Perception of New Order in different cultures — Forum Archive

22 Dec 2003, 05:45

(partialy inspired by the homophobia thread)

I don't know if this has been done before, but I must admit that I could never understand what were New Order doing in those american teenie movies. Last things I would connect them to were obviously very commercial movies whose plot was "they want to have sex but there is a problem". My embarrasment was complete with the infamous Beverly Hils t-shirt incident. However, I was equally surprised to find out about football riots at gigs. Where I live the idea of someone into New Order would be closest to either someone into electronic music as a whole or a young intelectual, definitely someone who closely follows music. Now how did they ever get into 90210 ? And what is the general idea on NO where you live ?

22 Dec 2003, 13:15

In Spain the prevalent idea about New Order (during their glory days) was that of a dark, moody and cerebral group. Arty and slightly sinister. The legacy of Ian. I was myself very much surprised to see what a lot of fun a New Order concert was and was certainly not expecting all the pogoing that goes on.

22 Dec 2003, 13:55

here there´re 2 main perceptions. the dark one, and the gay disco one. there was an inflection point in 1989 when a local radio station started to put "new" music on the map. it was massive. so NO were mixed with DM, Erasure, Camouflage, Cetu Javu and other synthpop acts. but also with all the acid house crap that was going on at that moment. so for the ones that remember that time of their life as a good one, NO is perceived as part of the synthpop movement of the "late 80s". that´s the "mainstream" perception. but there were people listening to them before that. a small but consistent group of fans (more than 33 years old, today) that had JD as a main influence and they continued with the NO legacy but just a little. the same happens with the "new dark youth" (kids of 18/19) that used to like NIN, and realized that JD was the beginning of it all. so they put JD into a "goth" movement and idealize them. both generations now shake hands. i´m not in one or the other even though i passed the three stages. as i never been part of a movement like those i consider myself lucky to be able to open my mind a little more and enjoy other things.

22 Dec 2003, 15:37

I've always found Joy Division held up by both the "hip" indie kids (see references to Interpol, et al.) and those goth kids, but New Order has been forgotten as just another kitschy new wave band like DM, The Cure, et al. Which gets more play in America is debatable, but it's usually just the few mainstream hits like BM, LWTUA, BLT, TF, etc. that are still remembered. Everything else has slipped into obscurity.

22 Dec 2003, 16:06

Here is... "who the hell is New Order?"

Then they know 3 songs.. Blue Monday, True Faith and BLT if you make them listen to it...

As for being in american teen movies, it's just a phase.. 80's music is popular towards the youth, hence why No Doubt's It's My Life cover is #1 right now here...!!

Or the soundtrack producers are New Order fans...

Just I'd say when you say New Order, you say "80's band" to the majority...

Joy Division on the other hand, is COMPLETELY different.. most people probably don't know it's the same band... and probably most people here don't know Joy Division unless they are into alternative music (real one, not Linken Park)

22 Dec 2003, 18:25

Originally posted by His Holiness, The Pope I've always found Joy Division held up by both the "hip" indie kids (see references to Interpol, et al.) and those goth kids, but New Order has been forgotten as just another kitschy new wave band like DM, The Cure, et al. Which gets more play in America is debatable, but it's usually just the few mainstream hits like BM, LWTUA, BLT, TF, etc. that are still remembered. Everything else has slipped into obscurity.

If indie kids think any of those bands are new wave, they don't know jack shite about music. Even though they think they're the world's leading authorities.

22 Dec 2003, 18:36

Either my friends do not know who the hell they are, or they think they are a band for gays to listen to. As for JD, my friends have no idea who they were.

22 Dec 2003, 20:15

The only songs my American friends knew were BLT, BM and TF. It's pretty sad as here in Texas, New Order are known as an 80's club act! As for JD and my friends, forget about it!!! Although, I'd like to thank my wonderful friend, Steve in Ilkeston (hope you read this) who turned me into a JD nut in the early 90's. :love2:

23 Dec 2003, 04:00

Makes sense most of the time, but why the hell the Beverly Hills and teenie movies connection ?

23 Dec 2003, 10:00

Originally posted by Julijana Zitnjak Makes sense most of the time, but why the hell the Beverly Hills and teenie movies connection ?

What happened in Beverly Hills?

23 Dec 2003, 12:44

In America: "Damn, that was a shitty cover of Orgy's song!" :D

23 Dec 2003, 13:49

Originally posted by Spotnick > Originally posted by Julijana Zitnjak> Makes sense most of the time, but why the hell the Beverly Hills and teenie movies connection ?

What happened in Beverly Hills? first episode. the David Silver character wears a black t shirt with the new order members in organge. i remember that episode because i saw it yesterday here. Sony is repeating the whole series all over again. ;)

23 Dec 2003, 15:39

Originally posted by Julijana Zitnjak Makes sense most of the time, but why the hell the Beverly Hills and teenie movies connection ?

the john hughes films had some good music: echo and the bunnymen, the smiths, NO, etc., and while they were 'teen' films, i think they were more intelligent that most of the other crap geared toward that particular demographic at the time. guess hughes and his crowd just had good taste.

23 Dec 2003, 23:15

Originally posted by AgentWood > Originally posted by Julijana Zitnjak> Makes sense most of the time, but why the hell the Beverly Hills and teenie movies connection ?

the john hughes films had some good music: echo and the bunnymen, the smiths, NO, etc., and while they were 'teen' films, i think they were more intelligent that most of the other crap geared toward that particular demographic at the time. guess hughes and his crowd just had good taste. Having been forced to sit through "She's all that" and "A walk to remember," I'd take "Pretty in pink" any day. Then again, I actually like "The Breakfast club."

26 Dec 2003, 12:37

i remember one film where the main characters are in a band of some kind and on the wall of their studio is a massive poster of the factus 81-82 ep.

can anybody remember what that was?

27 Dec 2003, 13:33

Most people where I live don't seem to have heard of either NO or JD before. My country's still a little bit clueless about real music. Things are getting better, though.