Info on the forthcoming (updated) Singles release

Mr Discography wrote: I haven't received the CD from the New Order store yet, but 'Spooky' is the 'Republic' album version on the Spotify version of the remastered 'Singles', despite being labelled as the (Fluke) 'Minimix'. Is this the case on the LP/CD? Another tracklisting balls up?

The CD/LP has the Minimix. It was a late change so I guess someone messed up the digital.

Let the fuck ups begin. How to review a New Order album:

1. Listen to each song in isolation and make detailed notes on their initial impact; then, deadlines permitting, repeat a week later. Do the tracks grow steadily with each visit, or are they already wearing thin?
2. Pay particular attention to the lyrics, the 'soul' of each piece. Pinpoint if there are any cultural or historical references: if so, evaluate whether they are universalised or mere fads, which may hence seem trite after years or even months.
3. Do any songs seem to come particularly 'from the heart'? Then research the composer's personal environment at the time of writing. You can also use social networks to contact friends, business colleagues or even band members themselves. Do be discreet though: bear in mind that unless you can lavish Rolling-Stone-esque publicity and currency, you're unlikely to be their first port of call!
4. Try to remove the vocal track and objectively analyse the music itself. Maybe you locate a band trade mark or the influence of current trends: remember that the best bands are both 'a part of' yet 'apart from' the mainstream.
5. Order your thoughts into a coherent whole with a succinct introduction, detailed 'main body' and brief but satisfying conclusion; then print onto a single, double spaced A4 sheet of paper.
6. Roll up the piece of paper and shove it up your arse and write, OMG, New Order are AWESOME, they're AWESOME and I love them, they're so AWESOME, I mean HELLO? I mean I like ONLY GREW UP WITH THESE GUYS, they are MY BAND and they're AWESOME.

Johnny James wrote:

Do you really need the text in the booklet changing too? Really? It's correct for the time that the release was originally compiled, it's not meant to be a a 'new' thing.

Not "needed" but would've been a nice touch at minimal effort. They went to the trouble of updating and adding tracks, so it is now somewhat of a "new" thing. The liner notes end with talk of WFTSC; the tracks now end at Lost Sirens.

depthcharge wrote:

Imagine a day when a New Order label actually consults some hardcore fans before throwing together another compilation. Free expertise and error correction.

Johnny James wrote:

It's happened.

Do you care to elaborate? I've lost track - and interest - of the endless errors made on endless compilations over the years. Who can lay claim to what?

Seriously impressed with the sound on vinyl...wow!

My only criticism so far is some dodgy typesetting on the credits...Here to Stay and 1963, sorry, Nineteen63 seem to have gone walkies. Doesn't anyone proof these things?

But in the scheme of NO compilation fuckups that's a small price to pay ;)

Michael Monkhouse wrote: Let the fuck ups begin. How to review a New Order album:

1. Listen to each song in isolation and make detailed notes on their initial impact; then, deadlines permitting, repeat a week later. Do the tracks grow steadily with each visit, or are they already wearing thin?
2. Pay particular attention to the lyrics, the 'soul' of each piece. Pinpoint if there are any cultural or historical references: if so, evaluate whether they are universalised or mere fads, which may hence seem trite after years or even months.
3. Do any songs seem to come particularly 'from the heart'? Then research the composer's personal environment at the time of writing. You can also use social networks to contact friends, business colleagues or even band members themselves. Do be discreet though: bear in mind that unless you can lavish Rolling-Stone-esque publicity and currency, you're unlikely to be their first port of call!
4. Try to remove the vocal track and objectively analyse the music itself. Maybe you locate a band trade mark or the influence of current trends: remember that the best bands are both 'a part of' yet 'apart from' the mainstream.
5. Order your thoughts into a coherent whole with a succinct introduction, detailed 'main body' and brief but satisfying conclusion; then print onto a single, double spaced A4 sheet of paper.
6. Roll up the piece of paper and shove it up your arse and write, OMG, New Order are AWESOME, they're AWESOME and I love them, they're so AWESOME, I mean HELLO? I mean I like ONLY GREW UP WITH THESE GUYS, they are MY BAND and they're AWESOME.

What about mentioning dead singers and how often it rains in Manchester?

The newly remastered version is infinitely superior to the original release, so I honestly hate to nitpick, but...

On the US CD edition, there is a brief bit of distortion at 00:18 on "World (The Price Of Love)." It's also present on the Spotify stream.

Can someone please confirm if this glitch is also present on the UK/EU CD?

Given that the radio edit of "World" is available elsewhere, it's not a deal breaker. However, it's a bit peculiar that a selection from the London era has an audible issue, as opposed to a track from the poorly maintained Factory archives.

Shelf wrote: The newly remastered version is infinitely superior to the original release, so I honestly hate to nitpick, but...

On the US CD edition, there is a brief bit of distortion at 00:18 on "World (The Price Of Love)." It's also present on the Spotify stream.

Can someone please confirm if this glitch is also present on the UK/EU CD?

Given that the radio edit of "World" is available elsewhere, it's not a deal breaker. However, it's a bit peculiar that a selection from the London era has an audible issue, as opposed to a track from the poorly maintained Factory archives.

I can't hear anything on a rip of the UK one.

FWIW The Factory era material is all on analogue tapes and they're mostly present and correct. Analogue tape ages well if looked after and can still be transferred successfully.

On the other hand, the early London material is mostly on DAT, which has quality limitations and is prone to be unplayable.

Shelf wrote: The newly remastered version is infinitely superior to the original release, so I honestly hate to nitpick, but...

On the US CD edition, there is a brief bit of distortion at 00:18 on "World (The Price Of Love)." It's also present on the Spotify stream.

Can someone please confirm if this glitch is also present on the UK/EU CD?

Given that the radio edit of "World" is available elsewhere, it's not a deal breaker. However, it's a bit peculiar that a selection from the London era has an audible issue, as opposed to a track from the poorly maintained Factory archives.

Yes, it's also present.

I'm getting old - I caught myself preferring CD2 to CD1.

Coops wrote:

Michael Monkhouse wrote: Let the fuck ups begin. How to review a New Order album:

1. Listen to each song in isolation and make detailed notes on their initial impact; then, deadlines permitting, repeat a week later. Do the tracks grow steadily with each visit, or are they already wearing thin?
2. Pay particular attention to the lyrics, the 'soul' of each piece. Pinpoint if there are any cultural or historical references: if so, evaluate whether they are universalised or mere fads, which may hence seem trite after years or even months.
3. Do any songs seem to come particularly 'from the heart'? Then research the composer's personal environment at the time of writing. You can also use social networks to contact friends, business colleagues or even band members themselves. Do be discreet though: bear in mind that unless you can lavish Rolling-Stone-esque publicity and currency, you're unlikely to be their first port of call!
4. Try to remove the vocal track and objectively analyse the music itself. Maybe you locate a band trade mark or the influence of current trends: remember that the best bands are both 'a part of' yet 'apart from' the mainstream.
5. Order your thoughts into a coherent whole with a succinct introduction, detailed 'main body' and brief but satisfying conclusion; then print onto a single, double spaced A4 sheet of paper.
6. Roll up the piece of paper and shove it up your arse and write, OMG, New Order are AWESOME, they're AWESOME and I love them, they're so AWESOME, I mean HELLO? I mean I like ONLY GREW UP WITH THESE GUYS, they are MY BAND and they're AWESOME.

What about mentioning dead singers and how often it rains in Manchester?

The Curtis reference always cracks me up too. It's been 638063 years - do you think there's still a fan who doesn't know about it? Strange they never introduce Hooky as the brains behind Revenge, or Steve as co-Genius behind Night Voice.

Johnny James wrote: I can't hear anything on a rip of the UK one.

FWIW The Factory era material is all on analogue tapes and they're mostly present and correct. Analogue tape ages well if looked after and can still be transferred successfully.

On the other hand, the early London material is mostly on DAT, which has quality limitations and is prone to be unplayable.

Fascinating - I would have expected the opposite.

When working with Factory master tapes, I would expect the key factor to consider is "if well looked after." Although James Nice at LTM has made a cottage industry out of preserving that back catalog.

Listened to disc 1 on my commute today. 'The Perfect Kiss' is not the UK or FBN/promo seven inch version, nor the alternate seven inch mix from 'Total', but yet another variant. Listen carefully for the wobble at 0:02 (first chord after the four beat intro - also present on the 'Total' version, but not on the original seven inch). Also, at 2:06, the (much discussed) "Wh...." aborted attack from the "When you area alone at night" line present in the 'Low-Life', 'Total' and 7" edits is absent. So this version has either been created just for this compilation, or was an alternate edit from way back, incorrectly sourced for this compilation.

The promo (FBN) original seven inch was essentially the 'Low-Life' edit with the intro bongos + drum fill and four bars after both choruses edited out. And it still remains unreleased on CD - along with the actual, 3:51 UK seven inch version, of course!

All other versions on disc 1 are the correct, original seven inch mixes ('Blue Monday' excepted of course). So, not a bad attempt to correct this collection, but no cigar. They really should run their pre-masters past us fans (i.e. me) first for proper quality control!

My comments on disc 2 to follow after tomorrow's commute!

Anyone else have trouble with the download code with the vinyl edition? Screen comes up blank, no download and of course code is expired. Someone on FB complained about the same so I'm guessing it's an issue... :(

I've no interest in re-purchasing this remastered singles collection, much as it is nice to see some care being taken with the project.

However, JJ's mentioning Spooky's Minimix caused me to dust off my old 2CD Spooky single box and have a listen to the neglected Minimix & Magimix, which I had previously largely overlooked in favour of the Stadium mix, with its extra emphasis on the Hookybass. (Oh, how times change!)

What a pleasant surprise - I think I may be including Spooky Mini/Magimix on my next playlist, so thanks for that. :-)

Played disc 2 on the cycle to work today. I can confirm that all are the correct single versions. Can also confirm the audio glitch on the left channel at 0:18 into 'World (The Price Of Love)', alas.

I have my own 7" singles playlist in my iTunes, and have updated it to include (almost) all of these new remasters, which - it has to be said - do sound very good. With the exception of:

• 'The Perfect Kiss', which I replaced with a vinyl grab of 3:51 UK 7" edit - but could also have replaced it with the FBN UK Promo Edit (which isn't the version on the remastered 'Singles', as mentioned in my earlier post above)
• 'World (The Price Of Love)', which I replaced with '(The Best Of) New Order' version
• '1963 (Arthur Baker Radio Mix)', which I thought a bit tinny on the new remaster, so I replaced it with the version from the US '(The Best Of) New Order', which has a warmer lower end to it.

I can also confirm that all tracks on the compilation have left and right channels the correct way round - unlike most on the original release which had them reversed (particularly most of the Factory singles).

So, almost a definitive collection, bar 'The Perfect Kiss' being an alternate, incorrect single edit (again); a very tiny audio glitch in 'World'; and a tinny remaster of '1963'. Naturally, I've added the four 'Music Complete' radio edits to the end of my iTunes playlist (and taken off 'Turn' and 'I'll Stay With You', which weren't singles, and 'Blue Monday' 12", which wasn't a 7" version).

But... The question is... should the definitive New Order 7" singles also include 'Guilt Is A Useless Emotion', which was a single in the US, but not in the UK..? What do you think?

Mr Discography wrote:

So, almost a definitive collection, bar 'The Perfect Kiss' being an alternate, incorrect single edit (again); a very tiny audio glitch in 'World'; and a tinny remaster of '1963'. Naturally, I've added the four 'Music Complete' radio edits to the end of my iTunes playlist (and taken off 'Turn' and 'I'll Stay With You', which weren't singles, and 'Blue Monday' 12", which wasn't a 7" version).

sure i'll stay with you was a promo: https://www.discogs.com/New-Order-Ill-Stay-With-You/release/4482086

promo

But... The question is... should the definitive New Order 7" singles also include 'Guilt Is A Useless Emotion', which was a single in the US, but not in the UK..? What do you think?

sure, add it, it's a single.

also, i would, and will add the japanese 7" promo edit of blue monday (or the video edit), since they were official.

there are promo edits on here anyways, so it's no different to me.

later -1

negative1 wrote:

sure, add it, it's a single.

also, i would, and will add the japanese 7" promo edit of blue monday (or the video edit), since they were official.

there are promo edits on here anyways, so it's no different to me.

later -1

I would do, but I don't have it (I own original copies of all the others). Does anyone have any of the original 'Blue Monday' 7" edits (apart from the band)?

Mr Discography wrote: So, almost a definitive collection, bar 'The Perfect Kiss' being an alternate, incorrect single edit (again)

Recreated, but with an improved edit. Is that bad thing?

Mr Discography wrote: But... The question is... should the definitive New Order 7" singles also include 'Guilt Is A Useless Emotion', which was a single in the US, but not in the UK..? What do you think?

The nearest thing to a 7" edit was Morel's Pink Noise Radio mix. You could also argue for 'Hellbent', being that it was a promo single for 'Total'.

Also, if GIAUE should be there, so should 'Someone Like You' (also a remix only release).

Where does it end?

Mr Discography wrote:

negative1 wrote:

sure, add it, it's a single.

also, i would, and will add the japanese 7" promo edit of blue monday (or the video edit), since they were official.

there are promo edits on here anyways, so it's no different to me.

later -1

I would do, but I don't have it (I own original copies of all the others). Does anyone have any of the original 'Blue Monday' 7" edits (apart from the band)?

there are plenty of recreations.

and in fact a really good copy on the recycle bootleg:

https://www.discogs.com/New-Order-Excerpts-From-Recycle/release/885232

3 Blue Monday (Seven Inch Edit) 4:09

recycle

later -1

Johnny James wrote:

Mr Discography wrote: So, almost a definitive collection, bar 'The Perfect Kiss' being an alternate, incorrect single edit (again)

Recreated, but with an improved edit. Is that bad thing?

Mr Discography wrote: But... The question is... should the definitive New Order 7" singles also include 'Guilt Is A Useless Emotion', which was a single in the US, but not in the UK..? What do you think?

The nearest thing to a 7" edit was Morel's Pink Noise Radio mix. You could also argue for 'Hellbent', being that it was a promo single for 'Total'.

Also, if GIAUE should be there, so should 'Someone Like You' (also a remix only release).

Where does it end?

'Perfect Kiss' isn't improved, due to the 'wobble' at 0:02. And it's not either of the two original 7" mixes. 'Hellbent' and 'I'll Stay With You' had CD-R promos sent to stations to promote 'Total' and 'Lost Sirens', but didn't have dedicated single releases commercially available - so not counted as singles. Similar to 'Plastic', which was an instant grat from 'Music Complete', but not officially a single release.

The album version of 'Guilt Is A Useless Emotion' was the lead track on its US single release, so that is the single mix as well. 'Someone Like You' was a single, but twelve inch only with solely DJ remixes, and nothing close to a single mix - so not eligible for my own 'Singles' playlist.

Didn't want a song on more than once, so sticking with 'Blue Monday 1988' instead of the original 12', as that's the most commonly available "radio edit".

Mr Discography wrote:

'Perfect Kiss' isn't improved, due to the 'wobble' at 0:02. And it's not either of the two original 7" mixes. 'Hellbent' and 'I'll Stay With You' had CD-R promos sent to stations to promote 'Total' and 'Lost Sirens', but didn't have dedicated single releases commercially available - so not counted as singles. Similar to 'Plastic', which was an instant grat from 'Music Complete', but not officially a single release.

The album version of 'Guilt Is A Useless Emotion' was the lead track on its US single release, so that is the single mix as well. 'Someone Like You' was a single, but twelve inch only with solely DJ remixes, and nothing close to a single mix - so not eligible for my own 'Singles' playlist.

Didn't want a song on more than once, so sticking with 'Blue Monday 1988' instead of the original 12', as that's the most commonly available "radio edit".

the following were 7" promo edits, and only released that way:

6 Confusion (UK 7" Promo Edt) (2015 Remastered Version) 4:09 <- german 7" promo's were also released

7 Thieves Like Us (7" Promo Edit) (2015 Remastered Version) 3:56 <- with a promo edit of 'lonesome tonight' on the b-side

yes, of course they were full 12 inch singles, but the single versions were never released properly either.

later -1

negative1 wrote:

Mr Discography wrote:

'Perfect Kiss' isn't improved, due to the 'wobble' at 0:02. And it's not either of the two original 7" mixes. 'Hellbent' and 'I'll Stay With You' had CD-R promos sent to stations to promote 'Total' and 'Lost Sirens', but didn't have dedicated single releases commercially available - so not counted as singles. Similar to 'Plastic', which was an instant grat from 'Music Complete', but not officially a single release.

The album version of 'Guilt Is A Useless Emotion' was the lead track on its US single release, so that is the single mix as well. 'Someone Like You' was a single, but twelve inch only with solely DJ remixes, and nothing close to a single mix - so not eligible for my own 'Singles' playlist.

Didn't want a song on more than once, so sticking with 'Blue Monday 1988' instead of the original 12', as that's the most commonly available "radio edit".

the following were 7" promo edits, and only released that way:

6 Confusion (UK 7" Promo Edt) (2015 Remastered Version) 4:09 <- german 7" promo's were also released

7 Thieves Like Us (7" Promo Edit) (2015 Remastered Version) 3:56 <- with a promo edit of 'lonesome tonight' on the b-side

yes, of course they were full 12 inch singles, but the single versions were never released properly either.

later -1

But they had accompanying single releases, unlike 'Hellbent' and 'I'll Stay With You'. Hence their inclusion on' Singles' (and on my amended/corrected 'Singles' playlist).

NotAMod wrote:

Mr Discography wrote: 'Hellbent' and 'I'll Stay With You' had CD-R promos sent to stations to promote 'Total' and 'Lost Sirens', but didn't have dedicated single releases commercially available - so not counted as singles. Similar to 'Plastic', which was an instant grat from 'Music Complete', but not officially a single release.

For me 'Hellbent' was a more natural choice for the new Singles compilation over 'I'll Stay With You' purely because the latter is just the bog standard album version whereas the former was completely remixed into - arguably - a single/radio version back in 2011. 'Plastic' was simply the album mix, released as a 'key digital track' to promote the LP so I wouldn't have included it. Hellbent had at least two promo CDs so if this were the 90s or early naughties then it almost certainly would have been put out as a single to promote Total. Even the back of the UK Hellbent promo says "Single street date June 27th":

Hellbent

I only recall the one version of 'Hellbent' - where is the radio mix/edit available? What's is running time?

Mr Discography wrote:

NotAMod wrote:

Mr Discography wrote: 'Hellbent' and 'I'll Stay With You' had CD-R promos sent to stations to promote 'Total' and 'Lost Sirens', but didn't have dedicated single releases commercially available - so not counted as singles. Similar to 'Plastic', which was an instant grat from 'Music Complete', but not officially a single release.

For me 'Hellbent' was a more natural choice for the new Singles compilation over 'I'll Stay With You' purely because the latter is just the bog standard album version whereas the former was completely remixed into - arguably - a single/radio version back in 2011. 'Plastic' was simply the album mix, released as a 'key digital track' to promote the LP so I wouldn't have included it. Hellbent had at least two promo CDs so if this were the 90s or early naughties then it almost certainly would have been put out as a single to promote Total. Even the back of the UK Hellbent promo says "Single street date June 27th":

Hellbent

I only recall the one version of 'Hellbent' - where is the radio mix/edit available? What's is running time?

It was lightly remixed for Total (and that 1 track CDR promo), it differs from the Lost Sirens mix.

Rhino.com

Johnny James wrote:

Mr Discography wrote:

NotAMod wrote:

Mr Discography wrote: 'Hellbent' and 'I'll Stay With You' had CD-R promos sent to stations to promote 'Total' and 'Lost Sirens', but didn't have dedicated single releases commercially available - so not counted as singles. Similar to 'Plastic', which was an instant grat from 'Music Complete', but not officially a single release.

For me 'Hellbent' was a more natural choice for the new Singles compilation over 'I'll Stay With You' purely because the latter is just the bog standard album version whereas the former was completely remixed into - arguably - a single/radio version back in 2011. 'Plastic' was simply the album mix, released as a 'key digital track' to promote the LP so I wouldn't have included it. Hellbent had at least two promo CDs so if this were the 90s or early naughties then it almost certainly would have been put out as a single to promote Total. Even the back of the UK Hellbent promo says "Single street date June 27th":

Hellbent

I only recall the one version of 'Hellbent' - where is the radio mix/edit available? What's is running time?

It was lightly remixed for Total (and that 1 track CDR promo), it differs from the Lost Sirens mix.

Really? I've never noticed any differences. What are they?

NotAMod wrote: When Lost Sirens came out, Hellbent was appended (Original Mix) on some digital stores which piqued my interest and the press release at the time indicated "Hellbent will appear for the first time in its non-Radio Edit form" or something similar.

Regarding the actual Total (4:28) vs Lost Sirens (4:27) version differences...

Snare drum for a start, much beefier on the Total version. The Hooky bass on the Lost Sirens version is noticeably quieter as are some keyboard parts. On the Total version some of the guitar parts are also quieter in the mix. Overall the two just have different stereo images over headphones... on one mix the guitar is on the left and on the other the right etc. The easiest way to sum it up is that the Total version has a bit of a sheen whereas the LS version is a bit rougher'n'ready.

Extra production done by Jeremy Wheatley.