Stephen, Barney, Hooky.....SELLOUTS???

i guess no one here goes to Hot Topic (dont know if you guys have it overseas), so I guess I'll bring it up. i do not shop at hot topic, but have a very good friend who up until about a yr ago did. now we just go back to poke fun at whats supposed to be trendy and "in". anyways, about a month ago went in and OMFG.....they have an Unknown Pleasures t-shirt on the wall.... Now, call me selfish, but the last thing I want is a bunch of trend-following teenagers who will never appreciate JD in the first place walking around with a UP t-shirt on and asking each other "Why did they rip off Dead Souls from NIN?" I have long disliked Hot Topic for taking some of my favorite bands and trying to make them fashionable or more appealing to the public by selling them as the next big thing. Now what I want to know is, who let Hot Topic sell this shirt, and does NO have any say in this? Do they even care? I would seriously doubt this was a decision they made, probably a record co./merchandising entity. Any thoughts? anyone as disgusted as I am?? btw the shirt isnt even very authentic, it only has the radio waves on front and in very small print on the back has JD's name and "Unknown Pleasures", quite different from a UP shirt I already have that matches the UP poster.

Hot Topic, refuge of the damned (not the Damned, mind you :D)

There's one in the mall in Greenville, I've been twice and am always amused by the lack of anything worthy of my time, bar a few Smiths singles on CD (What the hell is Morrissey doing in a Goth shop? Bizarre). Actually, back when I was just getting into JD I went there hoping to find just such a shirt as the Unknown Pleasures one, but I had no luck.

I'm always amused by "individualistic Goths" who just do the same thing as their depressed forefathers (dressing in black and listening to Marilyn Manson, whereas if they were older it would be The Cure) and are totally clueless about other musicians. I bet none of the workers there even know who Ian Curtis is... Posuers like that are a dime a dozen. I don't know, I've just never had sympathy for anyone who says "I want to be unconformist" than proceeds to join a group which promotes a sort of conformity. Maybe it's just me, but if you really want to be different and shock people, don't do it with multiple piercings and wierd colored hair. Do something different for God's sakes.

Anyway, it's been a couple of days since I had a nice rambling post that made no sense so I'm good now.

Originally posted by Taboo # 7 Hot Topic, refuge of the damned (not the Damned, mind you :D)I've just never had sympathy for anyone who says "I want to be unconformist" than proceeds to join a group which promotes a sort of conformity. Maybe it's just me, but if you really want to be different and shock people, don't do it with multiple piercings and wierd colored hair. Do something different for God's sakes.

'you mean I can be a non-conformist AND buy all my shit at the mall*!&^*&!?'

thats the prevailing attitude of the kids who shop at hot topic. however, i have been looking for that unknown pleasures tshirt since i failed to pick it up at off the record in san diego, so im not the best authority on hot topic =)

Originally posted by bill stevens > Originally posted by Taboo # 7> Hot Topic, refuge of the damned (not the Damned, mind you :D)> > I've just never had sympathy for anyone who says "I want to be unconformist" than proceeds to join a group which promotes a sort of conformity. Maybe it's just me, but if you really want to be different and shock people, don't do it with multiple piercings and wierd colored hair. Do something different for God's sakes.>

'you mean I can be a non-conformist AND buy all my shit at the mall*!&^*&!?'

thats the prevailing attitude of the kids who shop at hot topic. however, i have been looking for that unknown pleasures tshirt since i failed to pick it up at off the record in san diego, so im not the best authority on hot topic =)

Well, I must confess. In reality, I look just like Fred Durst, so maybe I shouldn't deride conformity so much :D

I've seen the shirt online, I imagine that would be better than going to a store, picking the shirt out, and having the clerk respond with "What, don't you like the Marilyn Manson shirts? What's wrong with you?" or "Joy Division? Are they anything like Insane Clown Posse?"

Originally posted by Taboo # 7 I'm always amused by "individualistic Goths" who just do the same thing as their depressed forefathers (dressing in black and listening to Marilyn Manson, whereas if they were older it would be The Cure) and are totally clueless about other musicians. I bet none of the workers there even know who Ian Curtis is... Posuers like that are a dime a dozen.

thats exactly what i asked all the little punk and goth employees there......they have no clue who JD is, and if i had it my way they never would. they say they just get what HQ sends them....somehow I find it hard to beleive that even the eggheads at Hot Topic Inc know who JD are. They probably just ordered it cuz they thought it looked cool...

So the Hot Topic around here isn't the only one with poseur and wannabe punks/goths??

Oh well, even though I hate that store, an Unknown Pleasures shirt is worth getting...

well i can see why you guys would want one. theres actually about a half dozen REAL authentic shirts at a local cd store down the street from here. but the ones at hot topic are not real, or at least they dont look it. if you can, order an authentic one from online or something. they are rare though. aside from me and my friend, i have only seen two other people wearing one, one here and one at numbers in houston. (if you ever go to houston, i HIGHLY suggest going to numbers. fuckin great club!!)

Heres one you should all love! Saw a kid at the mall wearing what I THOUGHT was a "still" shirt, grey shirt with the old english S that looks like an F in a circle, in white. Turns out it has nothing to do with Joy division at all. Some skateboard company is using it, as they make most of their stuff look like " famous" or at least well known logos. When will the madness stop?

The madness will stop when suggs is too old to do his boxing style dancing on stage.

Originally posted by Mr. Streak > Originally posted by Taboo # 7> > I'm always amused by "individualistic Goths" who just do the same thing as their depressed forefathers (dressing in black and listening to Marilyn Manson, whereas if they were older it would be The Cure) and are totally clueless about other musicians. I bet none of the workers there even know who Ian Curtis is... Posuers like that are a dime a dozen. > > ">

thats exactly what i asked all the little punk and goth employees there......they have no clue who JD is, and if i had it my way they never would. they say they just get what HQ sends them....somehow I find it hard to beleive that even the eggheads at Hot Topic Inc know who JD are. They probably just ordered it cuz they thought it looked cool...

Or check this out...was asking a kid (employee) a local Tower where the copy of International was that they said over the phone was in the store but was no where to be found.

After asking who the artist was...he said.."I don't know too much about New Order but weren't the related to that band Joy Division with the Curtis guy"... No Sh**t! I almost fell over...he goes on to say that "Joy Division is pretty cool...some of my friends are really into them"

I'm kinda glad that some kids from the next generation aren't all into "gansta rap" "Kid Rock" etc...but actually JD's music is living on...

I don't care how kids hear about the music, personally I bought my 1st TPK at a Werehouse Record Shop in 1985 in a strip mall here in California...and I became a real fan. I welcome any and all fans and am not worrying about wether they are "posing" or not...I think we all did a bit of that when we were young...for f*ck sake I was listening to Sammy Hagar and Loverboy when I was 13-14...Yikes....

I came across a blue True Faith shirt at a Hot Topic store a few months back. I was pretty damned shocked. What bugged me the most was that they had the shirt displayed on a wall, but they had the back side showing, which says New Order, instead of the front side that has the yellow leaf. When you think about it, every New Order fan knows what the artwork for True Faith is. Unless you're new to the band, but at the rate why would you buy a shirt by them? I've never met a casual New Order fan. They all seem to be on the same level of obsession. I even saw a Get Ready shirt that had a big hand made sticker on it saying "New Order", as if we are clueless as to what it is.

So are New Order and Joy Division becoming cool? Who knows. With the whole 80's new wave and punk style becoming popular again, I hope it just all goes away. I feel somewhat lame wearing blue jeans, a Sears button up over shirt, and a Joy Division t-shirt. Then at the same time running into some guy wearing knee high Kiss boots, black eyeliner, leather pants, then a Joy Division shirt with the sleeves cut off to show all his shitty tatoos. I see it alot, and it's bothersome.

The worst is this... I was shopping in Hollywood at some clothing store, and they were playing a handfull of forgetable 80's songs. Then out of no where, Transmission came on. At first I was like, "oh shit, they are playing Joy Division!"... but then they followed it up with the B-52's Love Shack.

I doubt that the members of New Order are "selling out", they just do what they do. It's this culture that's trying to sell them out, as well as the whole post-punk scene in general.

NewOrder are widely acknowledged as mainstream in the UK now and require little 'hard sell' to raise their profile as they are frequently critically acclaimed as one of the best bands England has ever produced.

I dont think you can ever hope to emulate that homegrown loyalty and affinity that people over here have for the band, anywhere else on earth to be quite honest.

But of course im sure the same goes for many bands out in the States.

Home is where the heart is ;)

Who gives a crap if some newby JD experimentalist wants a JD shirt? Most of us did not own JD shirts when they existed... am I right? Therefore, we all jumped on the bandwagon, some of us just did it earlier than others... let's move on to something a little less lame to discuss.

Originally posted by DoN NewOrder are widely acknowledged as mainstream in the UK now and require little 'hard sell' to raise their profile as they are frequently critically acclaimed as one of the best bands England has ever produced.I dont think you can ever hope to emulate that homegrown loyalty and affinity that people over here have for the band, anywhere else on earth to be quite honest.But of course im sure the same goes for many bands out in the States.Home is where the heart is ;)

I agree. I doubt there will ever be a NO fan that started listening to them with Get Ready who will ever love them to the degree that many of us do who started in the early 80's.

Originally posted by Wolfmann

I would not say that, I started listening to em in 1997, the got me into music in general. I first heard BLT and Blue Monday which changed everything.

But you always have the perception with any band that you love that people who fall in love with them after you do isn't as true a fan as you.

I love em as much as anyone on the forum here.

Cheers ALEX

Originally posted by Alex Jacks > Originally posted by Wolfmannditto to that!i'm a big new order fan and i get a little offended by the idea i'm less of a new order fan cuz í wasn't listening to them in 1985 or something. and i know lots of casual new order fans...most of them are my high school teachers.. i understand the t-shirt thing, that's why i don't wear t-shirts of bands i don't really know or like. thus, i only have one rock t-shirt...a le tigre one i got at a concert.hey, if since you guys are all so passionate about legit t-shirts...how do you feel about home-made ones done by fans? is that legit or do we have to wait for NO management to sell us one to be real deal?

stephen, barney, hooky; sellouts? FUCK OFF