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Barneys Voice: Why all the fuss?

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All I read here is gripes about Barneys voice. He is not Ian, personaly I don't want him to even try to sound like Ian. I can't think of a single song sung by Barney that I have issues with. I even like the Whoooops and HA's. Im as much a fan of Joy Division material as I am New Order, and a big part of what I like about New Order is Barney voice. But enough about what I like, what I want to know is...

...If you have a complaint or gripe about a certian way Barney sings a song (use examples) what would you prefer instead? Do you prefer he try to mimic Ian as much as possible for JD songs :confused2:, and stay as true to the orig. recordings as possible for the NO tracks :confused2:? Because thats the vibe I get here from most folks. Discuss.

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As above, except I don't want him to sing JD songs at the moment. It was great when the Order first dusted them off, but please dig out some of the lesser played New Order songs.

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If you want me to be REALLY harsh...

Well, on a good note first, I liked the way he sung on Movement (seriously!!) and the deadpan style of some of their earlier singles, and I think he reached his peak singing-wise on Technique and Republic. As for PC & L, brilliant album but I can't stand his strained high pitched attempts on Age of Consent and a few other tracks.
The same with Low-Life (particularly Face Up!) and on Brotherhood. And as for the lazy half-arsed singing on Get Ready!! :nonono:

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I do like Barney's voice, but I can't stand Ian's. For me, on songs like "Isolation," his voice sounds out of place. Some say that his voice wasn't as good on Get Ready as on Technique and Republic, but, on songs like "Crystal," I thought he did some of his best vocals, with the exception of Electronic's first album. However, this is only on the album. Live, the vocals for Crystal sound strained and for bad Technique vocals, watch the live performance of Mr. Disco on this site. But, then again, performances like the Montreaux Jazz festival and Reading 98 over shadow such bouts of laziness.

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My favorite singer is Ian Curtis. His voice is the most powerful I have ever heard.

As for Barney, I've always liked his voice...one of my top 5 favorite singers.

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they have a right to play those JD songs since they wrote them. But I others are right, I'd wish they'd dig out some old forgotten NO tunes. Imagine if they open their next gig with We All Stand or Hurt? Bring back EGG or TPK. Why not do Primative Notion? Skullcrusher with the Barcelona lyrics? End the set with LWTUA followed by Your Silent face.

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Hear Hear...

remember he only took over vocal duties because he was the best out of the rest of the band at singing and no one else could play the guitar and sing at the same time!

New Orders music has never been about pitch perfect vocals and it never will be.

But does it stop us from enjoying their music... Of course not!!!

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Howsabout Hooky trying the JD songs live? His voice is naturally lower, so it should fit better? (And he doesn't tend to whoop...)

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Originally posted by Jeff The Chef Howsabout Hooky trying the JD songs live? His voice is naturally lower, so it should fit better? (And he doesn't tend to whoop...)

He'd chew up too many mics :evil4:

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I bet he wouldn't need the autocue though..... :wink:

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I seem to remember dissenting voices in "Last Orders" bitching about how Bernard had been taking singing lessons around the time of "Technique". Not very punk rock and all that.

You're damned if you do.......

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Ah...The Village..

Hooky cannot sing either. Sure his voice may be lower but live it is neveer loud enough. Took him quite a long time to get Dreams Never End down. Listen to the Monaco gig and you can barely hear him when he sings. Besides, singing and playing bass at the same time plus his stage antics = disaster. Let Hooky do what he does best.

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Lets admit, barneys voice is not the hihgest or best,sometimes hes shocking live....... BUT THATS WHY WE LOVE EM........... :nod:

regards :nuts:

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Originally posted by :nuts:nuts Lets admit, barneys voice is not the hihgest or best,sometimes hes shocking live.......BUT THATS WHY WE LOVE EM........... :nod:regards:nuts:

:clap: :clap: :clap: :clap: :clap: :clap: :clap: :clap:

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I love his voice, except for Ceremony during that Ukranian gig. Wish I was listening to him now instead of my wife...

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Not the 1st i have heard that particular lament re Shevchenko's Ceremony, but i have to say i like it. Really brings out the weak desperation in the song. Although someone said it sounded like Bernard couldn't speak English so i may be wrong! :nuts:

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RE: Taras, there's something going on on that stage in that gig, Barney is distracted and edgy the whole time. It could just be the death of Ian, but it seems like there is more to it, could have been a nightmare gig or something.....and he Does get a lip spike during Temptaion ( to quote our engineer on the subject when we were playing stateside "dry your eyes, this is the USA, it's only 110V it won't kill you".....of course NO would have been using their own gear with a step up transformer.

As for the boy Barney....look....fact....he can't sing ( and he can't sing in a register above the one I can't sing in, which gets on my baps something awful when I'm trying to howl along). If Barney entered pop idol, he'd be out in the prelim's, out with all the fake tan karaoke singing pondlfe, long before they weed out the ones with any spark of creative talent. BUT, he has his moments, and even at other times, his inability to sing is what makes him what he is. If he'd been some obnoxious little stage school tyke, he'd have learned scales and music theory and breathing [1]. None of our favourite songs would have happened. His lack of ability goes hand in hand with a musical innocence, an innocence which is at the core of all things New Order.[2] I think what really openned my eyes wasn't so much the accapella of Crystal that's out there somewhere, on which he sings perfectly ( for him). Rather it was the dub mix of AoC. Barney's vox on AoC, as has been mentioned here, are shrill and kinda crappy. However, mixing them up front and dry, far from being painful, lends a certain frail beauty to them. It puts Barney in the same category as all those other great singers who can't ( only one's to come to mind right now are Robert Wyatt, Jim Morrison ( much as I dislike the doors) and of course Ian, whose vocals get more powerful the more he wanders in his accuracy). Again it's down to the innocence of the sound. You hear someone singing what their heart wishes to sing, and I would rather hear that than a perfect performance of something sterile.

[1] Barney has the lung capacity of a blue whale. Having tried to coherently sing True Faith, I can tell you, I had NO breath left for whoops. [2] And herein lies the problem with them doing JD songs these days, all the Whooping and popstar antics during them are not only not in the spirit of the tunes, they are not in the spirit many of us admire in JD/NO in general. Makes me cringe to be honest, which is a shame because they can do bloody good version when they control themselves ( H+S at reading, and Peel Isolation come to mind)

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Originally posted by Steve Campbell [2] And herein lies the problem with them doing JD songs these days, all the Whooping and popstar antics during them are not only not in the spirit of the tunes, they are not in the spirit many of us admire in JD/NO in general. Makes me cringe to be honest, which is a shame because they can do bloody good version when they control themselves ( H+S at reading, and Peel Isolation come to mind)

Well I for one don't mind the whooping, except in something like "Atmosphere" (what's next, whooping in "Lonesome Tonight", should they bring it back to stage again?). At least it proves that Barney doesn't think of those songs as the highest art on planet, which is a bonus in my book. :clap:

And since NO are now, without Gillian, a force that's driven by mainly testosterone, I've no problems with those party antics. I think they might even be going over-the-top with it intentionally, what with Hooky being even more hilariously masculine and "rawk'n'roll" in the 511 DVD than before. ;)

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Originally posted by Steve Campbell RE: Taras, there's something going on on that stage in that gig, Barney is distracted and edgy the whole time. It could just be the death of Ian, but it seems like there is more to it, could have been a nightmare gig or something.....

He was off his face - his first experiences of Ecstacy were on that tour, combined with just about everything else he could get his hands on. Look at those eyes, he is steaming anxiety at times!

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But he came back with a stellar performance of Denial and one of the best renditions of Temptation IMHO.

Further anxiety may have been because this venue was slected because two other clubs were bickering.

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Originally posted by Steve Campbell As for the boy Barney....look....fact....he can't sing ( and he can't sing in a register above the one I can't sing in, which gets on my baps something awful when I'm trying to howl along).If Barney entered pop idol, he'd be out in the prelim's, out with all the fake tan karaoke singing pondlfe, long before they weed out the ones with any spark of creative talent.BUT, he has his moments, and even at other times, his inability to sing is what makes him what he is. If he'd been some obnoxious little stage school tyke, he'd have learned scales and music theory and breathing [1]. None of our favourite songs would have happened. His lack of ability goes hand in hand with a musical innocence, an innocence which is at the core of all things New Order.[2]I think what really openned my eyes wasn't so much the accapella of Crystal that's out there somewhere, on which he sings perfectly ( for him). Rather it was the dub mix of AoC. Barney's vox on AoC, as has been mentioned here, are shrill and kinda crappy. However, mixing them up front and dry, far from being painful, lends a certain frail beauty to them. It puts Barney in the same category as all those other great singers who can't ( only one's to come to mind right now are Robert Wyatt, Jim Morrison ( much as I dislike the doors) and of course Ian, whose vocals get more powerful the more he wanders in his accuracy). Again it's down to the innocence of the sound. You hear someone singing what their heart wishes to sing, and I would rather hear that than a perfect performance of something sterile.[1] Barney has the lung capacity of a blue whale. Having tried to coherently sing True Faith, I can tell you, I had NO breath left for whoops.[2] And herein lies the problem with them doing JD songs these days, all the Whooping and popstar antics during them are not only not in the spirit of the tunes, they are not in the spirit many of us admire in JD/NO in general. Makes me cringe to be honest, which is a shame because they can do bloody good version when they control themselves ( H+S at reading, and Peel Isolation come to mind)

Always LOVED his voice, it has a frail authenticity to it, and the Idol cr@p means nothing to me. Isn't this why Ian is Ian, and Mariah and Whitney will be forgotten? Listen to a Smokey Robinson, or a Marvin Gaye song, and you see the very same thing that's been lost, truly talented vocalists who sing with a sense of authenticity. You believe them.

That's what also makes Ian and Barney so powerful as vocalists in spite of their limitations. Ian often sounded to me like he had some awful frog in his throat, I was never impressed with the pure technical ability. But his vocals were always exceedingly powerful, and immensely authentic, and you believed him, you believed that he felt what he was singing. The same applies/applied to Barney. Listen to PCL and you believe it, listen to Low-life and you believe it, listen to True Faith, or to Technique and his heart is on his sleeve or at least he sings like it is.

Maybe that's why some don't enjoy him as they used too? Because he sounds a lil more satisfied and contented, so the the same plainative quality to his voice might not be quite there anymore. All I know is that I have always loved his work as a vocalist, loved the sound of his voice, and loved the way he emoted the lyrics with a real sense of authenticity. Listen to Leave Me Alone, Lonesome Tonight, 1963, True Faith, the whole of Technique, or This Time of Night, and you believe Barney means it just as much as Ian did in Atrocity Exhibition. That's my sense anyway and that's why he's an amazing vocalist inspite of his obvious limitations.

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Originally posted by Steve Campbell You hear someone singing what their heart wishes to sing, and I would rather hear that than a perfect performance of something sterile.

Beautiful!!!! :clap: Hmmm ... I wish I wrote this :wink:

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Steve

Have you seen New Order live? It ain't about em sounding like the records, there is an energy between the band and audience.

84 was a good year :nod:

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I think some of you may have missed the point. Barney is good because he is crap. I do not hear what he IS singing very often, rather I hear what he is TRYING to sing. Maybe that's the difference between NO fans and lesser lifeforms, we have the babel fish in our ears that translates Barney :-) Oh and yes, I think the autocie has deprived us of that innocence a little, not to mention lyric rewrites, I miss those, still at least when he DOES do it you know it was on purpose :-)

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Crap is a bit harsh. Yes he sometimes sings notes that only he knows.

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