Discovering: New Order

I doubt there will be any new revelations, especially as the synopsis begins with this phrase: "Rising from the ashes...":

sky.com

The page also lists another programme called New Order: Their Story

Thanks.At least it looks like a brand new doc and not a repeat.Just looked at Sky Arts and they're showing the A Collection video compilation right now funnily enough.

19.11 www.youtube.com/watch?v=d76-hf6rggw... No doubt they're drumming up (see what I did there?) interest for the new album. The year of Republic saw one radio and two TV documentaries, but no fascinating new insights. Album was shit, too. Unlike Graham Norton, I can't be arsed. As with the PCL documentary, there are only so many times you can hear the same story. One of my favourite accunts is Claude Flowers' book, which stops at '94 (obviously) but made a welcome change from Paul Lester's OTTness, Savage's yawnfests and Morley's pretentiousness. Time for an update, Claude?

Michael Monkhouse wrote: 19.11 www.youtube.com/watch?v=d76-hf6rggw... No doubt they're drumming up (see what I did there?) interest for the new album. The year of Republic saw one radio and two TV documentaries, but no fascinating new insights. Album was shit, too. Unlike Graham Norton, I can't be arsed. As with the PCL documentary, there are only so many times you can hear the same story. One of my favourite accunts is Claude Flowers' book, which stops at '94 (obviously) but made a welcome change from Paul Lester's OTTness, Savage's yawnfests and Morley's pretentiousness. Time for an update, Claude?

Yes. Superb book.

BTW guys dont be fooled by "New Order: their story ": it's just New Order Story without the videos

Michael Monkhouse wrote: 19.11 www.youtube.com/watch?v=d76-hf6rggw... No doubt they're drumming up (see what I did there?) interest for the new album. The year of Republic saw one radio and two TV documentaries, but no fascinating new insights. Album was shit, too. Unlike Graham Norton, I can't be arsed. As with the PCL documentary, there are only so many times you can hear the same story. One of my favourite accunts is Claude Flowers' book, which stops at '94 (obviously) but made a welcome change from Paul Lester's OTTness, Savage's yawnfests and Morley's pretentiousness. Time for an update, Claude?

I was watching the Brixton 87 'Academy' video just the other night, out of interest to see how it stood up these days as hadn't watched it for years.Never did work out what that obsession Barney had around that time with inspecting and flexing his right arm muscle while singing was all about.Looks like a nervous tic watching it now.

Year of Republic saw two TV docs? Obviously there was NewOrderStory....what was the other one? Also, hard to imagine now but Radio 1 had a "New Order Day" around the release of Republic.NO songs every half hour and competitions etc and Jackie Brambles trying to feign enthusiasm for the band.I 've never read this Claude Flowers book you mention, i think i was vaguely aware of it once but didn't bother. Like you say, there are only so many times you can hear the same story.

Fuck! Two people agree with me in one day. I must be losing it. It's like waiting for a bus: Nothing happens for half-an-hour; then all of a sudden, still nothing fucking happens. Yes, I remember NO day on Radio One. A lot of hype around a dud album, but that's London for you. The three docs were 'NO Story', MTV's 'NO: Past, Present and Future', and Radio One's 'How does it Feel' with John Peel. All froth and no Substance. 'Academy' has a certain nostalgia value for me, but the filming is embarrassingly dated and the interviews get in the way. Steve should learn to look an interviewer in the eye, but maybe that's expecting too much after just 38 years in the biz. The Other Two always look like a charity appeal for retarded children (no disrespect. To retarded children.) Flowers' book is recommended. This was years before the Net and the other buke I knew was Brian Edge's 'Pleasures and Wayward Distractions' but the best thing about it is the photography. The actual text is vague and superficial, and the discography is shoddy too.

Michael Monkhouse wrote: One of my favourite accunts is Claude Flowers' book

😄

Michael Monkhouse wrote:

Flowers' book is recommended. This was years before the Net and the other buke I knew was Brian Edge's 'Pleasures and Wayward Distractions' but the best thing about it is the photography. The actual text is vague and superficial, and the discography is shoddy too.

Hmm..kind of interested but reading Shadowplayers at the moment.I know it's been around a few years now but only recently started reading it.It's more the story of Factory rather than the tired old JD/NO tale.Getting into it now as i've got to the part with the years i started becoming interested in Factory and became a big fan in 83/84.

Fotzepolitic wrote:

Hmm..kind of interested but reading Shadowplayers at the moment.I know it's been around a few years now but only recently started reading it.It's more the story of Factory rather than the tired old JD/NO tale.Getting into it now as i've got to the part with the years i started becoming interested in Factory and became a big fan in 83/84.

I've been reading this for about a year now and still have 2 chapters to go. It's a good book though. Very detailed.

I've also just downloaded the documentary to watch later. Not expecting too much from it. I watched The Smiths one yesterday and it was pretty run of the mill stuff.

BazG wrote:

Fotzepolitic wrote:

Hmm..kind of interested but reading Shadowplayers at the moment.I know it's been around a few years now but only recently started reading it.It's more the story of Factory rather than the tired old JD/NO tale.Getting into it now as i've got to the part with the years i started becoming interested in Factory and became a big fan in 83/84.

I've been reading this for about a year now and still have 2 chapters to go. It's a good book though. Very detailed.

I've also just downloaded the documentary to watch later. Not expecting too much from it. I watched The Smiths one yesterday and it was pretty run of the mill stuff.

Yeah very detailed indeed.Covers pretty much every single thing Factory ever released and every single band or artist that was on the label.Amongst little nuggets i learnt or once knew but had long since forgotten was that Low - Life was originally planned to be titled Love Vigilantes which i think would have worked just as well if not better than "Low - Life" as the album title.Though slightly frustratingly it doesn't go on to say why "Low - Life" was the eventual title.There's a hell of a lot of pages devoted to bands like Section 25, Quando Quango, Stockholm Monsters and many more most of which i tended to zone in and out of.Section 25's Looking From A Hilltop was the only song of theirs i ever gave time to but Stockholm Monsters' Alma Mater LP got a lot of plays on my turntable back in 1985.I never got into A Certain Ratio though, they just never did much for me for some reason.

Fotzepolitic wrote: Low - Life was originally planned to be titled Love Vigilantes...

Fab fact time! Did you also know that 'Stop' was the first single by the Spice Girls not to get to Number One? It's moving and intriguing to consider that the song was called 'Stop' and did indeed 'stop' at Number Two, hence putting a 'stop' to the girls' run of number one hits. I remember when the Shadowplayers DVD came out. To be honest I couldn't be bothered as (a) the only bit of interest was JD / NO and there's very little left to be said, and (b) fuck it.

Caught the repeat of Discovering New Order today. Nowt new for any long time fan but i think the point of this series is introducing bands to people not so familiar with the music but may be starting to take an interest.The programme is basically a beginners guide to New Order and it does that fairly well i thought.

Fotzepolitic wrote: Amongst little nuggets i learnt or once knew but had long since forgotten was that Low - Life was originally planned to be titled Love Vigilantes which i think would have worked just as well if not better than "Low - Life" as the album title.Though slightly frustratingly it doesn't go on to say why "Low - Life" was the eventual title.

From the barely audible intro to This Time of Night ---

tarbox23 wrote:

Fotzepolitic wrote: Amongst little nuggets i learnt or once knew but had long since forgotten was that Low - Life was originally planned to be titled Love Vigilantes which i think would have worked just as well if not better than "Low - Life" as the album title.Though slightly frustratingly it doesn't go on to say why "Low - Life" was the eventual title.

From the barely audible intro to This Time of Night ---

Well, yeah, i know there's the bit with the guy talking about living a low life at the start of TTON but i guess you're right

Fotzepolitic wrote:

Michael Monkhouse wrote: 19.11 www.youtube.com/watch?v=d76-hf6rggw... No doubt they're drumming up (see what I did there?) interest for the new album. The year of Republic saw one radio and two TV documentaries, but no fascinating new insights. Album was shit, too. Unlike Graham Norton, I can't be arsed. As with the PCL documentary, there are only so many times you can hear the same story. One of my favourite accunts is Claude Flowers' book, which stops at '94 (obviously) but made a welcome change from Paul Lester's OTTness, Savage's yawnfests and Morley's pretentiousness. Time for an update, Claude?

I was watching the Brixton 87 'Academy' video just the other night, out of interest to see how it stood up these days as hadn't watched it for years.Never did work out what that obsession Barney had around that time with inspecting and flexing his right arm muscle while singing was all about.Looks like a nervous tic watching it now.

Year of Republic saw two TV docs? Obviously there was NewOrderStory....what was the other one? Also, hard to imagine now but Radio 1 had a "New Order Day" around the release of Republic.NO songs every half hour and competitions etc and Jackie Brambles trying to feign enthusiasm for the band.I 've never read this Claude Flowers book you mention, i think i was vaguely aware of it once but didn't bother. Like you say, there are only so many times you can hear the same story.

I actually won one of the Republic Radio 1 competitions that day, during Steve Wrights show. Question - 'Name of New Orders manager'...

mnsfld wrote:

I actually won one of the Republic Radio 1 competitions that day, during Steve Wrights show. Question - 'Name of New Orders manager'...

Fuck, that's a toughie. I once saw a Betty Boo (phwoar) comp and the question was something like: Which cartoon character has a name like Betty Boo? (a) Betty Boop, (b) Fred Flintstone, (c) Felix The Cat. You deserve a prize just for sitting through Steve Wright. '93 was all sizzle and no steak. It LOOKED really cool - interviews, docs, journos spouting shite like, 'Arguably the most important UK band since the Beatles or the Rolling Stones' (HUH?)... But in reality? A handful of expensive, predictable gigs, with only one on the UK mainland; a bland, late album, spawning endless mixes and only the occasional gem; a later, blander offshoot spawing one single with lines like, 'Someone I hate / She thinks she's great.' We fell for the hype but it was the beginning of the end, and when they disappeared again it was just having your cake and eating it.

Fotzepolitic wrote: Caught the repeat of Discovering New Order today. Nowt new for any long time fan but i think the point of this series is introducing bands to people not so familiar with the music but may be starting to take an interest.The programme is basically a beginners guide to New Order and it does that fairly well i thought.

It's probably more about hyping the new album. At this point I'd be surprised if there are many newbie fans who don't know the '''history'''.

Michael Monkhouse wrote:

Fotzepolitic wrote: Caught the repeat of Discovering New Order today. Nowt new for any long time fan but i think the point of this series is introducing bands to people not so familiar with the music but may be starting to take an interest.The programme is basically a beginners guide to New Order and it does that fairly well i thought.

It's probably more about hyping the new album. At this point I'd be surprised if there are many newbie fans who don't know the '''history'''.

Well i was thinking 15- 16 year old kids might be interested and wouldn't know the history but then again i can't imagine 15- 16 year old kids watching Sky Arts so yeah it probably is hyping. I fully expect more hype come September.I wouldn't be in the least surprised if BBC4 have a NO/JD/Factory Friday night around September.They're always desperate to fill their schedules.Trouble is it will be repeats of the same old story you've heard a million times.They'll probably repeat that BBC4 doc from 2007 'Factory Records: From New Order and Joy Division To The Happy Mondays' i think it was called and was narrated by John Simm.It wasn't actually a bad doc - i quite enjoyed it.BBC4 will probably throw in a live video on the night like the Glasgow DVD or something

Michael Monkhouse wrote:

mnsfld wrote:

I actually won one of the Republic Radio 1 competitions that day, during Steve Wrights show. Question - 'Name of New Orders manager'...

Fuck, that's a toughie. I once saw a Betty Boo (phwoar) comp and the question was something like: Which cartoon character has a name like Betty Boo? (a) Betty Boop, (b) Fred Flintstone, (c) Felix The Cat. You deserve a prize just for sitting through Steve Wright. '93 was all sizzle and no steak. It LOOKED really cool - interviews, docs, journos spouting shite like, 'Arguably the most important UK band since the Beatles or the Rolling Stones' (HUH?)... But in reality? A handful of expensive, predictable gigs, with only one on the UK mainland; a bland, late album, spawning endless mixes and only the occasional gem; a later, blander offshoot spawing one single with lines like, 'Someone I hate / She thinks she's great.' We fell for the hype but it was the beginning of the end, and when they disappeared again it was just having your cake and eating it.

Yeah i remember all that best band since The Beatles kind of stuff from journalists in 1993 when actually Republic was mostly naff.The journalists probably hadn't even listened to the album and were still basing NO's greatness on Technique from 4 years previously.

I remember the Radio 1 evening session had interviews over consecutive nights with New Order and previewing tracks from Republic a week or two before its release.Think it was Mark Goodier interviewing and you got Hooky on Monday night, Barney on Tuesday night, and Steve and Gillian on Wednesday night each unveiling tracks.My mood throughout the evenings as they went on sunk lower and lower as we were first exposed to headache inducers like World, Ruined In A Day and Chemical.

Here yer go. Discovering New Order.I stuck it on YouChoob.Not best quality as i did it in WMV instead of MPEG2 because MPEG2 takes a fricking eternity to merge two parts of video and ages to upload to YouTube

Thanks for the info F. After 10 years on and off these forums I've finally found someone who sees things like me (0.00 - 0.10 https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=z55mLS-qWnc). I missed the Radio One hype cos that was my uni days and there was nothing like the media access taken for granted today. If they were using dross like 'Chemical' as a fanfare, maybe it was all for the better. Incidentally I can't watch the doc as it's blocked out here, but presumably I haven't missed any essential insights.

Andy wrote: I doubt there will be any new revelations, especially as the synopsis begins with this phrase: "Rising from the ashes...":

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My second fave is '... Under the self-effacing title of The Other Two.'

Fotzepolitic wrote: Here yer go. Discovering New Order.I stuck it on YouChoob.Not best quality as i did it in WMV instead of MPEG2 because MPEG2 takes a fricking eternity to merge two parts of video and ages to upload to YouTube

Darn WMG, it's been blocked.

later -1

negative1 wrote:

Fotzepolitic wrote: Here yer go. Discovering New Order.I stuck it on YouChoob.Not best quality as i did it in WMV instead of MPEG2 because MPEG2 takes a fricking eternity to merge two parts of video and ages to upload to YouTube

Darn WMG, it's been blocked.

later -1

Though weirdly it seems to play if i'm signed in to YouTube.I'm signed in now so try again

Fotzepolitic wrote:

Michael Monkhouse wrote:

mnsfld wrote:

I actually won one of the Republic Radio 1 competitions that day, during Steve Wrights show. Question - 'Name of New Orders manager'...

Fuck, that's a toughie. I once saw a Betty Boo (phwoar) comp and the question was something like: Which cartoon character has a name like Betty Boo? (a) Betty Boop, (b) Fred Flintstone, (c) Felix The Cat. You deserve a prize just for sitting through Steve Wright. '93 was all sizzle and no steak. It LOOKED really cool - interviews, docs, journos spouting shite like, 'Arguably the most important UK band since the Beatles or the Rolling Stones' (HUH?)... But in reality? A handful of expensive, predictable gigs, with only one on the UK mainland; a bland, late album, spawning endless mixes and only the occasional gem; a later, blander offshoot spawing one single with lines like, 'Someone I hate / She thinks she's great.' We fell for the hype but it was the beginning of the end, and when they disappeared again it was just having your cake and eating it.

Yeah i remember all that best band since The Beatles kind of stuff from journalists in 1993 when actually Republic was mostly naff.The journalists probably hadn't even listened to the album and were still basing NO's greatness on Technique from 4 years previously.

I remember the Radio 1 evening session had interviews over consecutive nights with New Order and previewing tracks from Republic a week or two before its release.Think it was Mark Goodier interviewing and you got Hooky on Monday night, Barney on Tuesday night, and Steve and Gillian on Wednesday night each unveiling tracks.My mood throughout the evenings as they went on sunk lower and lower as we were first exposed to headache inducers like World, Ruined In A Day and Chemical.

Ruined in a day is pretty good, no? Republic had a few gems, a few stinkers....just like most albums. However, NO's stinkers are so bad I can only listen to them a couple of times. And then never again. I'm thinking here of track two on Lost Sirens, which I charitably tried to give another chance on my way home on Friday. It won't get a third.

Mecha-Rigsby wrote:

Fotzepolitic wrote:

Michael Monkhouse wrote:

mnsfld wrote:

I actually won one of the Republic Radio 1 competitions that day, during Steve Wrights show. Question - 'Name of New Orders manager'...

Fuck, that's a toughie. I once saw a Betty Boo (phwoar) comp and the question was something like: Which cartoon character has a name like Betty Boo? (a) Betty Boop, (b) Fred Flintstone, (c) Felix The Cat. You deserve a prize just for sitting through Steve Wright. '93 was all sizzle and no steak. It LOOKED really cool - interviews, docs, journos spouting shite like, 'Arguably the most important UK band since the Beatles or the Rolling Stones' (HUH?)... But in reality? A handful of expensive, predictable gigs, with only one on the UK mainland; a bland, late album, spawning endless mixes and only the occasional gem; a later, blander offshoot spawing one single with lines like, 'Someone I hate / She thinks she's great.' We fell for the hype but it was the beginning of the end, and when they disappeared again it was just having your cake and eating it.

Yeah i remember all that best band since The Beatles kind of stuff from journalists in 1993 when actually Republic was mostly naff.The journalists probably hadn't even listened to the album and were still basing NO's greatness on Technique from 4 years previously.

I remember the Radio 1 evening session had interviews over consecutive nights with New Order and previewing tracks from Republic a week or two before its release.Think it was Mark Goodier interviewing and you got Hooky on Monday night, Barney on Tuesday night, and Steve and Gillian on Wednesday night each unveiling tracks.My mood throughout the evenings as they went on sunk lower and lower as we were first exposed to headache inducers like World, Ruined In A Day and Chemical.

Ruined in a day is pretty good, no? Republic had a few gems, a few stinkers....just like most albums. However, NO's stinkers are so bad I can only listen to them a couple of times. And then never again. I'm thinking here of track two on Lost Sirens, which I charitably tried to give another chance on my way home on Friday. It won't get a third.

I remember hearing Ruined In A Day on the radio (maybe Radio 1?) one day at work in summer 1993 and thinking yeah this is good but probably only because everything else Radio1 played was so shit.Best track on Republic is Avalanche (ok maybe Regret).Avalanche is the only song to truly stir the emotions from that album IMHO (ok maybe Regret also, and possibly Special) .Somehow captured the sad fact the 80s glory days of New Order and Factory was over but at the same time held some hope ("Faith") for the future.

Fotzepolitic wrote:

negative1 wrote:

Fotzepolitic wrote: Here yer go. Discovering New Order.I stuck it on YouChoob.Not best quality as i did it in WMV instead of MPEG2 because MPEG2 takes a fricking eternity to merge two parts of video and ages to upload to YouTube

Darn WMG, it's been blocked.

later -1

Though weirdly it seems to play if i'm signed in to YouTube.I'm signed in now so try again

no luck still. maybe because you uploaded it, or are signed in.

later -1