I sure hope a decent Democrat will emerge from the primaries (not Dean or Gephardt) because after watching the piece about Paul O'Neill on 60 Minutes, I find it hard to be a Bush supporter any longer. Supposedly Bush planned the Iraqi war before 9/11, also Cheney and Rove possessed great influence on the second wave of tax cuts that Bush questioned yet eventually supported, collapsing from the pressure he received from papa bush's cronies. I can't stand Bush if he is continually puppeteered by Cheney and Karl Rove. Bush's recently proposed immigration policy is wretched as well, and also his desire to go back to the moon is freakin ridiculous, for it is a feeble attempt to receive a Kennedy-esque support from the American public if he advocates space triumphs. If Cheney would die from a stroke already and Karl would be assassinated by some left-wing militia, then I would support Bush.
Paul O' Neill
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And let's not forget that Karl Rove is supposedly the one who deliberatly blew a CIA agent's cover.
Originally posted by bLuE oRdEr
Karl Rove is also rather fishy in the administration's dealing with Enron
Originally posted by bLuE oRdEr
In the name of all that is sweet and clean....
Do you KNOW that for a fact?
How's this one for you: Bill Clinton is supposedly the one that had Ron Brown capped in the back of the dome before his plane went down in Eastern Europe. Supposedly... 
Originally posted by Tristan Jayol I sure hope a decent Democrat will emerge from the primaries (not Dean or Gephardt) because after watching the piece about Paul O'Neill on 60 Minutes, I find it hard to be a Bush supporter any longer. Supposedly Bush planned the Iraqi war before 9/11, also Cheney and Rove possessed great influence on the second wave of tax cuts that Bush questioned yet eventually supported, collapsing from the pressure he received from papa bush's cronies. I can't stand Bush if he is continually puppeteered by Cheney and Karl Rove. Bush's recently proposed immigration policy is wretched as well, and also his desire to go back to the moon is freakin ridiculous, for it is a feeble attempt to receive a Kennedy-esque support from the American public if he advocates space triumphs. If Cheney would die from a stroke already and Karl would be assassinated by some left-wing militia, then I would support Bush.
Let's tap the brakes just a bit, shall we. You can see the sparks of Paul O'Neil's grinding axe from space. Speaking of space, you don't think that little exhibition put on by the Chinese has anything to do with our renewed interest in space, do you?
Originally posted by Michael McDermott > Originally posted by Tristan Jayol I sure hope a decent Democrat will emerge from the primaries (not Dean or Gephardt) because after watching the piece about Paul O'Neill on 60 Minutes, I find it hard to be a Bush supporter any longer. Supposedly Bush planned the Iraqi war before 9/11, also Cheney and Rove possessed great influence on the second wave of tax cuts that Bush questioned yet eventually supported, collapsing from the pressure he received from papa bush's cronies. I can't stand Bush if he is continually puppeteered by Cheney and Karl Rove. Bush's recently proposed immigration policy is wretched as well, and also his desire to go back to the moon is freakin ridiculous, for it is a feeble attempt to receive a Kennedy-esque support from the American public if he advocates space triumphs. If Cheney would die from a stroke already and Karl would be assassinated by some left-wing militia, then I would support Bush.
Let's tap the brakes just a bit, shall we. You can see the sparks of Paul O'Neil's grinding axe from space. Speaking of space, you don't think that little exhibition put on by the Chinese has anything to do with our renewed interest in space, do you? Not just the Chinese but the Europeans as well, but I still believe that there is enough money in the space program, and Bush should not increase the funding of NASA, for with a deficit nearing half a trillion dollars, the money could better be used somewhere else.
Originally posted by Tristan Jayol > Originally posted by Michael McDermott> > > > Originally posted by Tristan Jayol> I sure hope a decent Democrat will emerge from the primaries (not Dean or Gephardt) because after watching the piece about Paul O'Neill on 60 Minutes, I find it hard to be a Bush supporter any longer. Supposedly Bush planned the Iraqi war before 9/11, also Cheney and Rove possessed great influence on the second wave of tax cuts that Bush questioned yet eventually supported, collapsing from the pressure he received from papa bush's cronies. I can't stand Bush if he is continually puppeteered by Cheney and Karl Rove. Bush's recently proposed immigration policy is wretched as well, and also his desire to go back to the moon is freakin ridiculous, for it is a feeble attempt to receive a Kennedy-esque support from the American public if he advocates space triumphs. If Cheney would die from a stroke already and Karl would be assassinated by some left-wing militia, then I would support Bush.
Let's tap the brakes just a bit, shall we. You can see the sparks of Paul O'Neil's grinding axe from space. Speaking of space, you don't think that little exhibition put on by the Chinese has anything to do with our renewed interest in space, do you? Not just the Chinese but the Europeans as well, but I still believe that there is enough money in the space program, and Bush should not increase the funding of NASA, for with a deficit nearing half a trillion dollars, the money could better be used somewhere else.
There's LOTS money being spent that could be better used somewhere else! 
:D
A few of us were actually talking about the American Presidential ELection today.
General consensus is that Bush is an idiot, and that no one ever liked him. One of my friends, who lectures in american politics said that the international community should vote on the US president because it affects us just as much as you.
We all want Wesley Clark to run.
Originally posted by Uncle Liam A few of us were actually talking about the American Presidential ELection today. General consensus is that Bush is an idiot, and that no one ever liked him. One of my friends, who lectures in american politics said that the international community should vote on the US president because it affects us just as much as you. We all want Wesley Clark to run.
Clark is running.
As far as President Bush being an "idiot", that certainly seems to be a view held by many Europeans. However, it's never been fully explained (to me at least) as to why. Does a dislike (or hate) based on personality traits somehow equate to idiocy? Does the fact that President Bush isn't "boys" with Chirac or Schroder lead to this assertion that "no one" has ever liked him?
Just curious.
Well, I thought O'Neill was great with the Yankees back during their late Nineties run, but as treasury secretary 
:p
Anyway, I missed the 60 Minutes piece, but you can smell the blood in the water. I guarentee there will be tons of coverage on Fox News (you know, the people who set the Iraqi War to stirring music 
), and I already heard the Pres's Press Secretary defame Mr. O'Neill, so you just know the Ann Coulter book about O'Neill's traitor-status is in the works 
Originally posted by Uncle Liam A few of us were actually talking about the American Presidential ELection today. General consensus is that Bush is an idiot, and that no one ever liked him. One of my friends, who lectures in american politics said that the international community should vote on the US president because it affects us just as much as you. We all want Wesley Clark to run.
Clark is just as much of an idiot as Bush is; he has no particular policy platform yet, so if he is elected we have no fookin clue what the hell he plans to do with the country. He does not attend debates, and I still think he is just as much of a republican as he is a democrat. If Clark becomes president, then I believe his policy would be dictated by whoeveer is in his cabinet, for all I know kucinich could become the secretary of the treasury, and the US will become a Communist regime. I worry about Dean and Clark because of the existing uncertainty that we have no clue what the hell they would plan to do with the US. Also, would you vote for the candidate, Clark, that Madonna endorsed.
Originally posted by Taboo # 7 Well, I thought O'Neill was great with the Yankees back during their late Nineties run, but as treasury secretary
During the beginning of the 60 Minutes piece there was Jack Kemp on foxnews claiming that O'Neill's claims are revenge for his firing.
Originally posted by Tristan Jayol > Originally posted by Taboo # 7> Well, I thought O'Neill was great with the Yankees back during their late Nineties run, but as treasury secretary
During the beginning of the 60 Minutes piece there was Jack Kemp on foxnews claiming that O'Neill's claims are revenge for his firing.
Let slip the dogs of name-calling, I suppose; you'll pardon me for saying so, but it seems like the Bush Administration is pretty good at smearing the people who dare to question it, or disagree with it, or just say a bad word or two against it. Right now, the "in" thing is to be angry and conservative, and blame "liberals" (a loose collection of people you don't like for one reason or another) for everything that's "wrong" with America. I have no doubt that, deep inside the White House, Dick Cheney and Roger Ailes get together for a few sessions of "Who Do We Smear Next?" It's just sickening to think that your patriotism is questioned simply because you ask a question the President doesn't want to answer, or you wonder why they're so gung-ho to go to Iraq. The Bush Administration is wallowing in the sort of Nixonian secrecy that is anathema to democracy, and while I don't know which Dem candidate will be nominated I plan to vote for whoever it is. I am sick of the Bush Era, and I am sick of Fox News, and I am sick of Ann Coulter, and I am sick of Rush Limnaugh, Sean Hannity, and just about all the bootlickers of the Bush White House.
... and I am sick of Fox News, and I am sick of Ann Coulter, and I am sick of Rush Limnaugh, Sean Hannity, and just about all the bootlickers of the Bush White House.
Trev,
You sound like I did in '98. Except I was sick of the Clinton era, CNN, Carville and Begala (speaking of smear machines) and all the jelly spined sycopahnts of the Clinton White House.
So, to employ a quote from the era, "I feel your pain." ;)
Originally posted by Tristan Jayol > Originally posted by Uncle Liam> A few of us were actually talking about the American Presidential ELection today. > > General consensus is that Bush is an idiot, and that no one ever liked him. One of my friends, who lectures in american politics said that the international community should vote on the US president because it affects us just as much as you. > > We all want Wesley Clark to run.
Clark is just as much of an idiot as Bush is; he has no particular policy platform yet, so if he is elected we have no fookin clue what the hell he plans to do with the country. He does not attend debates, and I still think he is just as much of a republican as he is a democrat. If Clark becomes president, then I believe his policy would be dictated by whoeveer is in his cabinet, for all I know kucinich could become the secretary of the treasury, and the US will become a Communist regime. I worry about Dean and Clark because of the existing uncertainty that we have no clue what the hell they would plan to do with the US. Also, would you vote for the candidate, Clark, that Madonna endorsed.
With all due respect, i think already that the Cabinet would play a significant role in determining policy.
From the White House Website: "The tradition of the Cabinet dates back to the beginnings of the Presidency itself. One of the principal purposes of the Cabinet (drawn from Article II, Section 2 of the Constitution) is to advise the President on any subject he may require relating to the duties of their respective offices. "
And I would hardly think that kucinich would a) carry enough power to and b) actually attempt to tunr the USA into some kind of Communist state.
Originally posted by Uncle Liam > Originally posted by Tristan Jayol > Originally posted by Uncle Liam> A few of us were actually talking about the American Presidential ELection today. > > General consensus is that Bush is an idiot, and that no one ever liked him. One of my friends, who lectures in american politics said that the international community should vote on the US president because it affects us just as much as you. > > We all want Wesley Clark to run.
Clark is just as much of an idiot as Bush is; he has no particular policy platform yet, so if he is elected we have no fookin clue what the hell he plans to do with the country. He does not attend debates, and I still think he is just as much of a republican as he is a democrat. If Clark becomes president, then I believe his policy would be dictated by whoeveer is in his cabinet, for all I know kucinich could become the secretary of the treasury, and the US will become a Communist regime. I worry about Dean and Clark because of the existing uncertainty that we have no clue what the hell they would plan to do with the US. Also, would you vote for the candidate, Clark, that Madonna endorsed.
With all due respect, i think already that the Cabinet would play a significant role in determining policy.
From the White House Website: "The tradition of the Cabinet dates back to the beginnings of the Presidency itself. One of the principal purposes of the Cabinet (drawn from Article II, Section 2 of the Constitution) is to advise the President on any subject he may require relating to the duties of their respective offices. "
And I would hardly think that kucinich would a) carry enough power to and b) actually attempt to tunr the USA into some kind of Communist state. I was exaggerating about Kucinich, and about the cabinet, there are many different degrees of power can have. A weak candidate if he wins is likely to select strong influential persons for the cabinet (a la Bush in 2001).
To answer another question. Would i vote for Wesley Clark? The "candidate that Madonna endorsed".
Of course i would. Having read a fair bit about him, distinguished military career, pro choice, sensible polices on trade and the environment (unlike the 'president') etc etc, i was fairly impressed.
The fact that Madonna endorsed him is totally and utterly irrelevant.
Originally posted by Uncle Liam To answer another question. Would i vote for Wesley Clark? The "candidate that Madonna endorsed".Of course i would. Having read a fair bit about him, distinguished military career, pro choice, sensible polices on trade and the environment (unlike the 'president') etc etc, i was fairly impressed. The fact that Madonna endorsed him is totally and utterly irrelevant.
that was just a humorous addition to the end; and here is a nice link about Clark http://www.zpub.com/un/clark.html
Yes, a very interesting link. Amazing what certain parts of the American Right will do to sledge a candidate. Pity that none of the sources are reputable.
I will simply say that i have no doubt that whoever BUsh faces, he will win. The whole country at war issue and that pathetic excuse of an electoral system will ensure another four years of madness.
Clinton beat Bush after a war victory. November is a long way away.
BTW, I can vote for one of the Demos next week.
Originally posted by twist Clinton beat Bush after a war victory. November is a long way away.BTW, I can vote for one of the Demos next week.
Didnt Clinton beat Bush a full 18 months after Gulf War 1? Bush jr will play the 9/11 card and say that the US is at war with terror (and whoever else, like you said, November is a long way way) and you dont change presidents during war.
Johnson stepped down. Nixon quit. FDR died. Maybe a true statement. But alot of Americans are tired of this war. We miss quick wars like The Battle of France, Poland, Grenada, Panama
The fact is, the stock market crashed at the beginning of Bush's term. Fuck the world, we want our 401Ks to grow fast again. True the economy is better, terms of recession no longer used. But Bush will need more than the military victory to win. Its the Economy, stupid.
However, all these Demos are tax and spend types. Homeowners, business owners and people that work for a living vote in numbers. Democrats seem weak on economic issues other than raising taxes to give to welfare whores. They need to get over this image.
We threw Carter out on his ass over the economy, why not Bush??
Originally posted by twist Johnson stepped down. Nixon quit. FDR died. Maybe a true statement. But alot of Americans are tired of this war. We miss quick wars like The Battle of France, Poland, Grenada, Panama
because we do not have to make lines to get gas; don't compare the stagflation of Carter to the 9/11 recession
Originally posted by Michael McDermott > ... and I am sick of Fox News, and I am sick of Ann Coulter, and I am sick of Rush Limnaugh, Sean Hannity, and just about all the bootlickers of the Bush White House.
Trev,
You sound like I did in '98. Except I was sick of the Clinton era, CNN, Carville and Begala (speaking of smear machines) and all the jelly spined sycopahnts of the Clinton White House.
So, to employ a quote from the era, "I feel your pain." ;)
It's always good to let go a rant against the ne'er do wells on the other side of the political arguement. Clears out the sinuses 
Originally posted by Michael McDermott > Originally posted by bLuE oRdEr>
In the name of all that is sweet and clean....
Do you KNOW that for a fact?
How's this one for you: Bill Clinton is supposedly the one that had Ron Brown capped in the back of the dome before his plane went down in Eastern Europe. Supposedly...
Somebody blew the cover of a CIA agent. We know that as an indisputable fact. Even in the alternate universe that Reepublicans inhabit, it is a known fact that the cover of a CIA agent was blown. No, I don't know that Karl Rove blew her cover; that is why I said "supposedly." But it has been suggested by some observers that Rove had both the information and the motivation to blow her cover. This suggestion does not amount to an investigation, but certainly any investigation worth its salt will take a close look at Rove, among others, and eventually will uncover the identity of the person responsible, whether it was Rove or someone else.
As for Ron Brown, we know for a fact that his plane went down, and that he was among the dead. But a bullet to his head? And somehow, the ONLY people on this planet who are aware of that "fact" inhabit the alternate universe of the far right? Before you start speculating on who "capped" Ron Brown, don't you need to establish that he was indeed "capped"? Establish that as an indisputable fact, and then we can start wondering who pulled the trigger.
Until then, there's no comparison between speculation about whether Karl Rove is the member of the Bush administration who betrayed his country (an event that actually happened, perpetrator yet unknown), and speculation about whether Clinton ordered a murder.
Originally posted by Taboo # 7 Well, I thought O'Neill was great with the Yankees back during their late Nineties run, but as treasury secretary
Damn! You beat me to this joke Tabsy ;)
