Is Barney Catholic or Anglican???

Question is in the subject.... Just wondering after hearing Run Wild a couple of times; it does seem that Barney is somewhat religious...That would be cool if he was Catholic, being Catholic myself..but Anglican is fine as well.

I fail to see how this is relevant, faith is something you can have without the need for a label. Barney is a Human Being and as such is capable of the same emotions as any other Human Being, religious or not!!

And what about those who are not Catholic or Anglican?? Are they 'not cool' in your book??

Organized religion tends to corrupt very easily, so I try and steer clear of it. I accept the concept of one god, I think odds are Jesus had it right, but just because I believe that doesn't mean I should go around trying to make people believe like I do (especially with my loose morals and all)...

I think Barney and the rest are similar. They didn't seem shocked by Ian cutting into a bible, so apparently they're not zealots (unlike U2, but they use religion to declare themselves Heaven's house band or something equally pompous)

Given that the question is fairly pointless anyway (sorry), I was under the impression that the mighty 'Run Wild', being about Steven and Gillian's kid, would have been written by S & G also (at least partly). This doesn't mean we should draw their religious beliefs into question, but it's probably safe to say they're not Greek Orthodox (not that there's anything wrong with that) Thoughts? CTD

Religion is just another way of differentiating between people and that can only be complete horseshit! People are people are people. We're all basically the same. Same needs, same desires, same fate. I don't care what anybody's beliefs are as long as they're not telling me i'm wrong and they're right and as long as they're not shoving it down my throat. All I know is, New Order make great music, and that's enough for me!

I really didn't mean to create a furor with my original post.... Although, I am a little peeved with all the remarks about organized religion. I am Catholic, and proud of that fact and was wondering if Barney was as well.. I would not be unhappy to find out if Barney was anything else... I wouldn't care if he was a Branch Davidian!!!

After everything that has happened lately in the U.S. I think most of us need a little religion in our lives.

Rob

There's nothing wrong with organized religion so long as it's not used as an excuse for violence or other distasteful acts (see September 11). That's where my problem with it lies, I don't believe any one group or race of people has the right to hold themselves up as better because of their faith.

Now, in actual response to your post, I imagine New Order didn't bother going to church much in the Eighties, hangovers don't go well with hymns. Also, they've made no prnouncements concerning religion, so I suppose it's really not clear, but do we have the right to snoop around until we're satisfied? No, but people will still ask. I can't imagine them being atheists what with losing Ian, Rob, Martin et al, but I don't know, so I'll shut up now

Well, it's time for me to play the diplomat after all this heated digression, so let's get back to the point then yeah? Rob asks "Is Barney a Catholic or Protestant?" Hmmmm, good question, let's ponder for a while:

(five minute silence)

well....can't see it somehow....look let's be realistic shall we?

IS A BEAR CATHOLIC??? DOES THE POPE SHIT IN THE WOODS?? IT'S BLATANTLY OBVIOUS!!! BARNEY IS NEITHER!!! HE'S A BR.... Oh sod it, never mind.....

In a recent interview (which escapes me, possibly Mojo) he stated he was not religious but that he had a "spiritual" leaning. Also, in Q it categorically states that "Run Wild" is about Bernard's (not Steve 'n' Gillian's) daughter, I quote " as with Morris, tragedy still lurks. Run Wild, the tender ballad which closes the album, is about his youngest daughter who has a serious degenerative illness.... "it's personal", he (Barney) says..". I can't understand why anyone is interested in the religion of any of the band, it should make no difference, I'd be dissappointed, though, to find out that any of them believe in all that superstitious social control bollocks.

Siting here on a Saturday night/Sunday morning (only time i've had to really catch up with this weeks posts)I am amazed to see such a deep and meaningful thread here. Blimey!

I agree with Nic, religion is a personal thing, and whatever religion Barney is, i for one dont give a flying fuck...

Liv

Trust me, religion doesnt matter. Ive had friends killed over their stupid fucking religion. So don`t even go there please. Respect.

"Well, therefore, I give myself the right to ask questions about it."

It may be your right to ask questions about it, but you should also respect if the person you're asking don't want to answer. There may be other reasons than "not being confident" in what they believe.

Originally posted by Sébastien Boisvert > Originally posted by Nicolas LeBlanc> I think religion is a personal thing, and shouldn't be discussed in public

Quite the contrary!!!!!!!!

Religion is an important matter at the dawn of the 21st century that should be discussed widely. How come, now that we are so technologically and scientifically advanced, now that we can communicate with every part of the world in real time anytime we want, how come that religion still EXISTS? How can people still believe in tales who took place two thousand years ago, when the global knowledge was unexisting? Isn't it scary when it comes to check our progression as a whole, we, humans? Only to realise that we haven't progressed all that much, after all.

Very few people DARE asking this question, because if there's one thing that you cannot question in this world, it's... RELIGION. And that's the main problem, full circle. And why is that? Because traditionnally, if you questionned religion, people would be pointing their fingers at you. And why is that also? Because before that, centuries before, they would burn you down in a public place if you dared question that "divine law" that often had more similarities with a regime of terror than anything else.

In the history of mankind, religion has brought more hate and suffering than it brought well-being. It has always been an excuse that men have used to gain power and abuse of it. A good example of this is the interpretation of the bible or the coran (koran?). In the Catholic Church, traditionally, women had a very narrow place. Today, in our world of political correctness, the political structure that has become the Catholic Church are considering about voting for letting women become Priests. Now, I have absolutely nothing against that (quite the contrary actually), but this is a very good example of the hypocrisy of the people leading this religion. Originally, they could exclude women by saying that the BIBLE wanted it this way and that it was the voice of God -- when it was only really a way for them to keep full control on things. Now that people are deserting churches, these same men who were relying on the bible to justify the exclusion of women are considering letting them in. How hypocrit is that?

A great British man that I have studied alot named John Locke was the first to really question the impact of religion on civil society and on its political structures. His work was the basis of the work of other famous authors such as Montesquieu, Rousseau, and John Stuart Mill. That was at the 17th and 18th centuries. Without them, our world would probably be different today, and certainly not better (although it is, of course, historic speculation). Now, in the 21st century, a lot of people have realised at the price of their lives that religion can still be a source of hatred, and that many states in the world are directly an instrument for religion. Afghanistan is a good example, and so is Iran, and there are many others out there.

Right here, inside our own "developped occidental societies", we have many many sectarian groups who have been doing crazy things over the years, every time in the name of religion.

So YES, as a free citizen, I give myself the right to speak publicly of religion.

Seb.

religion is a load of wank

I have to agree with you on that, Facsy.

Religions a form of social control. It should make no difference what one person believes personally.

I personally am a non practising Christian. I think that most of whats taught in Church etc does makes a lot of sense though.

Take it or leave it.

Originally posted by Rob Revilo After everything that has happened lately in the U.S. I think most of us need a little religion in our lives.Rob

Man, are you having a fucking laugh or what!!!

With all due respect Seb, i still believe that religion should be a private thing. If you are an ardent supporter of your religion, then thats all well and good, but people who aren't shouldnt be subjected to your beliefs (not you in particular, you in general!?)

I think it is very important for people to have convictions and passions, but in a day and age when religion is the main cause for violence and war, i stand by my views that it should me (a term you dislike so much ) "A personal thing." It wasn't that long ago, that not staying private about your religion meant you were burnt at the stake....

Your analogy to politics is interesting. I was always told just because your vote is secret, you shouldn't keep it secret. I personally don't hide about who i vote for, because i have strong beliefs in that particular party, but i certianly dont shout it from the roof tops, as I am more than aware of the fact that people can be offended. The same goes for religion. Although non practising now, i was brought up with religion in my life, for fucks sake i was a Sunday School teacher (go figure?!?!), but i have seen too many times in my short life, religion be the cause of problems.

I have two close friends who are married. One is a Northern Irish Catholic and the other is a Northern Irish Protestant. You try telling them that religion isnt best kept private. They had to marry in the mainland UK to avoid repercussion from furvent family members who disapprove of their match. Even now they are married they are shunned by certain family members, and they know their lives would be a reisk should they venture into certain areas of their home city of Belfast. The fact that they are in love means nothing, the people at Shankhilll and Fall Roads in Belfast simple see the religion and no other mitigating circumstances. Without even knowning them as people their cards are marked simply becaus they are Catholic and Protestant.

Its is situations like this that remind me that religion, if you are a true believer should be private. If you have strong convictions, then WHY do you need to tell people? Your personal faith should be strong enough. I find a weakness in people who have to shout about their religion. The weakeness is there, this need to have to convince people that you are right (or maybe yourself), and a sort of disbelief and disdain of those people who dont follow that chosen religion. We all know people like this i am sure. If you believe in God, they thats fine and Dandy, but the only people who need to know about it are you and God. OK, Christians were told to spread the word, but if you behave like a true Christian you ARE spreading the word, it shouldnt be a case that you have to stop people inthe street to tell them how good God is.

I do not think religion is a bad thing, and granted religion can infulence many artists, but i firmly beleive it not not essential what religion you are. You said yourself, Depeche Mode were infulenced by religion, but you dont know which religion they are....and that is exactly my point.

Being spiritual, as Barney has often described himself as, is far more important that what organised religion you conform to. Having a strength and a passion about something is far more important that what religion you conform to.

And finally, there is nothing weak about not wanting to discuss religion. I am a very strong person, you ask any of the people who know me, and I am committed in my beliefs, in religion, politics and everything else. By not discussing them in public, that does not in anyway make me a weak person. On the contrary, it takes a lot of strength not to discuss religion and politics, especially when people try their best to draw you into an argument. I have in the past been drawn on certain topics and later regretted it. Weakness come from people who are unwilling to see other sides of an argument, and will battle their cause no matter what, regardless of offening people. The true strength comes from people who are committed and confirmed in their beliefs and do not have the desire to attempt to make people think the way they do, and do not need public support to make their beliefs any more true and real.

As I have previously mentioned, religion does cause problems, this board being a clear example of that. In only a handful of posts this thread had resulted in a religious debate.... where i am pretty damn sure people are eventually going to be offended. Relgion is a topic that will never be solved, not least on a New Order forum....

Liv

*stands down from soapbox*

Well Liv, you cetainly put everything in words that I wanted to say, but didn't know how to! :)

Originally posted by Maria Well Liv, you cetainly put everything in words that I wanted to say, but didn't know how to!:)

Cheers Maria, its because im a teacher! lol

Liv

Re: Depeche Mode. I think you'll find that Martin Gore uses religous devotion primarily as a metaphor for sex and desire. I remember reading that Gore's long-term girlfriend in the early days of the Mode was a devout Catholic and was VERY uptight about sex, constantly calling Mr Gore a "pervert". I think he claimed the whole leather skirt/fetish/S&M thing was an outlet for all that his (then-)girlfriend forced him to keep bottled-up. What's repressed will always return.....

Having seen the Mode this weekend in Manchester, I can only suggest that they worship at the feet of the Great God of Camp. About as far from an Order gig as you can possibly imagine (plenty of Order t-shirts on display, though), but enormous fun.

M.

Originally posted by Liv With all due respect Seb, i still believe that religion should be a private thing. If you are an ardent supporter of your religion, then thats all well and good, but people who aren't shouldnt be subjected to your beliefs (not you in particular, you in general!?)I think it is very important for people to have convictions and passions, but in a day and age when religion is the main cause for violence and war, i stand by my views that it should me (a term you dislike so much ) "A personal thing." It wasn't that long ago, that not staying private about your religion meant you were burnt at the stake.... Your analogy to politics is interesting. I was always told just because your vote is secret, you shouldn't keep it secret. I personally don't hide about who i vote for, because i have strong beliefs in that particular party, but i certianly dont shout it from the roof tops, as I am more than aware of the fact that people can be offended. The same goes for religion. Although non practising now, i was brought up with religion in my life, for fucks sake i was a Sunday School teacher (go figure?!?!), but i have seen too many times in my short life, religion be the cause of problems. I have two close friends who are married. One is a Northern Irish Catholic and the other is a Northern Irish Protestant. You try telling them that religion isnt best kept private. They had to marry in the mainland UK to avoid repercussion from furvent family members who disapprove of their match. Even now they are married they are shunned by certain family members, and they know their lives would be a reisk should they venture into certain areas of their home city of Belfast. The fact that they are in love means nothing, the people at Shankhilll and Fall Roads in Belfast simple see the religion and no other mitigating circumstances. Without even knowning them as people their cards are marked simply becaus they are Catholic and Protestant. Its is situations like this that remind me that religion, if you are a true believer should be private. If you have strong convictions, then WHY do you need to tell people? Your personal faith should be strong enough. I find a weakness in people who have to shout about their religion. The weakeness is there, this need to have to convince people that you are right (or maybe yourself), and a sort of disbelief and disdain of those people who dont follow that chosen religion. We all know people like this i am sure. If you believe in God, they thats fine and Dandy, but the only people who need to know about it are you and God. OK, Christians were told to spread the word, but if you behave like a true Christian you ARE spreading the word, it shouldnt be a case that you have to stop people inthe street to tell them how good God is. I do not think religion is a bad thing, and granted religion can infulence many artists, but i firmly beleive it not not essential what religion you are. You said yourself, Depeche Mode were infulenced by religion, but you dont know which religion they are....and that is exactly my point.Being spiritual, as Barney has often described himself as, is far more important that what organised religion you conform to. Having a strength and a passion about something is far more important that what religion you conform to. And finally, there is nothing weak about not wanting to discuss religion. I am a very strong person, you ask any of the people who know me, and I am committed in my beliefs, in religion, politics and everything else. By not discussing them in public, that does not in anyway make me a weak person. On the contrary, it takes a lot of strength not to discuss religion and politics, especially when people try their best to draw you into an argument. I have in the past been drawn on certain topics and later regretted it. Weakness come from people who are unwilling to see other sides of an argument, and will battle their cause no matter what, regardless of offening people. The true strength comes from people who are committed and confirmed in their beliefs and do not have the desire to attempt to make people think the way they do, and do not need public support to make their beliefs any more true and real.As I have previously mentioned, religion does cause problems, this board being a clear example of that. In only a handful of posts this thread had resulted in a religious debate.... where i am pretty damn sure people are eventually going to be offended. Relgion is a topic that will never be solved, not least on a New Order forum....Liv*stands down from soapbox*

Excellently said, Liv - full marks!!!

I've had a very quick glance at the religious banter on this here thread-a-rooney. Seems like all the regular members have come out with various sensible talk on the ever depressing and ultimately uncontrollably expansive and clearly unintelligible subject of religion.

I have only one thing to say which I'm sure you will all agree is a worthwhile slant on the subject.

'If Jesus Es-Chariot was so clever that he could make blind men see and limp cattle run, how comes he never did discover the secret ingredient inside the colonel's chicken?' (was he just too busy?)

Answer me that... and win a bun.

Originally posted by Liv With all due respect Seb, i still believe that religion should be a private thing. If you are an ardent supporter of your religion, then thats all well and good, but people who aren't shouldnt be subjected to your beliefs (not you in particular, you in general!?)I think it is very important for people to have convictions and passions, but in a day and age when religion is the main cause for violence and war, i stand by my views that it should me (a term you dislike so much ) "A personal thing." It wasn't that long ago, that not staying private about your religion meant you were burnt at the stake.... Your analogy to politics is interesting. I was always told just because your vote is secret, you shouldn't keep it secret. I personally don't hide about who i vote for, because i have strong beliefs in that particular party, but i certianly dont shout it from the roof tops, as I am more than aware of the fact that people can be offended. The same goes for religion. Although non practising now, i was brought up with religion in my life, for fucks sake i was a Sunday School teacher (go figure?!?!), but i have seen too many times in my short life, religion be the cause of problems. I have two close friends who are married. One is a Northern Irish Catholic and the other is a Northern Irish Protestant. You try telling them that religion isnt best kept private. They had to marry in the mainland UK to avoid repercussion from furvent family members who disapprove of their match. Even now they are married they are shunned by certain family members, and they know their lives would be a reisk should they venture into certain areas of their home city of Belfast. The fact that they are in love means nothing, the people at Shankhilll and Fall Roads in Belfast simple see the religion and no other mitigating circumstances. Without even knowning them as people their cards are marked simply becaus they are Catholic and Protestant. Its is situations like this that remind me that religion, if you are a true believer should be private. If you have strong convictions, then WHY do you need to tell people? Your personal faith should be strong enough. I find a weakness in people who have to shout about their religion. The weakeness is there, this need to have to convince people that you are right (or maybe yourself), and a sort of disbelief and disdain of those people who dont follow that chosen religion. We all know people like this i am sure. If you believe in God, they thats fine and Dandy, but the only people who need to know about it are you and God. OK, Christians were told to spread the word, but if you behave like a true Christian you ARE spreading the word, it shouldnt be a case that you have to stop people inthe street to tell them how good God is. I do not think religion is a bad thing, and granted religion can infulence many artists, but i firmly beleive it not not essential what religion you are. You said yourself, Depeche Mode were infulenced by religion, but you dont know which religion they are....and that is exactly my point.Being spiritual, as Barney has often described himself as, is far more important that what organised religion you conform to. Having a strength and a passion about something is far more important that what religion you conform to. And finally, there is nothing weak about not wanting to discuss religion. I am a very strong person, you ask any of the people who know me, and I am committed in my beliefs, in religion, politics and everything else. By not discussing them in public, that does not in anyway make me a weak person. On the contrary, it takes a lot of strength not to discuss religion and politics, especially when people try their best to draw you into an argument. I have in the past been drawn on certain topics and later regretted it. Weakness come from people who are unwilling to see other sides of an argument, and will battle their cause no matter what, regardless of offening people. The true strength comes from people who are committed and confirmed in their beliefs and do not have the desire to attempt to make people think the way they do, and do not need public support to make their beliefs any more true and real.As I have previously mentioned, religion does cause problems, this board being a clear example of that. In only a handful of posts this thread had resulted in a religious debate.... where i am pretty damn sure people are eventually going to be offended. Relgion is a topic that will never be solved, not least on a New Order forum....Liv*stands down from soapbox*

Religion is basically opinion/belief right ? i.e. "I believe this..." "I think that"

Knowing I will get castigated for saying this, but is it just me then who finds it ironic how many times those phrases appear in Liv's text ? Aren't you kind of contradicting the statement "Religion should be a private thing" ?

I'll just take cover before the flak arrives

Originally posted by Huntsman I've had a very quick glance at the religious banter on this here thread-a-rooney. Seems like all the regular members have come out with various sensible talk on the ever depressing and ultimately uncontrollably expansive and clearly unintelligible subject of religion.I have only one thing to say which I'm sure you will all agree is a worthwhile slant on the subject.'If Jesus Es-Chariot was so clever that he could make blind men see and limp cattle run, how comes he never did discover the secret ingredient inside the colonel's chicken?' (was he just too busy?)Answer me that... and win a bun.

Well Huntsy, only the colonel knows the colonel`s secret recipe.

One things for certain...It's not chicken

Originally posted by Ken Brough > > Religion is basically opinion/belief right ?> i.e. "I believe this..." "I think that"> > Knowing I will get castigated for saying this, but is it just me then who finds it ironic how many times those phrases appear in Liv's text ? Aren't you kind of contradicting the statement "Religion should be a private thing" ?> > I'll just take cover before the flak arrives

Ken, im sure you are more than aware that there is a great difference between opinion and religion. By saying I believe, or I think, i have simply expressed my opinion, not asked you to be circumsized, take communion or praise the lord. The statement(in my opinion) remains, religion is a private thing, but opinions are free and have the right to be expressed. Im sure no one will disagree with that.

Liv

you are right to run for cover, im not nice when the shit hits the fan... ask my pupils...

Originally posted by Liv > Originally posted by Ken Brough> > > > > > Religion is basically opinion/belief right ?> > i.e. "I believe this..." "I think that"> > > > Knowing I will get castigated for saying this, but is it just me then who finds it ironic how many times those phrases appear in Liv's text ? Aren't you kind of contradicting the statement "Religion should be a private thing" ?> > > > I'll just take cover before the flak arrives>

Ken, im sure you are more than aware that there is a great difference between opinion and religion. By saying I believe, or I think, i have simply expressed my opinion, not asked you to be circumsized, take communion or praise the lord. The statement(in my opinion) remains, religion is a private thing, but opinions are free and have the right to be expressed. Im sure no one will disagree with that.

Liv

you are right to run for cover, im not nice when the shit hits the fan... ask my pupils...

Not sure what happened there but anyway

I'm still not convinced but hey, I never disagree with a lady teacher

We shouldn't care what religion so and so is as long as we follow this simple rule

Love Everyone

yes, love yer mother, yer father, yer brother, yer sister, yer wife, yer sons, yer daughters, yer grandkids, yer in-laws, yer ex-wives, yer step-dad, yer step-mom, yer step-kids, yer friends, yes even yer friend that likes backstreet boys, the guy that makes fun of you, the guy that backstabbed you, the guy that isn't cool, yer co-workers, yer boss, the guy that owes you a lot of money, the guy that broke yer legs cuzz u owed him a lot of money, yer cousins, yer uncles, yer aunts, yes even the annoying one that insults yer weight, yer classmates, yer teachers, yer doctors, yer lawyers, yer repo-men, the IRS, yer congressmen, yer senators, yer politicians, yes even George Dubbya Bush, yer countrymen, Americans, Canadians, Englishmen, French, Germans, Russians, Italians, Japanese, Chinese, Arabians, Africans, Mongolians, Greeks, Afghans, yes even the Taliban, the Jews, the Catholics, the Protestants, the Anglicans, the Orthodox, the Muslims, the Hindus, the Buddhists, the Confucianists, the Taoists, the Sikhs, the Zoroasters, the Scientologists, the prostitute that you pregnated, yer bastard child, the person that gave you herpes, the guy that yer girlfriend had an affair with, yer neighbours, the guy that broke into yer car, the guy that stole yer car, the guy that broke into yer house, the guy that stole yer tv and/or stereo, the guy that killed yer dog, the people that listen to shitty music, the people that make shitty music,

but most of all love yer God and LOVE NEW ORDER!!!

Originally posted by Evil Dust We shouldn't care what religion so and so is as long as we follow this simple ruleLove Everyoneyes, love yer mother, yer father, yer brother, yer sister, yer wife, yer sons, yer daughters, yer grandkids, yer in-laws, yer ex-wives, yer step-dad, yer step-mom, yer step-kids, yer friends, yes even yer friend that likes backstreet boys, the guy that makes fun of you, the guy that backstabbed you, the guy that isn't cool, yer co-workers, yer boss, the guy that owes you a lot of money, the guy that broke yer legs cuzz u owed him a lot of money, yer cousins, yer uncles, yer aunts, yes even the annoying one that insults yer weight, yer classmates, yer teachers, yer doctors, yer lawyers, yer repo-men, the IRS, yer congressmen, yer senators, yer politicians, yes even George Dubbya Bush, yer countrymen, Americans, Canadians, Englishmen, French, Germans, Russians, Italians, Japanese, Chinese, Arabians, Africans, Mongolians, Greeks, Afghans, yes even the Taliban, the Jews, the Catholics, the Protestants, the Anglicans, the Orthodox, the Muslims, the Hindus, the Buddhists, the Confucianists, the Taoists, the Sikhs, the Zoroasters, the Scientologists, the prostitute that you pregnated, yer bastard child, the person that gave you herpes, the guy that yer girlfriend had an affair with, yer neighbours, the guy that broke into yer car, the guy that stole yer car, the guy that broke into yer house, the guy that stole yer tv and/or stereo, the guy that killed yer dog, the people that listen to shitty music, the people that make shitty music, but most of all love yer God and LOVE NEW ORDER!!!

amen

Liv

But not poor Tony W., eh Liv!!??!!??

M.

Originally posted by martin fradley But not poor Tony W., eh Liv!!??!!??M.

fuck me, its get Liv day today on NewOrderOnline...

No, Tony Wilson doesnt count, he is the devil incarnate...

Liv

Originally posted by Liv > Originally posted by Ken Brough> > > > > > Religion is basically opinion/belief right ?> > i.e. "I believe this..." "I think that"> > > > Knowing I will get castigated for saying this, but is it just me then who finds it ironic how many times those phrases appear in Liv's text ? Aren't you kind of contradicting the statement "Religion should be a private thing" ?> > > > I'll just take cover before the flak arrives>

Ken, im sure you are more than aware that there is a great difference between opinion and religion. By saying I believe, or I think, i have simply expressed my opinion, not asked you to be circumsized, take communion or praise the lord. The statement(in my opinion) remains, religion is a private thing, but opinions are free and have the right to be expressed. Im sure no one will disagree with that.

Liv

you are right to run for cover, im not nice when the shit hits the fan... ask my pupils...

perhaps seb should set up a "teacher voice" icon?

Originally posted by dave hibell perhaps seb should set up a "teacher voice" icon?

And why not.... im up for anything... I could be the resident disciplinarian....

Liv

"God is a concept by which we measure our pain"-John Lennon, 1970 (Plastic Ono Band)

Thank you, end of subject..

(close this one up, Sebsy boy, it's overdone)

Originally posted by Taboo # 7 "God is a concept by which we measure our pain"-John Lennon, 1970 (Plastic Ono Band)Thank you, end of subject..(close this one up, Sebsy boy, it's overdone)

Totally agree, If theres no room for Breasts, theres no room for religion! Haven't even looked at the North/South thread yet....Don't think I'll bother!

Originally posted by Sébastien Boisvert That's what I meant.But what I'd like to know from your message is: what other reasons would that be? (for not speaking of your religious beliefs)Seb.

That would be: personal reasons ( ;) ) that would make you not want to discuss religion/politics with a total stranger. But seriously. If it's someone I knew, I'd gladly discuss any "difficult" question (well not gladly maybe, but I wouldn't hesitate to give my opinion) that may arise. This is because sometimes things I say may sound very harsh and cynical, although I'm not like that at all. People may be offended. I may be offended. Often, VERY often, I am misunderstood. My life is about trying to explain what I mean, because I can't sufficiently express my thoughts in words. Even people who know me have a hard time understanding what I mean... Maybe I don't want to explain and explain and explain, and still the person don't (want to) understand me. Well, this message is suddenly all about me, which wasn't intended in the first place. I'm not even sure that I answered your question.. :) When I say something, though, it seems like you're taking it as very personal. I am not trying to make you upset.

If it's really important for you to know my what religious beliefs are, you could always mail me and ask. :) But I don't see this forum as the right place to discuss it.

While reading all of the posts...one thing has really disturbed me...it is the fact that people are placing the blame on organized religion....The only thing that people have to realize is that there are two types of religious people out there... the moderates and the extremists....The extremists are the individuals who go around crashing planes into building...bombing abortion clinics, and taking sleep for life pills that will take you to a spaceship that is following a comet...the others, who are moderate, have respect and tolerance for other religions and beliefs...like myself.

I go to church once a week, believe in God, and believe in Organized religion...without organization, there would be Chaos...simple as that...

I also believe that people have the choice to not choose religion in there lives...but I think they have an emptiness in their hearts.... Just think of all the great songs that God has inspired!!!!

Because religion is a very personal thing being non religious must also be a very personal thing. Criticising Religions is one of my favourite pastimes and is a pleasure I won´t forfait easily.

It is true I did not think I would find this discussion here.

Most of the things organised or non-organised religions propose as core beliefs are so praeternaturally ridiculous as not to resist the non biased analysis of a 10 year old and we should all know that at least since Hume.

By the way, I think Barney, as usual, only used the word Jesus to complete a rhyme.