24hr PP/Ladies Night Cornerhouse Event

Well, I did the decent thing and took meself along to this event, purely to catch the film (as the tickets for the Ladies Night seminar event had sold out the day before) and meet up with Liv and Kezzie. Which I duly did. Unsurprisingly, Alex the Red was soon there with a couple of his buddies, so after a little pre-film banter in the bar with the ladies and the lardy, we adjourned to cinema 1 to brace ourselves for the moment of truth.

And.....it was pretty good actually! Occasionally lapsing into the odd incongruous scene (like the town crier in Chester yelling out news of Ian Curtis's death - eh??? What was that all about? Isn't it a touch insensitive?? - and the visitation Tony Wilson has of himself high atop the roof of the Hacienda, to recall but two) but pretty well observed - especially Coogan's role as Wilson which was so painfully to a tee it made for pretty hilarious viewing. Best roles elsewhere were John Simm as the perpetually boyish Barney, the guy playing Rob Gretton was frighteningly accurate, and Sean Harris as Ian Curtis had his moves spot on - if a little more intense than reality. Cameos came from Paul Ryder, Mark E Smith, Howard Devoto, Mike Pickering, Graeme Park, Mani (looking horribly like John Thomson's Fast Show Jazz Club host!! I kid you not!), Margi Clarke and the inevitable Keith Bloody Allen.

There were obvious gaps and continuity errors as well in the script - that goes without saying: most glaring in the film for me was when Happy Mondays were just beginning to make their splash and were recording "Freaky Dancing" with Barney producing. There seemed to be a bit of a slip up on how the band actually looked here, as it was obvious that Shaun Ryder did NOT have the long hair he grew during the Madchester era as shown here at this point in time (1986) when they were just starting out - he should have been depicted with a convict's crop. But then that's just me being anal.

They also got the chronology for the New Order and Happy Mondays albums wrong too: apparently the Order were about to spend two years recording "Technique" in Ibiza AFTER Madchester had exploded onto the scene - whilst the Mondays were heading off to Barbados for their disastrous fourth album sessions pretty much around the same time....er....sorry to be pedantic but.....have you been paying attention back there, anybody??

Anyway, best scenes were the most harrowing ones too - the band panicking over Ian's first major on-stage fit at a frantic gig; the drug/gun madness that descended onto the club scene parodied to cruel and chilling effect (dealers on bicycles shooting pedestrians at random - horrible, but sadly all too prescient with added hindsight...), and Ian's tragic suicide which seemed to happen in just two frames (without Iggy Pop's "The Idiot" even coming within earshot). Deborah Curtis was conspicuous by her absence - bafflingly no mention was made in the script of her or even Ian's affair - perhaps this omission was solicited by Deborah herself?

Still, the madness and mayhem DID bring the whole Factory shambles into a new and twisted light for the benefit of those who weren't there to witness the glory years at the outset, and to sum up, the film is a fairly credible attempt (albeit sometimes wildly - and hysterically - distorted) at trying to nail down just what made Tony Wilson the arrogant, conceited, pretentious and indeed influential figurehead for all fuckwits in the biz today.

Oh yeah - to hear the closing credits play-off of "Here To Stay" was a minor pleasure too!

Now, fate was kind to me tonight because I found out that there were two no-shows for the last prebooked tickets to the seminar thingy and I was lucky to grab one of them, which meant I could, after all, join the discussion forum. Yippee!! Present was Gillian Gilbert and her sister Kim, plus her hubby Stephen and other family members and friends. Managed to (oh yes!) speak very briefly to Stephen and told him how much the film's Rob Gretton resembled their real manager, and he agreed. DJ/Writer Dave Haslam chaired the discussion which introduced us to the three ladies on the panel: Gillian, Wilson's ex wife Lindsay Reade and Martin Hannett's former widow Yvonne (?). Lindsay actually let on her discomfort at seeing her private life laid bare in the script for the film and expressed regret that she wasn't able to have more of a say in the editing. Gillian was also reminded from her stand-in actress (also present in the audience) that her presence in the film too was almost non-existent (only a glimpse of her with the band post-Ian's suicide rehearsing an embryonic guitar(!) rendition of "Blue Monday"), and Yvonne (?) concurred that Martin Hannett was indeed pretty much the ogre he was portrayed in the film, with a legendary drug/alcohol intake and a notorious intolerance of what constituted everything HE didn't believe in....!! A lively audience debate followed where the punters asked questions to the panel, Liv and I bookended the open forum by chipping in with our own questions. My only regret was that I typically forgot to ask Gillian Gilbert a question I've been dying to ask her for absolutely ages. And that was.... "What was it like then, Gillian, climbing fully clothed into a tepid bath with Tony Wilson all those (eighteen) years ago?"

All in all then, an enjoyable evening! (By the way, our Liv got Steve and Gillian to sign her "Low Life" CD insert pics - you can be sure she'll be gushing about that when she posts here later on!!) :)

Martian, excellent luck you had! i can't imagine why someone would get tickets for an event like that and then not go, but i s'pose if some incredibly ill stroke of fortune were to hit them, *some* things might be a little more important. worked out very well for you, though. :D

question, though...did anyone ask Gillian if she is indeed going to stay out of future things to do with the band? i know this was discussed here earlier, the possibility of asking her that rather delicate question...

There was a lady in the audience who begged her to please consider playing at Old Trafford at least - she just kind of giggled. I think Liv and a couple of others might have asked her if she was playing it too...didn't commit either way but seemed quite flattered by it all - lets hope last night has got her thinking of doing it....

Big up to Liv for asking the first question of the evening -even if I apparently looked totally shocked when she raised her hand(I thought for one scary moment she was going to ask Gillian for Barney's number ). Lindsay Reade (who I thought was well cool) came up to Liv afterwards to congratulate her on the question too....

All in all a good night. After enjoying the film and guffawing throughout most of it (apart from the Curtis suicide scene which made me feel a bit sick), the chat bit afterwards made me realise that there were numerous flaws in trying to portray the lives of real people and such a complicated story in a 2 hour piece of entertainment.

And the fact it barely covers New Order was a travesty, even more so that the Gillian 'character' wasn't even introduced properly - Gillian said there was a scene in that was cut that showed how Rob Gretton brought her into the band, which would have been the perfect way to show the transition from Joy Division to New Order in one easy step. Like Liv said to the lady herself, we needed to see her, and her blusher committed to celluloid in their full glory ;)

Oh, and Stephen looked like he'd nicked Barney's infamous camouflage fleece...

Wow. Its sounds great: soooooooooo gutted I couldn't make it, but thanks for the feedback. In reference to Marty G.'s comments about the movie, I'm giving Winterbottom et al the benefit of the doubt 'cos I think the errors MG points out are deliberate and provided to keep the Factory afficionados on their toes: can't believe in a film packed with attention to detail they'd make obvious mistakes (a la Ryder's haircut). As I suggested in another thread, a lot obviously got lost in the editing process, and here's hoping they'll put all "missing" scenes on the DVD release - especially the much-noted virtual absence of Gillian.

Re: Debbie Curtis - "Ian" does actually call her name when he returns to Barton St.: both her and Natalie's names are prominent in the "Thanks to" credits, so I guess her celluloid absence was her own choice.

Originally posted by martin fradley Wow. Its sounds great: soooooooooo gutted I couldn't make it, but thanks for the feedback. In reference to Marty G.'s comments about the movie, I'm giving Winterbottom et al the benefit of the doubt 'cos I think the errors MG points out are deliberate and provided to keep the Factory afficionados on their toes: can't believe in a film packed with attention to detail they'd make obvious mistakes (a la Ryder's haircut). As I suggested in another thread, a lot obviously got lost in the editing process, and here's hoping they'll put all "missing" scenes on the DVD release - especially the much-noted virtual absence of Gillian.Re: Debbie Curtis - "Ian" does actually call her name when he returns to Barton St.: both her and Natalie's names are prominent in the "Thanks to" credits, so I guess her celluloid absence was her own choice.

To be honest the odd flaw in costumes etc didn't really bother me (although Joy Division era Barney was v.inaccurate - where was the floppy fringe and skinny tie?!), but I did think there was a little too much of Wilson (as brilliant as Coogan was) when there are so many other interesting and rounded characters involved in the story.

Also, the Curtis suicide scene seemed to have no context at all. To those who are unfamiliar with the story, it probably looked as though he committed suicide because Tony Wilson was out when he went to see him :\ohwell:

About the suicide scene - I understood that it was in the kitchen, and Deborah found him slumped over the washing machine, and as Marty mentioned - Iggy Pop playing. Nowhere, in anything I've read, (that I remember anyway) was a singing, dancing chicken mentioned

That would explain why I haven't seen it then!:)

Originally posted by Allen Jarvis Curtis killed himself after watching Werner Herzog's Stroszek in which a character shoots himself whilst a chicken dances - not sure if the dancing chicken in 24HrPP is footage from the actual film, or not. Never seen Stroszek - too arty farty for me, to be honest..

I saw it about 15 years ago, and while it was quite good, it wasn't what I had expected, having read all the hyperbole about it in that Ideal For Living book. There were so many clear parallels with Ian's situation, it is a weird twist of fate that it was showing that night of all nights, it really was a closure to his life. Often wondered what might have been had that film not been shown that night.....

The film on Ian's TV in the movie IS "Stroszek": like the run-out on "Still" says, that chicken just keeps on dancing. Dunno if I'd consider the film "arty", but it certainly is bleak. Again, I think the truth is that Ian died in his kitchen, but the movie is playing with fact/speculation/historical-narrative-distorted-by-time-and-subjectivity as well as being Wilson's version of events, hence him being at the centre of everything.....

At the MEN Arena gig in Dec 98 I was sat behind Wilson, his daughter and model girlfriend before the Order came on. As the DJs pumped out endless techno choons, Wilson gave his daughter a history lesson, along the lines of none-of-this-music-would-exist-without-New-Order. After a prolonged bout of eavesdropping, our party learned the moral of Tony's story: HE discovered Joy Division, who became New Order (on HIS label), hence Tony invented house music and youth culture as we know it today. The guy is a self-mythologising nutcase, and I think the movie gets it spot on.....

Lifted from Amazon's DVD Review.....

Bruno S. plays Bruno Stroszek, a misfit thrust into the world after just being released from prison. Having spent most of his adult life in mental institutions, Bruno finds reality a difficult milieu to ease into. He holds impromptu concerts with his accordion and glockenspiel in apartment courtyards, mostly to disinterested tenants. With the slightly doddering landlord Herr Scheitz (Clemens Scheitz) and the gentle prostitute Eva (Eva Mattes), Bruno struggles to find a way to fit into a society that really would rather ignore his existence. When Eva’s vicious pimp (an extremely effective Wilhelm von Homburg, best recognized as the malevolent Vigo from "Ghostbusters II") beats up Eva once too often, the misfit trio band together and journey to America. The land of opportunity that they only knew from American movies turns out to be far more hostile than they anticipated…

The last line was the clincher......

Well, I've taken the film twice now, once alone and secondly with my eldest daughter and I'm not ashamed to admit this but on both occassions the tears started to well as soon as the film took focus on Joy Division. So many of the points that I wanted to make have already surfaced in previous threads. I may be wrong on this, so please correct me if I am, aside from the film + listening to The Idiot, did Ian not spend the majority of that ill fated Sunday evening furiously writing fiction whilst drowning whiskey after whiskey then black coffee?

Originally posted by Jon Murphy Well, I've taken the film twice now, alone once and secondly with my eldest daughter and I'm not ashamed to admit this but on both occassions the tears started to well as soon as the film took focus on Joy Division.

I loved the scene when they were listening to 'She's Lost Control' in the van, where they all seemed to realise that they were making truly brilliant music....I reckon the film could have done with more scenes like this, to balance out the more cartoony bits of the Happy Mondays story :)

thanks to all for the comments on the movie, and of the discussion...really hoping this comes our way now

Originally posted by Kezzie Big up to Liv for asking the first question of the evening -even if I apparently looked totally shocked when she raised her hand(I thought for one scary moment she was going to ask Gillian for Barney's number ). Lindsay Reade (who I thought was well cool) came up to Liv afterwards to congratulate her on the question too....

But did any of you lucky folk convey to Ms. Gilbert my mad crush on her?

They're called priorities, people!

No, but like I said at the very top of this thread, I rue the moment I forgot to ask Gillian about how it must have felt to share a tepid bath with Tony Wilson all those years ago, only to see the camera zoom in on the barely perceptible (but nevertheless genuine) bubbles that were exuding from his general direction. Poor Gillian! Heaven only knows what was going thru her mind at the time.....(or Steve's come to that!)

Sounds like you Mancs seem to get all the best bits of this current campaign! That's a good account of the evening there matey!! If only we could get some of the stellar cast to do a tour of the north-east and promote it likewise... I saw the film last Saturday at the MetroCentre in Gateshead and I thought it was pretty good. Some bits made me laff however - like when Shaun and Bez from the Mondays went to the bin to retrieve the takeaway Barney just chucked in ......did this REALLY happen in real life, or was it another piss-take thing like that Town Crier segment ?

Didn't like the way they dealt with the guns at the Hacienda scenario, found that abit sensatoinalist to be genuine - I don't belive dealers were riding bikes up and down the pavements shooting people at random..... but the gig scenes were very convincing and even had me girl Charley bopping up and down in her seat! (She has a huge crush on John Simm, and never stops reminding me of the fact - I'm getting quite worried now.... )

Any other events happening to tie in with the film down Manchester way then?

Me too Shuggy - Barney did mention this in an interview with Melody Maker (could have been the NME) just after Happy Mondays started getting a lot of music press attention (MM put them on the front cover a week after "Squirrel & GMan" came out). He was telling the journalist that he had a Chinese takeaway which he didn't like much so he slung it and went out of the room for a bit. On returning to the room later he saw some of the Mondays tucking into it, having dug it back out of the bin.....Barney was revolted by this, he said so, but then he understood because at the time the Mondays were pretty much penniless vagrants anyway!!!!

So there's the verification for you Hubey!! ;) All true then!

Saw that Shawn Ryder on the Channel 4 thingy last weekend and bloody hell, didn't he look a state? Is that what all the drug and alcohol abuse does to yer? He looks ready for the skip.....freaked me out seeing him so bloated and incapable of even speaking. How old is the guy? he looks abouit 50 there.

am still in shock after yesterdays events....

can't think straight....

will post soon...once i regain my composure...it's very hard to type whilst jumping up and down with excitement...

Liv

Cheers Kez for the "big up"...that was pretty fucking cool with Lindsay Reade wasn't it!! :)

Originally posted by Gnu Odor > Originally posted by Kezzie> Big up to Liv for asking the first question of the evening -even if I apparently looked totally shocked when she raised her hand(I thought for one scary moment she was going to ask Gillian for Barney's number ). Lindsay Reade (who I thought was well cool) came up to Liv afterwards to congratulate her on the question too....

But did any of you lucky folk convey to Ms. Gilbert my mad crush on her?

They're called priorities, people!

Sorry, no....remember her hubbie was there - he might not have taken to kindly to that ;)

She was looking well good though - she's ditched the blusher and discovered hair conditioner ;)

Originally posted by Hubert Mickle I saw the film last Saturday at the MetroCentre in Gateshead and I thought it was pretty good. Didn't like the way they dealt with the guns at the Hacienda scenario, found that abit sensatoinalist to be genuine - I don't belive dealers were riding bikes up and down the pavements shooting people at random..... but the gig scenes were very convincing and even had me girl Charley bopping up and down in her seat! (She has a huge crush on John Simm, and never stops reminding me of the fact - I'm getting quite worried now.... )Any other events happening to tie in with the film down Manchester way then?

Blimey Hubert, you went to the Metrocentre? You're brave.....Was it still full of chavas hanging around the amusement arcade?

Gotta agree with your lady about John Simm VERY cute.....

There are a few things happening at the Cornerhouse over the next couple of weeks...last week they showed that documentary Marty was on about (it was actually playing as I read about it :( ), they had a session where they played all of New Order's videos and there are various discussions about music in Manchester over the years, as well as a scriptwriting workshop with Frank Cottrell Boyce, who I think wrote 24HPP. Next week I they're showing the episode of The Tube that came from the Hacienda, which me and Liv have discussed going to see.....:)

Originally posted by Kezzie Sorry, no....remember her hubbie was there - he might not have taken to kindly to that ;)

If I can live with my wife hanging a framed portrait of Willem Dafoe in our bedroom, I sure Mr. Morris can survive a gushing fan an ocean away.

Besides, you must remember: when the Perfect Kiss video came out, I was, what, 17? So I had a crush on every woman alive.

Jo Brand's agent will be in touch shortly Gnu.......

Originally posted by Zizou Zidane Jo Brand's agent will be in touch shortly Gnu.......

My big break! I'm already at work in my studio on the jingle...

It's the mace that makes the taste...so incapacitating,So wrap your claw around a can, the one you use for mating.