Low points of 2005
Archived66 replies · 1,674 views
What's been the worst aspect, NO wise, of 2005 for you?
Closed-
WFTSC 3 (4%)
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Setlist still dedicated to 'greatest hits' 15 (21%)
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Jetstream released as single 21 (29%)
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UK Music Hall of Fame 2 (3%)
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Singles 2 (3%)
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Phill fully replacing Gillian 18 (25%)
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Brandon Flowers appearing with NO at T In The Park 0 (0%)
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THAT WFTSC single review in NME 1 (1%)
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Other (please state) 11 (15%)
73 votes · voting closed
UK Music Hall of Fame. Their performance OK but why was that twat Ozzy Osbourne in the same company as Dylan, Aretha, Pink Floyd & JD/NO?
Jet Stream wrote: UK Music Hall of Fame. Their performance OK but why was that twat Ozzy Osbourne in the same company as Dylan, Aretha, Pink Floyd & JD/NO?
And what do you suggest is wrong with Ozzy?
Nothing wrong with him from a light entertainment point of view. Just not a serious prospect for early inclusion in a Brit Hall of Fame.
Hey, why should I be providing an explanation! Can't believe there are people on here that would disagree with my view.
Christopher Owens wrote:
NObabe wrote: Christopher Owens spreading shite on boards
Save that for another thread.
I'm sorry, did you actually, seriously HONESTLY....tell Maya of for being gobby, just cos this your thread......Oh Christopher, MOST ungentlemanly. Especially since she's mainlt right.
Suppose I have to give you a sensible answer now all you'll get all precious with me too :D
You left out "continued miming"
But I voted for the Now That's What I Call New Order set list.
Jet Stream wrote: Nothing wrong with him from a light entertainment point of view. Just not a serious prospect for early inclusion in a Brit Hall of Fame.
Hey, why should I be providing an explanation! Can't believe there are people on here that would disagree with my view.
He did help create metal. I'm grateful for that.
Also forgot about the awful horlicks HMV made over the WFTSC 7 inch and posters.
Steve Campbell wrote:
Christopher Owens wrote:
NObabe wrote: Christopher Owens spreading shite on boards
Save that for another thread.
I'm sorry, did you actually, seriously HONESTLY....tell Maya of for being gobby, just cos this your thread......Oh Christopher, MOST ungentlemanly. Especially since she's mainlt right.
Suppose I have to give you a sensible answer now all you'll get all precious with me too :D
You left out "continued miming"
But I voted for the Now That's What I Call New Order set list.
Excuse me Cambo, you're guilty as well.
Voted for Phil replacing Gillian, 'cause that's just so wrong. In all the promo photos he looks like the kid standing behind the TV announcer on his tiptoes so he can get on TV. "Phil, help us down the steps." "Phil, fetch my dentures."
Other low points? Well, I think the WFTSC video was a missed opportunity. It's one of NO's more lyrically rich tracks -- really expansive in scope -- and, well, nothing else really. Easily forgettable.
Was that French TV dealie with the lip syncing this year? That sucked. Lip syncing itself is bad, but lip syncing Jetstream is just intolerable.
umm... Hyde Park was a bum gig, I thought.
Jetstream was dead poor too.
Mike Flowers would have been cool, not Brandon.
NO on Richard and Judy has sunk NO TV appearances to a new level.
And, yup, I miss Gillian as well. I like the idea of having beefier guitars, but I also miss someone having control and occasionally playing the keyboards. Can't we have both in there?
Low point of the year has to be Warners/London's handling of the last two single releases, it's like they don't want New Order's records to erm...sell! It was going ok until WFTSC which they decided to fuck up into a novelty 7" only release. Also, unless you've got a mate at Warners US or lots of disposable income, fans outside of the US have little chance of a sniff at the fantastic Guilt Is A Useless Emotion mixes.
Warners unwillingness to release mixes (they've paid for) on a convenient medium for fans to buy is just baffling. When you see the amount New Order Promo CDs are going for on eBay, alot of greedy twats are making LOTS of money out of fans simply wanting to hear their favourite band. 
To top it off, I bet Turn won't make a single in the new year. If anyone from the label is reading, please pull the finger out and give us proper single releases please!
My only other gripe would be the "greatest hits" setlists, I wish they'd taken more risks and shook things up a bit there. Losing a couple of the tired-as-fuck JD songs and revisiting Technique, Age of Consent, Sunrise and Perfect Kiss would've made the live shows untouchable for me.
Having said that, we did get Love Vigilantes and EGG (briefly) this year so 
No promo whoring of Turn and (now that I think about it - Morning Night and Day) which are now my heaviest rotated songs off WFTSC.
No massive street team for this area - not including my own humble efforts to influence the surrounding city with loudly played tracks out my windows. Maybe they oughta ask NOOL to do promotion for them. It can't hurt. 
Lack of interesting US dates, though I can understand it and still hold hope. (It's the fourth largest city in the US, you guys. Come on. If Depeche Mode can do it, so can you.) I offer up my backyard as a venue.
Bizarre single releasing techniques from their distros. Makes me wonder if they need me to help them out with a little thing called artist promotion and merchandising.
Getting all excited about the new album and sludging through far too many reviews by a bunch of musically degenerate "reviewers", and actually hearing a pal say "Well, if Pitchfork doesn't like it..."
Not getting my stuff together and joining you guys for all the nifty UK dates.
always next year :D
Actually (dropping all daftnes for a mo) i would like to go see them in the states cos When i left the last time I felt it in my bones that I'd be back.
Damnit now I have to walk away from Bonz AND you 
- miming on popworld instead of terrifying the kiddies with real music.
- not deciding to mime on the Ross show when it was already apparent the vibes had been trampled by that osborne beast.
Maybe we should let them know if they say fook off we'll back them. though what as handfull can do I dunno. Record companues can be real cunts. they can prevent your album ever seeing daylight and WILL take the costs just to spite you.
Don't think I've read a sleeve note on a london release. Are the published by an arm or warners now? if so they are relatively on their own. If they are published externally they have the publisher who wants paid, hassling the record company with them.
Tell you what tho if it's true the NYC show was planned for DVD release.....they fucked warners good....such wonderful "aye alright, release this ya twats" attitude.
We have to deal with it...they are no longer with factory. They may get paid right at long last ....but to that lot... New Order are "product" "livestock" (bloody awkward ones with any luck...living up to Rob's preduiction)
in the end tho....barnster still sings Steve still inpersonates a drum machine....and Hooky is sstill Hooky.
Pascal CHAMPAVERT wrote: Glastonbury gig was awful
you're joking arent you? glastonbury was great! my low point was jetstream and especially when they performed it on the jonathan ross show in the uk. its the only time ever ive been embarrassed to be a NO fan..
From memory, I believe the Jonathan Ross show was the worst event of the year according to NOOlers....
According to me, the low point of 2005 is the small amount of gigs done in North America... and obviously releasing 7" !!!!!!!!! fortunatly, I have the promo CDs ;)
I didn't see a 7" in a shop for over 15 years now...
RedKen wrote:
Pascal CHAMPAVERT wrote: Glastonbury gig was awful
you're joking arent you? glastonbury was great! my low point was jetstream and especially when they performed it on the jonathan ross show in the uk. its the only time ever ive been embarrassed to be a NO fan..
Yep..:barf:
I seem to remember a massive amount of NOOLers screaming that the Johnathan Ross performance was the absolute 'last straw' for them, giving up New Order and NOOL because of that single apperance. Haven't seen the thing, but it all seems a bit harsh, no? 
Would have liked a few more rarer songs played at gigs.But in the great scheme of things NEW ORDER matters have had NO real impact on my pathetic LIFE.
Mines was a triple blow.
Missing out on the French gig, then finding out all me mates were backstage and at the press conference and just to add to my woes Barney dedicates E/G/G to us while I am sat at home listening to the bastard gig like a sad cunt on a computer. I was kept fully up to date with phone calls and text messages from Al, Johnny Giles, Hibster, Ness and DoN though, the funniest telling me DoN was twatted a good 2 hours before the gig and doubts whether me cockerney bruv would actually be awake to see it, he pulled through though.....just :D
worst aspect for me...
Jarvo and Mr. Giles getting to more North American gigs than me....
I guess I should be used to that by now though!!!
Burt Reynolds wrote: NO on Richard and Judy has sunk NO TV appearances to a new level.
Er, they didn't play Richard & Judy?!
I'd say my low point of 2005 has to be the best group of NO fans in the world dissing the band
Jack_H wrote: I'd say my low point of 2005 has to be the best group of NO fans in the world dissing the band
Taking that on board I'll say the 'two-faced media'. NO have been lavished all year for their influence on music and current bands. They won an NME award, a Q award, inducted into the UK Hall of Fame (in only the second phase of acts), and been nominated for a grammy. However, absolutely no airplay from Radio 1, limited airplay on Key 103 (Manc's most listened to radio station aka 'Generic EMAP Provincial Shite FM') etc.
To say they are God like geniuses (official) everybody has been pretty cool towards them. Even fookin Tony Christie had more airplay! nono: 
It's one thing to ban Cliff Richard and Status Quo from the airwaves because they are OLD and SHITE, but NO are still fantastic, producing superb music. Definitely a case of ageism if ever I saw one.
Quite right for Barney to stay away from the Q awards because of the shit review of WFTSC.
Saying that I got the DJ at the staff do on Friday night to play a track. Guess which one? BM? No! Regret? No! True Faith? Yes!). Why is it shite mobile DJs posses just three NO tunes? 
My vote is for the 3x7" release. The Guilt digital-only release is technically worse I suppose, but I have a promo CD so I'm not too concerned about that.
Jack_H wrote: I'd say my low point of 2005 has to be the best group of NO fans in the world dissing the band
Without wishing to sound harsh, I think half the attraction of New Order has always been the mutual swapping of abuse, especially with your father. It's simply a case of doing it to them before they do it to us. I'm infamous for shouting abuse at the Order at gigs, and making the odd gesture, but, fcuk me, I have the ultimate respect for them as a group.
I agree with Jack AND Al on this one. There's a difference between good-natured ribbing and some of the crap that appeared on here during the summer.
Edit: Three edits required - too pissed!
I feel the urge to say "Your father started it!" in the most childish voice possible. 
I love the band, I love the music, and everything I love gets the piss taken out of it.
Jack's gonna smite me at a concert one day. I just know it. "This is for what you said in Reading! This is for what you said in 2007, this is for that letter you sent in '89!"
And I'll take it with a smile.
BIGINOIL wrote: I agree with Jack AND Al on this one. There's a difference between good-natured ribbing and some of the crap that appeared on here during the summer.
Edit: Three edits required - too pissed!
Was there ribbing? Confess, I can't remember. Just sent you a text, you mutha, but was dead confused as to why I didn't have a Col in my phone but have you listed under your 'handle'.
Now, that's very sad!!!! 
melly (msh) wrote: I feel the urge to say "Your father started it!" in the most childish voice possible.
Exactly. The cnut called me 'baldy' at Oxegen. Ok, so it's true, but not nice, but then I've said worse, much worse to the band when they're in earshot!!!!
Stop press: I mean 'cnut' in the nicest possible sense!!
I said jetstream being released as a single. But i imagine it wasn't the bands idea to release it...........
Al Jarvis wrote:
BIGINOIL wrote: I agree with Jack AND Al on this one. There's a difference between good-natured ribbing and some of the crap that appeared on here during the summer.
Edit: Three edits required - too pissed!
Was there ribbing? Confess, I can't remember. Just sent you a text, you mutha, but was dead confused as to why I didn't have a Col in my phone but have you listed under your 'handle'.
Now, that's very sad!!!!
I like it when you call me Biggy, Al!
Jack_H wrote: I'd say my low point of 2005 has to be the best group of NO fans in the world dissing the band
You saw the threads after Jonathan Ross then but most of the abuse around here is definitely good humoured, I don't think anyone would tolerate any nasty or personal attacks on the band.
My nomination for low point of the year wasn't really aimed at New Order but more at the record label which (I feel) has fucked up a couple of major single releases this year. I just hope Warners sometimes scan these forums and are interested in what the fans think.
I'll also join Al and Colin by saying I have nothing but total respect for New Order. I wouldn't spend so much cash collecting their records or time on here talking about 'em (plus Monaco, Electronic etc.) otherwise In the end, it would've been a much duller 2005 if the band hadn't released and toured WFTSC. Can't wait for the next record with the leftover WFTSC session tracks. Got any inside info on when we might realistically see it Jack? Cheers!
Gotta be the hm fookin v fiasco for me ,what a set of complete arsebags!
I'M STILL WAITING FOR THE FINAL 7 TO ARRIVE!
Calling hm fookin v customer service is a joke,i'll not bother with the last 7 you keep my money,useless cunty fuckwits!
Oh and the Johnny ross Jizzstream performance,embarrasing or what!
Singles. Would've been a high point with the BSides thou'.
Being too ill to get to 'Hall of Fame'; Glad they got it, although it turned out as a damp squid with the fans being caged away about half a mile from the stage!
it just seems, at least in New order's case, the record label is running out of ideas to 'market' this band when it doesn't really need to (7" inch releases, digital only releases) since New order already has a firm base. by diversifying the release format from track to track it sets a precedent of being unpredictable when the record label should seek to compensate the loyal following with an accessible release for each song they put out. if i had to choose between the wftsc 7" releases and giaue digital releases, being a purist i would have to go with 7"single releases because you get an actual product. would have been nice to see a more international release of the set though. that richard x mix of blt is fantastic and of course i have to scour the mp3blogs and file sharing system to get it...
Bad management.
First the album cover to WFTSC is dismal. Very 80s PSB-ish. For a band that prides itself on the product presentation and having past glories of PC&L and Technique (not to mention countless singles artwork), I found WFTSC to be very bland.
Secondly, the choices of singles were bad. Kraft was a good choice, but WFTSC and Jetstream were well wide of the mark and no surprise they had little success. GIAUE and HNWYD would have been far more popular for public consumption.
Thirdly, the lack of publicity for the Brixton gig was scandalous. £38 tickets going for a tenner on the night paints a picture of greed and lack of understanding of the market. No publicity shows total negligence and an insult to that market. Its also a big oversite of the potential that Singles album might have brought, in way of new followers wanting to see NO first hand.
Whoever is NO publisist needs a good kickin'!!!!!
OK, this is really picky, but I really despise the newest batch of promo photos.
"Here, dress like car mechanics and stand against a wall."
Yeah, I know the veil of secrecy is shot, but c'mon.
Gnu Odor wrote: OK, this is really picky, but I really despise the newest batch of promo photos.
"Here, dress like car mechanics and stand against a wall."
Yeah, I know the veil of secrecy is shot, but c'mon.
I think this is probably lost on most people who aren't from the UK, but they're wearing a lot of SI in those publicity shots. Very, very expensive and still quite popular with lads-about-town in this country. It's very much an English look and one a lot of people still go for. Certainly a few people here dress similarly. Think Jonathan Ross summed it up perfectly when he said they looked like a "bunch of builders who've come into money"!
I don't know what people would expect them to dress like otherwise?! Wear suits or fancy dress, or what?! At least I can 'relate' to them in those publicity shots.
I think they've overdone the Adidas on the live front though. Barney's baseball cap at Oxegen was the final straw!
Gnu Odor wrote: OK, this is really picky, but I really despise the newest batch of promo photos.
"Here, dress like car mechanics and stand against a wall."
Yeah, I know the veil of secrecy is shot, but c'mon.
i agree. they need more zhuj--barney in a duck outfit, hooky a la bootsy collins, steve dressed as marie antoinette and phil with a fauxhawk, black eye liner and in a kilt for the cover of 'the face'!
Al Jarvis wrote: I don't know what people would expect them to dress like otherwise?! Wear suits or fancy dress, or what?! At least I can 'relate' to them in those publicity shots.
Steve's Space Invaders T-shirt is the coolest thing ever made. A closeup of that would be fine.
Gnu Odor wrote: OK, this is really picky, but I really despise the newest batch of promo photos.
"Here, dress like car mechanics and stand against a wall."
Yeah, I know the veil of secrecy is shot, but c'mon.
You will appreciate this link, and so will anyone else who needs a laugh.
Can I just point out that Phil didnt replace Gillian full time in 2005. Probably a good few years ago now since he joined full time. Like in 2001 possibly.
Having to stay sober and drive home for work from the apollo gig.Whos idea was it to stage it on a Monday?
that absolute shitty cover sleeve for Singles - - even though i aint bought it - - it just looks crap when i see it in the record shops.
who gets paid for that crap??
Dropping the original album art for WFTSC and replacing it with something even I could knock up
I am surprised that nobody mentioned this:
THE BLOODY SLIPCASE for the 3x7" that you could only get if you were in the UK.
So it was bad enough if you were in Canada, US, Germany, France, Portugal, Japan, Australia, etc. and imported the 7" to your place. But to get a slipcase you were forced to either go onto Ebay or win the awesome contest that this website hosted.
That was retarded.
I thought the 3 different versions of Singles was interesting.
The GIAUE digital release was rubbish, but thank god for US promo CDs at least.
Now we'll just see about that alleged single release for Turn....it will probably be 10" or something obscure (DAT, Cassette, etc.)
Aye the Waiting 7 inch saga and the shitty way Guilt got released and the fact you had to pay way over the odds for a sleeveless promo.
Dropping HNWYD and EGG for the autumnal gigs.
Missing Hyde Park cos the littl'un was ill.
Missing the pre gig get together at the Apollo due to a friend not finishing work on time. Cnut!!
Singles not being quite..well singles
BIGINOIL wrote: I agree with Jack AND Al on this one. There's a difference between good-natured ribbing and some of the crap that appeared on here during the summer.
I'm with you on this one too. Maybe I'm over-sensitive but I get really pissed off when I see bands being criticised and ripped into by their own fans. I don't see the point in it. My other vote goes to Phil fully replacing Gillian; I still say they (and we) need her to come back.
I must have missed this huge groundswell of hatred in the ranks. What are we talkin about like...the jetstream wars?
Low point....holding my head in my hnds and being sick while NO played YSF for me.
Steve Campbell wrote: I must have missed this huge groundswell of hatred in the ranks. What are we talkin about like...the jetstream wars?
No, it was the abuse the band got on here after being on Jonathan Ross's show. Some of it got a bit nasty and if I remember right, one or two people were talking about giving up on NO altogether because of that one performance (which, personally, I think is childish beyond belief but that's a whole other debate that I don't want to get into here).
digital mike binoche wrote: Hearing that Depeche Mode are to tour
And what do you suggest is wrong with DM?
Miss Disco wrote:
Steve Campbell wrote: I must have missed this huge groundswell of hatred in the ranks. What are we talkin about like...the jetstream wars?
No, it was the abuse the band got on here after being on Jonathan Ross's show. Some of it got a bit nasty and if I remember right, one or two people were talking about giving up on NO altogether because of that one performance (which, personally, I think is childish beyond belief but that's a whole other debate that I don't want to get into here).
Ahhhh right...yeah some if that was majorly nasty. They stank....but NOBODY can play well with a vibe like that around them...don;t see the problem.
It's got to be Jetstream in my book. Oh and the almighty JR performance, how can we forget the uproar in the NO cyber-world when that was aired lol...
