Hooky.

Let Mr 1000 pound/hr sort it out

They should have finished the band in 1990 indeed 💀

Big Mouth Julio wrote: They should have finished the band in 1990 indeed 💀

really? but then we would never have had Regret, Crystal, Turn and Working Overtime!!!

Another interview

Excerpt:

Indy: I'd like to begin by asking about the transition from Joy Division to New Order, and the band going on to work with dance producers like Arthur Baker. Did that feel like a departure for you, or was it, in some way, an extension of what you'd been doing all along?

Peter Hook: Well to be honest with you, it felt like too radical a departure for me. I'd been very happy being the bass player in a rock band, and to be presented with this new kind of music basically done by robots, it seemed a bit threatening to me.

Andy wrote: Another interview

Excerpt:

Indy: I'd like to begin by asking about the transition from Joy Division to New Order, and the band going on to work with dance producers like Arthur Baker. Did that feel like a departure for you, or was it, in some way, an extension of what you'd been doing all along?

Peter Hook: Well to be honest with you, it felt like too radical a departure for me. I'd been very happy being the bass player in a rock band, and to be presented with this new kind of music basically done by robots, it seemed a bit threatening to me.

Hmmm... interesting quotes....

Indy: I'd like to begin by asking about the transition from Joy Division to New Order, and the band going on to work with dance producers like Arthur Baker. Did that feel like a departure for you, or was it, in some way, an extension of what you'd been doing all along?

Peter Hook: Well to be honest with you, it felt like too radical a departure for me. I'd been very happy being the bass player in a rock band, and to be presented with this new kind of music basically done by robots, it seemed a bit threatening to me.

But not so threatening as to put him off performing said tracks with the Light?

Coops wrote:

Indy: I'd like to begin by asking about the transition from Joy Division to New Order, and the band going on to work with dance producers like Arthur Baker. Did that feel like a departure for you, or was it, in some way, an extension of what you'd been doing all along?

Peter Hook: Well to be honest with you, it felt like too radical a departure for me. I'd been very happy being the bass player in a rock band, and to be presented with this new kind of music basically done by robots, it seemed a bit threatening to me.

But not so threatening as to put him off performing said tracks with the Light?

Good point, Coops.

Coops wrote:

Indy: I'd like to begin by asking about the transition from Joy Division to New Order, and the band going on to work with dance producers like Arthur Baker. Did that feel like a departure for you, or was it, in some way, an extension of what you'd been doing all along?

Peter Hook: Well to be honest with you, it felt like too radical a departure for me. I'd been very happy being the bass player in a rock band, and to be presented with this new kind of music basically done by robots, it seemed a bit threatening to me.

But not so threatening as to put him off performing said tracks with the Light?

Does that comment even make sense?

He was a bass player. People started using technology which could effectively make drummers, bass players and guitarists (let's face it, any musicians) redundant, then of course he probably felt threatened at the time. I'm sure a whole generation of musicians felt threatened.

It didn't stop him performing tracks in New Order which were 'basically done by robots' either, did it?

is it bro wrote:

Big Mouth Julio wrote: They should have finished the band in 1990 indeed 💀

really? but then we would never have had Regret, Crystal, Turn and Working Overtime!!!

Julio and his old lamentation, as usual... 😴

El Jarvo wrote:

Coops wrote:

Indy: I'd like to begin by asking about the transition from Joy Division to New Order, and the band going on to work with dance producers like Arthur Baker. Did that feel like a departure for you, or was it, in some way, an extension of what you'd been doing all along?

Peter Hook: Well to be honest with you, it felt like too radical a departure for me. I'd been very happy being the bass player in a rock band, and to be presented with this new kind of music basically done by robots, it seemed a bit threatening to me.

But not so threatening as to put him off performing said tracks with the Light?

Does that comment even make sense?

He was a bass player. People started using technology which could effectively make drummers, bass players and guitarists (let's face it, any musicians) redundant, then of course he probably felt threatened at the time. I'm sure a whole generation of musicians felt threatened.

It didn't stop him performing tracks in New Order which were 'basically done by robots' either, did it?

Aracri wrote:

is it bro wrote:

Big Mouth Julio wrote: They should have finished the band in 1990 indeed 💀

really? but then we would never have had Regret, Crystal, Turn and Working Overtime!!!

Julio and his old lamentation, as usual... 😴

Fortunately, I will have the chance to see Monaco playing New Order next week

Big Mouth Julio wrote: They should have finished the band in 1990 indeed 💀

"Finsbury Park 2002 Brasilia 2006 Sao Paulo 2006 1st Night Sao Paulo 2006 2nd Night Sao Paulo 2011 Lima 2013 Bogota 2013"

Then you'd never have seen them live?

😎

El Jarvo wrote:

Coops wrote:

Indy: I'd like to begin by asking about the transition from Joy Division to New Order, and the band going on to work with dance producers like Arthur Baker. Did that feel like a departure for you, or was it, in some way, an extension of what you'd been doing all along?

Peter Hook: Well to be honest with you, it felt like too radical a departure for me. I'd been very happy being the bass player in a rock band, and to be presented with this new kind of music basically done by robots, it seemed a bit threatening to me.

But not so threatening as to put him off performing said tracks with the Light?

Does that comment even make sense?

He was a bass player. People started using technology which could effectively make drummers, bass players and guitarists (let's face it, any musicians) redundant, then of course he probably felt threatened at the time. I'm sure a whole generation of musicians felt threatened.

It didn't stop him performing tracks in New Order which were 'basically done by robots' either, did it?

I've tried to remain impartial regarding the split but this quote was significant to me for two reasons:

1. When interviewers praise him for New Order's pioneering work in tbe development of electronic music, he proudly acknowledges the bands' achievements.

2. If he had that little input into the bands' direction, that early on, how can he claim that New Order can't exist without him?

I didn't say he resented, or even took credit for their pioneering work. I just wanted to point out that he's saying he wasn't on board with something that was a crucial aspect to their appeal/mission.

I liked Revenge and loved Monaco but considering how many years down the line that work appeared, "sophisticated" is a bit of a stretch.

Nick King wrote:

Big Mouth Julio wrote: They should have finished the band in 1990 indeed 💀

"Finsbury Park 2002 Brasilia 2006 Sao Paulo 2006 1st Night Sao Paulo 2006 2nd Night Sao Paulo 2011 Lima 2013 Bogota 2013"

Then you'd never have seen them live?

😎

Joy Division either [eek2]

I don't understand how he could've been threatened by the technology back then. It's possible to play an actual bass (or other instruments) with a synth-based song, as they did early on.... On top of that, it's humans that program the beats and sounds, not the other way around.... I don't know the band members, but do you think Steve or Bernard ever felt 'threatened' by the new technology and synths?

leather-girl wrote: I don't understand how he could've been threatened by the technology back then. It's possible to play an actual bass (or other instruments) with a synth-based song, as they did early on.... On top of that, it's humans that program the beats and sounds, not the other way around.... I don't know the band members, but do you think Steve or Bernard ever felt 'threatened' by the new technology and synths?

Totally agreed. As Pink Floyd's guitarrist David Gilmour said [about technology in music] in 1972: "it's all extensions of what's coming out of our heads... the equipment isn't actually thinking about what to do any of the time. It couldn't control itself". And as one of the pioneers of using synths and sequencers in popular music (even before Kraftwerk and Giorgio Moroder), they weren't threatened by the new technology at that time. I think Hooky once more doesn't had something relevant to say and said the first bullshit that came on to his head... again. 😄

Another interview (and change in tune)

Excerpt:

“I think the main reason for this was that all three of us were becoming more and more interested in electronics — particularly sequencers and synthesizers,” Hook said. “You can hear the beginnings of this on ‘Closer,’ the final Joy Division record. So when it came to New Order, it was only natural that our interests in electronics would continue to grow and that this would then show itself in our new music.”

Andy wrote: Another interview (and change in tune)

Excerpt:

“I think the main reason for this was that all three of us were becoming more and more interested in electronics — particularly sequencers and synthesizers,” Hook said. “You can hear the beginnings of this on ‘Closer,’ the final Joy Division record. So when it came to New Order, it was only natural that our interests in electronics would continue to grow and that this would then show itself in our new music.”

It makes much more sense... probably, that's what everyone always thought about.

Aracri wrote: I think Hooky once more doesn't had something relevant to say and said the first bullshit that came on to his head... again. 😄

Yeah. I love Hooky live but in interviews he's a bit like Jordan's pussy: doesn't think before opening its lips. I loved it in 93 when he said Republic was a classic NO-sounding LP, now it's all fuck Bernard and Hague.

Threatened? They "fookin" invented much of it.

I really wish Peter would SHUT IT!

"New Odour". ? Does he mean they stink? If yes, funny that this comes from the person in the band that always looked like he needed a shower.

Tim wrote:

leather-girl wrote: do you think Steve or Bernard ever felt 'threatened' by the new technology and synths?

Hardly, both Bernard and Steve totally embraced the new technology, and Bernard was responsible for most of the innovation in their use of technology, from the bubbling sound on These Days to EGG, arpeggiators and all kinds of weirdness.

😎

This sounds most likely

"Also, Bernard and Stephen's interest in technology really bloomed from 1982. I was the old stick-in-the-mud saying 'can't we just rock out?'

Andy wrote: This sounds most likely

"Also, Bernard and Stephen's interest in technology really bloomed from 1982. I was the old stick-in-the-mud saying 'can't we just rock out?'

Yeah I'm no expert but this makes sense to me. When Melody Maker's Paul Lester wasn't wanking over Thieves Like Us he did a massive masturbatory article http://www.neworderonline.com/Common/Topic.aspx?Topic=Article031 and Hooky says it was really Bernard who was into the technology, Hooky himself who was into rocking. As Claud Flowers' book points out, it's no coincidence that 'Electronic' is synth with supporting guitars, 'One True Passion' the opposite formula. You get the same impression from the Glasgow DVD interview with Pete.

is it bro wrote:

Big Mouth Julio wrote: They should have finished the band in 1990 indeed 💀

really? but then we would never have had Regret, Crystal, Turn and Working Overtime!!!

Or Sugarcane, that pile of sub-One Direction wank. Oh joy.

Andy wrote: Another interview (and change in tune)

Excerpt:

“I think the main reason for this was that all three of us were becoming more and more interested in electronics — particularly sequencers and synthesizers,” Hook said. “You can hear the beginnings of this on ‘Closer,’ the final Joy Division record. So when it came to New Order, it was only natural that our interests in electronics would continue to grow and that this would then show itself in our new music.”

This article says, 'New Order was originally Joy Division.' Fucking hell, another scoop. You learn a new thing every day. Thank you for that.