Pictures in my Mind

This is not a wind up. Ive e-mailed Bernard about this and told him the situation.If Barney says the guy can publish it then i want to know if he will,Steve and Hooky both know,and though i dont speak for the band,i dont see any problem,ill keep you posted and ill put up the reply be it from whoever just to prove im not bullshitting ok,

This sounds like a feasible plan, though if it turns to rubbish ask barney if theres World In Motion demos.

Oh FFS SHUT UP.

Bernard Dicken, Sumner, whatever is the main reason that old and rare Joy Division and New Order stuff can't be released or uploaded on the web. If you want to involve him on this, forget about hearing this song in the next 20 years.

Big Mouth Julio wrote: Bernard Dicken, Sumner, whatever is the main reason that old and rare Joy Division and New Order stuff can't be released or uploaded on the web. If you want to involve him on this, forget about hearing this song in the next 20 years.

A rare moment of clarity there, Julio. Are you feeling okay?

Biginoil wrote:

Big Mouth Julio wrote: Bernard Dicken, Sumner, whatever is the main reason that old and rare Joy Division and New Order stuff can't be released or uploaded on the web. If you want to involve him on this, forget about hearing this song in the next 20 years.

A rare moment of clarity there, Julio. Are you feeling okay?

Think it's still that Christmas thing that may have caught you at night

Talking serious now. The only reason he says is that he hated his voice (out of tune probably) and could not sing at the beginning of his carrer

The Internet is anonymous upload it anway.

Chris Nash wrote:

HAL 9000 wrote: The Internet is anonymous upload it anway.

And if you believe that...

ok the internet can be anonymous. Go wiki anonymous peer to peer. I run torrents through tor on occasion. A computer novice can direct his web server through a proxy.

Can always listen to Bob...

0_o wrote: Can always listen to Bob...

I hear tell Bobbert was originally in electronic.

Tucker wrote: A bit staggering the rumblings of some fans who seem to believe they have some sort of an automatic entitlement to unreleased material. I'm as curious as the next person but even if said demo was released I doubt I'd play it more than twice. It was probably held back because it wasn't up to Joy Divison's usual standard... nothing more. The endless threads on here building up this mystique around it are

More importantly and legally, unreleased audio belongs to the surviving members of the band and Ian's widow... to do with as they please. If they want to release some of it as they did on Heart & Soul back in '97 then great. By the same token, if they want to hold it back as they don't deem it to be of a high enough quality then that's totally up to them. They don't owe any of us anything and no doubt are also trying to keep a watchful eye on Ian's legacy.

Leaking or trying to encourage the illegal leaking of it seems a tad disrespectful dunnit?

Just saying like

I know England has worse copyright laws than america. And America is pretty said. You can only sue for a copyrighted recording. I doubt a vapor recording copy that nobody knows exsists is copyrighted. Just look over in the forum thieves like us. There is no differnce between my request in this thread vs that whole discussion group.

If they want to release it than I will pay for it. It's not a question of money since the cost of releasing it is greater than the 30 people who would actually puchase this.

Chris Nash wrote:

HAL 9000 wrote:

Chris Nash wrote:

HAL 9000 wrote: The Internet is anonymous upload it anway.

And if you believe that...

ok the internet can be anonymous. Go wiki anonymous peer to peer. I run torrents through tor on occasion. A computer novice can direct his web server through a proxy.

One can ALWAYS backtrail a proxy via IPs, IP adresses, Proxy servers, etc. Nothing is ever completely safe.

Ask Cambo...

P.S. Everyone knows how "reliable" Wikipedia info is. If you believe that...

I had rather thought you might actually read up on how an onion router actually works. The source code is readily available off sourceforge. Since are keeping it simple though.... Exactly how are you going to get logs off anonymous proxies in eastern Europe or china. Maybe the will just hand over the logs to you? 1/2 the home routers in the world have upnp enabled. Pretty easy protocol to redirect.

Tucker wrote: A bit staggering the rumblings of some fans who seem to believe they have some sort of an automatic entitlement to unreleased material. I'm as curious as the next person but even if said demo was released I doubt I'd play it more than twice. It was probably held back because it wasn't up to Joy Divison's usual standard... nothing more. The endless threads on here building up this mystique around it are

More importantly and legally, unreleased audio belongs to the surviving members of the band and Ian's widow... to do with as they please. If they want to release some of it as they did on Heart & Soul back in '97 then great. By the same token, if they want to hold it back as they don't deem it to be of a high enough quality then that's totally up to them. They don't owe any of us anything and no doubt are also trying to keep a watchful eye on Ian's legacy.

Leaking or trying to encourage the illegal leaking of it seems a tad disrespectful dunnit?

Just saying like

Agreed. I think it is very disrespectful to the band and their families to keep on moaning about this, whether it's real or not.

From TPOIT:

So the internets are abuzz lately with talk of a newly-discovered Joy Division rehearsal tape floating around, featuring not one but five full-length takes on "In A Lonely Place" - the last song written by the band prior to Ian's suicide, and closing with the verse beginning with "Hangman looks round as he waits / Cord stretches tight, then it breaks...". In 1997 this song was released on the Heart and Soul box set, but ending just prior to the final verse (sensitivity reasons to his surviving family, perhaps?). So it would be great to finally hear the long-rumored full-length variant, alas the set has yet to surface publicly on the internets so we will just have to wait.

So maybe this song should stay out of the public domain.

To sum this PIMM thing:

1. People get excited about ANY unknown recording by Joy Division because their recording output is not that great yet very well systemized (we all know their songs off by heart) and since 1981 only one unknown studio recording surfaced (the two Graveyard songs on H&S). So it's understandable from the beginning.

2. What is the sound and creative quality of this song? If it is like "Reaction", an unknown song by Warsaw posted by Hook on his myspace, then honestly I won't give two tosses about. But the likes of "The Drawback" give us a hint that it is possible for quite a good song to be dropped by Joy Division very quickly (it flashed only once at the RCA session, nowhere else, to my knowledge).

3. As for copyright. It's not in Deborah Curtis' book, is it? Is there really a copyright maintained for that song? Now come to think of it, where was the rage when the 1978 RCA recordings were surfacing on countless bootlegs from 1981 on?

|| | ||| 6217|| 8 || 3 wrote: To sum this PIMM thing:

1. People get excited about ANY unknown recording by Joy Division because their recording output is not that great yet very well systemized (we all know their songs off by heart) and since 1981 only one unknown studio recording surfaced (the two Graveyard songs on H&S). So it's understandable from the beginning.

2. What is the sound and creative quality of this song? If it is like "Repetition", an unknown song by Warsaw posted by Hook on his myspace, then honestly I won't give two tosses about. But the likes of "The Drawback" give us a hint that it is possible for quite a good song to be dropped by Joy Division very quickly (it flashed only once at the RCA session, nowhere else, to my knowledge).

3. As for copyright. It's not in Deborah Curtis' book, is it? Is there really a copyright maintained for that song? Now come to think of it, where was the rage when the 1978 RCA recordings were surfacing on countless bootlegs from 1981 on?

You forgot about Reaction, m8! But it's so crap that became forgotten

The other point is that was said here that those lyrics was in the unseen ones in Deborah's book, is it true?

Big Mouth Julio wrote:

|| | ||| 6217|| 8 || 3 wrote: To sum this PIMM thing:

1. People get excited about ANY unknown recording by Joy Division because their recording output is not that great yet very well systemized (we all know their songs off by heart) and since 1981 only one unknown studio recording surfaced (the two Graveyard songs on H&S). So it's understandable from the beginning.

2. What is the sound and creative quality of this song? If it is like "Repetition", an unknown song by Warsaw posted by Hook on his myspace, then honestly I won't give two tosses about. But the likes of "The Drawback" give us a hint that it is possible for quite a good song to be dropped by Joy Division very quickly (it flashed only once at the RCA session, nowhere else, to my knowledge).

3. As for copyright. It's not in Deborah Curtis' book, is it? Is there really a copyright maintained for that song? Now come to think of it, where was the rage when the 1978 RCA recordings were surfacing on countless bootlegs from 1981 on?

You forgot about Reaction, m8! But it's so crap that became forgotten

The other point is that was said here that those lyrics was in the unseen ones in Deborah's book, is it true?

Well I meant Reaction, not Repetition, I don't know why I got it confused, other than it's a Fall song

Repetition is by Information Society, have you ver heard of them?

Big Mouth Julio wrote:

Biginoil wrote:

Big Mouth Julio wrote: Bernard Dicken, Sumner, whatever is the main reason that old and rare Joy Division and New Order stuff can't be released or uploaded on the web. If you want to involve him on this, forget about hearing this song in the next 20 years.

A rare moment of clarity there, Julio. Are you feeling okay?

Think it's still that Christmas thing that may have caught you at night

Talking serious now. The only reason he says is that he hated his voice (out of tune probably) and could not sing at the beginning of his carrer

What, and his singing is any better now? The only difference is he know's the words properly now thanks to screen in front of him with the lyrics on it! Karaoke NO/JD

condemnation wrote: [What, and his singing is any better now? The only difference is he know's the words properly now thanks to screen in front of him with the lyrics on it! Karaoke NO/JD

there was something great in his offkey vocals.

Chris Nash wrote:

HAL 9000 wrote: The Internet is anonymous upload it anway.

And if you believe that...

Fucking hell!! Ha ha!

the end