Great Move by Police
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http://www.neworderonline.com/Forums/MessageList.aspx?ThreadID=43123
Liam doesn't agree. I think I'm with him on this one.
well,he enjoyed his last festival in hungary at least,, he come off the plane at gatwick stoned and banged his head on the plane door,, "you allright pete" queried his minder,,, uuuuuhhhhhh,,, uuuuuhhhhhhh
so
Its not so much cancelling it because it Babyshambles, it sets a VERY dangerous precedent for future events.
Considering I've seen loads of bands with more "violent" (for lack of a better term) than Babyshambles, whats stopping the Police doing this at a festival they think might get a bit out of hand? All they seemingly have to do now is go to YouTube, pick out a bit of a footage, complain a bit on so called "health and safety" grounds, and thats it, gig cancelled.
Utter, utter wankers.
I've been saying it for ages, but sooner or later all gigs will be all seater.
Uncle Liam wrote: Utter, utter wankers.
I've been saying it for ages, but sooner or later all gigs will be all seater.
And at the gates, it will be like in airports, with all these devices and procedures...
Common sense is out of the window here. How many people have been injured at gigs? How many of them would go on to blame anyone but themselves?
I suspect that the Police has solved a problem that would never have existed. In fact, as was seen in Manchester earlier in the year, the risk is that you create a nasty problem from nothing by cancelling an event that would otherwise have passed peacefully.
And now Babyshambles have offered to do another gig. Just what the world needs. Another Babyshambles gig!
Way of the world these days isn't it? You can't stand at a football match unless you go watch a crap team. I can't help but think gigs are far more sanitised than they used to be, even sell-out gigs don't seem packed, security are OTT all the time especially when anyone hasn't got both feet on the floor, approach the stage and you're out (Grant!)
God knows what they would have made of the Eighties - New Model Army, King Kurt, Cramps, Meteors, Spear of Destiny, Pogues, NiN etc. You mentioned more violent followings than Babyshambles Liam, who are the current hell-raisers.
DJ Diamond wrote: Common sense is out of the window here. How many people have been injured at gigs? How many of them would go on to blame anyone but themselves?
Exactly. But if someone goes down the front and gets hurt, whose fault is it? I'll tell you whose fault it is, its the person own fault. I remember seeing Morrissey at the Apollo, and some girl ahead of us in the queue (we queued up all day for a laugh) told us it was her first morrissey gig and she "needed" to be down the front. This was girl was tiny. She was carried out during the first song, crying. But what did she expect?
It was the same when I saw Muse. Me and Andrew actually had a bet saying how long it would take for someone to barge past us crying. Two songs it was. But again, people should be expected just to stnad there motionless during a band like Muse. This is not KT fucking Tunstall.
It is my belief that everyone should take responsibilty for their own actions. Thats an alien concept to some I know but still. If it s a bit rough down the front, and you dont think you'll cope... dont go down there!Its hardly a fucking revolutionary concept.
It is groups like "Love Not Riots" (who have taken up "speaking up" for gig and festival goes on a number of issues and "Safe Concerts" who are claiming they are speaking for all gig goers in an effort to stop the "risk" that people might get hurt. Personally, if i was down the front for an Interpol gig and didnt come out a bit battered i'd be disappointed. But what the idiots who run these campaigns dont understand is that 99.9% of the time being down the front at gigs ("moshing" as it were) is tremensous fun with great cameraderie with everyone having a good time and making sure no one gets hurt. I remember seeing The Killers in the Academy in Jan 05, and they had exploded in terms of popularitiy by this point, and the whole of the Academy was just one great mosh pit. If someone wanted lifting up, me and someone else lifted them up and chucked them, and if they fell down someone piecked them up again. Thats the way it works, always has done, and always will, until the health and Safety nuts and the courts force all gigs to be seated.
James Thomas wrote:
God knows what they would have made of the Eighties - New Model Army, King Kurt, Cramps, Meteors, Spear of Destiny, Pogues, NiN etc. You mentioned more violent followings than Babyshambles Liam, who are the current hell-raisers.
Well, you can just think of the crop of Metal and Punk bands, and even "pop-punk" bands like Green Day, Fall Out Boy or My Chemical Romance have all the kids jumping around. And then their are bands like Oasis, Arctic Monkeys etc who are great at getting a big crowd moving. In my experience Babyshambes just have a fair few down the front nothing that Interpol, Kings of Leon and even Arcade Fire dont have. And thats just bands on the larger level.
Imagine what it's like for the musicians to perform for an audience that isn't allowed to dance.
That's like asking a comedian to perform to an audience that can't laugh.
Obviously I'm only talking about some types of music. I'm sure the tree tenors wouldn't thank you for pogoing and pushing one another over.
DJ Diamond wrote: Imagine what it's like for the musicians to perform for an audience that isn't allowed to dance.
But the thing is, we've already seen that at Summerpops!
Last year, I went to a concert and...
We had to sit. We could not smoke. No smoking pause allowed.
It drove me to conclude. Better lie on my couch and watch a DVD. But what is the interest of a concert on DVD?
Uncle Liam wrote: Its not so much cancelling it because it Babyshambles, it sets a VERY dangerous precedent for future events.
Considering I've seen loads of bands with more "violent" (for lack of a better term) than Babyshambles, whats stopping the Police doing this at a festival they think might get a bit out of hand? All they seemingly have to do now is go to YouTube, pick out a bit of a footage, complain a bit on so called "health and safety" grounds, and thats it, gig cancelled.
Utter, utter wankers.
I've been saying it for ages, but sooner or later all gigs will be all seater.
Common sense just went bye bye
I agree with you, Liam. Who is to say these people know what is good for me? Every time I have gone to a show-getting the crowd up is a release of energy.
98% of folks are there for a good time, the rest are just jerks. So spoil my good time because of a random jagoff?
Look we all know where the pit is-It is an assumption of risk if you do go into a pit. You do not have to be there.
You can't protect from their own natural behavior or the good and bad it may bring them.
Pete Doherty at this point is a hack. I do not like his music but I will defend his right to play it and for people to see it.
What's as disturbing if not more is i've noticed more young uns moaning about moshing at gigs compared to when i first starting seeing bands.Which is very surprising.One example was the girl down the front during Doves at Manc v Cancer 2006.She took right umbridge at me moshing .If there is a generation coming through who are against moshing then god help us
Harry Cross wrote: .If there is a generation coming through who are against moshing then god help us
But there isnt. Its a small group of individuals who cant take it at gigs and then go on the internet and moan about it. And because no one emails these people saying "I wasnt hurt" at the gig (and why should they, do you ring a doctor to say "I'm not sick"?) these people assume that everyone is getting hurt and there is a safety issue.
Safe Concerts is a dispecable organisation. It was set up by a woman (Debbie, i think she was called) after Glastonbury in 2005, because she was pushed around a bit during Brian Wilson... and she was in the front row!
Think about that for a second. BRIAN WILSON doing BEACH BOYS songs in front of the one of the biggest crowds of the weekend at GLASTONBURY and this woman complains about being pushed around a bit, despite bieng in the front row. So she wants to ruin it for us all.
Love Not Riots is another disgrace. They started out campaigning against the traditional Sunday night riots at Leeds (not realising that tens of thousands of pissed up teenagers in a field is recipe for trouble) and The fucking NME jumped on board, as did loads of no names from here today, gone tomorrow bands (and Goldie Lookin' Chain, for some reason) and then last year started on becoming this "go to" organisation for various festival issues. Which is ridiculous. They have a small amount of support, who basically shout down any criticism of them, with the simplistic argument of "You're either for the riots, or against them" not realising that it doesnt effect nearly as many people as their "information" campaign about moshing/crowd surfing/aggressive dancing, which is basically just a disguised form of over zealous do gooding.
But of course, thats whats Love Not Riots, and Safe Concerts, dont realise. They're "do gooding" would be tremendously unpopular, if enough people knew about it. But Love Not Riots regularly liase with Police and Security services before festivals and tell them they're feedback. But of course, the only feedback they're getting is some scrawny teenager who couldnt cope being in the second row of Kaiser Chiefs. I've got absolutely no doubt in my mind that Love Not Riots and Safe concerts influenced this decision to cancel this day at a festival.
And think about it, its not even a big festival, so how long is it going take to transfer to the bigger festivals, and eventually gigs?
If they want Safe Concerts,why don't THEY fcuking stay at home and watch it on YOUTUBE!
Gigs with seats are shit.
EDIT: Wasn't Tim Jonze the dribbly-nosed one that pissed Mozz off last year?
DJ Diamond wrote: Rare Guardian link :nod:
EDIT: Wasn't Tim Jonze the dribbly-nosed one that pissed Mozz off last year?
Brilliant quote:
"In fact, the police went further, claiming to have carried out in-depth analysis on Babyshambles' music - something I have studiously avoided doing in my six years as a music journalist." 
But, yeah, I agree with Liam... Even though I can't stand Bambyshambles/Doherty, any two-bit police force that uses the excuse of crowd surfing or a "whirlpool" effect to cancel a gig, deserves all it gets...
NP: The Prodigy (with PWEI) - Their Law
3615 Jiphy wrote: Last year, I went to a concert and...
We had to sit. We could not smoke. No smoking pause allowed.
It drove me to conclude. Better lie on my couch and watch a DVD. But what is the interest of a concert on DVD?
Me and a few others from here went to see the Yellow Magic Orchestra at the all seated Royal Festival Hall, and it was much the same. Hilarious, in fact. I got warned for getting my camera out, from about a mile away, and was constantly 'SHUSHHHH!'ed' by upset punters for talking quietly between songs.
I would have got extremely wound up if it was someone i really liked.
Burt Reynolds wrote: Hilarious, in fact.
Indeed. That is what happened to us. We could not help laughing at some point. But instead of "sshhh", people laughed along...
