Given that they're releasing WFTSC as a single - a track that features the most amount of autotuner on Bernard's voice ever heard since Electronic's "Freefall" - and the fact that he appears to have succumbed to lyrical dementia, should Bernard be sacked?
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No need for Bernard?
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Probably should be. This song could have been excellent if the chorus followed on from the verse more smoothly and the if the keyboards in the chorus didnt sound like some dated casio effort.
No. He's still a good singer, and IS New Order in a way. They should all collaborate with song writing, not be like those Oasis fags who just get Noel to do it all...
No. He's still a good singer, and IS New Order in a way. They should all collaborate with song writing, not be like those Oasis fags who just get Noel to do it all...
Auto tuner, WTF shutup! I highly doubt Bernard cheats by using one of those. It's all very prepared and planned out when it comes to studio work, where as live it all goes out the window.
yeah,sack him. theres loads of people that could replace him. Gary Barlows doing fuck all nowdays,singing with NO beats working at Runcorns drive-thru KFC.
i've been wondering if there was autotune- it does sound like it but then the whole vocal treatment is a bit odd- why keep in the breaths in the verse (techniquey almost) but then overlap in the chorus? I'm sure someone tech could explain- please do.
I doubt there was much modification, if any, on Bernard's vocals. He has improved tremendously as a vocalist...live the issue is both stage fright and laziness as a defense mechanism. From Brotherhood onward he came into his own, and is absolutely the most underrated vocalist of his generation. He's the main songwriter, and always has been. Sacking him is like sacking Hooky or Steve...then the group really wouldn't be NO.
They should definitely keep Bernard. Without his vocals, New Order wouldn't be New Order. It'd like be listening to Monaco or something. And I have a question. What was the reference to Electronic's Freefall in previous posts in this thread?
sugarcane wrote: i've been wondering if there was autotune- it does sound like it but then the whole vocal treatment is a bit odd- why keep in the breaths in the verse (techniquey almost) but then overlap in the chorus? I'm sure someone tech could explain- please do.
Nothing odd about the vocal treatment really. The vocal has been compressed VERY heavily(limiting the dynamic range) as is pretty much the norm these days to help it sit in the mix steadier. As a result, when you compress that hard, you're going to bring up the breath noises louder into the vocal. It's purely a production decision, but if you edit or gate out all the breath noises it tends to sound a bit un-natural. The other defining characteristic of the vocal in this song is the EQ. The lows have been rolled off a bit and boosted the highs boosted for a bit of sheen. You're also hearing a very slight delay created by what possibly sounds like a plate type reverb panned somewhere left and right. During the choruses you're hearing a mix of several different vocal tracks to help thicken it up. What it all comes down to is what the band, producers, mix engineers, and record label decided the production should sound like. The reason the chorus vocal starts as the verse is finishing is most likely an artistic choice and what happened to fit the song.
As for Auto-tune, it's no big secret that it's widely used in a number of productions for a number of reasons. Do they tune Barney's vocals at all? Only the engineers and the band know for certain. Most times you'll never hear it, other times it's pretty obvious. Vocal tuning of one form or another has been around for a long time and used for a variety of reasons. You can believe what you want to believe, but bear in mind that recording, mixing, and producing an album is a very deliberate and involved process aimed at putting out the best possible sounding product.
Thanks very much, I find all this techy stuff really fascinating. I was interested to hear you coment on thickening up- i always think of that word expecially in connection with the vocals but also the overall sound- it sounds very thick and solid around the middle, and i have to say i'm more of a fan of sound with lots of space and dimension to it, like i think how NO used to sound. Is there a smiley for nostalgia?
Bentley's probably right on most of that mix stuff.
I think it was Stephen Hague that helped Barney with vocal training, although Bernard may have started practicing his singing more before that.
Vocal takes, especially these days, are a compilation of several different takes. Bernard, known for being meticulous about keyboard sequencing and the rest of it, is probably pretty hard on himself as a singer. You can tell by the strain he put in during Taras. He was searching for his range at that stage, sometimes he nails it ("Everything's Gone Green"), and sometimes he blows it on the songs the band has rehearsed most ("Ceremony" in point from that concert). On PCL, his pitch varies, high and low, but he corrected those problems more and more from album to album.
Maybe on some tracks they tune the vocals, but the band also writes in keys that fit Barney's voice, something they did not think about doing earlier in their career.
From the recordings I have heard from this year's gigging Barney sounds like Barney--Far from perfect even on established tunes, especially on the WFTSC songs. The Oxegen broadcast is a great example of this.
Dave Stephenson wrote: Given that they're releasing WFTSC as a single - a track that features the most amount of autotuner on Bernard's voice ever heard since Electronic's "Freefall" - and the fact that he appears to have succumbed to lyrical dementia, should Bernard be sacked?
no barney!!! DONT TALK SHIT get a course of personality alignment mate this is offically now my vote for most stupid thread
But I totally agree. NO wouldn't be NO without Barney. Maybe it's just that this evolving and changing of NO as I remember them reminds me of my age. 
When Ian McCullough "left" Echo and the Bunneymen it was the end of Echo as I knew it. I didn't even bother buying that one album.
its like crackers without cheese
coke without vodka
forums without digital mike
rivalry without burnley dingles
Barney Army wrote: Salt 'n Peppers here
salt and pepper are there.huh.two dancing,singing girls in ya house???
bansheeman wrote:
Dave Stephenson wrote: Given that they're releasing WFTSC as a single - a track that features the most amount of autotuner on Bernard's voice ever heard since Electronic's "Freefall" - and the fact that he appears to have succumbed to lyrical dementia, should Bernard be sacked?
no barney!!! DONT TALK SHIT get a course of personality alignment mate this is offically now my vote for most stupid thread
Yeah, it's right up there with the Holographic/Android Ian thread and the iCurtis avatar!!
Dave Stephenson wrote: Given that they're releasing WFTSC as a single - a track that features the most amount of autotuner on Bernard's voice ever heard since Electronic's "Freefall" - and the fact that he appears to have succumbed to lyrical dementia, should Bernard be sacked?
He would have to sack himself ofcourse..And I think you are just having a dafty arnt ye?
bLuE oRdEr wrote: Bernard's a great vocalist. Better than the other guy they used to have.
Let's not forget that the other guy *supposedly* used electronic modification of his voice for that low baritone.
His Holiness, The Pope wrote:
bLuE oRdEr wrote: Bernard's a great vocalist. Better than the other guy they used to have.
Let's not forget that the other guy *supposedly* used electronic modification of his voice for that low baritone.
hey your holliness! How are you? Still hollier than thou? I saw you in Oakland. You wrere all in Movement. Remember me? Yo!!
