Barney's delusions of adequacy.

I've been holding off bringing this up, because at the best of times people take me the wrong way, and this post really IS a potential invite to flame.

It really comes down to two things.

1. When "New Order Suck", it has always been more likely that the truth is that Barney sucked. This has become more and more true as the potential for the electronics to generate a sizavle amount of suckage has reduced. There are so many songs from so many gigs where the machines the drums and the bass sound fine, only for Barney to come in with shite guitar and vocals ( not that he always plays and sings shite, don;t mean to imply that.)

2. Always, but again increasingly, when anyone makes a mistake or behaves in a manner that we would think of as being New Ordery, or not like a pop megagroup, he adopts a face like a constipated hallibut. The Ross show was only the most recent and admittedly catalysed of incidents. Increasingly I fell an urge to slap him and tell him to wake up.

He seems to me to be deluding himself that he now plays in a proper real band, and appears to get deeply aggitated when reality encroaches on his fantasy. His comments at the NME awards among others, make it sounds like he'd rather go back in time and have a nice proper well paid career thru the 80's no factory, no hacienda, no wilson ( and no freedom he forgets).

Personally I reckon Steve's happy enough being a drum machine, and Hooky just LIVES to stand in front of big speakers making giant twanging noises ( that's why so many bass players like him, he's a fantasy because he gets to do the stuff we get yelled at for and all he gets is barney scowling and people cheering).

But Barney, well I think Barney would rather New Order had not been quite so New Order.

I think Bernard is simply uncomfortable in the public eye, and self-consious about his past... he wants to be what he isn't... it's not rational, but I can relate... don't take things he says all that seriously. If Bernard wants to deny his past, it's kinda stupid, but then thats how he deals with stuff... maybe he wishes he was Morrisey, but of course he is completely different

He's not a "normal" star... but then, thats what makes New Order unique

as for the live show...well... people don't have to buy tickets and watch

What was wrong with the ROSS show, I thought it was SUBLIME!

WHINGE WHINGE WHINGE

Only thing wrong with it is that Barney had "punch me I'm a wanker" written on his face.....oh and you can't hear Hooky :)

So basically your problem is that Barney is Barney?

LOL, not quite. can we say that my problem is I see too much of "evil barney" and not enough "nice barney".

TBH it's his constant glowering at Hooky that's really gettin on my nerves, I don't think his little ego can handle the bass being like a 2nd vocal to most people anymore. I don't care how obnoxious he is to the audience, that's funny.But this "I'm the talented one you're all holding me back" vibe he seems to be putting out is just stupid. If I were hooky, the next time fuckface glares at me, I'd just hand him the bass and say "there you go, you play it at the RIGHT volume, coming to the bar Steve?" and stroll on.

Don't get me wrong, I'm a misrerable bastard and all, I've been sick and in pain for nearly a year now, and in general my demeanour is that of a man with a lobster hanging from his cock, so I feel Barney's pain, but the guy needs to work out that if there's a weak link in New Order, if there's a member of the band who wouldn't walk right into another one if they split, it's him and no one else. Honestly, with the exception of Gillian's pets back in the day, can anyone honestly say that Barney doesn't screw up 5 times as often as the rest of them put together.

No Barney, no New Order. To you the choice.

Well, couldn't we just increase the fucker's dosage of prozac? Or maybe the next NOOLer to bump into him could politely suggest that he just accepts that he's in New Order and that the price of being a legend is putting up with a noisey bassplayer. Tell him we love them all even when they stink, even him. Tell him Hooky is NOT too loud, and tell him that many of us would rather see a human being make mistakes than an embarrassing old fart making himself look older, more embarrassing and even a bit senile by needing the words of his own songs on muppet-prompter.

But would ANYONE here, dispute that he screws up 5 times as much as anyone else and seems to take others mistakes very badly?

I think he needs to chill his arse out for a while, and avoid the columbian marching powder if he's been into it.

Steve Campbell wrote: I've been holding off bringing this up, because at the best of times people take me the wrong way

How would you like to be taken, big boy?

Steve Campbell wrote: I think he needs to chill his arse out for a while, and avoid the columbian marching powder if he's been into it.

Speaking of, spot the bright red nose in the Popworld video.

And speaking of that, my favorite New Ordery moment is 2:12 into that clip, when Ana and Hooky share a look and Hooky gets that genuine, "I'm 50 and I still get to do this for a living?" smile across his face. Awesome.

Barney: you are the weakest link - Goodbye. And take Gwen the fanny, Ana Big Ass Scissor Sistor and the follow up to WFTSC (lazy so and so's - recording it at the same time)- and choke on the Jetstream. PS and stop taking your fans for mugs.

I think we're worrying about nothing really. They're 50, been around for 30 and are still the best. That's all that matters, we're just lucky. Enjoy.

Barney is Barney.

True, but the "smack me very hard" look is new over the last coupla years.

Coke is a real possibility as it does turn half it's users into complete assholes. But I DO think he's having some sort of midlife crisis and wishing he was in U2 or some other proper band. That's what I was gettin at above, maybe we need to show him love instead of my original idea of just beating the shite out of him.

Gnu Odor wrote:

Steve Campbell wrote: I've been holding off bringing this up, because at the best of times people take me the wrong way

How would you like to be taken, big boy?

you are a sick indibvidual, and it's made all the worse by the Gnu I have staring at me from my destop all the time :)

What part of and why should he be ashamed of his past?

dunno, ask him :)

I've probably muddled myself and in doing so muddled you too :)

Getting a bit fed up of the constant Barney criticisms...

Don't know what a constipated halibut looks like...

No Bernard equals no New Order...

Take it you don't rate Electronic then?

delilah wrote: Getting a bit fed up of the constant Barney criticisms...

I'll second that

Electronic....well a couple of astonishingly good songs, but lots of it I don't like ( FWIW, I don't like revenge much more, gimme the other two and Monaco)

I think perhaps you are mistaking my comments about Barney's recent nasty streak, for some kind of attack on the man's songwriting ability, or on his entire career. Do I think he's shite because he's usually the one out of tune, or out of time, or who needs his own parts spoonfed to him like frank sinatra...no i do not. I merely object to the sort of holier than thou attitude that exudes from him when any of the rest of them slip from the pinacle of perfection.

in all honesty, what kicked me over from thinking this was mildly amusing to being raging, was the J Ross show. All the way thru the song they all look like they want to be somewhere else...(not entirely surprising given the circumstances, and hey if you are gonna suck it's better if you dont look like you're giving your best ;) )..and right at the end Hooky makes his classic clang and barney's face is just illuminated with disgust. Of course there were other factors and there is no evidence the shot I describe is actually contemporaneous with the audio, so perhaps I'm being unfair.

I think the man needs to mellow, I think he needs to put his aerial out again (unless he's trying to pin the lyrics to jetstream on us), and he could probably do with taking some hooky pills.

I like Bernard, like him a lot, the man is a genius, but we all want to strangle even our best friends from time to time.

Steve Campbell wrote:

in all honesty, what kicked me over from thinking this was mildly amusing to being raging, was the J Ross show. All the way thru the song they all look like they want to be somewhere else...(not entirely surprising given the circumstances, and hey if you are gonna suck it's better if you dont look like you're giving your best ;) )..and right at the end Hooky makes his classic clang and barney's face is just illuminated with disgust. Of course there were other factors and there is no evidence the shot I describe is actually contemporaneous with the audio, so perhaps I'm being unfair.

OK, I've just watched the Woss show again. They were not at their best, but it was hardly worth the over the top criticism that some people have levelled at them over the last couple of weeks. Looked like they were pretty hacked off by Woss which must have been part of the reason (are we ever going to get a first hand account of what happened during the recording?) And my interpretation of the final seriously pissed off Barney look was that it was directed at Woss rather than anyone or anything else.

I adore Barney's singing (and think he was at his best on some the later Electronic stuff) but he's never been great singing live, has he?

Barney has his thang and he does what he wants and according to Hook he's in charge. So if NO quits it's because in my opinion the gig's over. I thought when Gretton passed on NO is over but now (in my opinion) NO is racking up the money account for a cozy retirement. Who wouldn't? Who would want to see NO at fucking 55 still playing. Rolling Stones they're not and those fuckers are fugly looking to watch.

Steve Campbell wrote: in all honesty, what kicked me over from thinking this was mildly amusing to being raging, was the J Ross show. All the way thru the song they all look like they want to be somewhere else...

*Someone wrote what we've seen was the sixth take of the performance. I think every band would be tired of doing the same song for the sixth time in front of an audience which was probably just saying "yeah, but can we go home now?". And still, Barney managed to perform at his best, with his mad Hamster Wheel Dance and the whoops, what do you want, Barney shouting "mad for it" instead of whoop so he states very clearly he's very very happy of being there? And yes, I want to see New Order perform at 70 too, as long as they give us albums like WFTSC... at 50, artists like Lou Reed, Iggy Pop and the Stones had lost their inspiration from a long time, but New Order have just made their third best album, and that means the third best album in music history.

Mick Aneworderfan wrote:

Steve Campbell wrote: in all honesty, what kicked me over from thinking this was mildly amusing to being raging, was the J Ross show. All the way thru the song they all look like they want to be somewhere else...

*Someone wrote what we've seen was the sixth take of the performance. I think every band would be tired of doing the same song for the sixth time in front of an audience which was probably just saying "yeah, but can we go home now?". And still, Barney managed to perform at his best, with his mad Hamster Wheel Dance and the whoops, what do you want, Barney shouting "mad for it" instead of whoop so he states very clearly he's very very happy of being there? And yes, I want to see New Order perform at 70 too, as long as they give us albums like WFTSC... at 50, artists like Lou Reed, Iggy Pop and the Stones had lost their inspiration from a long time, but New Order have just made their third best album, and that means the third best album in music history.

Once again I've drowned my meaning in a lake of words.

I got no beef with the "let's get it done and get to the bar" bit, in light of all that is supposed to have happened.

It's really the gob on him at the end, it looks a LOT like it's cos Hooky after being nice for a few secs, manages to get his final twang in, as I say it's editting more than reality, but it did get me thinking about this whole issue.

Think people are taking me a wee touch too seriously, just cos I call Bernard a miserable stuck up cunt, doesn't mean I don't love him and think he's a fookin genius.

But I do think the perfectionist in him, which has never sat easy with the reality of his, and his cohorts less than perfect musicianship[1][2], is starting to make him even crankier than usual, and more and more at the band.

Still he seemed to enjoy laughing his ass off at the bafflement he continually caused the crowd in NYC :) Maybe that'll help him.

[1]Let's be clear here, I'd rather listen to New Order screw up for two hours than listen to any other band playing well. [2] Of course Steve is genuinely good at his instrument, I know lots of drummers who used to put him down saying they could never hear any drums, only machines, I bought it, until more video evidence proved conclusively that he IS a bleedin drum machine. As for the others, I only mean they are less than perfect musicians in the sense that none of them are going to go out on the dirge gig circuit playing 20 different things a week, in numerous styles and often from sight with no rehearsal. EG...Les Claypool from primus is indispuably a technically superior bassplayer to hooky, yet his ability to move the masses pale in comparison.

Jeez, hate to think what you say about people you REALLY don't like...

See I'm from Northern Ireland, it's not unknown for friends ro greet one another with things like "all right you c*, u still ridin your dog?"

Worry only when I'm not being rude and over the top.