New Order and hooliganism

I have heard from somewhere that New Order was the football hooligan's music of choice in the 80's. Bernard also mentions on 'New Order Story' that the average fan was either a spotty student or football hooligan. Your comments please

I dunno about that, but what do the lyrics of "1963" mean - is it something to do with JFK?

Where's Gillian? Are they touring the US soon?

ally wrote:

Old Blue wrote: Where's Gillian? Are they touring the US soon?

Never mind that, where's Ian these days?

Probably laying around somewhere not doing a thing...the lazy bastard.

Who or what is New Order?

Is New Order a gay band?

was IC really sitting on a block of ice when he killed himself?

Answers please

Always thought it was strange that in the UK New Order had such a sttrong football folllowing.

I mean, New Order is by no means an overtly masculine band. Essentially, for the most part they make dance music, or rock tinged dance music, which is not exactly the kind of music that I would think would attract male sports fans.

I am an American, so this may be the difference. Here in the US, a lot of male football fans tend to be into overtly macho hard rock bands. New Order would be considered a "gay" band by most male football fans.

Of course, it may be different in England. In the UK, and Europe in general, football seems to be liked by a wider audience. I mean, I remember being surprised when i read that John Lydon and Rotert Smith are huge football fans.

Also, in England and Europe it seems like a lot of football fans have a bit of style. Ie, they wear well designed Adidas trainers and track jackets. I get this impression from the 80s Casual site.

We have nothing like that in the US. Growing up here, it was not acceptable in school to like both art and sports. And most American Sports fans are not fashionable, nor would they listen to a band that uses lots of electronics, liek New Order.

Here is a good example of the cultural difference.

I got into New Order when I was 13. The first CD I bought was The Best of New Order, which had just come out.

Now, when I heard it, I loved the song World In Motion. But I had no idea that it was a World Cup Anthem!

4 years later, I found out that WIM was a UK World Cup anthem. I couldn't beleive it. i couldn't figure out why macho sports fans would love a song that sounded so........not macho.

But thats the difference. In America, sports tend to attracted a bigger meat head contigent than in Europe.

No don't get me wrong, I enjoy football, boxing, ect.

But I never could understand how a Post Punk Electro Dance band like New Order could attract such a football hooligan following.

www.myspace.com/ZacheryAllanStarkey

Did you catch that Jarvo? He just called you gay!

No No No....

I just mean....here in America, from my experience, most of the American equivlantsof football hooligans seem to consider New Order to be some sort of "sissy" band, thats all.

No No No....

I just mean....here in America, from my experience, most of the American equivlantsof football hooligans seem to consider New Order to be some sort of "sissy" band, thats all.

that's because soccer is a "sissy" game...

Most importantly though, where's Love Vigilantes on Retro?!

EdelBrock wrote:

ally wrote:

Old Blue wrote: Where's Gillian? Are they touring the US soon?

Never mind that, where's Ian these days?

Probably laying around somewhere not doing a thing...the lazy bastard.

Thought the general view was 'hanging around somewhere...'

ally wrote:

Never mind that, where's Ian these days?

Hangs around the kitchen. The fat bastard.

dunno,,, theres a story around town that barney went on a bender with the 657 boys in old portsmouth and woke up to see the isle of wight ferry doing its morning run,, one of the guys shouted "i see a ship in the harbour" to which the barnster replied any one got an emulator ??i feel a song coming on,, get lost m8 ,this is portmouth we dont do gay disco.!

now i stand here waiting.

The connection is just the flippant remark on NewOrderStory you mentioned. Football hooligans like The Police.

Zachery Starkey wrote: Always thought it was strange that in the UK New Order had such a sttrong football folllowing.

I mean, New Order is by no means an overtly masculine band. Essentially, for the most part they make dance music, or rock tinged dance music, which is not exactly the kind of music that I would think would attract male sports fans.

I am an American, so this may be the difference. Here in the US, a lot of male football fans tend to be into overtly macho hard rock bands. New Order would be considered a "gay" band by most male football fans.

Of course, it may be different in England. In the UK, and Europe in general, football seems to be liked by a wider audience. I mean, I remember being surprised when i read that John Lydon and Rotert Smith are huge football fans.

Also, in England and Europe it seems like a lot of football fans have a bit of style. Ie, they wear well designed Adidas trainers and track jackets. I get this impression from the 80s Casual site.

We have nothing like that in the US. Growing up here, it was not acceptable in school to like both art and sports. And most American Sports fans are not fashionable, nor would they listen to a band that uses lots of electronics, liek New Order.

Here is a good example of the cultural difference.

I got into New Order when I was 13. The first CD I bought was The Best of New Order, which had just come out.

Now, when I heard it, I loved the song World In Motion. But I had no idea that it was a World Cup Anthem!

4 years later, I found out that WIM was a UK World Cup anthem. I couldn't beleive it. i couldn't figure out why macho sports fans would love a song that sounded so........not macho.

But thats the difference. In America, sports tend to attracted a bigger meat head contigent than in Europe.

No don't get me wrong, I enjoy football, boxing, ect.

But I never could understand how a Post Punk Electro Dance band like New Order could attract such a football hooligan following.

www.myspace.com/ZacheryAllanStarkey

It wasn't New Order and football. Football was always incidental, it just happened to be something that most of the youth associated with. New Order were the band for the youth to go out, get pissed and fight to. Youths and young men do that a lot. They also do football a lot, and do the drinking and fighting with that. Many people who liked a drink and a fight at the football also liked listening to New Order. World in Motion was a red herring.

There were lots of fights at New Order gigs in the 80s, and almost always involving local youths and others who had come to invade their patch, like between home and away supporters if you like. Britain is territorial like that, you hate the bastards from up the road, it's second nature. Territorial rivalry. New Order was the unifying force, we all liked the music even if we wanted to kick each other in!

WTF is a Post Punk Electro Dance band, anyway? Do you septics have to categorise everything? New Order are New Order. End of.

Tim forgot to mention that male New Order fans are nearly all barely repressed homosexuals, hence all the homosocial meet-ups (gay bar, anyone?), various fag-hags in tow, vanishing off to the toilets in large groups, singing along en masse with songs about not being able to communicate what you really feel, getting all sweaty down t'pit.....

The football link is self-evident: large groups of men gathering together to watch a bunch of athletic blokes in shorts running around getting sweaty, singing songs in praise of said men and the 'club' they belong to, mass hugging and outpouring of emotion in the collective orgasm that is the post-coital....I mean, post-goal delirium.....innit?

New Order's fanbase = all gayers.

Natch.

Fookin strange post for your 1st - man machine. My comment - grow up knob, didnt hoolies follow pet shop boys. The mind boggles with some people here

El Jarvo wrote:

EdelBrock wrote: Did you catch that Jarvo? He just called you gay!

They don't call me Big Gay Al for nothing!

Need someone to protect yer boat?

Where am I?

oldmonkey wrote:

Zachery Starkey wrote: Always thought it was strange that in the UK New Order had such a sttrong football folllowing.

I mean, New Order is by no means an overtly masculine band. Essentially, for the most part they make dance music, or rock tinged dance music, which is not exactly the kind of music that I would think would attract male sports fans.

I am an American, so this may be the difference. Here in the US, a lot of male football fans tend to be into overtly macho hard rock bands. New Order would be considered a "gay" band by most male football fans.

Of course, it may be different in England. In the UK, and Europe in general, football seems to be liked by a wider audience. I mean, I remember being surprised when i read that John Lydon and Rotert Smith are huge football fans.

Also, in England and Europe it seems like a lot of football fans have a bit of style. Ie, they wear well designed Adidas trainers and track jackets. I get this impression from the 80s Casual site.

We have nothing like that in the US. Growing up here, it was not acceptable in school to like both art and sports. And most American Sports fans are not fashionable, nor would they listen to a band that uses lots of electronics, liek New Order.

Here is a good example of the cultural difference.

I got into New Order when I was 13. The first CD I bought was The Best of New Order, which had just come out.

Now, when I heard it, I loved the song World In Motion. But I had no idea that it was a World Cup Anthem!

4 years later, I found out that WIM was a UK World Cup anthem. I couldn't beleive it. i couldn't figure out why macho sports fans would love a song that sounded so........not macho.

But thats the difference. In America, sports tend to attracted a bigger meat head contigent than in Europe.

No don't get me wrong, I enjoy football, boxing, ect.

But I never could understand how a Post Punk Electro Dance band like New Order could attract such a football hooligan following.

www.myspace.com/ZacheryAllanStarkey

It wasn't New Order and football. Football was always incidental, it just happened to be something that most of the youth associated with. New Order were the band for the youth to go out, get pissed and fight to. Youths and young men do that a lot. They also do football a lot, and do the drinking and fighting with that. Many people who liked a drink and a fight at the football also liked listening to New Order. World in Motion was a red herring.

There were lots of fights at New Order gigs in the 80s, and almost always involving local youths and others who had come to invade their patch, like between home and away supporters if you like. Britain is territorial like that, you hate the bastards from up the road, it's second nature. Territorial rivalry. New Order was the unifying force, we all liked the music even if we wanted to kick each other in!

WTF is a Post Punk Electro Dance band, anyway? Do you septics have to categorise everything? New Order are New Order. End of.

Thank you Old Monkey. This was very interesting for me to read.

It is very much a cultural thing. Here in America, people are not always so territorial. or, if they are, its not asociated with music.

Here is a good example.

One of the biggest football rivalries on the US is the long standing rivalry between the Ohio State University football tean amd the Michigan State University football team. These two teams hate each other with a passion.

I live in Columbus. Ohio, which is the capital of Ohio. Its the 13th largest city in the US. I am a student at OSU. OSU has 58,000 students and is the biggest University in the US.

The rivalry between OSU and Michigan is intense. We have had huge riots on campus when OSU lost a game. On game days, thousands of people wear the team clors, get drunk, and get into fights. When Michigan plays OSU at OSU, Michigan fans get harrassed and get beat up. We hate Michigan at OSU. Go google "OSU Football Riots" and you will see.

But there is no music associated at all with any of this. OSU doesnt have a certain band or type of music associated with our team.

And whats odd to me...

I can;t nderstand why New Order were a band to get pissed and fight to. I mean, I can't hear anythign violent or aggressive in New Orders music. Even trakcs like Sunrise dont make me feel violent. I can't imagine anyone getting in a fight to New Orders music. To me, New Order aren't a macho piss up band at all.

Now Crass, the Exploited........those bands I could see men getting into rowdy fightas at thier gigs...

But I just cant see people fighting while NO plays TPK. Can't fathom it.

As for Post Punk Electro Dance Band....thats my personal catagorization for New Order. I work for a record company man, I just get used to coming up with categories for bands. Force of habit. Don't get me wrong though. New Order are the best band ever. At least for me.

I appreciate your insight, Old Monkey. This is really interesting to me. The UK is very different from the US in some way.

i didn't know NO was a gay band. someone tell my wife i have to divorce her and marry doctor?

Brits are bonkers, that's all there is to it.....:D

i always thought NO were a jar head band.

jonathan wrote: i always thought NO were a jar head band.

Suprisingly.......no.

EdelBrock wrote: Brits are bonkers, that's all there is to it.....:D

Surely the answer is that Britishers are all FAGS?

yrs sincerely, Desiring of San Francisco