Che fucking Guevara
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I think Kershaw is trying to rob Liam of his King of the Cunts NOOL title. Judging by his 'jokes' about Jewish people on t'other thread, I think he may have snatched the crown.
The thieving scouse cunt.
J.A.K wrote: are you offended?
you do look remarkably jewish after all.
Mate, you're offensively boring. PC-baiting is the last refuge of the braindead. It's like a schoolkid flashing his cock, but without the style.
You do know you're probably gonna get banned?
(The Good Doctor) Martin Fradley wrote: I think Kershaw is trying to rob Liam of his King of the Cunts NOOL title. Judging by his 'jokes' about Jewish people on t'other thread, I think he may have snatched the crown.
The thieving scouse cunt.
Well, at least i'm entertaining. But that crown is something i'm quite proud of, and i'm going to fight for it dammit!
(The Good Doctor) Martin Fradley wrote:
J.A.K wrote: are you offended?
you do look remarkably jewish after all.
Mate, you're offensively boring. PC-baiting is the last refuge of the braindead. It's like a schoolkid flashing his cock, but without the style.
You do know you're probably gonna get banned?
cheers faggy dancer. i'll take it on board.
I'm probably a bit late now, but I agree with the posters who said that most people who wear Che shirts have no fucking idea who he was. I also think it's more of a fashion thing than anything else. Next year the kids will be wearing Buddha t-shirts. 
Che wasn't all bad. He grew up under pretty good conditions but saw how destitute the masses were and tried to do something about it. He did have some miserable failures though, which is perhaps why someone here called him a rent-a-revolutionary, or something like that. I'm sure as hell not gonna be wearing his shirt, but when I do see someone with his shirt, all it brings to me is a little smile.
Shellshocker wrote: I'm probably a bit late now, but I agree with the posters who said that most people who wear Che shirts have no fucking idea who he was. I also think it's more of a fashion thing than anything else. Next year the kids will be wearing Buddha t-shirts.
Che wasn't all bad. He grew up under pretty good conditions but saw how destitute the masses were and tried to do something about it. He did have some miserable failures though, which is perhaps why someone here called him a rent-a-revolutionary, or something like that. I'm sure as hell not gonna be wearing his shirt, but when I do see someone with his shirt, all it brings to me is a little smile.
Actually, around here, I'm seeing kids wearing shirts that have a picture of Buddha on it and written below it is "Rub my belly."
Fire-arm wrote:
the main point is that the people of cuba and south america were forced to work for such pay in such conditions that they were in effect in the situation of a slave camp much like the gulags that stalin set up. che guevara set free an entire nation from this oppression so now he is worshipped in cuba.
i think the millions of people and generations since who hav benefitted from this revoloution is worth the lives of these people who died especially as they were supporting this slave labour like conditions.
Right. Cuba is kicking all sorts of economic a$$ these days. BTW, if I were Cuban, I could travel freely to any other country I wanted to, right? Or, I could purchase a satellite dish and watch what ever I wanted to, right? How about if I wanted to set up my own blog or weekly paper? How far do you think I would get?
My Dad was there last year and reckons it's a perfectly liberal place where the people are happy and proud of where they're from.
They'd be a lot more successful economically if America lifted their sanctions and stopped bullying them.
Tex wrote:
Right. Cuba is kicking all sorts of economic a$$ these days. BTW, if I were Cuban, I could travel freely to any other country I wanted to, right? Or, I could purchase a satellite dish and watch what ever I wanted to, right? How about if I wanted to set up my own blog or weekly paper? How far do you think I would get?
Knob. If I were Cuban could I expect a good standard of healthcare no matter what my social status/income was? Could I expect to be literate (note this also applied 40 years ago putting most of the world to shame)? Could I expect to sit on my fat arse stuffing my face, drive a big car that uses up stacks of fuel ('cause I can), stick two fingers up to the rest of the world (most of which I am completely ignorant of) then strut round like school bully stealing the other kids oil money?
Know where I'd rather be.
James Thomas wrote:
Tex wrote:
Right. Cuba is kicking all sorts of economic a$$ these days. BTW, if I were Cuban, I could travel freely to any other country I wanted to, right? Or, I could purchase a satellite dish and watch what ever I wanted to, right? How about if I wanted to set up my own blog or weekly paper? How far do you think I would get?
Knob. If I were Cuban could I expect a good standard of healthcare no matter what my social status/income was? Could I expect to be literate (note this also applied 40 years ago putting most of the world to shame)? Could I expect to sit on my fat arse stuffing my face, drive a big car that uses up stacks of fuel ('cause I can), stick two fingers up to the rest of the world (most of which I am completely ignorant of) then strut round like school bully stealing the other kids oil money?
Know where I'd rather be.
You'd rather live in Cuba than America?? 
We'll have to take up a collection for your one way ticket.
Diamond White wrote: My Dad was there last year and reckons it's a perfectly liberal place where the people are happy and proud of where they're from.
They'd be a lot more successful economically if America lifted their sanctions and stopped bullying them.
I think it is obvious to anyone with a brain that America's sanctions against Cuba aren't working at all. In fact, I think they're actually made Castro stronger. I used to be unsure if the sanctions were helping or hurting, and I figured that after the USSR collapsed, there'd be revolution in Cuban and Castro would be overthrown. Didn't happen, ain't gonna happen. Anyone that think the sanctions might still work is just being stubborn. The only way Castro is giving up power is if Doctor Nick (Simpsons reference) is his surgeon. It would seem to make a lot of sense to lift the sanctions, it would probably improve the lot of the Cuban people. Why don't we do it then? Might be partly stubbornness, but I don't think that the lobbying and political influence of Cuban-Americans can be underestimates. Cuban-Americans are generally affluent, and they vote! They are well organized too, and nobody hates Castro more than Cuban-Americans, as the dancing in the streets of Miami over news of his demise shows.
Tex wrote:
Right. Cuba is kicking all sorts of economic a$$ these days. BTW, if I were Cuban, I could travel freely to any other country I wanted to, right? Or, I could purchase a satellite dish and watch what ever I wanted to, right? How about if I wanted to set up my own blog or weekly paper? How far do you think I would get?
Of course communism has its flaws.. for us it's unthinkable that people can't travel and they need to keep the wealth in their own country so the system would work... nobody would go for that.
But have you actually been to Cuba? It's not as worst as they make you think it is... I'm quite sure most people are better there than being poor in most of the G7 countries.
Democracy and capitalism is good for the sucessful, but not for those who aren't.
People there don't have to pay for doctors and education... can't say the same in the USA as far as I know.
Yes it has its flaws, we all know them, but you also have to appreciate the good sides.
I was pretty impressed to know that Cuba could actually afford to send doctors in Venezuela to get oil in return.. Gee, in Canada we are badly missing doctors...
And of course, Cuba would probably be better without the economic limitations due to the US policies...
Visiting Jamaica last june, I can tell you those people in Cuba are a lot better the way they are than the poors in Jamaica... or many carabeans countries for that instance, people who live in places worst than our cottages where we store our landmowers!
James Thomas wrote:
Tex wrote:
Right. Cuba is kicking all sorts of economic a$$ these days. BTW, if I were Cuban, I could travel freely to any other country I wanted to, right? Or, I could purchase a satellite dish and watch what ever I wanted to, right? How about if I wanted to set up my own blog or weekly paper? How far do you think I would get?
Knob. If I were Cuban could I expect a good standard of healthcare no matter what my social status/income was? Could I expect to be literate (note this also applied 40 years ago putting most of the world to shame)? Could I expect to sit on my fat arse stuffing my face, drive a big car that uses up stacks of fuel ('cause I can), stick two fingers up to the rest of the world (most of which I am completely ignorant of) then strut round like school bully stealing the other kids oil money?
Know where I'd rather be.
I seem to have struck a chord, James.
Good standard of health care? By what standard? I have a friend who is a doctor and travels every year to Cuba (I think it's with Doctors Without Borders or somethign like that). He says the doctors their are good and well menaing but that they just don't have the basic resources to properly care for the population. He says he packs his suitcases full of supplies every year beacuse the docs in Cuba need them so badly. So, why don't you tap the breaks on the glories of Cuban health care.
As for the rest of your post, I just can't help but wonder how the Fates have so conspired against the rest of the wolrd....
Tex wrote:
Good standard of health care? By what standard? I have a friend who is a doctor and travels every year to Cuba (I think it's with Doctors Without Borders or somethign like that). He says the doctors their are good and well menaing but that they just don't have the basic resources to properly care for the population. He says he packs his suitcases full of supplies every year beacuse the docs in Cuba need them so badly. So, why don't you tap the breaks on the glories of Cuban health care.
The life expectancy at birth is a reasonable way of measuring the standard of care.
Cuba: 77.41 years US: 77.85 years
Suppose you need all that extra care to make up for all the pies.
Tex wrote:
So, why don't you tap the breaks on the glories of Cuban health care.
What does that mean? Does it mean like tap the breaks in a car?
And another thing - this thread would be far cooler if it was called Che Ger fucking Vara.
uncle liam jst because im a teenager it doesnt mean i havnt researched the topic like an adult which i hav. through many books and other sources with no influance i hav made my mind up.
in your reply of sayin wot a load of bollocks you made no educated reply to what i had 2 say to prove it was a load of bollocks thus proving yourself wrong and most likely the ignorant person i was talking about, anyways u also seem like the stuck up facist that i would expect 2 b following around the BNP.
che only targeted military officer and people who commited bigger crimes against the people so u cant say that these murders as u call them. u hav 2 remember taht these people even castrated ches brother jst for rising up.
i know theres plenty of ppl wearing his t shirts without knowing hu he is and that winds me up but like trendy ppl wearing rolling stones tshirts and never knowing who they are.
Fire-arm wrote: uncle liam jst because im a teenager it doesnt mean i havnt researched the topic like an adult which i hav. through many books and other sources with no influance i hav made my mind up.
in your reply of sayin wot a load of bollocks you made no educated reply to what i had 2 say to prove it was a load of bollocks thus proving yourself wrong and most likely the ignorant person i was talking about, anyways u also seem like the stuck up facist that i would expect 2 b following around the BNP.
che only targeted military officer and people who commited bigger crimes against the people so u cant say that these murders as u call them. u hav 2 remember taht these people even castrated ches brother jst for rising up.
i know theres plenty of ppl wearing his t shirts without knowing hu he is and that winds me up but like trendy ppl wearing rolling stones tshirts and never knowing who they are.
People wear Rolling Stones t-shirts??! :barf: Egads, now I'm offended!
Just a wee note to these well read literate historians who are throwing the words communist/socialist around like confetti, check any DECENT dictionary for the meaning of the words, it'll say "a STATELESS CLASSLESS society, were production is: from each according to ability to each according to need". No such society has EVER existed and the notion of a Socialist/Communist State is an oxymoron. :) Rosa Luxembourg, among many others, immediately condemned the October revolution as non-communist/socialist, these so-called socialist/communist "states" were/are in fact state capitalist (as opposed to the usual private capitalist mode). If you want to swing in trees REFUSE to live upon your knees! PS gist noticed that Union Jack next to my name, can anyone tell me how to get rid of it?
It's true that comminist and socialist are not the same thing. The Soviet Union wasn't really a communist state by the true definition. At least that's what I learned in school. Oh well, po-tay-to, po-tah-to.
Please, please check any decent dictionary! There is NO DIFFERENCE between Communist/Socialist, the notion that there was/is was a fucking LIE dreamt up by that arsehole Lenin and compounded by many others since. Both refer to a stateless/classless society.
i won´t enter in this discussion because it´s as useless as discussing which political system is better. we just won´t agree, ever. what i will say is that you have to understand political processes according to the space/time they´re being produced. for people in USA or England it´s hard to understand the cuban problem because first you have to understand the cuban way of living, which is totally different from what you´re used to live everyday. latin american countries in general have a particular way of living that separates them from the rest. not better, not worst, different. and believe me, we´re still trying to figure it out ourselves, less can i expect you to understand it. having said that my opinion is that neither the ones who wear Che Guevara´s t-shirts nor the ones who condemn him for being a communist or whatever really understand the situation. i´ve been to Cuba and i´ve seen it, i´ve talked to people there, i´ve learned a lot about them. i live in a latin american country, i know our history and our problems. Guevara was my countryman so all the information about him is fresh here and it´s there for me to read it, which i did. but that doesn´t make me an expert, it´s hard to make a serious opinion even having all the elements. what it´s true is that Guevara wanted the revolution in latin america. he went to all different countries before Cuba and before that he went to other ones as well. revolutions like these are always violent so questioning that is like questioning the sense of the word "revolution". was he right? i don´t know. he did try to change things in favor of a new political order in the region. was it the better political system? i don´t know and probably never will. Cuba became the only country of the region that developed that idea. if they succeeded in all the region now we were talking about other situation. but it didn´t happen so we won´t know. instead we had militar coups payed by the US government so all the communist seeds were erased from the face of the region. thousands of disappeared people, thousands of people murdered, all the economies collapsed and 30/40 years later we´re still paying those consequences. so the alternative wasn´t good if you ask me. so does the cuban process sound appealing? why not? it didn´t work the opposite way for us! maybe for you guys it did work so that´s why you can´t fully understand the situation. i´m not blaming anyone, it´s just the way it is 
Diamond White wrote:
Tex wrote:
So, why don't you tap the breaks on the glories of Cuban health care.
What does that mean? Does it mean like tap the breaks in a car?
Yes.
James Thomas wrote:
Tex wrote:
Good standard of health care? By what standard? I have a friend who is a doctor and travels every year to Cuba (I think it's with Doctors Without Borders or somethign like that). He says the doctors their are good and well menaing but that they just don't have the basic resources to properly care for the population. He says he packs his suitcases full of supplies every year beacuse the docs in Cuba need them so badly. So, why don't you tap the breaks on the glories of Cuban health care.
The life expectancy at birth is a reasonable way of measuring the standard of care.
Cuba: 77.41 years US: 77.85 years
Suppose you need all that extra care to make up for all the pies.
While you're busy throwing stones, why don't you regale the class with how many stones you weigh.
Burt Reynolds wrote: The differences between socialism and communism
Exactly the ROT I'd expect from some left winger who's never read Marx in his life. Marx/Engles (the "fathers" of Socialism/Communism) NEVER, ANYWHERE made a distinction in anything they wrote between Socialism & Communism. The idea that Socialism is/was a "transitional" stage between capitalism and communism was a lie first put about by that bastard Lenin to justify his anti-democratic cancelling of the elections held shortly after the Oct. revolution. To paraphrase the communist manifesto (1848) "the time for revolutions led by cliques is over. The working class AS A WHOLE must emancipate THEMSELVES"! Or "Only sheep need leaders".
MIMX wrote: Please, please check any decent dictionary! There is NO DIFFERENCE between Communist/Socialist, the notion that there was/is was a fucking LIE dreamt up by that arsehole Lenin and compounded by many others since. Both refer to a stateless/classless society.
I will merely refer you to Burt Reynold's link above.
Shellshocker wrote:
MIMX wrote: Please, please check any decent dictionary! There is NO DIFFERENCE between Communist/Socialist, the notion that there was/is was a fucking LIE dreamt up by that arsehole Lenin and compounded by many others since. Both refer to a stateless/classless society.
I will merely refer you to Burt Reynold's link above.
Not, by any stretch of the imagination a DECENT DICTIONARY! I will merely refer you to my post above, being a guy who has read Marx/Engles for well over 25yrs,(as well as many other political philosophers).
