The 3rd and final punch-up
Archived34 replies · 480 views
Who won the third debate?
Closed-
The pig-headed liar? 5 (56%)
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The liberal flip-flopper? 4 (44%)
9 votes · voting closed
Too bad I'll be at school (organization meeting at 7) and not be able to watch the shit go down, but... 
maybe the Round Table on campus is showing it (yes they do show CNN, along with any sports game at the time).
Anyways I selected the champion pre-emptively 
.
Originally posted by Tristan Anyways I selected the champion pre-emptively
It's the American Way! 
Holy SHIT...
Has Bush been watching films of Hitler for public speaking tips? The similarities in gesturing for emphasis are eerie...
Originally posted by Jeff has he grown that sexy little moustache?
Well, that's where they differ. That, and Hitler wasn't such a beady-eyed MF'er.
Originally posted by Jeff and what's wrong with Dubya's mouth...has it alwasy looked like that?
The new Bush smiley: :\ohwell:
OK, listen up, rest of the world:
BUSH: And just look at other countries that have tried to have federally controlled health care. They have poor-quality health care. Our health-care system is the envy of the world because we believe in making sure that the decisions are made by doctors and patients, not by officials in the nation's capital.
BLUE ORDER: 45 million Americans have no health care coverage (5 million more than when Bush took office). So my question to the rest of the world is, are any of you envious of our health-care system?
More bullshit from Kerry...
Bush has met with the Congressional Black Congress when they stormed his office due to the Haiti crisis
1.6 million jobs lost? Au contraire mon fraire 900 thousand jobs lost (he forgot to account the federal job gains), but in the past thirteen months climbing out of the recession stemming from Clinton and aggravated by 9/11, there's been a huge amount of jobs created (yes the numbers do not meet the eutopian goals the White House set out).
More bullshit from how much the healthcare will cost. Anybody who wants to read conservative articles just go to heritage.org
Originally posted by Tristan > Originally posted by Grell> does anyone actually like bush anymore?
ME ME ME
Anyone whose opinion REALLY counts?
Originally posted by Server Error in "/" Application > Originally posted by Tristan> > > > > > > Originally posted by Grell> > does anyone actually like bush anymore?>
ME ME ME
Anyone whose opinion REALLY counts?
ME ME ME
Me MeMe!!
Kerry really came across as an answer dodging idoit...AGAIN!!!
JUST ANSWER THE F-ING QUESTION!!! MORON!!!!! 
Ah Kerry, he must have been studying his copy of the "Communist Manifesto" again!! 
Originally posted by Sir CHUNKS Ah Kerry, he must have been studying his copy of the "Communist Manifesto" again!!
i read an article that said many people won't vote for kerry because he is "too smart" and "too articulate."
also, the US democrats are probably more in league with canada's conservatives (ideologically speaking). so really, are the democrats really *all* that liberal after all?
i guess what it boils down to is that canadians love the communist manifesto. 
Originally posted by Ronald Kirsch So was W wired up this time?Was he wired up for the second one? It really looked like it.
ha! i saw those pictures too, it sort of looked like a bullet-proof vest, too(??)
but, who would be telling him what to say?
don't believe the lies - dubya says there are rumours on the internets
Like most of America, I was caught up in....the second game of the ALCS (f-ing Yankees! 
), but from what I saw of the debate (and because I'm just a tool for the liberal media) I give it to Kerry. But not by much: the last two debates suffer by comparison to the first, which was a first-class KO of Dubya by the Flip-Flop Wearing, Vietnam Serving, High-Stepping Liberal from Boston Bay.
And what the hell was up with that "thing" on Dubya's mouth, right in the corner on his right? Was that from kissing a syphillitic baby or something? 
Originally posted by Taboo # 7 Like most of America, I was caught up in....the second game of the ALCS (f-ing Yankees!
The mark is from Karl Rove's genital herpes
Originally posted by kamar factcheck.orgis there a better source to check facts available?
heritage.org
Originally posted by Tristan More bullshit from Kerry...Bush has met with the Congressional Black Congress when they stormed his office due to the Haiti crisis
the truth: he met with them once at the beginning of his administration but has refused repeated requests to meet with them since. he dropped in on a meeting they had with condoleezza rice once, but that's the whole of it.
Originally posted by Sir CHUNKS Kerry really came across as an answer dodging idoit...AGAIN!!!JUST ANSWER THE F-ING QUESTION!!! MORON!!!!!
Really? Can you give some examples? I'll make it easy; here's an abridged transcript:
Q 1: Will our children and grandchildren ever live in a world as safe and secure as the world in which we grew up?
KERRY: Will we ever be safe and secure again? Yes, we absolutely must be.
BUSH: Yes, we can be safe and secure if we stay on the offense against the terrorists.
Q 2: We're talking about protecting ourselves from the unexpected, but the flu season is suddenly upon us, flu kills thousands of people every year, suddenly we find ourselves with a severe shortage of flu vaccine. How did that happen?
BUSH: Bob, we relied upon a company out of England to provide about half of the flu vaccines for the United States citizens and it turned out that the vaccine they were producing was contaminated. And so we took the right action and didn't allow contaminated medicine into our country.
KERRY: This really underscores the problem with the American health care system. It's not working for the American family. And it's gotten worse under President Bush over the course of the last years.
Q 3: Senator Kerry…you pledged during the last debate that you would not raise taxes on those making less than $200,000 a year … how can you or any president, whoever is elected next time, keep that pledge without running this country deeper into debt and passing on more of the bills that we're running up to our children?
KERRY: I'll tell you exactly how I can do it, by reinstating what President Bush took away, which is called pay as you go. During the 1990's, we had pay-as-you-go rules. If you were going to pass something in the Congress, you had to show where you were going to pay for it and how.
BUSH: I proposed a detailed budget, Bob. I send up my budget man to the Congress and he says here's how we're going to reduce the deficit in half by five years, it requires pro-growth policies that grow our economy and fiscal sanity in the halls of Congress.
Q 4: Mr. President, what do you say to someone in this country who has lost his job to someone overseas who's being paid a fraction of what that job paid here in the United States?
BUSH: I'd say, Bob, I've got policies to continue to grow our economy and create the jobs of the 21st century. And here's some help for you to go get an education. Here's some help for you to go to a community college. We've expanded trade adjustment assistance. We want to help pay for you to gain the skills necessary to fill the jobs of the 21st century. You know there's a lot of talk about how to keep the economy growing and we talk about fiscal matters. But perhaps the best way to keep jobs here in America and to keep this economy growing is to make sure our education system works.
KERRY: I want you to notice how the president switched away from jobs and started talking about education principally … The fact is that he's cut job training money - $1 billion was cut, they only added a little bit back this year because it's an election year. They've cut the Pell Grants and the Perkins Loans to help kids be able to go to college. They've cut the training money. They've wound up not even extending unemployment benefits and not even extending health care to those people who are unemployed. I'm going to do those things because that's what's right in America - help workers to transition in every respect.
Q 5: …Is it fair to blame the administration entirely for this loss of jobs?
KERRY: I don't blame them entirely for it. I blame the president for the things the president could do that has an impact on it.
BUSH: [Non-responsive answer to the question posed; discusses Pell Grants, tax relief, fiscal responsibility]
Q 6: Both of you are opposed to gay marriage. But to understand how you have come to that conclusion I want to ask you a more basic question. Do you believe homosexuality is a choice?
BUSH: You know, Bob, I don't know. I just don't know.
KERRY: I think if you talk to anybody, it's not a choice.
Q 7: Senator … The New York Times reports that some Catholic archbishops are telling their church members that it would be a sin to vote for a candidate like you because you support a woman's right to choose an abortion and unlimited stem call research. What is your reaction to that?
KERRY: I respect their views. I completely respect their views. I am a Catholic. And I grew up learning how to respect those views, but I disagree with them, as do many. I believe that I can't legislate or transfer to another American citizen my article of faith. What is an article of faith for me is not something that I can legislate on somebody who doesn't share that article of faith. I believe that choice, a woman's choice is between a woman, God and her doctor.
BUSH: [Non-responsive answer to the question posed; discusses ways to reduce the number of abortions].
Q 8:: …Health insurance costs have risen over 36 percent over the last four years, according to The Washington Post. We're paying more, we're getting less. I would like to ask you who bears responsibility for this? Is it the government, is it the insurance companies, is it the lawyers, is it the doctors, is it the administration?
BUSH: No, there is a - look, here - there's a systemic problem. Health care costs are on the rise because the consumers are not involved in the decision-making process. Most health costs are covered by third parties. And therefore, the actual user of health care is not the purchaser of health care. And there's no market forces involved with health care… Secondly, I do believe the lawsuits - I don't believe, I know that the lawsuits are causing health care costs to rise in America. …Thirdly, one of the reasons why there's still high costs in medicine is because this is they don't use any information technology …And finally, moving generic drugs to the market quicker. So those are four ways to help control the costs in health care.
KERRY: The reason health care costs are getting higher, one of the principal reasons is that this administration has stood in the way of common-sense efforts that would have reduced the costs. Let me give you a prime example. In the Senate we passed the right of Americans to import drugs from Canada. But the president and his friends took it out in the House, and now you don't have that right. The president blocked you from the right to have less expensive drugs from Canada. We also wanted Medicare to be able to negotiate bulk purchasing … But rather than help you, the taxpayer, have lower costs, rather than help seniors have less expensive drugs, the president made it illegal, illegal for Medicare to actually go out and bargain for lower prices. Now we also have people sicker because they don't have health insurance. So whether it's diabetes or cancer they come to the hospitals later. And it costs America more. We've got to have health care for all Americans.
Q 9: … Senator Kerry …You have… proposed a massive plan to extend health care coverage to children. You're also talking about the government picking up a big part of the catastrophic bills that people get at the hospital. And you have said that you can pay for this by rolling back the president's tax cut on the upper 2 percent.
KERRY: That's correct.
Q 9 (Continued): You heard the president say earlier tonight that it's going to cost a whole lot more money than that. I'd just ask you where are you going to get the money?
KERRY: Well two leading national news networks have both said the president's characterization of my health care plan is incorrect. One called it fiction, the other called it untrue … Here's what I do. We take over Medicaid children from the states so that every child in America is covered. And in exchange, if the states want to - they're not forced to, they can choose to - they cover individuals up to 300 percent of poverty. It's their choice. I think they'll choose it because it's a net plus of $5 billion to them. We allow you if you choose to, you don't have to, but we give you broader competition to allow you to buy in to the same health care plan that senators and congressmen give themselves… In addition to that we're going to allow people 55 to 64 to buy in to Medicare early. And most importantly we give small business a 50 percent tax credit so that after we lower the cost of health care they also get, whether they're self-employed or a small business, a lower cost to be able to cover their employees. Now what happens is when you begin to get people covered like that - for instance in diabetes, if you diagnose diabetes early you could save $50 billion in the health care system of America by avoiding surgery and dialysis. It works. And I'm going to offer it to America.
BUSH: …The Lewin Report accurately noted that there are going to be 20 million people - over 20 million people added to government-controlled health care. Be the largest increase in government health care ever. If you raise the Medicaid to 300 percent, it provides an incentive for small businesses not to provide private insurance to their employees. Why should they insure somebody when the government's going to insure it for them? It's estimated that eight million people will go from private insurance to government insurance.
KERRY: …I am not proposing a government-run program. That's not what I have. I have Blue Cross/Blue Shield. Senators and congressmen have a wide choice; Americans ought to have it, too.
Q 10: Mr. President …We all know that Social Security's running out of money and it has to be fixed. You have proposed to fix it by letting people put some of the money collected to pay benefits into private savings accounts. But the critics are saying that's going to mean finding a trillion dollars over the next 10 years to continue paying benefits as those accounts are being set up. So where do you get the money? Are you going to have to increase the deficit by that much over 10 years?
BUSH: [non-responsive answer]…I will work with Republicans and Democrats. Will be a vital issue in my second term. It is an issue that I'm willing to take on. And so I bring Republicans and Democrats together.
KERRY: The C.B.O. said very clearly that if you were to adopt the president's plan, there'll be a $2 trillion hole in Social Security because today's workers pay in to the system for today's retirees. And the C.B.O. said - that's the Congressional Budget Office, it's bipartisan - they said that there would have to be a cut in benefits of 25 to 40 percent. Now, the president has never explained to America, ever - hasn't done it tonight - where does the transitional money, that $2 trillion, come from? He's already got $3 trillion, according to The Washington Post, of expenses that he's put on the line from his convention and the promises of this campaign, none of which are paid for, not one of them are paid for.
Q 11: … Senator Kerry, you have just said you will not cut benefits. Alan Greenspan, the chairman of the Federal Reserve, says there's no way that Social Security can pay retirees what we have promised them unless we recalibrate. What he's suggesting: We're going to have to cut benefits or we're going to have to raise retirement age. We may have to take some other reform. But if you've just said you've promised no changes, does that mean you're just going leave this as a problem, another problem for our children to resolve?
KERRY: Not at all. Absolutely not, Bob. This is the same thing we heard, I remember I appeared on "Meet the Press" with Tim Russert in 1990-something, we heard the same thing. And we fixed it. In fact we put together a $5.6 trillion surplus in the 90's that was for the purpose of saving Social Security. If you take the tax cut that the president of the United States has given, President Bush gave to Americans in the top 1 percent of America, just that tax cut that went to the top 1 percent of America, would have saved Social Security until the year 2075. The president decided to give it to the wealthiest Americans in a tax cut. Now Alan Greenspan, who I think has done a terrific job in monetary policy, supports the president's tax cut. I don't. I support it for the middle class, not that part of it that goes to people earning more than $200,000 a year. And when I roll it back and we invest in the things that I've talked about to move our economy, we're going to grow sufficiently that we begin to cut the deficit in half and we get back to where we were at the end of the 1990's when we balanced the budget and paid down the debt of this country. Now we can do that. Now if, later on after a period of time, we find that Social Security is in trouble, we'll pull together the top experts of the country, we'll do exactly what we did in the 1990's, and we'll make whatever adjustment is necessary. But the first and most important thing is to start creating jobs in America. … I have a plan to put America back to work. And if we're fiscally responsible and put America back to work we're going to fix Social Security.
BUSH: … I didn't hear any plan to fix Social Security. I heard more of the same…But we acted. I led the Congress. We passed tax relief. And now this economy's growing.
Q 12: I'm told that at least 8,000 people cross our borders illegally every day. Some people believe this is a security issue, as you know; some believe it's an economic issue; some see it as a human rights issue. How do you see it, and what do we need to do about it?
BUSH: I see it as a serious problem. I see it as a security issue. I see it as an economic issue, and I see it as a human rights issue. We're increasing the border security of the United States. We've got 1,000 more Border Patrol agents on the Southern border. We're using new equipment, we're using unmanned vehicles to spot people coming across. And we'll continue to do so over the next four years … in order to take pressure off the border, in order to make the borders more secure, I believe there ought to be a temporary worker card that allows a willing worker and a willing employer to mate up, so long as there's not an American willing to do the job, to join up in order to be able to fulfill the employer's needs … It also means it takes pressure off the border. If somebody is coming here to work with a card, it means they're not going to have to sneak across the border. It means our Border Patrol will be more likely to be able to focus on doing their job. Now, it's very important for our citizens to also know that I don't believe we ought to have amnesty. I don't think we ought to reward illegal behavior. There are plenty of people standing in line to become a citizen, and we ought not to crowd these people ahead of them in line. If they want to become a citizen, they can stand in line, too. And here's where my opponent and I differ. In September 2003, he supported amnesty for illegal aliens.
KERRY: [Non responsive answer to the first question-- how he sees the issue; answers the second question-- what he'll do about it] … Here's what I'll do. Number one, the borders are more leaking today than they were before 9/11. The fact is we haven't done what we need to do to toughen up our borders. And I will. Secondly, we need a guest-worker program. But if it's all we have it's not going to solve the problem. The second thing we need is to crack down on illegal hiring. It's against the law in the United States to hire people illegally. And we ought to be enforcing that law properly. And thirdly, we need an earned legalization program for people who've been here for a long time, stayed out of trouble, got a job, paid their taxes and their kids are American. We've got to start moving them towards full citizenship out of the shadows.
Q 13: Next question to you, Senator Kerry. The gap between rich and poor is growing wider. More people are dropping into poverty. Yet the minimum wage has been stuck at, what, $5.15 an hour now for about seven years. Is it time to raise it?
KERRY: Well, I'm glad you raised that question. It's long overdue time to raise the minimum wage … If we raise the minimum wage, which I will do over several years, to $7 an hour, 9.2 million women who are trying to raise their families would earn another $3,800 a year … I will fight tooth and nail to pass the minimum wage.
BUSH: Actually, Mitch McConnell had a minimum wage plan that I supported that would have increased the minimum wage.
Q 14: Mr. President, I want to go back to something Senator Kerry said earlier tonight and ask a follow-up of my own. He said, and this will be a new question to you, he said that you had never said whether you would like to overturn Roe v. Wade. So I'd ask you directly would you like to?
BUSH: [Non-responsive answer to the question posed] What he's asking me is will I have a litmus test for my judges. And the answer is no, I will not have a litmus test. I will pick judges who will interpret the Constitution. But I'll have no litmus tests.
KERRY: …Well again, the president didn't answer the question. I'll answer it straight to America. I'm not going to appoint a judge to the court who's going to undo a constitutional right, whether it's the First Amendment or the Fifth Amendment or some other right that's given under our courts today under the Constitution. And I believe that the right of choice is a constitutional right. So I don't intend to see it undone. Clearly the president wants to leave an ambivalence or intends to undo it.
Q 15: … If you became president, Senator Kerry, what would you do about this situation, holding National Guard and Reservists for these extended periods of time and these repeated call-ups that they're now facing?
KERRY: …Now, I've proposed adding two active-duty divisions to the Armed Forces of the United States - one combat, one support. In addition, I'm going to double the number of special forces so that we can fight a more effective war on terror with less pressure on the National Guard and Reserve. And what I would like to do is see the National Guard and Reserve be deployed differently here in our own country. There's much we can do with them with respect to homeland security. We ought to be doing that. And that would relieve an enormous amount of pressure. But the most important thing to relieve the pressure on all of our armed forces is, frankly, to run a foreign policy that recognizes that America is strongest when we are working with real alliances, when we are sharing the burdens of the world by working through our statesmanship at the highest levels and our diplomacy to bring other nations to our side.
BUSH: … The best way to take the pressure off our troops is to succeed in Iraq, is to train Iraqis so they can do the hard work of democracy, is to give them a chance to defend their country - precisely what we're doing. We'll have 125,000 troops trained by the end of this year. Q 16: Mr. President, new question, two minutes. You said that if Congress would vote to extend the ban on assault weapons that you'd sign the legislation. But you did nothing to encourage the Congress to extend it. Why not? BUSH: Actually, I made my intentions, my views clear. I did think we ought to extend the assault-weapons ban and was told the fact that the bill wasn't ever going to move. Because the Republicans and Democrats were against the assault-weapon ban, people of both parties.
KERRY: I believe it was a failure of presidential leadership not to reauthorize the assault-weapons ban. … If Tom DeLay or someone in the House said to me, 'Sorry, we don't have the votes,' I'd have said, 'Then we're going to have a fight.' And I'd have taken it out to the country and I'd have had every law enforcement officer in the country visit those congressmen. We'd have won what Bill Clinton won.
Q 16: Do you see a need for affirmative action programs or have we moved far enough along that we no longer need to use race and gender as a factor in school admissions and federal and state contracts and so on?
KERRY: No, Bob, regrettably, we have not moved far enough along. And I regret to say that this administration has even blocked steps that could help us move further along … We used to, you know, we have a goal there for minority set-aside programs to try to encourage ownership in the country. They don't reach those goals. They don't even fight to reach those goals. They've tried to undo them. The fact is that in too many parts of our country we still have discrimination. And affirmative action is not just something that applies to people to color. Some people have a mistaken view of it in America. It also is with respect to women, it's with respect to other efforts to try to reach out and be inclusive in our country. I think that we have a long way to go, regrettably.
BUSH: [non-responsive answer to question of using race and gender as a factor in school admissions and federal and state contracts] … like my opponent, I don't agree we ought to have quotas. I agree. We shouldn't have quotas. But we ought to have an aggressive effort to make sure people are educated, to make sure when they get out of high school there's Pell Grants available for them, which is what we've done, we've expanded Pell Grants by a million students.
Q 17: I would like to ask you what part does your faith play on your policy decisions?
BUSH: First, my faith plays a big part in my life. … And my faith is a very, it's very personal … I never want to impose my religion on anybody else. But when I make decisions I stand on principle. And the principles are derived from who I am. I believe we ought to love our neighbor like we love ourself. That's manifested in public policy through the faith-based initiative where we've unleashed the armies of compassion to help heal people who hurt. I believe that God wants everybody to be free. That's what I believe. And that's one part of my foreign policy. In Afghanistan, I believe that the freedom there is a gift from the Almighty. And I can't tell you how encouraged how I am to see freedom on the march. And so my principles that I make decisions on are a part of me. And religion is a part of me.
KERRY: … I was taught - I went to a church school, and I was taught that the two greatest commandments are love the Lord your God with all your mind, your body and your soul and love your neighbor as yourself. And frankly, I think we have a lot more loving of our neighbor to do in this country and on this planet. We have a separate and unequal school system in the United States of America. There's one for the people who have and there's one for the people who don't have. And we're struggling with that today. The president and I have a difference of opinion about how we live out our sense of our faith. I talked about it earlier when I talked about the works and faith without works being dead. I think we've got a lot more work to do.
Q 18: Senator Kerry, after 9/11 - and this is a new question for you - it seemed to me that the country came together as I've never seen it come together since World War II. But some of that seems to have melted away. I think it's fair to say we've become pretty polarized, perhaps because of the political season. But if you were elected president - or whoever is elected president - will you set a priority in trying to bring the nation back together or what would be your attitude on that?
KERRY: Oh, very much so. Let me pay a compliment to the president, if I may. I think in those days after 9/11, I thought the president did a terrific job …We were all just Americans. That's where we were. That's not where we are today. I regret to say that the president who called himself a uniter, not a divider, is now presiding over the most divided America in the recent memory of our country. I've never seen such ideological squabbles in the Congress of the United States. I've never seen members of a party locked out of meetings the way they're locked out today. We have to change that. And as president, I am committed to changing that. You know, I don't care if the idea comes from the other side or this side. I think we have to come together and work to change it. And I've done that. Over 20 years in the United States Senate, I've worked with John McCain, who's sitting here. I've worked with other colleagues. I've reached across the aisle. I've tried to find the common ground because that's what makes us strong as Americans. And if Americans trust me with the presidency, I can pledge to you: We will have the most significant effort - openly, not secret meetings in the White House with special interests, not ideologically driven efforts to push people aside, but a genuine effort to try to restore America's hope and possibilities by bringing people together.
BUSH: Well my biggest disappointment in Washington is how partisan the town is. I had a record of working with Republicans and Democrats as the governor of Texas. And I was hopeful to be able to do the same thing. And we made good progress early on. The No Child Left Behind Act, incredibly enough, was good work between me and my administration and people like Senator Ted Kennedy. And we worked together with Democrats to relieve the tax burden on the middle class and all who pay taxes in order to make sure this economy continues to grow. But Washington is a tough town. And the way I view it is there's a lot of entrenched special interests there. People who are, you know, on one side of the issue or another, and they spend enormous sums of money, and they convince different senators to tout their way or different congressmen to talk about their issue. And they dig in. I'll continue in the four years to continue to try to work to do - my opponent said this is a bitterly divided time. Pretty divided in the 2000 election. So in other words it's pretty divided during the 1990's as well. We're just in a period and we've to got work to bring it out.
Q 19: All three of us are surrounded by very strong women. We're all married to strong women. Each of us have two daughters that make us very proud. I'd like to ask each of you what is the most important thing you've learned from these strong women?
BUSH: To listen to them. To stand up straight and not scowl.
KERRY: … Can I say, if I could just say a word about a woman that you didn't ask about, but my mom passed away a couple years ago. And just before I was deciding to run and she was in the hospital and I went in to talk to her and tell her what I was thinking of doing. And she looked at me from her hospital bed and she just looked at me and she said, "Remember: integrity, integrity, integrity." Those are the three words that she left me with. And my daughters and my wife are people who just are filled with that sense of what's right and what's wrong. They also kick me around. They keep me honest. They don't let me get away with anything. I can sometimes take myself too seriously. They surely don't let me do that.
Originally posted by Tristan Abridged=worthless
Abridged = cut out all the parts of the response that are not relevant to determine if the the question was answered. For example, on the last question of the debate, it is not necessary to include the fact that Bush met his wife at a barbecue to determine whether or not he answered the question posed -- "What have you learned from these women in your life." Irrelevant portions of the response, such as the fact that Bush met Laura at a barbecue, were edited out.
That said, if you can find a relevant fault with my transcript, fire away.
Originally posted by twist Bitching aint a plan.
Do I really need to point out in the transcript all of the places where Kerry discussed his plans? Republicans might not agree with his plans, but that's not the same thing as saying that he did not lay out his plans. But if people want to maintain that he didn't lay out his plans, that's fine, I'm willing to direct people to the relevant portions of the transcript. 
Incidentally, I asked for examples of where Kerry dodged the questions, and even provided a transcript. The silence is deafening. 
