The Conservative Party

Link

Public sector pay freeze.

A sure-fire vote winner there

Am I the only one worried that the apocalypse (slight return) is actually imminent?

Am I the only one that knew people could even claim tax credits if they were earning that kind of money in the first place? I thought it only applied to families with a household income of 30k or less.

Clayhead Liberation Faction wrote: Am I the only one worried that the apocalypse (slight return) is actually imminent?

No

i'm scared silly. i wish people would stop talking about cameron being the next prime minister in that flippant, fatalistic way. it's not helpful OR funny.

Not a fan of Dave. But someone has to sort out the complete fooking mess / lies the useless Blair & Brown has created in this country.

So far their ELECTION PROMISES (which they will surely break) are to cut spending on the NHS and schools and a pay freeze for nurses and teachers.

All this based on Labour's supposed dropping of us all in the shit by keeping the financial system afloat, which saved a lot of us from real misery and only dropped us in paper shit, rather than the actual shit of losing our jobs and all of our money.

So what if the country is in debt? They'll pay it back when the banks pay the loads back. We're in great shape really.

Look at what happened when that Swiss bank collapsed - everyone lost their OWN money. That's not happened here, entirely because of the intervention of the government.

Our only hope is that the debt that the country incurred by lending money to the banks is paid back by election time.

So that's the bankers have to work harder or the Conservatives lose.

Oh dear.

And the left wing option would be?

This is like America, you can vote right or very right.....and soon we'll have the BNP taken seriously, so we can vote nazi too.

Still, tis all your problem, as you know paddies are prohibited from voting.

That's bollocks.

Doctor? wrote: and soon we'll have the BNP taken seriously, so we can vote nazi too.

No we wont.

Biginoil wrote: That's bollocks.

Oh so Labour didn't continue thatch's policies of privatisation and destruction of unions and workers' rights?

Must have missed them setting BR up again, etc etc.

Glad we're kept out of it to be honest, yous can simmer in your own sewage.

Liam, just because you and I have opposable thumbs doesn't mean everyone does, the Mail has a vast readership you know.

Biginoil wrote:

Public sector pay freeze.

A sure-fire vote winner there

Didnt the Labour Party say they would do the same thing last week?

Chris Nash wrote:

Burt Reynolds wrote:

Biginoil wrote:

Public sector pay freeze.

A sure-fire vote winner there

Didnt the Labour Party say they would do the same thing last week?

Surely you're not suggesting that the Tories are trying to copy Labour (again) in order to gain votes as they have no viable policies of their own?

No I think that both realise that you either cut public jobs or freeze pay in order to reduce the debt. It's hardly rocket science.

I doubt Id vote next electon. Labour have been in far too long and have just run the country into the ground. They havent taken a hard enough stance on crime, removed too much power from the police, teachers, etc and bowed down to human rights. And ive not even mentioned economics or immigration fiasco.

Tories dont have a strong enough leader in Cameron. He seems decent enough (like Boris) but I dont think theyre really heavy weights in the political arena.

BNP is a worry. The amount of seats they won on local councils will no doubt carry on to general election. And with so few people showing up at poll stations and showing the same apathy for main parties as I have could mean BNP reaping the rewards. I cant stand the BNP but Blues and Reds need to raise their game to counter them.

Libs and Green wont do much. Theyre kinda like Fulham or Villa. Always there but never win anything.

So far they've alienated anyone on benefits, all civil servants and anyone that can't stand arrogant wankers, so I think the more often they open their mouth, the less chance they stand of getting elected.

OK the economy is a mess, but it's global, and also cyclic, no matter who is in, this shit happens every 10-15 years, you just carry on through it and have forgotten by the time it comes round again.

Jed's right.

It's not enough to just read the newspapers. You have to think as well.

This country might not be in as bad a state as they tell you it is you know.

How is it for you?

Chris Nash wrote: . I hate to think what our society will be like in five years time.

It will still be shite. We will still be sorting out Labours mess. Labour did well early on because the Conservatives did the groundwork for many years before. It was only when they planted their own ideas they got shown to be complete fook wits.

Vote Tory

I'd rather Piss in my own eye

Chris Nash wrote: the Conservatives will drag Britain down to the lowest depths

We're already there.

Burt Reynolds wrote:

Chris Nash wrote: the Conservatives will drag Britain down to the lowest depths

We're already there.

oh what an idiotic thing to say. it's up there with:

"they're all as bad as each other." "we're about ready for a change now." "they can't make things any worse." "you can't tell them apart these days." "this lot have fucked things right up, let the other lot have a go."

the public will get what the public wants. stupid fuckers.

i can't bear to think about it. don't have nightmares, do sleep well.

Ally wrote: One person won't give a toss either way:

my contingency plans are already underway

Chris Nash wrote:

Ger Boy wrote:

Chris Nash wrote: . I hate to think what our society will be like in five years time.

It will still be shite. We will still be sorting out Labours mess. Labour did well early on because the Conservatives did the groundwork for many years before. It was only when they planted their own ideas they got shown to be complete fook wits.

Vote Tory

Did the groundwork for:

Strikes (throughout), Destruction of the coal and steel industries, war and mass murder (1982), selling weapons to Iraq and Afghanistan (1980 - 1997) that are still being used to kill allied troops today, the destruction of the railway infrastructure (throughout), slow deterioration of the NHS (I was working for them at the time), the privatisation and resulting disolvement of many public bodies - PSA, half of the DOE, an eigth of the Treasury Services, foundation for the privatisation of the postal service (heard any complaints about that?) I could go on and on, but seriously, no one in their right blue-rinsed mind could ever vote Conservative.

remarkably blinkered stuff. Think I could put up a list covering all of those points and more but set it in the last twenty years. But I can't be arsed with politics.

Do you not remember 1979 and the strikes? and don't even start on war lol

Coal had been losing massive amounts of cash since 1965 when it last scraped a profit.. ( I know this is a long argument, but lets not start it)

And Royal Mail was running alright until 1997.. Then email came along..

I'm not defending any party here.. But lets face it, changes happen, and its a shame you can be so holier than thou about it, Chris.

Bringin up the Falklands is rich, at least there was some possibly explicable reason for that one....not just piling the corpses of our young men to make the yanks pipeline go easier.

They're all bastards. Tories sent SAS death squads after terrorists, Labour put them in charge of policing and schools then went chasing make believe terrorists for the yanks. All cunts.

Oh, and for the twat who said Labour were all about human rights and shit....it works like this....set up a load of retarded legislation designed to protect criminals and annoy victims, thereby creating the perfect conditions in the small minds of most people to begin routine phone tapping, forcing citizens to carry and produce papers on demand, keeping a database of DNA from innocent persons, making possession of a camera an offense, and so on ad infinitum....and have the proles sing your fucking praises for it.

Douglas Adams had it perfectly right when he said that the desire to become a politician should instantly and perpetually preclude one from becoming such. People should be FORCED into government at gunpoint.

bloodynora wrote:

Burt Reynolds wrote:

Chris Nash wrote: the Conservatives will drag Britain down to the lowest depths

We're already there.

oh what an idiotic thing to say. it's up there with:

"they're all as bad as each other." "we're about ready for a change now." "they can't make things any worse." "you can't tell them apart these days." "this lot have fucked things right up, let the other lot have a go."

the public will get what the public wants. stupid fuckers.

i can't bear to think about it. don't have nightmares, do sleep well.

I can just remember my shed being burned down one October in 1979, and a Green Goddess turn up four hours after calling them. Then a power cut the same night.

bliss...

I'm not bothered who runs it all, but a change is needed. Both parties appear to be aligned, or at least Labour has shifted so dramatically away from Socialism, I'm surprised you old staunch lefties even recognise the party you supported as rebel kids. A change brings in new ideas though, which are often good til they run out of them. In 1997, there was a rush of good new policies for a while.

Actually.. let the Lib Dems have a go.. they must have been sitting on new policy for 50 years.

Chris Nash wrote:

Strikes (throughout), Destruction of the coal and steel industries, war and mass murder (1982), selling weapons to Iraq and Afghanistan (1980 - 1997) that are still being used to kill allied troops today, the destruction of the railway infrastructure (throughout), slow deterioration of the NHS (I was working for them at the time), the privatisation and resulting disolvement of many public bodies - PSA, half of the DOE, an eigth of the Treasury Services, foundation for the privatisation of the postal service (heard any complaints about that?) I could go on and on, but seriously, no one in their right blue-rinsed mind could ever vote Conservative.

Hmmm 1980's politics , love it! Lady T did more good for this country than any Labour politician ever has.

I wonder if I could think of anything bad Labour has done in the last 12 years

Oh Lord, the end is truly nigh......and the irony is an awful lot of people seem happy to welcome it with open arms.

Ally wrote: One person won't give a toss either way:

Another fat useless Jock

Chris Nash wrote:

Harping back to the 70s as an example of Labour incompetence is naiive.

I agree, as is harping back to the Eighties.

I suspect the whole drive to this inevitability is a vote for anyone else but the current government, which run out of steam some years ago.

The beauty of politics is, if we don't like change, we can always vote them out. We don't have to keep them in twenty year cycles after all.

I can pinpoint the exact moment i lost any faith in the current government, although it had been dwindling for a long time. October 2003.. was watching Sky News live with coffee, when it was revealed that Dr David Kelly hadnt turned up to give evidence to the Hutton Enquiry...

Lots of panicking people running around, worried looking Labour faces, then of course the announcement two hours later.

Chris Nash wrote: Come on then Burt - who would you vote for? Don't be shy...

I haven't ever used my mandate, and don't see any reason to start in the near future. Politics is a complete farce these days, although i do reckon a bit of freshness in terms of policy, from any realistic contender may well make a difference, albeit temporarily.

I touched on it earlier, but we need to stop giving parties twenty year runs, and change the c___s more often.

Chris Nash wrote: I think that not voting is an awful waste. If one doesn't vote, there's no right to complain about whichever party is in power.

It particularly irks me when women don't vote, especially after what the suffragettes went through. They really did die for their cause.

We need a completely new political option, or we'll end up as bad as the USA and eventually... Italy

Well we perhaps need a new system. Parties are too aligned. I do miss the characters from the 70's and 80's, and the passion from both sides. Was just on MSN, talking about Boris.. not praising him necessarily, but at least he speaks his mind and talks with passion. Probably why he isn't an MP any more lol.

I am concerned we've done this 20 year cycle twice in the last forty years. The 'Italy' situation is not going to happen, but we can swop parties every five, and I wish we did it more.

Chris Nash wrote:

Burt Reynolds wrote: I do miss the characters from the 70's and 80's.

I actually meant the Hattersleys, Howes, Heseltines, Clarks etc of this world. All great public speakers.
it all seems a bit false and faceless now.

Surely you can agree on that one?

Only characters I can see now are Prescott and Ken Clarke. And Mandelson can fuck off despite his impressive recent effort.

set of posh toffs masquerading as "ordianry, decent" folk, struggling though this self-made financial fuck-up. seems increasingly clear we should've let those Del-Boy city chancers jump out of their 20th storey windows rather than bail them out and have BOTH parties pay for it with our money and massive public sector cuts.

on a lighter note, the smug London wankers at this party conference in Manchester look just like the "In The City" tossers who'll be turning up next week, but with better drugs i suspect.

Can't be as bad as the USA. We have the ultra conservative white party and the mild conservative pseudo liberal party. The ultra conservatives only just complain about everything they say the mild party does but the mild party doesn't actually do anything in the first place. Sort of like the chicken or egg question without any chickens. And the nice smart black guy is being called the most horrible person ever because, well just because he has the nerve to be there. The rest of world should be laughing.

Ger Boy wrote:

Ally wrote: One person won't give a toss either way:

Another fat useless Jock

Give him his country back then (oh, and his oil that's the only thing keeping the UK from being a genuine 3rd world country)

0_o wrote: Can't be as bad as the USA. We have the ultra conservative white party and the mild conservative pseudo liberal party. The ultra conservatives only just complain about everything they say the mild party does but the mild party doesn't actually do anything in the first place. Sort of like the chicken or egg question without any chickens. And the nice smart black guy is being called the most horrible person ever because, well just because he has the nerve to be there. The rest of world should be laughing.

ummm.... not really.... but what ever

Let the Brits talk about their politics without us putting ours in... holy sh** what a concept!

Chris Nash wrote: I think that not voting is an awful waste. If one doesn't vote, there's no right to complain about whichever party is in power.

Yes but whoever you vote for.....you are then responsible for every single thing they do.....so anyone voting labour in the last ten years has Iraq and A'stan on their conscience, alon with all of whaqui jacqui's 1984 inspired nonsense of the last couple of years.....plus one Brazillian, executed for looking a bit foreign.

And who would you suggest I vote for, remembering that we're not allowed to vote for the government...should I vote for the party who wants to burn all that filthy fenians, or the one who wants to crucify the dirty huns....what about the party who only deal with women's issues, or the one with the name that sounds WAY to much like the full title of the Nazi party.....well?

I've voted ONCE, in the vote on the good friday agreement, I voted for it, got beaten up by an old school friend for it too. This means I'm responsible for a mass murderer being minister of education, and possibly even for the fact (since there's no way such a thing woulda happened before) that public money is being used to fund terrorist memorials (can you imagine the US taxpayer coughing for a shrine to the brve men who flew the planes into the towers?????????). Actually on the subject of that memorial, I dunno what's worse, the fact that they said it was for the dead of WWI, then put up a stone for each of the major kill-all-fenians terrorist clubs.....or the bare fact that they constantly try to monopolise WWI memorials in every shape, utterly displacing the fact that just as many catholics were left burried in the mud of France during the "big family bust up".

So yeah, I can vote unionist, and know that I support racism, petty thuggery and downright puritan thinking.....or I could vote for the shinners, and feel just fabulous the next time our minister for education orders a nice big bomb in an army barracks or shopping street.

EdelBrock wrote:

Let the Brits talk about their politics without us putting ours in... holy sh** what a concept!

Good job DHS don't monitor the net like the UK home office is gearing up for, otherwise....cuban food for you lad.

There's a useful article in the paper today which argues that the Tories are going to clean up at the election simply because David Cameron is neither (a) as anonymous or (b) as loathed as his predecessors.

Personally I find this unfathomable given that he's transparently a shit-eating, grotesquely overprivileged Public School cunt in the Grand Tory Tradition. But lots of other people think he's OK. Or, at least, not quite as much of a twat as previous Party leaders.

In other words, a truly depressing state of affairs however you look at it.

Click it and weep....

I don't vote but i struggle to see why that excludes me from passing comment on party politics and the way our country is run. Can someone please explain?

The reason I don't vote is that I don't want to legitimate any of them by giving them my endorsement. Why the hell should I put my name beside something or someone I don't believe in?

Can I vote Independant Party? Otherwise ill go Green.

NO Regret wrote: Can I vote Independant Party? Otherwise ill go Green.

...which begs the question: should the illiterate be allowed to vote?

Clayhead Liberation Faction wrote:

NO Regret wrote: Can I vote Independant Party? Otherwise ill go Green.

...which begs the question: should the illiterate be allowed to vote?

Im only independent when theres no one there

GlasVegas wrote: I don't vote but i struggle to see why that excludes me from passing comment on party politics and the way our country is run. Can someone please explain?

The reason I don't vote is that I don't want to legitimate any of them by giving them my endorsement. Why the hell should I put my name beside something or someone I don't believe in?

is this a joke? if not, yes, do please explain, someone. i've tried to do it myself several times now, but i keep losing what i've written when i start banging my head against the keyboard.

El Jarvo wrote:

NO Regret wrote: BNP is a worry. The amount of seats they won on local councils will no doubt carry on to general election. And with so few people showing up at poll stations and showing the same apathy for main parties as I have could mean BNP reaping the rewards. I cant stand the BNP but Blues and Reds need to raise their game to counter them.

Fella, you simply can't say you're not gonna vote, and then say you're worried about the BNP.

If you're not going to vote, then you've got no right to be worried.

As has been said here a billion times before though (er, mainly by Liam) the BNP are simply not a threat in this country. People in kitchen-sink estates vote for them in local elections (and perhaps European elections, which people still see as a bit of a sideshow over here) as a kneejerk reaction to whatever ills are going on in their world. "I've got a shit life, let's blame someone else for it." The overwhelming majority simply aren't gonna vote for 'em when they think their vote actually counts for something - i.e. in a general election. This country's come a long way since the 70's when far-right politics and the boot boys of the NF seemed, dare I say it, quite fashionable.

i think it may be getting trendier.

i'm not wildly worried about the BNP - it's the tories who are keeping me awake at night - but they're definitely making something of a come-back. and if far-right policies are popular they'll get absorbed, to some degree, into the mainstream. like catwalk fashion and high street shops.

last week i was teaching a class of 17 year olds about the third reich, and they couldn't see the link or the problem with our neck of the woods voting in those BNP MEPs. perhaps you don't spend enough time in small northern working-class towns. (well, no, clearly that's a nonsense, it's that i spend far too much time in small northern working-class towns. but you get my point.)

this is an express front page from a couple of weeks ago.

'britain is full up' is a BNP slogan. i don't think the express were being ironic.

bloodynora wrote:

GlasVegas wrote: I don't vote but i struggle to see why that excludes me from passing comment on party politics and the way our country is run. Can someone please explain?

The reason I don't vote is that I don't want to legitimate any of them by giving them my endorsement. Why the hell should I put my name beside something or someone I don't believe in?

is this a joke? if not, yes, do please explain, someone. i've tried to do it myself several times now, but i keep losing what i've written when i start banging my head against the keyboard.

Take a deep breath then dear and try again. I'm curious to know which part of my post is enraging you so much!

This thread is full of the most left wing shite I have ever read.

Teachers & Guardian readers

"Britain is Full Up"??

Worry not: Tracy Emin is fucking off and if Posh (who has clearly not been full up for a while) loses a couple more ounces that'll make room for a few extra as well.....

El Jarvo wrote:

Ger Boy wrote: This thread is full of the most left wing shite I have ever read.

Teachers & Guardian readers

I blame the blacks.

Twat

El Jarvo wrote:

Ger Boy wrote: This thread is full of the most left wing shite I have ever read.

Teachers & Guardian readers

I blame the blacks.

You can't go around blaming rugby players for the state this country is in!

GlasVegas wrote:

bloodynora wrote:

GlasVegas wrote: I don't vote but i struggle to see why that excludes me from passing comment on party politics and the way our country is run. Can someone please explain?

The reason I don't vote is that I don't want to legitimate any of them by giving them my endorsement. Why the hell should I put my name beside something or someone I don't believe in?

is this a joke? if not, yes, do please explain, someone. i've tried to do it myself several times now, but i keep losing what i've written when i start banging my head against the keyboard.

Take a deep breath then dear and try again. I'm curious to know which part of my post is enraging you so much!

you're toying with me, aren't you?

it's like that annoying girl who moans about her boyfriend but you know full well she's never going to dump him or tell him how she feels or try and change things in any way. it's REALLY FRUSTRATING.

you do get to pass comment. everyone does! it's ace! it's called democracy! we use a ballot box. and it expresses your views far more clearly and eloquently than any amount of arguing over a pub table ever could. jesus christ, if they TOOK AWAY that right to vote, i imagine you'd have something to say about it. don't make me use that line about the brave men and women of our armed forces dying so that etc etc. because, so help me young man, i will.

if you don't vote, you can, of course, continue to comment all you like (as long as we still have free speech) but it will mean nothing. NOTHING. it will be the incoherent bleating of the back seat driver.

one of those things you don't like is going to happen anyway. wouldn't it be lovely if it was the thing you disliked the least? those nasty politicans are not going to see the errors of their ways if you decide to take your ball home. they're not going to CANCEL government. they don't care. they don't need you to legitimise them. they're already fairly well established.

i think it's babyish and egocentric not to vote. it's not making a stand about what you do/don't believe. it's abstaining. copping out.

*clambers down from soapbox*

there. you WERE having me on, weren't you?

El Jarvo wrote:

Ger Boy wrote: This thread is full of the most left wing shite I have ever read.

Teachers & Guardian readers

I blame the blacks.

The Feinians and the blacks, surely??

bloodynora wrote:

GlasVegas wrote:

bloodynora wrote:

GlasVegas wrote: I don't vote but i struggle to see why that excludes me from passing comment on party politics and the way our country is run. Can someone please explain?

The reason I don't vote is that I don't want to legitimate any of them by giving them my endorsement. Why the hell should I put my name beside something or someone I don't believe in?

is this a joke? if not, yes, do please explain, someone. i've tried to do it myself several times now, but i keep losing what i've written when i start banging my head against the keyboard.

Take a deep breath then dear and try again. I'm curious to know which part of my post is enraging you so much!

you're toying with me, aren't you?

it's like that annoying girl who moans about her boyfriend but you know full well she's never going to dump him or tell him how she feels or try and change things in any way. it's REALLY FRUSTRATING.

you do get to pass comment. everyone does! it's ace! it's called democracy! we use a ballot box. and it expresses your views far more clearly and eloquently than any amount of arguing over a pub table ever could. jesus christ, if they TOOK AWAY that right to vote, i imagine you'd have something to say about it. don't make me use that line about the brave men and women of our armed forces dying so that etc etc. because, so help me young man, i will.

if you don't vote, you can, of course, continue to comment all you like (as long as we still have free speech) but it will mean nothing. NOTHING. it will be the incoherent bleating of the back seat driver.

one of those things you don't like is going to happen anyway. wouldn't it be lovely if it was the thing you disliked the least? those nasty politicans are not going to see the errors of their ways if you decide to take your ball home. they're not going to CANCEL government. they don't care. they don't need you to legitimise them. they're already fairly well established.

i think it's babyish and egocentric not to vote. it's not making a stand about what you do/don't believe. it's abstaining. copping out.

*clambers down from soapbox*

there. you WERE having me on, weren't you?

I dunno. I used to believe this too. But where I currently live is one of the safest Tory seats in the country. The Tories will retain the seat, just as they always do. And Labour will come third, just like they always do - with the Libs marginally in front of them.

So, apart from the bloody-minded principle of exercising my right to vote, what exactly is the point? How 'privileged' is the right to make a gesture that is utterly futile?

But you're right about one thing: the G-Man is like an annoying girlfriend. We've all been there with him.

Clayhead Liberation Faction wrote: There's a useful article in the paper today which argues that the Tories are going to clean up at the election simply because David Cameron is neither (a) as anonymous or (b) as loathed as his predecessors.

Personally I find this unfathomable given that he's transparently a shit-eating, grotesquely overprivileged Public School cunt in the Grand Tory Tradition. But lots of other people think he's OK.

On the subject of lying self-serving arseholes,let's draw a bit of attention to George Osbourne,the shadow chancellor. A slime ball of the highest order,who seems barely able to conceal his own sinister demeanor.He's fucking Beelzebub without horns,clearly.Worse than Peter Mandelson the horrible prick,with too much power.

Do we really want these utter Tory fuckers running the show?

You could bang on about it all day long,fact is,a Tory government is just so wrong for the vast majority of people in this country..but it looks like that's what we're getting unless there is a dramatic turnaround and people see them for what they are,and soon..

Unfortunately the job of running this country now looks to have become far too big even for an idealistic Prime Minister and his government,especially for an idealistic one,given the complexity of how everything works.It's simply mammoth...But do we really want borderline evil cunts at the helm?

All those on 150k a year or more,and in favour say Aye!

That's not even funny,actually.The Tories are a'coming.Nightmare.

Clayhead Liberation Faction wrote:

El Jarvo wrote:

Ger Boy wrote: This thread is full of the most left wing shite I have ever read.

Teachers & Guardian readers

I blame the blacks.

The Feinians and the blacks, surely??

Ahh, making me out to be racist & sectarian.

Maybe I should support Celtic, Vote Labour ,Talk 1980's politics and of course read The Guardian.

Because I want to be a leftie sheep

Boatraceface wrote:

Clayhead Liberation Faction wrote: There's a useful article in the paper today which argues that the Tories are going to clean up at the election simply because David Cameron is neither (a) as anonymous or (b) as loathed as his predecessors.

Personally I find this unfathomable given that he's transparently a shit-eating, grotesquely overprivileged Public School cunt in the Grand Tory Tradition. But lots of other people think he's OK.

On the subject of lying self-serving arseholes,let's draw a bit of attention to George Osbourne,the shadow chancellor. A slime ball of the highest order,who seems barely able to conceal his own sinister demeanor.He's fucking Beelzebub without horns,clearly.Worse than Peter Mandelson the horrible prick,with too much power.

Do we really want these utter Tory fuckers running the show?

You could bang on about it all day long,fact is,a Tory government is just so wrong for the vast majority of people in this country..but it looks like that's what we're getting unless there is a dramatic turnaround and people see them for what they are,and soon..

Unfortunately the job of running this country now looks to have become far too big even for an idealistic Prime Minister and his government,especially for an idealistic one,given the complexity of how everything works.It's simply mammoth...But do we really want borderline evil cunts at the helm?

All those on 150k a year or more,and in favour say Aye!

The Tory Party has promised to equip Our Troops. All the squaddies I know are not voting Labour. And I don't think they are on 150k.

Sounds like you're making a style decision in who you vote for, rather than muddying yourself with the idealogical or even practical issues.

This, I think, typifies about half of all people with right-wing views. The other half are just selfish cunts.

Would you be embarrassed if your friends knew you voted Labour? Or supported Celtic? Or read the Guardian? Or is there another reason?

Ger Boy wrote:

Clayhead Liberation Faction wrote:

El Jarvo wrote:

Ger Boy wrote: This thread is full of the most left wing shite I have ever read.

Teachers & Guardian readers

I blame the blacks.

The Feinians and the blacks, surely??

Ahh, making me out to be racist & sectarian.

Maybe I should support Celtic, Vote Labour ,Talk 1980's politics and of course read The Guardian.

Because I want to be a leftie sheep

You only vote Conservative because the play in blue,admit it,Jersey!

Fuck the Tories!

bloodynora wrote:

GlasVegas wrote:

bloodynora wrote:

GlasVegas wrote: I don't vote but i struggle to see why that excludes me from passing comment on party politics and the way our country is run. Can someone please explain?

The reason I don't vote is that I don't want to legitimate any of them by giving them my endorsement. Why the hell should I put my name beside something or someone I don't believe in?

is this a joke? if not, yes, do please explain, someone. i've tried to do it myself several times now, but i keep losing what i've written when i start banging my head against the keyboard.

Take a deep breath then dear and try again. I'm curious to know which part of my post is enraging you so much!

you're toying with me, aren't you?

it's like that annoying girl who moans about her boyfriend but you know full well she's never going to dump him or tell him how she feels or try and change things in any way. it's REALLY FRUSTRATING.

you do get to pass comment. everyone does! it's ace! it's called democracy! we use a ballot box. and it expresses your views far more clearly and eloquently than any amount of arguing over a pub table ever could. jesus christ, if they TOOK AWAY that right to vote, i imagine you'd have something to say about it. don't make me use that line about the brave men and women of our armed forces dying so that etc etc. because, so help me young man, i will.

if you don't vote, you can, of course, continue to comment all you like (as long as we still have free speech) but it will mean nothing. NOTHING. it will be the incoherent bleating of the back seat driver.

one of those things you don't like is going to happen anyway. wouldn't it be lovely if it was the thing you disliked the least? those nasty politicans are not going to see the errors of their ways if you decide to take your ball home. they're not going to CANCEL government. they don't care. they don't need you to legitimise them. they're already fairly well established.

i think it's babyish and egocentric not to vote. it's not making a stand about what you do/don't believe. it's abstaining. copping out.

*clambers down from soapbox*

there. you WERE having me on, weren't you?

So you vote for one crap party. Another crap party gets in. And then you sit there all smug in the knowledge that you've done youre bit, youve participated and youre happy with that?

I dont think so. Im with Glasvegas on this one

If the squaddies are voting Conservative then more fool them.A Tory promise aint worth shit.

The squaddies are in a ridiculous situation,in a stupid war they have little business being in,and need bringing home out of it,now!....say all the squaddie's families who I know(who are probably planning to vote Tory too,in some forlorn hope..)

I don't argue that Labour have not made a pig's ear of things,course they have...I argue The Tories are in no way,shape or form the answer.

NO Regret wrote:

So you vote for one crap party. Another crap party gets in. And then you sit there all smug in the knowledge that you've done youre bit, youve participated and youre happy with that?

I dont think so. Im with Glasvegas on this one

brilliant. better to not vote for any party and just sit around and bitch about them instead?

i don't think the labour party's crap. i think it's got problems, but i don't think it's crap. and i think it's a DAMN SIGHT better than the alternative.

if i vote at least i know i tried, yes. that i took, what - half an hour max? - out of my day to register my opinion on something that matters. hell's bells, you doubtless spend five times that every day registering your opinion on these bloody boards! it's partly apathy and resignation that will probably see the tories victorious next time.

i'm rarely smug about anything. but if i've participated i reckon i can feel justifiably saddened if things don't go my way and i don't like the state we're in.

bloodynora wrote:

GlasVegas wrote:

bloodynora wrote:

GlasVegas wrote: I don't vote but i struggle to see why that excludes me from passing comment on party politics and the way our country is run. Can someone please explain?

The reason I don't vote is that I don't want to legitimate any of them by giving them my endorsement. Why the hell should I put my name beside something or someone I don't believe in?

is this a joke? if not, yes, do please explain, someone. i've tried to do it myself several times now, but i keep losing what i've written when i start banging my head against the keyboard.

Take a deep breath then dear and try again. I'm curious to know which part of my post is enraging you so much!

you're toying with me, aren't you?

it's like that annoying girl who moans about her boyfriend but you know full well she's never going to dump him or tell him how she feels or try and change things in any way. it's REALLY FRUSTRATING.

you do get to pass comment. everyone does! it's ace! it's called democracy! we use a ballot box. and it expresses your views far more clearly and eloquently than any amount of arguing over a pub table ever could. jesus christ, if they TOOK AWAY that right to vote, i imagine you'd have something to say about it. don't make me use that line about the brave men and women of our armed forces dying so that etc etc. because, so help me young man, i will.

if you don't vote, you can, of course, continue to comment all you like (as long as we still have free speech) but it will mean nothing. NOTHING. it will be the incoherent bleating of the back seat driver.

one of those things you don't like is going to happen anyway. wouldn't it be lovely if it was the thing you disliked the least? those nasty politicans are not going to see the errors of their ways if you decide to take your ball home. they're not going to CANCEL government. they don't care. they don't need you to legitimise them. they're already fairly well established.

i think it's babyish and egocentric not to vote. it's not making a stand about what you do/don't believe. it's abstaining. copping out.

*clambers down from soapbox*

there. you WERE having me on, weren't you?

No I was being dead serious. Although I'm quite taken of that image of myself as an 'annoying girlfriend'. Do I get to wear frilly knickers?

If you can't recognise the inherent worth in abstaining, if you can't see how that in itself can be a political action, albeit a futile and worthless one (though no less worthless than actually going out and sticking your solitary 'x' next to someone's name) then there's no point in continuing the debate. Although it's really not a difficult concept to grasp.

As for you graciously conceding that although I don't vote I will still be able to pass comment on the state of the nation (thanks for that!) I'm confused as why my opinion will mean 'NOTHING' (in angry capital letters) and why yours will mean 'something'. What's that about?

As I, the Doctor and the fella in the post above me have said previously why on earth should I give my backing to a person/party who's principles I don't believe in? Makes no sense to me.

GlasVegas wrote:

No I was being dead serious. Although I'm quite taken of that image of myself as an 'annoying girlfriend'. Do I get to wear frilly knickers?

If you can't recognise the inherent worth in abstaining, if you can't see how that in itself can be a political action, albeit a futile and worthless one (though no less worthless than actually going out and sticking your solitary 'x' next to someone's name) then there's no point in continuing the debate. Although it's really not a difficult concept to grasp.

As for you graciously conceding that although I don't vote I will still be able to pass comment on the state of the nation (thanks for that!) I'm confused as why my opinion will mean 'NOTHING' (in angry capital letters) and why yours will mean 'something'. What's that about?

As I, the Doctor and the fella in the post above me have said previously why on earth should I give my backing to a person/party who's principles I don't believe in? Makes no sense to me.

ok then, you do me the favour of explaining the inherent worth in abstaining. explain how that makes a difference to people's daily lives in the same way a vote does.

i would have thought it was quite clear my whole tone was good-natured/light-hearted. the capital letters were a mocking exaggeration of my passionate rant. as was the 'gracious concession'. my point was that a voter's opinion will have the weight of action behind it. they've put their money where their mouth is.

isn't it better sometimes - isn't it INEVITABLE sometimes - to make a choice that is the lesser evil? most of us rarely get to do or get to have exactly what we want. expecting everything all our own way "or i'm not playing" is, as i said, babyish and egocentric.

in my worthless, leftie, teacher's, guardian-reading opinion :shy:

Boatraceface wrote: [You only vote Conservative because the play in blue,admit it,Jersey!

Thats me

I also only listen to Blue Monday, and refuse to listen to Everythings Gone Green.

bloodynora wrote:

NO Regret wrote:

So you vote for one crap party. Another crap party gets in. And then you sit there all smug in the knowledge that you've done youre bit, youve participated and youre happy with that?

I dont think so. Im with Glasvegas on this one

brilliant. better to not vote for any party and just sit around and bitch about them instead?

So which version of the nazi party should I vote for here, since we're not allowed to vote for the govt??

Would you prefer IRA or UVF deaths on my conscience?

(just as labour voters have all those dead squaddies, and innocent people in their own homes on theirs and the tories have the falklands on theirs)

Do please tell me, how voting for evil scum is SO important?

Right now, I'd vote for satan himself to get shot of what the oh so very left wing (presumably, as in Stalin) home office have in store for us all....but while blacks have the vote, dogs and irish still don't.

Ally wrote: Personally, I share GlasVegas's point of view on this. If none of the candidates in my area appeal to me then I just won't vote rather than strategically registering a "protest" vote for Labour/Lib Dems/Green just to keep either the Tories or BNP from power. If I don't identify with any of the candidates views I don't want to affiliate my name with them by marking an X. Those are my own reasons for abstaining anyway.

Where I'm originally from the BNP - or Tories for that matter - aren't exactly much of a problem which is probably why I don't share the same alarm as some folk on here. Obviously from what I know of the BNP and their policies they wouldn't be getting my vote at any point.

Also to agree with Bert, rather than the usual cyclical 15 years of Tories then 15 years of Labour it would be nice to see the UK populace using their voting power to boot out under performing governments more often. If suddenly a political party or politician pierced my current political apathy I'd gladly give them a vote otherwise I'm far too disinterested to start strategically voting to keep far right or far left parties out of Hollyrood or Westminster.

Dull observations:

1. Well, the ballot is anonymous, innit? So, in effect, you don't actually "affiliate [your] name" with any party, much in the same way that registering a spoiled ballot paper has any direct affiliation with you. Except in your own head, natch.

2. It's all very well having this idea that chopping and changing Governments every four years is healthy, but its not exactly realistic, is it? Any major policy shifts or re-routing of public money takes serious time to implement or for the effects to be felt at street-level. Governments inherit the previous incumbents policies to an extent and have to go with the flow for a while. No good would be done by installing a new Government at whim - the end result would be ultimately be stasis.

3. I didn't vote last time around because I knew the gesture would be empty. If I thought my vote had any chance I could keep the Tories (or, indeed, BNP) out there'd be no chance of me even considering abstention.

Casting a vote has bollocks all to do with one's contribution to society and it has far less effect on how society operates than people like to think. 'Popular democracy' exists ONLY to legitimate and serve the interests of capitalism. That's not some radical leftie thinking, it's a simple fact. And I'm not even saying it's necessarily a bad thing (being a dirty capitalist exploiter-of-labour myself). My point is that Joe Bloggs trundling down to cast his vote actually has fuck all influence on the fundamentals of how society runs.

Anyone who stamps their feet and gets uptight when reasoned people decide 'nah, fuck it, I'm not getting involved with any of these clowns' really needs to have a word with themselves. Or at least provide us with a thoughtful reason as to why this is wrong beyond the emotive 'good men died for your right to vote' nonsense.

Half the country share G's point of view on this.. What was the turnout at the last General Election? 52% or something close to that??That's a lot of apathy.I never voted last time around.Safe Labour heartlands around here-at the time.

I really don't want a Tory government,never have,but they were in complete disarray last time,internally chopping and changing leaders,squabbling,split on all their own policies and more importantly-people still remembered full well they can't be trusted.So they were a joke,a party in terminal decline.

Now the public perception seems to be they have their act together and are fit to govern,or more likely people are just pissed off with the present incumbents.The Tories are still hugely divided,they've just learned they have to keep up a public perception of unity or they will never get in.It'll kick off again once the do,god forbid,'come to power'

Like we all know,as much depends on personalities as policy,if not more so when people come to decide their vote. Labour are lacking a dynamic leader.Unlike say,a Blair.Who,for all his many many faults..when he first came to power had a bit of charisma,played the game very well with the media(He even got the Tory rag THE SUN onside for a while) made people believe he could turn his hand to it and make a decent fist of it,which he did for a while and was an extremely good liar,helped by the talented spin doc Alistair Campbell.He got found out in the end and has a fair bit to answer for now..Gordon Brown is a real intellectual and political heavy weight,but the job is just too big for him,I think he's finding that out himself now after coveting the post for so long,and he has an image problem,which it is far too late for him to overcome.Labour can't win with him in charge,seemingly.

David Cameron on the other hand,is a prissy posh jumped up power hungry political pygmy by comparison,with despisable lieutenants.The worst sort of dangerous little slimey fanny that you want in charge,I'll wager. God help us.

I thought it was every mans (and womans) right NOT to vote.

Unlike Australia where you get banged up for 6 months:\ohwell:

Ger Boy wrote:

Boatraceface wrote: [You only vote Conservative because the play in blue,admit it,Jersey!

Thats me

I also only listen to Blue Monday, and refuse to listen to Everythings Gone Green.

Word on the street,is you in no way dig Hoola Hoops Gerboy,or Mealers Pacers... No siree...for you,the grass is several shades of blue and every member of parliament trips on glue..

Hmmmm been watching this thread and was really ready to write a collosal post but cant be arsed.

1,They all piss in the same pot 2,The BNP are as daft as Boris 3,CamerOON is a slimy bastard 4,The one eyed scottish idiot is a still a one eyed scottish idiot...... and finally number 5 I would NEVER vote Tory.

None of them do anything decent for the average working man.

Coming from an area that has seen its two main industries decimated by the Tories they are straight off my list,i would NEVER vote for them.

My town WAS always a labour heartland and the local council was always Labour.

The last few council elections have seen massive gains for independents and rather sadly the BNP.

Why do people vote BNP?

Admittedly in some of my previous posts i have harped on about immigration,as many of us have,and quite rightly so,the main BNP policy is immigration and this particular issue wins votes,again unfortunately.

In my town i see the BNP as a vote of protest,they are in town everyday of the week spouting their rubbish.

I was in on Monday and actually stopped to listen what the Gadji was saying.

My opinion of them still hasn't changed,they talk shite are shite,and will never win shite,Or WILL they?

They will continue to win seats in Northern towns like ours,perhaps because of the protest vote,or because at present there are no particular parties that are a real viable alternative.

This country needs a revolution to sort it out,not one eyed scotch idiots nor slimy tory publicity seeking fuckwits....

I therefore propose to start my own particular political party,the party....

Policies to follow soon

http://neworderinfoweb.piczo.com

Boatraceface wrote: Half the country share G's point of view on this.. What was the turnout at the last General Election? 52% or something close to that??That's a lot of apathy.I never voted last time around.Safe Labour heartlands around here-at the time.

Turnout figures

2005: 61.3% 2001: 59.1% 1997: 71% 1992: 78% (I think)

The Tories will get in no matter what; that was a foregone conclusion once Brown took the reins.

I hope the sanitised Nazi party don't make too many gains.

A few Parliamentary candidates were interviewed on Radio 4 this morning.

When asked who was the greatest Prime Minister of the 20th Century, almost all of them said Margaret Thatcher. One of them said 'apart from her last few years' and someone else, predictably, said dear old Winston.

In 1988 Margaret Thatcher tried to outlaw "the teaching in any maintained school of the acceptability of homosexuality as a pretended family relationship". That's 1988. Not 1888 (sorry Shug): 1988.

They are, genetically, horrible horrible people.

Biginoil wrote: A few Parliamentary candidates were interviewed on Radio 4 this morning.

When asked who was the greatest Prime Minister of the 20th Century, almost all of them said Margaret Thatcher. One of them said 'apart from her last few years' and someone else, predictably, said dear old Winston.

In 1988 Margaret Thatcher tried to outlaw "the teaching in any maintained school of the acceptability of homosexuality as a pretended family relationship". That's 1988. Not 1888 (sorry Shug): 1988.

They are, genetically, horrible horrible people.

How dare they!! I'm going on Strrke in protest.

Surely it's James Callaghan or Tony Blair.

Viking Numéro 7 wrote: The tories are cunts.

Anyone that supports them are cunts.

That is all.

I'm a handsome cunt then

Ger Boy wrote:

21st Century Political Debate in action right there.

We are fucked

It could be red It could be blue Theres nothing much to choose between the two

Biginoil wrote:

Ger Boy wrote:

21st Century Political Debate in action right there.

We are fucked

Wow ,is it still 1983? I just heard a new song called Blue Monday , it's ace!

Thatcher won , get over it and dry your eyes. I know your style icon Michael Foot lost , but hey, Thats Life!

It's 2009 ,and Labour have completely fooking ruined this country for the last 12 years.

Yes Foot would have been a terrible leader, him being all scruffy and that.

Could you outline how the country is fucked, and how Labour is to blame?

No looking at your Sun, now. This must be all your own work.

I can. Under the last Tories regime, how many ASBO's served? How many mobile phones stolen? How many cybercriminals were there?

NONE on each count.

NO Regret wrote: I can. Under the last Tories regime, how many ASBO's served? How many mobile phones stolen? How many cybercriminals were there?

NONE on each count.

I liked your poem :)

Howay Ger,you've had ya fun.The only good Tory is a Frankie Defuckintorri..You know it,I know it,gadge.

Biginoil wrote: Could you outline how the country is fucked, and how Labour is to blame?

Yeah your right , my mistake. I wonder why The Labour Party has the worst support now than it ever has?

Debt, Europe , Health Service , Education , War , Crime , Policy , Economy , Employment, Expenses , Pensions

A fine job done on all of them.

Thatcher Out

Biginoil wrote: Yes Foot would have been a terrible leader, him being all scruffy and that.

Could you outline how the country is fucked, and how Labour is to blame?

No looking at your Sun, now. This must be all your own work.

Enforced ID cards just round the corner, innocent people's DNA being kept on police file, the outlawing of cameras in public places etc etc etc etc. Trouble is, those are all Tory policies as far as I can see, so they will not do away with them.

Oh, and giving 5 billion to the world's richest man for him to deliver a computer system for the NHS, and letting him walk away without delivering anything. Police watchin a child drown because to intervene would breach H+S

Ger Boy wrote:

Biginoil wrote:

Ger Boy wrote:

21st Century Political Debate in action right there.

We are fucked

Wow ,is it still 1983? I just heard a new song called Blue Monday , it's ace!

Thatcher won , get over it and dry your eyes. I know your style icon Michael Foot lost , but hey, Thats Life!

It's 2009 ,and Labour have completely fooking ruined this country for the last 12 years.

The point, my right-wing friend, is that we are all still living with the fall-out from the 1980s. The 80s might have ended nearly two decades ago but so much of the core ideological ground which governs the UK today is grounded in the shift towards neoliberal consensus in the Thatcher years.

As it stands, the political and economic shifts of the eighties are Ground Zero for 21st Century Britain. If you don't understand this then you're probably as braindead as your online persona.

Clayhead Liberation Faction wrote:

The point, my right-wing friend, is that we are all still living with the fall-out from the 1980s. The 80s might have ended nearly two decades ago but so much of the core ideological ground which governs the UK today is grounded in the shift towards neoliberal consensus in the Thatcher years.

As it stands, the political and economic shifts of the eighties are Ground Zero for 21st Century Britain. If you don't understand this then you're probably as braindead as your online persona.

So...

I wanted Blair out for starting an illegal war in Iraq ,and it was Thatchers fault all along.

I knew it , thank you for putting me right my Socialist Buddy

Ah yes, I remember the extraordinary outcry against joining the US-led coalition from the Tories. It was deafening.

Oh, hang on - it was actually high-profile Labour MPs who openly voiced their discontent, some even resigning over the matter.

Blair is as irrelevant now as Thatch - get over it, buddy.

Ger Boy wrote:

Clayhead Liberation Faction wrote:

The point, my right-wing friend, is that we are all still living with the fall-out from the 1980s. The 80s might have ended nearly two decades ago but so much of the core ideological ground which governs the UK today is grounded in the shift towards neoliberal consensus in the Thatcher years.

As it stands, the political and economic shifts of the eighties are Ground Zero for 21st Century Britain. If you don't understand this then you're probably as braindead as your online persona.

So...

I wanted Blair out for starting an illegal war in Iraq ,and it was Thatchers fault all along.

I knew it , thank you for putting me right my Socialist Buddy

Well if we're playing warcrimes.....Belgrano.

Clayhead Liberation Faction wrote: Ah yes, I remember the extraordinary outcry against joining the US-led coalition from the Tories. It was deafening.

Thats because Blair had seen evidence of WMD.

But it was just good old Labour lies

Or was it Thatcher

Doctor? wrote:

Well if we're playing warcrimes.....Belgrano.

You, my sitting on the fence friend , are a troublemaker

wrote: Hmmmm been watching this thread and was really ready to write a collosal post but cant be arsed.

1,They all piss in the same pot 2,The BNP are as daft as Boris 3,CamerOON is a slimy bastard 4,The one eyed scottish idiot is a still a one eyed scottish idiot...... and finally number 5 I would NEVER vote Tory.

None of them do anything decent for the average working man.

Coming from an area that has seen its two main industries decimated by the Tories they are straight off my list,i would NEVER vote for them.

My town WAS always a labour heartland and the local council was always Labour.

The last few council elections have seen massive gains for independents and rather sadly the BNP.

Why do people vote BNP?

Admittedly in some of my previous posts i have harped on about immigration,as many of us have,and quite rightly so,the main BNP policy is immigration and this particular issue wins votes,again unfortunately.

In my town i see the BNP as a vote of protest,they are in town everyday of the week spouting their rubbish.

I was in on Monday and actually stopped to listen what the Gadji was saying.

My opinion of them still hasn't changed,they talk shite are shite,and will never win shite,Or WILL they?

They will continue to win seats in Northern towns like ours,perhaps because of the protest vote,or because at present there are no particular parties that are a real viable alternative.

This country needs a revolution to sort it out,not one eyed scotch idiots nor slimy tory publicity seeking fuckwits....

I therefore propose to start my own particular political party,the party....

Policies to follow soon

http://neworderinfoweb.piczo.com

Clayhead Liberation Faction wrote:

Ger Boy wrote:

Biginoil wrote:

Ger Boy wrote:

21st Century Political Debate in action right there.

We are fucked

Wow ,is it still 1983? I just heard a new song called Blue Monday , it's ace!

Thatcher won , get over it and dry your eyes. I know your style icon Michael Foot lost , but hey, Thats Life!

It's 2009 ,and Labour have completely fooking ruined this country for the last 12 years.

The point, my right-wing friend, is that we are all still living with the fall-out from the 1980s. The 80s might have ended nearly two decades ago but so much of the core ideological ground which governs the UK today is grounded in the shift towards neoliberal consensus in the Thatcher years.

As it stands, the political and economic shifts of the eighties are Ground Zero for 21st Century Britain. If you don't understand this then you're probably as braindead as your online persona.

You should consider politics as a future Martin. Really should. You can quote your shit in the Houses of Parly as well as on here then

Ger Boy wrote:

Clayhead Liberation Faction wrote: Ah yes, I remember the extraordinary outcry against joining the US-led coalition from the Tories. It was deafening.

Thats because Blair had seen evidence of WMD.

But it was just good old Labour lies

Or was it Thatcher

Or was it more that the Tories are never going to (a) pass up a chance to gear up for war, (b) challenge our "special relationship" with the U.S. (particularly when there's a Republican in the White House), (c) reject quasi-Imperialist foreign policy which allows Britannia to pretend to be Great once more, and (d) avoid the bashing of Johnny Foreigner (especially them darkie types).

What the fuck were the Conservatives doing believing anything Blair said anyway? Their job is to be the fucking opposition, after all. But, of course, now they can bleat about how they were "lied to", just like the rest of us ordinary folk.

You're talking bollocks. The situation regarding British troops in the Middle East would be exactly the same even if the Tories had been in power for the last decade. Still, I'm looking forward to an immediate withdrawal of the British presence in Iraq and Afghanistan within months of Cameron entering Number 10.

Oh, hang on.......he's just going to give the soldiers better helmets and extra copies of "Razzle", isn't he?

Ger Boy wrote:

Doctor? wrote:

Well if we're playing warcrimes.....Belgrano.

You, my sitting on the fence friend , are a troublemaker

No, I, just says it like I sees it, they're all cunts, and picking over the details of their cuntishness is just tiring to my soul.

Clayhead Liberation Faction wrote:

Ger Boy wrote:

Clayhead Liberation Faction wrote: Ah yes, I remember the extraordinary outcry against joining the US-led coalition from the Tories. It was deafening.

Thats because Blair had seen evidence of WMD.

But it was just good old Labour lies

Or was it Thatcher

Or was it more that the Tories are never going to (a) pass up a chance to gear up for war, (b) challenge our "special relationship" with the U.S. (particularly when there's a Republican in the White House), (c) reject quasi-Imperialist foreign policy which allows Britannia to pretend to be Great once more, and (d) avoid the bashing of Johnny Foreigner (especially them darkie types).

What the fuck were the Conservatives doing believing anything Blair said anyway? Their job is to be the fucking opposition, after all. But, of course, now they can bleat about how they were "lied to", just like the rest of us ordinary folk.

You're talking bollocks. The situation regarding British troops in the Middle East would be exactly the same even if the Tories had been in power for the last decade. Still, I'm looking forward to an immediate withdrawal of the British presence in Iraq and Afghanistan within months of Cameron entering Number 10.

Oh, hang on.......he's just going to give the soldiers better helmets and extra copies of "Razzle", isn't he?

Latest Election 2010 Betting Odds

Conservatives 1/16 Labour 8/1 Libs 100/1

Sorry mate , looks like me and the majority of the UK voters think Labour are shite.

Bye Bye Labour

Oh , by the way Dave said this today -

Frankly, time is short," Mr Cameron said in his keynote speech on the final day of the Manchester conference.

"We cannot spend another eight years taking ground only to give it back again.

"So our method should be clear - send more soldiers to train more Afghans to deliver the security we need. Then we can bring our troops home."

Amid widespread alarm in the country at the rapid rise in British losses this summer, Mr Cameron pledged a "ruthless, relentless focus on fighting, winning and coming home".

And he promised to ensure that UK service personnel were provided with "every piece of equipment they need" to accomplish the task at hand.

Vote Tory

Chris Nash wrote: I think that not voting is an awful waste. If one doesn't vote, there's no right to complain about whichever party is in power.

Rubbish.

If you pay taxes you've got as much right as anyone else.

Tories to increase dead darkies by 300 tons p/a.

WONDERFUL NEWS.

"a vote for me is a vote for increased mass murder of innocents".

i'll be voting labour by the way, as i'm from Sheffield and what the tories did to the industry in my home city will never be forgotten

I also don't earn more than 50k a year and i like interest rates where they are, so i really hope the tories don't get in

Major Tarantino wrote: i'll be voting labour by the way, as i'm from Sheffield and what the tories did to the industry in my home city will never be forgotten

I also don't earn more than 50k a year and i like interest rates where they are, so i really hope the tories don't get in

May be I am being a little over dramatic here........but

the last thing I remember about the 80's and the tories was my first mortgage in 1987 - 21 years old. Flat in converted house in Brighton, moved to London, the flat lost 10K in 4 months; (My mum sent me postal orders to live) lived in staff accom in London couldnt afford to rent never mind buy; came back 'home' got a decent place - honestly cannot remember the price, but the mortgage payments at one point got to £600 (THEN!) a month...........( IT was only half ok maybe 3/4 of that when I moved in) .I only earned the equiv of £550 a month net then. Lots and lots of pepes were in negative equity, lots of homes were repossessed. My best friend now - in 2009 was repo'd. Shit shit shit government.

My Grandad instilled the work ethos into his children, my parents etc and in turn, me to my children but sometimes its a joke. Vicious circle, catch 22 etc etc.

Best not continue along these lines, cos yet again, I will be seen as a racist.

I for one, will NOT vote Tory.

I also will NOT vote Labour.

So Sheffield is just one city of many that feels hard done by. The Midlands and North by far seem to be hard done by. Fact.

The Party I would vote for, doesn't exist yet. I personally am awaiting policies!

I dunno, Jeff. Tough times call for tough measures. Obama's too nice.

This chap would get my vote, though:

Stay out of trouble, Tory motherfuckers.

Jeffari-al-Texani wrote: y'all need this guy:

Hasn't he fucked up already by trying to do too much too quickly?

Burt Reynolds wrote:

Jeffari-al-Texani wrote: y'all need this guy:

Hasn't he fucked up already by trying to do too much too quickly?

That's men in general

choosing between voting for tories or labour is like a doctor asking you if you want you leg amputated or your arm. You dont really wont either. You know youre be fucked either way.

NO Regret wrote: choosing between voting for tories or labour is like a doctor asking you if you want you leg amputated or your arm. You dont really wont either. You know youre be fucked either way.

I do love glib sub-Sixth Form rhetoric. How many times can you make the same inane point, you socially autistic fucking twat?

Kath wrote: Sheffield is just one city of many that feels hard done by.The Midlands and North by far seem to be hard done by. Fact.

My uncle was a Policeman during the miners strikes in the Midlands. He loved it - Loads of overtime at double time. Treated himself to a brand new car afterwards.

Clayhead Liberation Faction wrote:

NO Regret wrote: choosing between voting for tories or labour is like a doctor asking you if you want you leg amputated or your arm. You dont really wont either. You know youre be fucked either way.

I do love glib sub-Sixth Form rhetoric. How many times can you make the same inane point, you socially autistic fucking twat?

The poem was good though.

Most of what I would say on this subject has been said eloquently by other more learned friends already, so I'm going to repeat what Shug said:

The tories are cunts.

Nuff said...

Kath wrote:

Major Tarantino wrote: i'll be voting labour by the way, as i'm from Sheffield and what the tories did to the industry in my home city will never be forgotten

I also don't earn more than 50k a year and i like interest rates where they are, so i really hope the tories don't get in

May be I am being a little over dramatic here........but

the last thing I remember about the 80's and the tories was my first mortgage in 1987 - 21 years old. Flat in converted house in Brighton, moved to London, the flat lost 10K in 4 months; (My mum sent me postal orders to live) lived in staff accom in London couldnt afford to rent never mind buy; came back 'home' got a decent place - honestly cannot remember the price, but the mortgage payments at one point got to £600 (THEN!) a month...........( IT was only half ok maybe 3/4 of that when I moved in) .I only earned the equiv of £550 a month net then. Lots and lots of pepes were in negative equity, lots of homes were repossessed. My best friend now - in 2009 was repo'd. Shit shit shit government.

My Grandad instilled the work ethos into his children, my parents etc and in turn, me to my children but sometimes its a joke. Vicious circle, catch 22 etc etc.

Best not continue along these lines, cos yet again, I will be seen as a racist.

I for one, will NOT vote Tory.

I also will NOT vote Labour.

So Sheffield is just one city of many that feels hard done by. The Midlands and North by far seem to be hard done by. Fact.

The Party I would vote for, doesn't exist yet. I personally am awaiting policies!

Ha! Hilarious. Let's decide who's right and who's wrong BY THE SIZE/AFFORDABILITY OF OUR HISTORICAL FUCKING MORTGAGES.....Never thought I'd agree with Ger Boy over anything ever but, Jesus,..... fucking spare me from the not-as-well-read-as-they'd-like-to-think-they-are Gaurdian readers of this world. Puhleaseeee!!!!

Am i the only person on this board that doesnt give a fuck about politics?

Theyre all fucking liars (politicians) anyway,are they not?

GlasVegas wrote:

Ha! Hilarious. Let's decide who's right and who's wrong BY THE SIZE/AFFORDABILITY OF OUR HISTORICAL FUCKING MORTGAGES.....

It is, however, refreshing to see someone who at least considers their own experiences in considering their political opinions.

I think this election, and politics in general, will be characterised more than ever by arguments that bear no relation to people's actual experiences under government, or to the actual state of the economy, state or world situation.

Broken Britain, for example. What the fuck is that. Is Britain any more broken than it was twenty years ago? Are 'the kids' more violent? In any case, why do people think that the situation is particularly bad at the moment? Direct experience or press coverage?

The Economy. What's happening? How is it affecting individual citizens? What caused it? How could the government have handled it better? Are they faring better in this than the government in the last serious crisis; when the government wasted £27bn of our reserves in a failed attempt to keep us in the ERM in 1992. This government may have invested a large amount in ensuring the survival of the UKs banks, but we stand to get a lot of it back when the banks repay these loans. We never got our £27bn back in 1992, the sort-sellers kept it.

GlasVegas wrote:

Kath wrote:

Major Tarantino wrote: i'll be voting labour by the way, as i'm from Sheffield and what the tories did to the industry in my home city will never be forgotten

I also don't earn more than 50k a year and i like interest rates where they are, so i really hope the tories don't get in

May be I am being a little over dramatic here........but

the last thing I remember about the 80's and the tories was my first mortgage in 1987 - 21 years old. Flat in converted house in Brighton, moved to London, the flat lost 10K in 4 months; (My mum sent me postal orders to live) lived in staff accom in London couldnt afford to rent never mind buy; came back 'home' got a decent place - honestly cannot remember the price, but the mortgage payments at one point got to £600 (THEN!) a month...........( IT was only half ok maybe 3/4 of that when I moved in) .I only earned the equiv of £550 a month net then. Lots and lots of pepes were in negative equity, lots of homes were repossessed. My best friend now - in 2009 was repo'd. Shit shit shit government.

My Grandad instilled the work ethos into his children, my parents etc and in turn, me to my children but sometimes its a joke. Vicious circle, catch 22 etc etc.

Best not continue along these lines, cos yet again, I will be seen as a racist.

I for one, will NOT vote Tory.

I also will NOT vote Labour.

So Sheffield is just one city of many that feels hard done by. The Midlands and North by far seem to be hard done by. Fact.

The Party I would vote for, doesn't exist yet. I personally am awaiting policies!

Ha! Hilarious. Let's decide who's right and who's wrong BY THE SIZE/AFFORDABILITY OF OUR HISTORICAL FUCKING MORTGAGES.....Never thought I'd agree with Ger Boy over anything ever but, Jesus,..... fucking spare me from the not-as-well-read-as-they'd-like-to-think-they-are Gaurdian readers of this world. Puhleaseeee!!!!

That's just the problem though, innit? As far as I can see, the main way Britain is "broken" is the broad absence of any real concept of the 'social' or of collective responsibility. Everyone's debt-ridden with huge loans/mortgages and maxed-out credit cards, but of course when the economic shit hits the fan it's never 'our' fault - no, it's the fault of the evil bankers and/or Gordon Brown.

Or take the war. "Not in My Name" was a nice slogan, but ultimately as effective as sticking your finger up your arse. It's pretty depressing the the slaughter of tens of thousands in the Middle East is used as little more than a vehicle for tit-for-tat political point-scoring.

I read somewhere that Maggie's infamous "there's-no-such-thing-as-society-there-are-only-individuals" statement is in fact a myth - she never said anything of the sort. But the point is that was still the basis of her entire ethos, and it's been internalised wholesale by the British populace en masse.

And on a 'personal' note: I've spent the best part of 15 years racking up debt and training for a 'career' that is as good as dead in the water. I'm totally unemployable and have barely worked in nearly 18 months. I spend most days declaring with debt collectors and it looks like I'll have to declare myself bankrupt before the year is out. I am fucked, in other words, but I at least have the basic fucking dignity not to blame Blair or Brown (or the Tories for that matter).

And on a 'personal' note: I've spent the best part of 15 years racking up debt and training for a 'career' that is as good as dead in the water. I'm totally unemployable and have barely worked in nearly 18 months. I spend most days declaring with debt collectors and it looks like I'll have to declare myself bankrupt before the year is out. I am fucked, in other words, but I at least have the basic fucking dignity not to blame Blair or Brown (or the Tories for that matter).

Shrug

Ffs it ain't just me.I was 41 when it went fcuked up.Ten years on and no help from the state for 2 years despite a large amount i paid into the system i don't get a PEnny off the STATE.Yes i know it is all MY fault.Despite my protests i have worked 5 out of the last ten and kept a roof over for head by getting into Serious Trouble(what other kind of Trouble is there?).I just find it easier to deal with by blaming Myself.Probably is.... Aggressive dancing to aggressive banking...Hands up!

...but i hate the Tories.

Gazman wrote: Am i the only person on this board that doesnt give a fuck about politics?

Theyre all fucking liars (politicians) anyway,are they not?

I'm starting to see a pattern.....the Engerlish care, because they can vote for a government, the rest of us don't because we can't.....In NI we're not allowed to vote for a governemt at all, and in jockland, thatch's lot fucked you lot by making the entire country of scotland into about 3 seats cos they never voted for her. What really freaks me out though is the willingness to go with the current stalinist regime, and it's removal of our basic freedoms and human rights, in order to avoid a potential hitler.

They're probably glad we don't care, after all, us and Rockall are the Engerlish empire these days, the last thing they want is us scum thinking too much :D

Gazman wrote:

Theyre all fucking liars (politicians) anyway,are they not?

I heard John Reid call Celtic a succesful club , so

Just seen Dave's speech for the Tories and I still don't like him. He is too smarmy. He does talk alot of sense though .His policies on getting more police back on the street by cutting down on the paperwork and targets, getting the debt down and of course equiping our troops with the best gear available. I just hope he delivers his promises, unlike the current unelected liar

Ger Boy wrote:

Gazman wrote:

Theyre all fucking liars (politicians) anyway,are they not?

I heard John Reid call Celtic a succesful club , so

6 out of the last 10 league titles,id say that was quite succesful,anyway,this threads about politics not footy.

lets get things clear.. Cameron and the tories say there will be hard times ahead.. fair enough..they say everyone will have to make a sacrifice.. again fair enough.. but it seems to me that the hardship ahead will fall on the pensioners,the sick,the low income families .. no mention of the high income earners.. if, as Cameron says we all have to suffer to atain prosperity, then it looks like the sick and old are gonna pay for it.

I don't see any evidence of broken Britain/recession where i live.The recession/credit crunch is all a myth. Nobody i know has lost their job and everyone is still driving around in brand new cars. And the fact that people can afford to waste money on going to gigs by the the truly awful Bad Lieutenant confirms to me everyone is still rolling in money that they can throw away on utter crap.Sorry, had to get my daily dig at Bad Lieutenant in there.

johnny wrote: I don't see any evidence of broken Britain/recession where i live.The recession/credit crunch is all a myth.

Most people I know (or they know of) have being reduced to short time working for the forseeable future or redundancy. Unfortunately, I experienced the latter in July.

So where I live, it's far from being a myth.

johnny wrote: truly awful Bad Lieutenant

Sam wrote:

johnny wrote: I don't see any evidence of broken Britain/recession where i live.The recession/credit crunch is all a myth.

Most people I know (or they know of) have being reduced to short time working for the forseeable future or redundancy. Unfortunately, I experienced the latter in July.

So where I live, it's far from being a myth.

Same here, except my lot are announcing record profits every month while doing it, there's a word for that.....profiteering, and people were once shot for it.

Doctor? wrote:

Sam wrote:

johnny wrote: I don't see any evidence of broken Britain/recession where i live.The recession/credit crunch is all a myth.

Most people I know (or they know of) have being reduced to short time working for the forseeable future or redundancy. Unfortunately, I experienced the latter in July.

So where I live, it's far from being a myth.

Same here, except my lot are announcing record profits every month while doing it, there's a word for that.....profiteering, and people were once shot for it.

It's not a myth in the charity shop where I work. Takings this summer were down by almost two-thirds.

Back to the Conservative party question; which party can do anything to stop multi-continental businesses from outsourcing staff to the middle and far east, where governments are a soft touch on human rights?

It's good to be upset about the apparent choices being offered to us by our wonderful media, but before we can start to write a manifesto of our own, we need to know how to bring about change MORALLY, LEGALLY, PEACEFULLY AND DEMOCRATICALLY. One option to do this is to consider what type of body could indeed stop mass redundancies by multi-continental businesses...

Empress Touch wrote:

It's not a myth in the charity shop where I work. Takings this summer were down by almost two-thirds.

I would have thought charity shop takings would go up in a recession?

Perhaps you should take the A-ha records out of the window display.

Empress Touch wrote:

Doctor? wrote:

Sam wrote:

johnny wrote: I don't see any evidence of broken Britain/recession where i live.The recession/credit crunch is all a myth.

Most people I know (or they know of) have being reduced to short time working for the forseeable future or redundancy. Unfortunately, I experienced the latter in July.

So where I live, it's far from being a myth.

Same here, except my lot are announcing record profits every month while doing it, there's a word for that.....profiteering, and people were once shot for it.

It's not a myth in the charity shop where I work. Takings this summer were down by almost two-thirds.

Back to the Conservative party question; which party can do anything to stop multi-continental businesses from outsourcing staff to the middle and far east, where governments are a soft touch on human rights?

It's good to be upset about the apparent choices being offered to us by our wonderful media, but before we can start to write a manifesto of our own, we need to know how to bring about change MORALLY, LEGALLY, PEACEFULLY AND DEMOCRATICALLY. One option to do this is to consider what type of body could indeed stop mass redundancies by multi-continental businesses...

That would be whatever party has a senior tier who do not have shares in those companies. So, that'd be none then.

That's 100% right, Doctor.

Now, if 51% of the world electorate were to spoil their ballots... the words morally, legally, peacefully AND democratically would come into play. And then that's where the manifesto of our own would be of use.

GlasVegas wrote:

Kath wrote:

Major Tarantino wrote: i'll be voting labour by the way, as i'm from Sheffield and what the tories did to the industry in my home city will never be forgotten

I also don't earn more than 50k a year and i like interest rates where they are, so i really hope the tories don't get in

May be I am being a little over dramatic here........but

the last thing I remember about the 80's and the tories was my first mortgage in 1987 - 21 years old. Flat in converted house in Brighton, moved to London, the flat lost 10K in 4 months; (My mum sent me postal orders to live) lived in staff accom in London couldnt afford to rent never mind buy; came back 'home' got a decent place - honestly cannot remember the price, but the mortgage payments at one point got to £600 (THEN!) a month...........( IT was only half ok maybe 3/4 of that when I moved in) .I only earned the equiv of £550 a month net then. Lots and lots of pepes were in negative equity, lots of homes were repossessed. My best friend now - in 2009 was repo'd. Shit shit shit government.

My Grandad instilled the work ethos into his children, my parents etc and in turn, me to my children but sometimes its a joke. Vicious circle, catch 22 etc etc.

Best not continue along these lines, cos yet again, I will be seen as a racist.

I for one, will NOT vote Tory.

I also will NOT vote Labour.

So Sheffield is just one city of many that feels hard done by. The Midlands and North by far seem to be hard done by. Fact.

The Party I would vote for, doesn't exist yet. I personally am awaiting policies!

Ha! Hilarious. Let's decide who's right and who's wrong BY THE SIZE/AFFORDABILITY OF OUR HISTORICAL FUCKING MORTGAGES.....Never thought I'd agree with Ger Boy over anything ever but, Jesus,..... fucking spare me from the not-as-well-read-as-they'd-like-to-think-they-are Gaurdian readers of this world. Puhleaseeee!!!!

I don't read the Guardian( not Gauridan); I will spare you yes.

Up ones' own.

Bless xxx

I should probably add, I pretty much take what I see in the press with a pretty big pinch of salt. How can I make any comment, if I don't look at my own experiences?

How much on a Soliders head?

How much on a decent education for my Son?

How much on a future for my Daughter?

How much for healthcare for my Parents?

How much for the poor sods who have lost their businesses, their homes, their just about everything? (ie ME!)

etc etc etc

Boring as it may be; they are the questions I want answered and to date, no one really comes up with a viable proposition. To that end, no vote.

Well we have a perfect chance here to see what Cameron's made of............... Cameron: If anyone objects to paying their stolen expenses back, they can get the fuck out of the conservative party. Tory MPs: Away and fuck if u think we're paying.

SHould be good to see

It can't just be me who finds it pretty hilarious that the Conservatives set up the very generous system of expenses, helped themselves to equally ridiculous sums as members of the other parties and yet still blame the Labour Party for it all.

Still, that's polly-dicks, baby!