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I remember reading on the 'Recycle' blog that there are differences between the 12" and LP versions of 'Fine Time', a fact that I was completely unaware of for 20 years or more.
I seem to think that, at the time of finding out, I checked the two versions and could hear some differences. However, now that I am listening to them again, I can't spot anything obvious.
Can anyone with younger / better ears point me to the bits of the mix that differ?
Ta.
perspexorange wrote:
Can anyone with younger / better ears point me to the bits of the mix that differ?
Nope, soz. But while we're asking questions on this track... What does the vocodor-y voice at around 2.41 sing? "Edit bossin' edit, fuckit", or something?
Slightly different sound/sample at 1:17-1:19 is the only difference. Always wondered if this was intentionally different to the LP version, or if an alternate mixdown was used by mistake on one or the other? I prefer the sample on the 12", FWIW.
This particular section is edited out of the seven inch version.
Debaser wrote: What does the vocodor-y voice at around 2.41 sing? "Edit bossin' edit, fuckit", or something?
According to Smash Hits (so it must be true), it's 'Acid man, acid man, acid man, acid box it man.' True Dylan.
perspexorange wrote: However, now that I am listening to them again, I can't spot anything obvious.
At the 1:17 mark on the 12", the sound is more of a guitar bend/slide. Higher pitch, sharper sound, a little disorienting. At the same mark on the LP version it's 3 guitar chords strummed, with a flanger effect on them.
Debaser wrote: Nope, soz. But while we're asking questions on this track... What does the vocodor-y voice at around 2.41 sing? "Edit bossin' edit, fuckit", or something?
"The past doesn't matter."
Michael Monkhouse wrote:
Debaser wrote: What does the vocodor-y voice at around 2.41 sing? "Edit bossin' edit, fuckit", or something?
According to Smash Hits (so it must be true), it's 'Acid man, acid man, acid man, acid box it man.' True Dylan.
i'm sure they said "acid box it man...acid box it man....acid box it man"
Many thanks for the responses everyone. I knew someone would know.
As for that sample, I really can't make it out. Even with the Smash Hits lyrics posted above, my ears can't pick it out.
I learned something else new about the song today though. According to this page http://www.neworderonline.com/music/Song.aspx?SongID=25 , the track's name came from this:
Steve Morris: "We finished the record off in Bath, and the reason why it's called Fine Time was because my car had been towed away and I had to remind myself to go and pay the fine. I just wrote "Fine Time" on this piece of paper to remind myself to go get it and thought, that's a good title."
I'd never heard that story. I guess it beats 'The Happy One', 'Mr Disco' and 'MTO (Mid Tempo One)' (those being working titles to differentiate tracks, which were never replaced with better names).
Music Complete wrote:
Debaser wrote: Nope, soz. But while we're asking questions on this track... What does the vocodor-y voice at around 2.41 sing? "Edit bossin' edit, fuckit", or something?
"The past doesn't matter."
I think you're right. Nice. Another thing I've learnt today.
I read somewhere it was just 'Ecstacy man' repeated, which you can also kind of hear. I think Bernard whispers 'Ecstacy' along with it on the 'Retro' live version.
perspexorange wrote: Many thanks for the responses everyone. I knew someone would know.
As for that sample, I really can't make it out. Even with the Smash Hits lyrics posted above, my ears can't pick it out.
I learned something else new about the song today though. According to this page http://www.neworderonline.com/music/Song.aspx?SongID=25 , the track's name came from this:
Steve Morris: "We finished the record off in Bath, and the reason why it's called Fine Time was because my car had been towed away and I had to remind myself to go and pay the fine. I just wrote "Fine Time" on this piece of paper to remind myself to go get it and thought, that's a good title."
I'd never heard that story. I guess it beats 'The Happy One', 'Mr Disco' and 'MTO (Mid Tempo One)' (those being working titles to differentiate tracks, which were never replaced with better names).
MTO had a working title of 'MT One', and this was probably more to do with the Roland MT-32 that was used throughout Technique.
Mr Disco was 'Disco One', you'll be surprised to learn.
perspexorange wrote: my car had been towed away and I had to remind myself to go and pay the fine. I just wrote "Fine Time" on this piece of paper
Knew this.
Music Complete wrote: At the 1:17 mark on the 12", the sound is more of a guitar bend/slide. Higher pitch, sharper sound, a little disorienting. At the same mark on the LP version it's 3 guitar chords strummed, with a flanger effect on them.
Didn't know this, but totally hear it now, thanks. I think I prefer the album verison. Fine Time isn't a "Rock" track but that bit on the 12" sounds more "Rock" than the album version. Incidentally I just had a listen to the Steve Silk Hurley and Messed Around mixes. They're rubbish! Haven't aged well at all. Fun Fact: Around 2012 the Chemical Brothers used to play their own re-edit of Fine Time in their DJ sets. It was quite good.
Music Complete wrote: "The past doesn't matter."
I should have checked the lyrics websites; they all have "the past doesn't matter" (mind you, they do tend to crib off each other). I think I'm I'm going with this; I will sleep easier at night now!
Debaser wrote: Fun Fact: Around 2012 the Chemical Brothers used to play their own re-edit of Fine Time in their DJ sets. It was quite good.!
I know Steve hates this song, and it would probably be a real pain to re-sequence, but I've always loved it and wish it would make a return to the live set.
I remember feeling disappointed when I first heard the track. I have no idea why as, a few listens later, I thought it was bloody brilliant. I still do.
Although it probably wouldn’t (quite) make my personal top ten, I think I’d rate it as one of the band’s most important tracks.
perspexorange wrote: I remember feeling disappointed when I first heard the track. I have no idea why as, a few listens later, I thought it was bloody brilliant. I still do.
Although it probably wouldn’t (quite) make my personal top ten, I think I’d rate it as one of the band’s most important tracks.
Yeah i remember too being massively disappointed when i first heard it, i thought it was utter crap.Mind you it was the 7" version i heard first on Radio 1.When i got my hands on the 12" i liked the track a lot more.It was great live back in the day.
I always had a soft spot for Fine Time. (I also have a soft spot for the Spice Girls, but that's old age.) It might be Technique's weakest single (even track) but it was a perfect intro to the new Balearic sound, especially after the Pointless Waste Of Time that was BM 88. The video was suitably mental and with typical modesty, Wilson considered the TOTP appearance the UK's intro to acid... Wendy James said it was 'very acid house'. She's so astute, I see how she got into the biz. News of a Spice Girls reunion just leaked. So did I when I saw the picture.
I never really liked this track, but thought Don't Do It was a nice B side.
It never stopped me buying the 7", 12" and remixes (which I think are better).
The thing that did impress me about the 12" was the weight of the vinyl. I don't know if I got a mutant pressing but it was about twice the depth of a regular record.
I always thought it was weird, especially considering how short the content was. Typical Factory.
Blue 5 wrote: I never really liked this track, but thought Don't Do It was a nice B side.
It never stopped me buying the 7", 12" and remixes (which I think are better).
The thing that did impress me about the 12" was the weight of the vinyl. I don't know if I got a mutant pressing but it was about twice the depth of a regular record.
I always thought it was weird, especially considering how short the content was. Typical Factory.
I have just checked mine with the silver inner sleeve. Same as yours and again the run off groove on the A side is bloody huge. More than a Fine LINE. It took me till i saw them at G.Mex to start liking the track.
I never understood why FT didn't get more love. Certainly when they played it live - even in 1998 - it was an utter monster of a track.
I always enjoyed the Steve Hurley mix as it felt like he was trying to make a 'extended' 12" mix like the previous N.O. 12" A-sides.
I spliced together a long version taking as many of the unique elements from the various 12"s, LP, and 7" here : https://www.mixcloud.com/mrmarkreed/new-order-full-time-fine-time-re-edit/ and became very familiar with the original mixes.
It's a fascinating construction that feels like its several songs all at once.
To me, fine time, was a weird experiment that failed for new order.
There was nothing 'new orderey' about it, and in fact, it seemed more like a joke when it was released.
I'm surprised it got as far as it did when it came out.
Definitely not worthy of being a single.
later -1
I get fairly tired of the constant negativity sometimes. In no way was FT a failed experiment. The band were young, loaded with tech and were involved in one of the most influential nightclubs in the world. If you think the band weren't going to get ripped to the tits on drink and drugs and then try to write songs that sounded like their hazy memory of a batshit crazy Saturday night out at the peak of their hedonism that's quite innocent. Also, they were recording and writing in that well known monastery of chaste prudence : Ibiza
Also, NO never did what they were told or what anyone else expected at that point. I never knew with any NO song whether it was going to be a 10 minute disco epic or a three minute bleeding heart guitar track. If they'd released Round & Round as the first single from Technique, no doubt someone would say it was just a lame rip off of TBTHOG and the band had run out of ideas. If they'd spent their career trying to live down to other peoples demands and produce an identikit run of songs that sounded like the old ones, they could have had a fate worse than Simple Fucking Minds.
Fine Time was always a great end to a sweaty night out when they played it, and the record sounds great to me now, and that's probably the best you can hope for from a song unless Bob Dylan wrote it.
Fine Time is an odd one and a divisive one and always has been.
When it first came out in 88, I really loved it but the girl in my 6th form class who had introduced me to much of Neworder, absolutely hated it because "it's not Neworder to me." She had an import 12" single which she kept wrapped to protect it's value (and because she hated the song.)
I bought the 12" as soon as it came out and really got into the Messed Around mix and the Silk mix. When Technique came out, I was, for a very short time, a little disappointed that FT was not more representative of the sound of the whole album (!)
Over the years, I kinda went off FT and saw it as a bit of an incongruous & skippable opener the my all time favourite album before recently growing to appreciate it (and Fine Line) once again.
I've never had a problem with it being a single though. It was of its time and the TOTP appearance was a good laugh. Also, the FT single gave us the utterly majestic Don't Do It, so I can't and won't complain.
markreed wrote: I get fairly tired of the constant negativity sometimes. In no way was FT a failed experiment. The band were young, loaded with tech and were involved in one of the most influential nightclubs in the world. If you think the band weren't going to get ripped to the tits on drink and drugs and then try to write songs that sounded like their hazy memory of a batshit crazy Saturday night out at the peak of their hedonism that's quite innocent. Also, they were recording and writing in that well known monastery of chaste prudence : Ibiza
Also, NO never did what they were told or what anyone else expected at that point. I never knew with any NO song whether it was going to be a 10 minute disco epic or a three minute bleeding heart guitar track. If they'd released Round & Round as the first single from Technique, no doubt someone would say it was just a lame rip off of TBTHOG and the band had run out of ideas. If they'd spent their career trying to live down to other peoples demands and produce an identikit run of songs that sounded like the old ones, they could have had a fate worse than Simple Fucking Minds.
Fine Time was always a great end to a sweaty night out when they played it, and the record sounds great to me now, and that's probably the best you can hope for from a song unless Bob Dylan wrote it.
Here here! Fine Time is not only a song I still love, but at the time it was right in line with what I thought was so cool about NO - they just did things how they wanted. It was completely unexpected to me when I heard it and I still love them for that. I probably listen to Technique start to finish at east once a week
I feel like I need to chime in here and add that I always loved Fine Time; like good Acid House it sounds irreverent and somewhat insane. And yes, I think the different guitar sound at 1'17" is the only difference between the LP and 12" versions (discovered that by accident one day and was quite surprised).
