Peter Hook: 'New Order was an empty shell'

Bass player reflects on band's demise

Peter Hook has spoken out about the last days of his former band New Order, claiming that a lack of communication had left the band "an empty shell".

Speaking as part of BBC Radio 2's New Order week, the bass player spoke about how relations between himself and frontman Bernard Sumner had broken down.

New Order split up last summer, apparently for the final time.

Asked by DJ Stuart Maconie about the prospects of the band burying the hatchet, Hook explained: "I've no idea really. Sometimes you wonder what you were arguing about.

"From what I can gather, Bernard was upset that I didn't go and see him to tell him that I didn't want to work with him anymore. To my mind it had gone.

"I had a manager and I was paying my manager 20 per cent, so got her to do the dirty work. I didn't see why I had to do my own dirty work. She told him in February and he never said anything, he just went, 'Right'."

Hook also spoke of his anger at the 'New Order' statement released by his bandmates that claimed Hook had gone to the press without telling the other band members he had left the band.

"I told him every night after the Brazilian tour that I wasn't going to do this again," Hook said. "I did Brazil for the money. I just felt it was like an empty shell, New Order. It really was for me. I can't talk for the others."

However, Hook went on to say that the process of remastering the band's five albums for Factory Records had given him closure on the turbulence.

"I must admit that when I listened to it, I was really proud of them [his former bandmates]," he said. "It did cheer me up because it made me realise that while we fight like kids in the playground we actually achieved something that we should all be proud of."

http://www.nme.com/news/new-order/40173

linus sulanki wrote: Bass player reflects on band's demise

Peter Hook has spoken out about the last days of his former band New Order, claiming that a lack of communication had left the band "an empty shell".

Speaking as part of BBC Radio 2's New Order week, the bass player spoke about how relations between himself and frontman Bernard Sumner had broken down.

New Order split up last summer, apparently for the final time.

Asked by DJ Stuart Maconie about the prospects of the band burying the hatchet, Hook explained: "I've no idea really. Sometimes you wonder what you were arguing about.

"From what I can gather, Bernard was upset that I didn't go and see him to tell him that I didn't want to work with him anymore. To my mind it had gone.

"I had a manager and I was paying my manager 20 per cent, so got her to do the dirty work. I didn't see why I had to do my own dirty work. She told him in February and he never said anything, he just went, 'Right'."

Hook also spoke of his anger at the 'New Order' statement released by his bandmates that claimed Hook had gone to the press without telling the other band members he had left the band.

"I told him every night after the Brazilian tour that I wasn't going to do this again," Hook said. "I did Brazil for the money. I just felt it was like an empty shell, New Order. It really was for me. I can't talk for the others."

However, Hook went on to say that the process of remastering the band's five albums for Factory Records had given him closure on the turbulence.

"I must admit that when I listened to it, I was really proud of them [his former bandmates]," he said. "It did cheer me up because it made me realise that while we fight like kids in the playground we actually achieved something that we should all be proud of."

http://www.nme.com/news/new-order/40173

Amazing, anyone wanna bet on there being a book about this?

They should just move on with their side projects. I wish Bernard would revive Electronic and bring Stephen into it.

"I didn't see why I had to do my own dirty work"

Hmmm, hope that this came across better in person than it looks on paper...........

"i did it for the money" They really came a long ways since JD.

lucienchardon wrote: They should just move on with their side projects. I wish Bernard would revive Electronic and bring Stephen into it.

It's not Electronic, but he's doing just that - Bad Lieutenant (or whatever they'll end up being called).

It's no surprise, but still sad. In my own unrealistic little world I'd want them all to be friends again eating strawberry cake on the grass...

nataliet wrote: It's no surprise, but still sad. In my own unrealistic little world I'd want them all to be friends again eating strawberry cake on the grass...

Just like on "Play at Home", sweet! "How do you think that went Bern?" "I'd say it was a piece of cake!"

......suit.Hey hey...calm down

linus sulanki wrote: Bass player reflects on band's demise

Peter Hook has spoken out about the last days of his former band New Order, claiming that a lack of communication had left the band "an empty shell".

Speaking as part of BBC Radio 2's New Order week, the bass player spoke about how relations between himself and frontman Bernard Sumner had broken down.

New Order split up last summer, apparently for the final time.

Asked by DJ Stuart Maconie about the prospects of the band burying the hatchet, Hook explained: "I've no idea really. Sometimes you wonder what you were arguing about.

"From what I can gather, Bernard was upset that I didn't go and see him to tell him that I didn't want to work with him anymore. To my mind it had gone.

"I had a manager and I was paying my manager 20 per cent, so got her to do the dirty work. I didn't see why I had to do my own dirty work. She told him in February and he never said anything, he just went, 'Right'."

Hook also spoke of his anger at the 'New Order' statement released by his bandmates that claimed Hook had gone to the press without telling the other band members he had left the band.

"I told him every night after the Brazilian tour that I wasn't going to do this again," Hook said. "I did Brazil for the money. I just felt it was like an empty shell, New Order. It really was for me. I can't talk for the others."

However, Hook went on to say that the process of remastering the band's five albums for Factory Records had given him closure on the turbulence.

"I must admit that when I listened to it, I was really proud of them [his former bandmates]," he said. "It did cheer me up because it made me realise that while we fight like kids in the playground we actually achieved something that we should all be proud of."

http://www.nme.com/news/new-order/40173

jezz! here we go again... :rip:

anybody else find it a bit charming that they still act like children?

Nick King wrote:

lucienchardon wrote: They should just move on with their side projects. I wish Bernard would revive Electronic and bring Stephen into it.

It's not Electronic, but he's doing just that - Bad Lieutenant (or whatever they'll end up being called).

I meant it would be great to have Bernard, Stephen and Johnny Marr work together.

coney island baby wrote: "i did it for the money" They really came a long ways since JD.

hey there are older guys now, at this age you realize that you need money to eat!

FRANK[gold]ITO wrote:

coney island baby wrote: "i did it for the money" They really came a long ways since JD.

hey there are older guys now, at this age you realize that you need money to eat!

oh i know... i don't blame them and I don't have those lofty ideals anymore.. just playing devil's advocate

It sounds like a softening of animosity to me. The first step to a "kiss and make up". Typical fooking NO in fact.

They'll be back.

noorder wrote:

They'll be back.

spot on

typical New Order really. Don't you see the pattern? They always need time apart. Then they start over all over again and claim its the happiest they ever been. If they make another album like Get ready, i would be thrilled. If not, its been fun while it lasted.

I feel sure that I remember him saying it was only 10%

EDIT: No, it was 20%

I'd have done it for 15

coney island baby wrote: "i did it for the money" They really came a long ways since JD.

If they did it for the money then why not do one final-proper-farewel-fuck-off gig in the UK..i mean, come on, that's where it started..

Talking about not taking ur fanbase seriously...

I feel sold out

Peter Hook wrote: "I did Brazil for the money"

It's silly, but it hurts a little, you know :(

Igor wrote:

Peter Hook wrote: "I did Brazil for the money"

It's silly, but it hurts a little, you know :(

I don't know why so many are taking offense to this statement. When bands reform and go on tour... its usually for the money

EdelBrock wrote:

Igor wrote:

Peter Hook wrote: "I did Brazil for the money"

It's silly, but it hurts a little, you know :(

I don't know why so many are taking offense to this statement. When bands reform and go on tour... its usually for the money

Yes, but it's New Order, the indie Apostles Although if you think of what the Sex Pistols have been doing lately... I guess when you're old you just don't care about certain things anymore but money.

I'm really disappointed to hear it from Hooky, the punk bassist. A bit more honesty was needed when you toured in 2006 then. Simple: if you don't enjoy playing music together, just stop right there.

Hooky always loved the music : it wasn't that he stopped loving the music, was it? It must have been the interpersonal band relationship that could function no more.

The bottom line is we all work for money, no matter what your job is. Punk, indie, blah, blah...hardly any of those bands made money during their peaks, not that it was their priority so they said at the time....but they've all moaned about it since. NO had singles on albums from Low Life and then it was just the downward spiral of shitty remixes and miming on TV. Punk ethics, BS.

Arfur Fuscake wrote: The bottom line is we all work for money, no matter what your job is. Punk, indie, blah, blah...hardly any of those bands made money during their peaks, not that it was their priority so they said at the time....but they've all moaned about it since. NO had singles on albums from Low Life and then it was just the downward spiral of shitty remixes and miming on TV. Punk ethics, BS.

well, i agree with you about almost everything you said..

but i'm a sucker for remixes, and there have been a tiny few lately over the past few years that are decent..

later -1

EdelBrock wrote:

Igor wrote:

Peter Hook wrote: "I did Brazil for the money"

It's silly, but it hurts a little, you know :(

I don't know why so many are taking offense to this statement. When bands reform and go on tour... its usually for the money

Nah, it was just an emo moment. Come on, of course it's stupid to take offense. Go make a lot of money. In the "South America reunion tour 2010" I'll be happy to put a few pounds in Hooky's pocket again.

Now, if you excuse me, I'll listen to all the albums back to back, in a dark room. Then I'll cry and cut my wrists.

Having now listened to the NO interviews with Stuart Maconie this week on BBC Radio 2, I have to say that Hooky sounded like he had one great big, fat chip on his shoulder.

It is interesting to note that it seems to be only Hooky who thought that New Order was through..an empty shell.

Bernard and Stephen seemed quite content with New Order and seemed like they want New Order to continue. A lot of my friends and myself loved WFTSC and were looking forward to another record in a few years.

I don't know. I really like Peter Hook, he seems like such a swell guy (he takes the time to respond to fan emails on Myspace, which is just incredibly awesome of him) but I wonder why he alone wants New Order to be dead so badly.

Zachery Starkey wrote: It is interesting to note that it seems to be only Hooky who thought that New Order was through..an empty shell.

Bernard and Stephen seemed quite content with New Order and seemed like they want New Order to continue. A lot of my friends and myself loved WFTSC and were looking forward to another record in a few years.

I don't know. I really like Peter Hook, he seems like such a swell guy (he takes the time to respond to fan emails on Myspace, which is just incredibly awesome of him) but I wonder why he alone wants New Order to be dead so badly.

Well from his interview I know Bernard effectively said that winning the singer sweepstake after Ian's death suited his ego. And I just wonder, whether or not that has been a constant thorn in Hooky's side down the years?

Zachery Starkey wrote:

I don't know. I really like Peter Hook, he seems like such a swell guy (he takes the time to respond to fan emails on Myspace, which is just incredibly awesome of him) but I wonder why he alone wants New Order to be dead so badly.

Because he and Barney can't stand each other anymore. Something must have happened between them that we don't know about. I don't think Peter has an issue with Steve. Steve seems to be the guy who kind of avoids any serious tension with everyone...maybe more easy going is a good way to describe him?? And according to Peter, Barney has self confidence problems.....Maybe Barney is too controlling? Either way in 5 years they will get back together.

J

No Holiday wrote:

Zachery Starkey wrote:

I don't know. I really like Peter Hook, he seems like such a swell guy (he takes the time to respond to fan emails on Myspace, which is just incredibly awesome of him) but I wonder why he alone wants New Order to be dead so badly.

Because he and Barney can't stand each other anymore. Something must have happened between them that we don't know about. I don't think Peter has an issue with Steve. Steve seems to be the guy who kind of avoids any serious tension with everyone...maybe more easy going is a good way to describe him?? And according to Peter, Barney has self confidence problems.....Maybe Barney is too controlling? Either way in 5 years they will get back together.

J

Yeah I think it was something along these lines maybe. Bernard is not the most eloquent man in the world and I often wonder if he said something to Hooky that seriously offended or insulted him without meaning to. Its definately something we don't know about....and you are right about Steve....its nothing to do with him. Something happened between Hooky and Barney...who knows what.

Its just kind of sad, seeing as how they were lifelong friends and all. I am sure that, deep inside, both of them probably feel hurt.

On a lighter note, in a recent email, Hooky told me that Bernard is "a very lazy man!" which I thought was quite funny.

I hope they get back together, even if I could just see them play live once more, that would be so awesome. Thier music is very important to me.

speculation....i speculate the sky is going to fall any minute now.

Hooky didn't like that New Order was reduced to a heartless empty shell going thru the motions. Bernard didn't mind going through the motions even though Bernard doesn't like playing live, writing lyrics, or interviews, cause he was still the center of attention. Steve was trying not to rock the boat.

Really, if they were not having fun and not being very creative either, why would you want them to stick together like a bad marriage with the wife having an affair and the husband going to bath houses, a dysfunctional facade.

0_o wrote: Hooky didn't like that New Order was reduced to a heartless empty shell going thru the motions. Bernard didn't mind going through the motions even though Bernard doesn't like playing live, writing lyrics, or interviews, cause he was still the center of attention. Steve was trying not to rock the boat.

Really, if they were not having fun and not being very creative either, why would you want them to stick together like a bad marriage with the wife having an affair and the husband going to bath houses, a dysfunctional facade.

I don't know if Barney was ever comfortable being the center of attention....I just think that he thinks he knows what's best for the group, and was the one that everyone sort of followed. And you have to remember, Barney wasn't always the center of attention.....certainly not in Joy Division. But he was second to Ian in terms of being a leader....in that sense Barney might have a strong personality. Obviously so does Peter. The only thing is a lot of WFTSC was very strong, and showed a lot of promise, and I was excited to hear those "7 yet to be released tracks" that would follow shortly after. I don't know about their live performance, but I don't think their creativity petered out, at least not when listening to their last album.

J

In essence it's one big fook up, by grown men who should know BETTER.

or grown men all needing an easy excuse to stop touring cause they all hate it.

are any of them grandparents yet?

In the past, they would have had someone around them to either tell them to wind their necks in about going public (Rob Gretton?) or they would just pursue their own projects without anyone outside really knowing what's gone on. Now, they have the means to be as independent and public as they like. I don't think there's anything new about all of this, except that we know that it's happened this time. Roll on the Siren's outtakes release, let's hope they realise even more than they appeared to when interviewed this week that they had something and still could create something, if not then roll on the release of the side projects and gigs.

seriously, i am getting sick of hearing about these 7 extra songs.

they either have them or they don't.

either release them or burn them.

i am sick of the f'in wait.

wtf?

are they still under any contracts, do you gurus know? if they are not under any contract, why not release the music? if they ARE under contract, why would London or whomever NOT want to release these songs and make a bundle of cash?????

or, why can't they just put this out under Fractured?

come on, be the artists you once were, new order.

let the fans hear your art.

wtf.

why does nobody know nothin?

Tarbox23 wrote: seriously, i am getting sick of hearing about these 7 extra songs.

they either have them or they don't.

either release them or burn them.

i am sick of the f'in wait.

wtf?

are they still under any contracts, do you gurus know? if they are not under any contract, why not release the music? if they ARE under contract, why would London or whomever NOT want to release these songs and make a bundle of cash?????

or, why can't they just put this out under Fractured?

come on, be the artists you once were, new order.

let the fans hear your art.

wtf.

why does nobody know nothin?

It's probably because these 7 tracks suck big time. Even if they don't, they still need, I assume, additional updated programming, overdubs, etc. And the band is not there to do all that.

I have been told that the songs are fully complete and have been produced by Brian Higgins - must admit I've never heard of him.

en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Brian_Higgins_(producer)

I always thought that the release of Singles should have been backed up with these 7 new songs on the second disc.

Anyway, in terms of performance, I've seen some amazing NO gigs and some boring ones : the last UK performance in Wolverhampton was the best NO show I had seen since the Apollo in 98. At least they hadn't gone shite live.

Arfur Fuscake wrote: I have been told that the songs are fully complete and have been produced by Brian Higgins - must admit I've never heard of him.

en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Brian_Higgins_(producer)

Not true. Higgins was just one of the many producers involved in the WFTSC sessions. At least two of the remaining tracks, namely "Madonna" and "Sugarcane", were produced by Stephen Street (the former) and some bloke with a scandinavian-sounding name I can't remember right now (the later). As for these tracks being shite and hence not released, I recall Street saying "Madonna" was a top tune...

Igor wrote:

Peter Hook wrote: "I did Brazil for the money"

It's silly, but it hurts a little, you know :(

Anyway, we all had a great time together here! Peter pretends very well though Bernard looked terrible, just see Josue's (Mr Disco) picture in his avatar!

Is it because Bernard hates Peters natural showmanship or maybe its the other way round:D

No Holiday wrote:

Zachery Starkey wrote:

I don't know. I really like Peter Hook, he seems like such a swell guy (he takes the time to respond to fan emails on Myspace, which is just incredibly awesome of him) but I wonder why he alone wants New Order to be dead so badly.

Because he and Barney can't stand each other anymore. Something must have happened between them that we don't know about. I don't think Peter has an issue with Steve. Steve seems to be the guy who kind of avoids any serious tension with everyone...maybe more easy going is a good way to describe him?? And according to Peter, Barney has self confidence problems.....Maybe Barney is too controlling? Either way in 5 years they will get back together.

J

Sit and drink. Penny Royalty. Cryptic to those who don't.

Arfur Fuscake wrote: I have been told that the songs are fully complete and have been produced by Brian Higgins - must admit I've never heard of him.

en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Brian_Higgins_(producer)

Brian Higgins was commissioned to produce some songs, but the band were unhappy with the results.

No Holiday wrote:

0_o wrote: Hooky didn't like that New Order was reduced to a heartless empty shell going thru the motions. Bernard didn't mind going through the motions even though Bernard doesn't like playing live, writing lyrics, or interviews, cause he was still the center of attention. Steve was trying not to rock the boat.

Really, if they were not having fun and not being very creative either, why would you want them to stick together like a bad marriage with the wife having an affair and the husband going to bath houses, a dysfunctional facade.

I don't know if Barney was ever comfortable being the center of attention....I just think that he thinks he knows what's best for the group, and was the one that everyone sort of followed. And you have to remember, Barney wasn't always the center of attention.....certainly not in Joy Division. But he was second to Ian in terms of being a leader....in that sense Barney might have a strong personality. Obviously so does Peter. The only thing is a lot of WFTSC was very strong, and showed a lot of promise, and I was excited to hear those "7 yet to be released tracks" that would follow shortly after. I don't know about their live performance, but I don't think their creativity petered out, at least not when listening to their last album.

J

I agree 100 percent here..WFTSC was a great album..some cracking good songs on there...

As for live performance...I guess I must disagree..I think they were still brilliant live (see the Personal Fest footage from Rio) but I think perhaps you prefer the intensity of the ealier NO performances to the ones of later years.

I personally enjoy Barney's silly dancing.

Zachery Starkey wrote:

No Holiday wrote:

0_o wrote: Hooky didn't like that New Order was reduced to a heartless empty shell going thru the motions. Bernard didn't mind going through the motions even though Bernard doesn't like playing live, writing lyrics, or interviews, cause he was still the center of attention. Steve was trying not to rock the boat.

Really, if they were not having fun and not being very creative either, why would you want them to stick together like a bad marriage with the wife having an affair and the husband going to bath houses, a dysfunctional facade.

I don't know if Barney was ever comfortable being the center of attention....I just think that he thinks he knows what's best for the group, and was the one that everyone sort of followed. And you have to remember, Barney wasn't always the center of attention.....certainly not in Joy Division. But he was second to Ian in terms of being a leader....in that sense Barney might have a strong personality. Obviously so does Peter. The only thing is a lot of WFTSC was very strong, and showed a lot of promise, and I was excited to hear those "7 yet to be released tracks" that would follow shortly after. I don't know about their live performance, but I don't think their creativity petered out, at least not when listening to their last album.

J

I agree 100 percent here..WFTSC was a great album..some cracking good songs on there...

As for live performance...I guess I must disagree..I think they were still brilliant live (see the Personal Fest footage from Rio) but I think perhaps you prefer the intensity of the ealier NO performances to the ones of later years.

I personally enjoy Barney's silly dancing.

Personal was in Buenos Aires mate!

WFTSC is a studio album different from Get Ready...

Big Mouth Julio wrote:

Zachery Starkey wrote:

No Holiday wrote:

0_o wrote: Hooky didn't like that New Order was reduced to a heartless empty shell going thru the motions. Bernard didn't mind going through the motions even though Bernard doesn't like playing live, writing lyrics, or interviews, cause he was still the center of attention. Steve was trying not to rock the boat.

Really, if they were not having fun and not being very creative either, why would you want them to stick together like a bad marriage with the wife having an affair and the husband going to bath houses, a dysfunctional facade.

I don't know if Barney was ever comfortable being the center of attention....I just think that he thinks he knows what's best for the group, and was the one that everyone sort of followed. And you have to remember, Barney wasn't always the center of attention.....certainly not in Joy Division. But he was second to Ian in terms of being a leader....in that sense Barney might have a strong personality. Obviously so does Peter. The only thing is a lot of WFTSC was very strong, and showed a lot of promise, and I was excited to hear those "7 yet to be released tracks" that would follow shortly after. I don't know about their live performance, but I don't think their creativity petered out, at least not when listening to their last album.

J

I agree 100 percent here..WFTSC was a great album..some cracking good songs on there...

As for live performance...I guess I must disagree..I think they were still brilliant live (see the Personal Fest footage from Rio) but I think perhaps you prefer the intensity of the ealier NO performances to the ones of later years.

I personally enjoy Barney's silly dancing.

Personal was in Buenos Aires mate!

WFTSC is a studio album different from Get Ready...

Oh that is right! Forgive me I couldn't remember where in Brazil is was.

I do know that Get Ready was the album before WFTSC...I think WFTSC is far superior to Get Ready. :)

Zachery Starkey wrote:

Big Mouth Julio wrote:

Zachery Starkey wrote:

No Holiday wrote:

0_o wrote: Hooky didn't like that New Order was reduced to a heartless empty shell going thru the motions. Bernard didn't mind going through the motions even though Bernard doesn't like playing live, writing lyrics, or interviews, cause he was still the center of attention. Steve was trying not to rock the boat.

Really, if they were not having fun and not being very creative either, why would you want them to stick together like a bad marriage with the wife having an affair and the husband going to bath houses, a dysfunctional facade.

I don't know if Barney was ever comfortable being the center of attention....I just think that he thinks he knows what's best for the group, and was the one that everyone sort of followed. And you have to remember, Barney wasn't always the center of attention.....certainly not in Joy Division. But he was second to Ian in terms of being a leader....in that sense Barney might have a strong personality. Obviously so does Peter. The only thing is a lot of WFTSC was very strong, and showed a lot of promise, and I was excited to hear those "7 yet to be released tracks" that would follow shortly after. I don't know about their live performance, but I don't think their creativity petered out, at least not when listening to their last album.

J

I agree 100 percent here..WFTSC was a great album..some cracking good songs on there...

As for live performance...I guess I must disagree..I think they were still brilliant live (see the Personal Fest footage from Rio) but I think perhaps you prefer the intensity of the ealier NO performances to the ones of later years.

I personally enjoy Barney's silly dancing.

Personal was in Buenos Aires mate!

WFTSC is a studio album different from Get Ready...

Oh that is right! Forgive me I couldn't remember where in Brazil is was.

I do know that Get Ready was the album before WFTSC...I think WFTSC is far superior to Get Ready. :)

I actually haven't been given the privilege to see New Order live, but I did borrow the 2001 live DVD Finsbury Park i think, or 611 or something....It wasn't bad, they seemed like they were for the most part having fun.....but I clearly remember during Temptation Barney was complaining TO THE CROWD that Hook's bass was too loud! There was definite on stage tension between them. But I do like seeing live footage from the 80s with Gillian.....What can I say, that was their prime. They were younger, doing more drugs, and making classic music. Broken Promise live kicks ass, as does the live video to Perfect Kiss.....The Barney dancing.....ehhh....Honestly I thought it looked a bit ridiculous, but it didn't deter from the music. It just looked awkward to me. Guess you lighten up some with age!

I quite like both Get Ready and WFTSC, but I think Get Ready is the better album by a slight advantage.....They just sound so re-energized and cool on that record. Primitive Notion is one of their underrated tracks me thinks.

J

0_o wrote: Really, if they were not having fun and not being very creative either, why would you want them to stick together like a bad marriage with the wife having an affair and the husband going to bath houses, a dysfunctional facade.

which one of them is the wife and which the bath-house-frequenting husband...?

I just want to point out, in Hooky's defense, he did end the Maconie interview with a compliment to Barney (his vocals and lyrics having improved tremendously over time or however it went)--seemed like a nice gesture.