I love Brazil!!!

Originally posted by almanso > > alright, now i got what you´re saying. and i can´t believe you bought the old theory of the two demons again. it´s not "you or the others", "be on my side or on the other side", "my way or the hightway" kind of thinking what it will solve the problem. you´re saying if we not support US then all the world will become islamic? come on, give us some credit! we´ve built entire countries based on religion mainly, and without any help from the outside. what they want is to let them alone and do what they want to do with their lives. USA messed up with them, invaded their territories and tried to change their way of life. why? who the hell is "the USA" to think they could do that? and who the hell are them to do that also? and don´t get me wrong, between the islamic fascists and the fascist empire (for me, the USA) i choose the empire. but that´s because i don´t share their belief for islam. just that. but if you ask me i don´t choose any of them because for me it´s two forces that want to impose to the world a way of thinking, a way of behaving, a way of living their own lives. ones by terrorist terror, others by economic (and militar) terror. i want to follow my own, i want freedom. and neither sides give me that.> wake up and smell the coffee! i´m tired to see generations after generations of americans making the same mistakes all over again!

Nicely, and eloquently put sir

Originally posted by Garymac > Originally posted by bLuE oRdEr> > > > Originally posted by Garymac> > > > > > > So the Brits argued that all paddies are terrorists? Given British policies and actions against the Irish civilian population, what would that make all Brits?> > > > > > Between the methods of Gandhi and those of the IRA, I'll take Gandhi. But when they were calling "all paddies" terrorists, did these same sanctimonious Brits ever stop to wonder why there are 38 million Americans of Irish descent, or why there is such strong support from America for kicking the Brits the fuck out of Ireland?> > >

Like I said my family came over from the south of Ireland in the Sixties , thats the 1960's, they made England their home, specificaly Manchester and Liverpool,they never realy thought about the six counties that much,employment was simply easier to find ' over the water'. Yet by the seventies, simply having an Irish accent was enough to put a fella under suspicion. And as you point out 38 million is a hell of a figure ,but that was the US, fortunately for members of my family and others, Fortress America was a long way off and the Irish had an acceptable religion, my point is this, in England/UK there was a kneejerk reaction, it was wrong but it happened,now what is happening at US borders is that a kneejerk reaction ? And God help you if you've got 38 million reactionaries who want to fund their cause Also the reality of being a Brit of Irish decent is this, if you put money into any of the para-military parties ,you stand a pretty good chance of payin for the bullet or bomb that blows up the kid from your local school who according to his Mum ' always wanted to be a soldier when he grew up', the kid whose Brother you went to school with, that kinda thing, the kinda thing 38 million descendants would not have to do 'cos the Atlantic is pretty wide

My only point about the 38 million Irish-Americans is that a lot of Irish immigrated to America-- 4 million in the mid-19th century alone-- to keep from dying, because British policies and actions were exterminating the civilian population of Ireland. The British have over 800 years of Irish blood-- civilian blood-- on their hands, and they called the Irish terrorists.

The 38 million Irish-Americans are not all funding the IRA. I would suspect that a very, very small percentage of those 38 million actually have anything at all to do with the IRA. I would also suspect that sympathy for kicking the Brits out of Ireland runs much, much higher.

I agree with you entirely about the actual effects of the bullets and bombs. Gandhi kicked the British out of India, and he did it by exposing the British-- to themselves-- for what they actually were. No bullets, no bombs-- at least, not from the Indians. But I think even Gandhi believed that his strategy would not have worked with Hitler's Germany.

Here in the U.S., being Muslim now is probably equivalent to having an Irish accent in the UK of the '70s. A bit hard to play armchair general on the border issue, though. Prior to 9/11, the US was very lax about keeping track of who was here. I have an ex-girlfriend who was here, along with her family, illegally (damn Canadians ;) ); another friend overstayed her student visa, never returned home, and the government had no idea. Obviously, we've had some kneejerk reactions here, particularly in regard to our civil liberties, but I'm not sure that keeping track of who is visiting our country is improper or abusive.

OK, sure its a pain in the ass to be "booked" after flying to the US. But the anal probes for domestic flights have got to go!

No, I am not saying that "be on my side or be my enemy." I am saying that right or wrong the US is attempting to stop terrorists from entering the country. "Ire papieri, bitte" You papers, please!

Given that the US has invade 2 nations after 911 chances are high that something is going to happen on US soil. I do not think they have given up.

Jesus, I have to live here in the 4th Reich. Most of these laws effect me. it is a pain in the ass to fly anywhere in the US even without finger printing. Got to watch what you say. Alcohol consumption on domestic flights reduced. Non-terrorism arrests up thanks to new laws.

So go ahead. Bash America all you want. Its so fucking easy to do so. Bush is a nazi. Himmler lives in DC. Sure seems to be the fashionable thing to do.

Bashing America a fashionable thing to do,sorry if it comes across that way, first of all I love the place, second I dont hold all her people responsible for her policies. We get mixed messages in the UK, first of all what is an American ? African-American, Italian-American, Franco-American, Chinese- American,Native-American etc, etc,etc. Are you not just American ? The Aussies seem content to be Australian and they're a young country ( who would also be well rid of the UK ) You swear allegiance to your own flag, yet believe you have the right to be involved in the politics/policies of the old countries. We hear horror stories about how American schoolkids could not find Europe on a map I know there are places in the US I'd never be able to point out but then again this country does'nt purport to have any influence over the US. Very few countries in Europe have escaped terrorism, yet none have led us to the brink of a world war. Like I say most people are not into America bashin to be fashionable, most like our friend from Argentina are saddened that it came as a shock to the US to find they were'nt loved or needed as the worlds policeman. This lack of endearment goes back to Reagonomics and Nixon at least, but dont take it as a slight to average Americans, just their politicians. I mean Clinton was loved overhere but we didn't have to live with him, Thatcher was loved overthere and we had to with put up with her By the way, which one is playin Himmler ? How as the guy who suggested givin long term illegal aliens resident status been recieved ? When somebody arrives illegaly from Cuba we are told he is granted citizenship, does that apply to all border runners ? I am genuinely interested.

The immigration thing is mixed. Anyone running a business favors relaxing the restrictions. Most immigrants work hard and are willing to do the work that US citizens refuse to do.

The reactionary folks, like my wife's mother, sit and bitch that Mexicans are taking away jobs from Americans and spend all their money on booze and end up jail for DUI. "They refuse to learn English!" No one bitches about deadbeat Americans collecting unemployment, food stamps and welfare while refusing to lower themselves to do the job of an immigrant.

Economists realize that to end illegal immigrant workers and to get US citizens to fill those jobs would radically change the economy. Namely, a head of lettuce would cost $12 and a Big Mac $15.

Personally, I respect someone willing to uproot and travel thousands of miles away from home to work 3 shitty jobs. I do not respect those that refuse to work if favor of sucking off the State because the only jobs they can do are "beneath them".

Cubans are admitted IF THEY REACH DRY LAND. If the boat or raft is still in the water they get sent back. Many people, however, were upset when Elian Gonzales was sent back to Cuba.

People are suspicious of Bush's immigration proposals. Most see it as a political move to save his brother's job in Florida. Others see it as an acknowlegement of reallity, they are here, why waste money fighting to deport them?

Ascroft Himmler. Rumsfeld Boorman

Not quite on the same scale,the immigration thing over here,though I'm sure one party or another will use it as an election gambit. I hear the refusal to speak English argument over here too, again not on the same scale as the US, the most ludicrous from a guy who aint worked for years, as he is a registered alcholic. He recieves enhanced benefits because of his affliction plus housing, bus pass etc he is in the pub everyday includin weekends.... basicaly the fucker has'nt spoken sensible English since the seventies, and he's got a thing against idle Kosovans ! Incidentaly, the poor Kosovans get the blame 'round here for everything, I dont think anyone ever stops to think if they are Kosovans or not, they all get the same label. Our bigots are pretty fuckin lazy. My wife was workin over in Miami for a large part of 03 and she was surprised how much Spanish she had to use on a day -to -day basis, me too actualy ,whenever I 'phoned her hotel switchboard I invariably had to use a little Spanish , but I was glad of the practice. I was in Cuba at the time of the Elian thing, so I have seen how both Governments used a child as part of their propoganda, however the Fathers argument seemed the more persuasive at the time. Incidentaly I was advised not to have my passport stamped in Cuba in case I had problems entering the US at a later date, it was almost up for renewal anyway ,so i got it stamped, I am curious though if it would have had any bearing on subsequent visits, whilst I'm glad it was an old passport in view of recent events. I had'nt realised you had unemployment benefit overthere, here if you are made 'redundant' , you are given a set time to find a job that is'nt 'beneath' you after that it may be amacjob, like it or not, that's why our sickness benefit claimants are on the increase, fell into the same trap myself last year,got made redundant and 12 weeks later I was filling shelves in Tesco ( bit like your Wal-Mart I think ) Frightening to think that the worlds , not just the US, economy could depend on the price of a Big mac or a head of lettuce innit ?

We have, at least in my sity, many refuges from Bosnia/Yugoslavia. Their youth are picking the worst of American culture, all FUBU wearing, "riced up" Honda driving rap listeners.

Its not that the Hispanics refuse to learn English, its just extremely difficult to learn a new language when you are an adult. Most of their children pick it up quickly and serve as translators.

Just heard on the radio an anti-immigration message. But US unemployment is low, sometimes up to 10% better than Europe.

Originally posted by twist No, I am not saying that "be on my side or be my enemy." I am saying that right or wrong the US is attempting to stop terrorists from entering the country. "Ire papieri, bitte" You papers, please!Given that the US has invade 2 nations after 911 chances are high that something is going to happen on US soil. I do not think they have given up.Jesus, I have to live here in the 4th Reich. Most of these laws effect me. it is a pain in the ass to fly anywhere in the US even without finger printing. Got to watch what you say. Alcohol consumption on domestic flights reduced. Non-terrorism arrests up thanks to new laws.So go ahead. Bash America all you want. Its so fucking easy to do so. Bush is a nazi. Himmler lives in DC. Sure seems to be the fashionable thing to do.

Why do the US government think terrorists could come in from Brazil, and not Portugal, for example?

We never had a terrorist attack, and never heard of some terrorist that flied from here to there.

If the US intelligence knows something we don't - like some peculiar place here with terrorists organizations - we should have knowledge of it. Otherwhise, I can't imagine the critery in the choices of who needs to be identified and who doesn't.

Originally posted by almanso the triple border, andrei. that´s where they think are thousands of islamic terrorists waiting to bomb everything. i know there´s a large arabian community on that zone, but that doesn´t mean anything. well, at least nobody could prove anything.

That's what I meant. They THINK. Where's the evidences? Why they don't show them? Anyway, arabians are arabians, brazilians are brazilians.