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What do you think?
I think they are generally speaking. Joy division, an acclaimed punk band was influenced by Kraftwerk,, the known first techno band. Where did punk came from? I bring up this topic because I notice a similarity between the two genre and its here in this forum because of the references of JD to the two genres. Some punk bands today have some techno in it, it seems. And i notice orgy's Blue Monday's cover, but thats unrelated. :). 
totally different genres in my opinion. punk was founded on a "who gives a fuck" attitude with loud sloppy guitars, fast drums, and in your face lyrics about sticking it to the man and society. the sex pistols, and the ramones are undoubtedly the forefathers of that genre.
techno... a whole different animal. solid and consistent beats through machinery and melodies produced by synths. a lot of the music in this genre doesn't even have lyrics and is more geared towards dancing.
i can't see how anyone can say they're the same. it's true that some bands these days are creating a fusion of the two genres (JD and NO being at the forefront of accomplishing this first). but in the purest senses of the two genres, they aren't the same.
just my $0.02
I think any attempt to categorise the music of either Joy Division or New Order is a waste of time. Why do Americans (and those from above the northern US border) have to put everything into a neat genre? It's bollocks!
Joy Division was a hybrid of the diverse listening tastes of four individuals, each of whom had his own preferences. When combined with the location and socio-economic climate in which these individuals existed, they created some music that wasn't punk, it was different. They may have been galvanised by punk, but they had left punk behind before they played their first gig.
New Order took what they had created as Joy Division and added new layers, different colours and different shades. They added in new and more diverse reference points, continuing the original flirtation with electronic music and using it to create new sounds. They embraced technology, everything they have ever done has been using the latest gadgets and gizmos, no retro gear to be seen here. At every stage they have pushed back the boundaries, broken new ground.
How the hell do you categorise that? You can't. New Order are New Order.
Come to think of it, techno and punk has the same beat, just change the synth for the guitars and the fuck you lyrics, pretty much.
i don't know... bands like the ramones, the sex pistols, minor threat, fugazi, bad religion, the descendents, and green day sound NOTHING like underworld, aphex twin, and other techno acts to me.
no.... and maybe, what does it matter, its all a bunch of superficial labels.
Joy Division was mainly influenced by The Stooges, plus Can and Kraftwerk, maybe some Velvet Underground, Eno and Bowie.... mainly other creative bands/ minds... i suppose creative minds think alike, youthful energy follows parellel courses, everything is recycled and made new again.
Ever hear of the early Warsaw demos from 77? Like the Kill, your no good for me, in a way, they sound like new order, the fact i can dance to them. But add Ian's rage, which unfortunately he didnt keep within his songs and into life, ultimately lead to his death.
Originally posted by Richard Latanville Ever hear of the early Warsaw demos from 77? Like the Kill, your no good for me, in a way, they sound like new order, the fact i can dance to them. But add Ian's rage, which unfortunately he didnt keep within his songs and into life, ultimately lead to his death.
Sorry, not sure if I follow that - and for what it's worth, once you start labelling music in this way, you are missing the point.
There are only two sorts of music - good and crap.
CTB
Originally posted by CTB There are only two sorts of music - good and crap.
"All music is folk music. I ain't never heard a horse sing a song."
/TLV
