New Interview with Gillian and Stephen

IrishExaminer.com

Thanks for this, Andy.

Short but sweet.

This bit interested me particularly:

“Technique is rather unfairly treated by us," admits Morris, “It’s the anti-Movement record because we had such a good time making it. ‘Vanishing Point’ works great live but Bernard doesn’t want to play certain songs. The fans would love it and I would love to.”

Gilbert hints at other differences of opinion with main man Mr Sumner: “I love ‘Technique’, Bernard thinks it’s unfinished.”

Unfinished?! Bah! The album is perfection and Mr Sumner needs to be reminded of this.

They need to play more tracks from it live.

(I wonder if the real reason Bernard doesn't like it is more down to it bringing back some memories of what he was going through at the time. A lot of the lyrics hint at this, and it's no secret that he was in the middle of some personal turmoil at the time).

perspexorange wrote: Thanks for this, Andy.

Short but sweet.

This bit interested me particularly:

“Technique is rather unfairly treated by us," admits Morris, “It’s the anti-Movement record because we had such a good time making it. ‘Vanishing Point’ works great live but Bernard doesn’t want to play certain songs. The fans would love it and I would love to.”

Gilbert hints at other differences of opinion with main man Mr Sumner: “I love ‘Technique’, Bernard thinks it’s unfinished.”

Unfinished?! Bah! The album is perfection and Mr Sumner needs to be reminded of this.

They need to play more tracks from it live.

(I wonder if the real reason Bernard doesn't like it is more down to it bringing back some memories of what he was going through at the time. A lot of the lyrics hint at this, and it's no secret that he was in the middle of some personal turmoil at the time).

I agree. He either isn't comfortable admitting it, or perhaps even subconciously has a distaste for how candid he was with some of its lyrics.

In an unprecedented move, he actually wrote two sets of lyrics for "Vanishing Point". The "unfinished" excuse doesn't hold water.

I agree. He either isn't comfortable admitting it, or perhaps even subconciously has a distaste for how candid he was with some of its lyrics.

In an unprecedented move, he actually wrote two sets of lyrics for "Vanishing Point". The "unfinished" excuse doesn't hold water.

Do you think so? I think enough time / water has passed under the bridge for that to be a non-issue. But only Sumner will know for sure. My hunch is they have never had enough technical ability to pull off a number of the songs to the a standard where they would sound any good.

I heard Dream Attack in Miami for example, and they completely butchered the outro. Just one example.

Bernard has said in the past, maybe a couple of times, that Run just never worked very well live, they gave up on playing it.

Fotz wrote: Bernard has said in the past, maybe a couple of times, that Run just never worked very well live, they gave up on playing it.

Guilty Partner also went disastrously wrong the first (and penultimate) time they tried it (Manchester 29/12/98). They ended up having to restart it.

Still, Technique is perfect and I won't have anything bad said about it.

"Technical ability"? It's New Order. There isn't a single song in their repertoire that hasn't been butchered at least once.

Every song on Technique has been performed live in the past. At the legendary 1989 'SECCstasy' gig in Glasgow, they played everything apart from "Guilty Partner". Most gigs in 1989 featured 5-7 Technique tracks. The shorter gigs on the dire 1993 tour tended to feature only 2-3, but that was perfectly acceptable when promoting a newer LP. At the four gigs in 1998,"Fine Time" and "Guilty Partner" were played twice and "Run" once.

It's their return from 2001 onwards that really sticks out. A ton of songs returned to the set (including a few too many Joy Division ones for my taste) yet NOT A SINGLE Technique track made the cut thoughout their 2001, 2002, 2005, 2006 or 2011 tours. That's a long time (and a lot of gigs) to pretend a fan favourite album doesn't exist. Could it really just be that it's too hard to play?

Finally, in 2012, "Round & Round" snuck back into the set (but not at every gig). I believe "Dream Attack", "Fine Time" and "Vanishing Point" are the only others to have been aired since and Technique-less gigs are still a common occurrance.

perspexorange wrote:

Fotz wrote: Bernard has said in the past, maybe a couple of times, that Run just never worked very well live, they gave up on playing it.

Guilty Partner also went disastrously wrong the first (and penultimate) time they tried it (Manchester 29/12/98). They ended up having to restart it.

Yes, i was at that gig.

Fotz wrote:

perspexorange wrote:

Fotz wrote: Bernard has said in the past, maybe a couple of times, that Run just never worked very well live, they gave up on playing it.

Guilty Partner also went disastrously wrong the first (and penultimate) time they tried it (Manchester 29/12/98). They ended up having to restart it.

Yes, i was at that gig.

I missed it, but caught the Ally Pally gig two days later.

Those '98 gigs were generally great. I know this seems weird now but, when they first started playing JD numbers regularly in those run of gigs, it felt so damn special. Now, as Andy said above, they play too many of them (at least for my liking) and I don't think Bernard's voice really suits the JD stuff.

Saying that, certain JD songs sound pretty good, IMO. Isolation, Decades, Heart & Soul especially. Wish they'd swap out LWTUA, Atmosphere & Transmission for these tracks more often. It'd be pretty decent to hear something like Warsaw too, or one of the other 'punk' numbers.

Yes, agreed, Bernard's voice doesn't suit the JD stuff let's be honest.

A shame really because musically they do and have done the songs really well live.

I was at Reading 98 and it was utterly brilliant, one of the best nights i ever had at a NO gig.

I was unaware of the Manc Apollo July 98 gig til after the event! Only found out about it when i stumbled across the NME review a week or two later.

Didn't make it to the Alexandra Palace gig NYE 98.

The only one of the '98 gigs I missed was Manchester. I caught all the others, including their one-track appearance at Albert Square for the Commonwealth hand-over ceremony. Not sure why I passed on Manchester 29/12/98. Probably lack of cash and it being a very close date to the Ally Pally gig. Makes me wonder if the London gig's tickets went on sale before the Manchester ones, as it's odd that I would chose London (a pain to get to for me) over Manchester (easy-peasy for me). Unless I just thought it might be nice to spend New Year in London.

The Apollo gig was my favourite of the bunch, probably due to hearing rare-outings of songs (inc. Paradise, Touched, Confusion and the JD tracks) for the first time. Obviously, there were diminishing returns each time they played these tracks at the remaining '98 gigs, but they still sounded great. The best bit of the Apollo gig for me was hearing In A Lonely Place as the last track. Sounded brilliant. And to be playing that at a venue that JD had graced the stage of as well. I walked away from the gig that night in complete awe.

Found it a little frustrating that only a few seconds of IALP from Manc Apollo July 98 was on an extras section of , i think, the 5 11 DVD. Have i remembered that correctly or was it the 3 16 disc? Anyway it sounded really good.

Can't remember why i was unaware of that Apollo gig. It was before i had any internet connection yes but i still bought the music papers most weeks in those days. Oh well.

Don't know i chose the MEN Arena Dec 98 gig instead of Alexandra Palace NYE, guess i just fancied Manchester rather than London and couldn't do both, financially and/ or otherwise.

Fotz wrote: Found it a little frustrating that only a few seconds of IALP from Manc Apollo July 98 was on an extras section of , i think, the 5 11 DVD. Have i remembered that correctly or was it the 3 16 disc? Anyway it sounded really good.

It's on 5 11, I believe.

Fotz wrote:

Can't remember why i was unaware of that Apollo gig. It was before i had any internet connection yes but i still bought the music papers most weeks in those days. Oh well.

Yeah, it was definitely pre-internet (at least for me and most of the country, I think).

I don't think it was advertised much. It seemed to be more 'word of mouth'. I remember that me and David Smith (from Paradise fanzine) found out about it too late to get tickets through legitimate means. We ended up getting tickets through a tout that we were put in contact with. Cost us £50 a ticket, which seemed scandalous then.

I think DigiMike missed it too, due to not knowing about it, and he's really well connected. So if he and Paradise fanzine weren't aware of it, I reckon it must have been pretty 'under the radar'.

Anybody else manage to get a ticket for the Apollo gig? If so, did you manage to buy them through legitimate means (Virgin Records Manchester, on the door at the Apollo etc.)?

perspexorange wrote:

Fotz wrote:

perspexorange wrote:

Fotz wrote: Bernard has said in the past, maybe a couple of times, that Run just never worked very well live, they gave up on playing it.

Guilty Partner also went disastrously wrong the first (and penultimate) time they tried it (Manchester 29/12/98). They ended up having to restart it.

Yes, i was at that gig.

I missed it, but caught the Ally Pally gig two days later.

Those '98 gigs were generally great. I know this seems weird now but, when they first started playing JD numbers regularly in those run of gigs, it felt so damn special. Now, as Andy said above, they play too many of them (at least for my liking) and I don't think Bernard's voice really suits the JD stuff.

Saying that, certain JD songs sound pretty good, IMO. Isolation, Decades, Heart & Soul especially. Wish they'd swap out LWTUA, Atmosphere & Transmission for these tracks more often. It'd be pretty decent to hear something like Warsaw too, or one of the other 'punk' numbers.

"Isolation" is the most obvious one that works well. I'm actually surprised how faithful to the original version they kept it. It was exciting to hear the first couple of times but, as usual, they ended up overplaying it (along with the souped-up "586" from those tours). I agree about "Heart and Soul" and "Decades" (it was a bit of a surprise when they played it after "Temptation" to end the main set at the 2nd Hollywood Unity Tour gig). "Disorder" is great also. .

perspexorange wrote:

Fotz wrote: Found it a little frustrating that only a few seconds of IALP from Manc Apollo July 98 was on an extras section of , i think, the 5 11 DVD. Have i remembered that correctly or was it the 3 16 disc? Anyway it sounded really good.

It's on 5 11, I believe.

Fotz wrote:

Can't remember why i was unaware of that Apollo gig. It was before i had any internet connection yes but i still bought the music papers most weeks in those days. Oh well.

Yeah, it was definitely pre-internet (at least for me and most of the country, I think).

I don't think it was advertised much. It seemed to be more 'word of mouth'. I remember that me and David Smith (from Paradise fanzine) found out about it too late to get tickets through legitimate means. We ended up getting tickets through a tout that we were put in contact with. Cost us £50 a ticket, which seemed scandalous then.

I think DigiMike missed it too, due to not knowing about it, and he's really well connected. So if he and Paradise fanzine weren't aware of it, I reckon it must have been pretty 'under the radar'.

Anybody else manage to get a ticket for the Apollo gig? If so, did you manage to buy them through legitimate means (Virgin Records Manchester, on the door at the Apollo etc.)?

I guess it was arranged as a warm up for their Phoenix Festival headline slot the following weekend.Of course, by the time the Manchester Apollo gig had been finalised and confirmed, Phoenix Festival had been cancelled and never happened again.I did go to a couple of the Phoenix Festivals, in 1995 ,and 1996 i think.Not a great festival but it wasn't far from me, 30 miles or so, at Long Marston Airfield near Stratford Upon Avon.

So we all ended being allowed to use our Phoenix Festival tickets for the Sunday at Reading 98.To this day some people still think New Order were the headliners on that Sunday night when in fact Garbage were.Think we wandered off a couple of songs into Garbage's set.I just couldn;t be bothered with them after the euphoria of NO's set. Thing is, i was quite a fan of Garbage and Shirley Manson around that ear but i just didn't want to watch them.

I got a ticket for Phoenix too but when that folded I couldn't be arsed going to Reading. Strange times as I also had tickets for The Verve near my hometown and failed to go there aswell. My drinking at that time was probably connected. Times change!

Ah, yes. The Phoenix debacle. Yeah - I had a ticket for that, but used it for Reading.

I did stop to watch Garbage as I quite liked them, although I felt the second LP (which was what they were promoting at the time, I think) was a bit of a let-down after the first one.

My abiding memory of their set was Shirley Manson apologising, at least twice, that they didn't really have any numbers that could better New Order. She wasn't wrong, but I did think that was quite nice (but not very rock 'n' roll) of her to show such humility.

perspexorange wrote:

Fotz wrote: Found it a little frustrating that only a few seconds of IALP from Manc Apollo July 98 was on an extras section of , i think, the 5 11 DVD. Have i remembered that correctly or was it the 3 16 disc? Anyway it sounded really good.

It's on 5 11, I believe.

Fotz wrote:

Can't remember why i was unaware of that Apollo gig. It was before i had any internet connection yes but i still bought the music papers most weeks in those days. Oh well.

Yeah, it was definitely pre-internet (at least for me and most of the country, I think).

Anybody else manage to get a ticket for the Apollo gig? If so, did you manage to buy them through legitimate means (Virgin Records Manchester, on the door at the Apollo etc.)?

Bizarrely it was advertised locally in Blackpool in our local paper as our local Concert Travel firm Millenium Events had tickets and a coach travelling to the gig. An absolute no brainer. God knows how they got so many tickets. Best gig atmosphere of any NO gig I've experienced. Oh and Doves supporting.

perspexorange wrote: Ah, yes. The Phoenix debacle. Yeah - I had a ticket for that, but used it for Reading.

I did stop to watch Garbage as I quite liked them, although I felt the second LP (which was what they were promoting at the time, I think) was a bit of a let-down after the first one.

My abiding memory of their set was Shirley Manson apologising, at least twice, that they didn't really have any numbers that could better New Order. She wasn't wrong, but I did think that was quite nice (but not very rock 'n' roll) of her to show such humility.

https://www.facebook.com/GarbageOfficial/posts/pfbid02qJ2BhsuqeJLc2RJkGPmVH5i7wf38uWispAFJCgNQXxfJkr2aV9m3VNgdcEgPxsCul

The Ruts wrote:

perspexorange wrote: Ah, yes. The Phoenix debacle. Yeah - I had a ticket for that, but used it for Reading.

I did stop to watch Garbage as I quite liked them, although I felt the second LP (which was what they were promoting at the time, I think) was a bit of a let-down after the first one.

My abiding memory of their set was Shirley Manson apologising, at least twice, that they didn't really have any numbers that could better New Order. She wasn't wrong, but I did think that was quite nice (but not very rock 'n' roll) of her to show such humility.

https://www.facebook.com/GarbageOfficial/posts/pfbid02qJ2BhsuqeJLc2RJkGPmVH5i7wf38uWispAFJCgNQXxfJkr2aV9m3VNgdcEgPxsCul

Like everyone else here I was also at the gig. Only remember getting a curry and then watching Monaco, New Order and the 1st few Garbage tracks before catching the train back (along with 1/2 the festival it seemed). Rest of the lineup must have been instantly forgettable.