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FYI - CONTROL Update - Ian Curtis has been cast

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AgentWood wrote:

Johnny wrote: Well , i hope he does a better job than Sean Harris did in 24HPP.I'm probably on my own here but i thought he was shit as Ian.

sean harris may not look like ian, but i thought his movements were spot on.

anybody could do an Ian dance if they put some effort into it.I've tried it myself sometimes:laugh:

When i went to see my mates band ,Painsville ,in a pub gig last December they invited me to sing on their cover of Transmission.I was tempted but just didn't have the bottle:\ohwell:

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JonnyMac wrote:

Nicky wrote:

I do agree with you, I'm English, but still, it doesn't bother me. I'm not a manc, but I live near there. I'm from Hull, anyone know where that is?

Of course, it's just over the Quebec border from Ottawa.

Actually, I am more concerned that the bloke can do the stage presence and the dancing.

Mind you we Irish have been much abused by Hollywood accent wise (Think Tom Cruise in Home And Away). Then there was that film with Sinead O'Connor in it where they gave out language cards for the audience in America so that they could understand it. They may have done this with The Commitments too if I remember correctly.

Still its disappointing that yerman Cillian Murphy didn't get the job. Would have been great to hear Curtis in a Cork accent.

Dis is de wey, step inside la.

Jonathan. Cork.

Ha! Ha! Ha! I'm English, I wasn't aware of there being a Hull in Canada...but, last time I checked...I'm a 100% Brit. English Hull.

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You've heard the one about the Brandsholme bird and the ice cream cornet?

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AgentWood wrote:

[orange]depthcharge[/orange] wrote: I don't know that you can equate English and Australian actors doing US accents with US actors doing UK/AU accents, unfortunately. There have been (and still are, look no further than Lost for a dire example) so many cases of American actors struggling to do international English accents over the years.

what american actor on lost is pretending to be english? the only englishman i can think of on the show is charlie, and he's played by dominic monaghan--from stockport. :scratch:

Aussies, not English. Using the term "English" a bit more broadly.

Plenty of bit parts in Series One. A lot of the background stories were supposed to be located in Aus but clearly weren't. Several actors made a complete hash of the accent. Couldn't work out why they wouldn't fly a few Aussie actors out to Hawaii or wherever it was being filmed.

:\pimp3:

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AgentWood wrote:

[orange]depthcharge[/orange] wrote: The sad fact is that almost everyone in the English-speaking world can pull off a reasonable American accent. You needn't even be an actor!

oh, god no. when my british, australian, kiwi and south african friends try american accents it always ends in disaster (and many laughs all around)!

They sound a bit hopeless!

I suspect they'd do a better job than most Americans do of English, Aussie, et al, accents.

The US accent is so pervasive. Look at how many people move to the States and pick up the accent in no time, or at least start waxing in that nasty "Mid-Atlantic" hybrid. I can't think of any Americans I know here who sound like a local.

:\pimp3:

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[orange]depthcharge[/orange] wrote:

AgentWood wrote:

[orange]depthcharge[/orange] wrote: The sad fact is that almost everyone in the English-speaking world can pull off a reasonable American accent. You needn't even be an actor!

oh, god no. when my british, australian, kiwi and south african friends try american accents it always ends in disaster (and many laughs all around)!

They sound a bit hopeless!

I suspect they'd do a better job than most Americans do of English, Aussie, et al, accents.

The US accent is so pervasive. Look at how many people move to the States and pick up the accent in no time, or at least start waxing in that nasty "Mid-Atlantic" hybrid. I can't think of any Americans I know here who sound like a local.

:\pimp3:

i don't know any brits, aussies, etc. who live here who have american accents! i can still pinpoint the county they come from (or london borough) if they're british, or if they're aussie, kiwi, or from south africa--even if they've lived here for 25 years. when i lived in london, near the end of my 2nd year i had people who didn't believe that i was american; they thought i was from london. i didn't realize i was speaking any different, i just picked it up, i guess. not sure if i can do it anymore, though.

as for charlize theron--she had lots of coaching to rid herself of her afrikaaner accent.

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sam riley is not american , i can assure you , i have known him my whole life. i realy dont think they could of found anyone better to play the late great mr curtis

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AgentWood wrote: i don't know any brits, aussies, etc. who live here who have american accents! i can still pinpoint the county they come from (or london borough) if they're british, or if they're aussie, kiwi, or from south africa--even if they've lived here for 25 years. when i lived in london, near the end of my 2nd year i had people who didn't believe that i was american; they thought i was from london. i didn't realize i was speaking any different, i just picked it up, i guess. not sure if i can do it anymore, though.

I'm afraid that your experiences exist in some bizarre parallel universe to mine, AW. I know of plenty of people who've spent barely a week in the US and have started picking up an accent.

I get the impression that your experiences being a traveller aren't quite representative of your nation as a whole (as is that case for many of your arguments on these boards!). It's pretty well-documented that US citizens aren't the greatest nation of travellers outside of their borders and even when they do, they often take their little world along with them. Not directed at you personally, but a trend all the same.

A weight of evidence suggests that English-speakers from outside the US can generally mimic and/or pick up an American accent quite easily. And yet Americans generally struggle to pick up other English-speaking accents as easily.

The reasons are as clear as day. We are so bombarded with US culture here from the day we start watching Sesame Street as a toddler until the day we die in front of The Young & The Restless. A scary thought. Your accents and cultural traits become second nature to us. Yet most of the US is traditionally so immersed in its own culture that the reciprocal argument simply doesn't work. They don't have the same endless exposure to other English-speaking TV and film to afford them easy reproduction of other accents.

Does this have an effect on American actors' abilities to reproduce accents for films and TV? I'd argue yes - to an extent, as the backlash on this thread would suggest. Recent memories of American actors murdering Aussie accents in Lost, or Don Cheadle's Mockney or Renee Zellwegger's Bwidget don't have too many reciprocal accent crimes in the US. Most English, Aussie and Kiwi actors sound more seamless in their US accents. Exceptions exist, although I'm struggling to come up with an American who's ever mastered an Aussie accent. Meryl Streep possiby came the closest in "A Cry in the Dark" (Evil Angels). Perhaps Mel Gibson still has it in him, who knows.

:\pimp3:

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ben cruse wrote: sam riley is not american , i can assure you , i have known him my whole life. i realy dont think they could of found anyone better to play the late great mr curtis

Think I just heard a general sigh of relief from this thread.

So for those of us who don't know jack about him, can you tell us why he's so perfect for the role?

:\pimp3:

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some people can do accents, some can't. some people loose their accents some don't. the same goes for actors.

yes there a large number of Aussies in Hollywood who can do good American accents, like heath ledger, and hugh jack man. some like Anthony la pagila and mel gibson can't even speak aussie anymore. some like old rutsty, yes i know he's a kiwi, but he call Australia home, don't even try to speak american. there is a reasonably famous singer in oz, jimmy barnes, who came out here when he was about three years of age, and still speaks with a noticeably scottish accent

from personal experience. almost nobody can tell that i come from Germany. i usually get south africa, on new zealand, both yuck, or even no accent depending on how tired an/or emotional i am. my brother doesn't have an accent at all. i have a friend who came out to this wide brown land about the same time i did, who still has the thickest german accent going, and will never loose it. i know any number of people from englad schotland, canada, and the usa here who have been here for 20 or even 30 years who will never loose their accents.

if need be i think i can do a decent american accent, just give me two weeks over there. a northern english accent could be a bit more difficult, but i've had a good 20 years to practice that one.

so in conclusion. some people/actors as some actors lose their accents, or can do accents, and some never lose their accent of origin, and can't do other accents. granted some accents are more difficult to achieve than others. dc has a point. most people in the english speaking world given a little time can do a more than passable mid western american accent, as yes we have been exposed to it for so long.

the argument is dead as he's a pom anyway, so he shouldn't have too much trouble portraying an Englishman.

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Can a Leeds lad pull of a manc accent ?

*stir* *stir*

Why couldn't they have gone for a Macclesfield lad?

:evil:

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Nicky wrote:

JonnyMac wrote:

Nicky wrote:

I do agree with you, I'm English, but still, it doesn't bother me. I'm not a manc, but I live near there. I'm from Hull, anyone know where that is?

Of course, it's just over the Quebec border from Ottawa.

Actually, I am more concerned that the bloke can do the stage presence and the dancing.

Mind you we Irish have been much abused by Hollywood accent wise (Think Tom Cruise in Home And Away). Then there was that film with Sinead O'Connor in it where they gave out language cards for the audience in America so that they could understand it. They may have done this with The Commitments too if I remember correctly.

Still its disappointing that yerman Cillian Murphy didn't get the job. Would have been great to hear Curtis in a Cork accent.

Dis is de wey, step inside la.

Jonathan. Cork.

Ha! Ha! Ha! I'm English, I wasn't aware of there being a Hull in Canada...but, last time I checked...I'm a 100% Brit. English Hull.

Hull, Canada - pronounced 'ull.

Hull, U.K. - home of the Housemartins. Happy hour again. Hull 4 - 0 'ull

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[orange]depthcharge[/orange] wrote:

A weight of evidence suggests that English-speakers from outside the US can generally mimic and/or pick up an American accent quite easily. And yet Americans generally struggle to pick up other English-speaking accents as easily.

but can they fool an american with their accents? just as an aussie probably isn't fooled when an american plays an aussie (even though the accent might sound perfect to an american), or a brit isn't fooled when an american plays a brit (while an american might be), americans can tell when someone is butchering a regional american accent or when they're doing it well. ian holm, for example, tries his best when he plays an american, but you can tell he's british, particularly when he speaks quickly.

when i saw 'fargo' with some scottish friends (in scotland), they couldn't understand the humour of the 'minnesota nice' accent, which is part of what makes the film so funny. in fact, they couldn't pinpoint the regional accent at all.

you're right, american culture is very pervasive, but it's as hard to fool an american as it is to fool someone with another english accent. it takes a lot of training to perfect any accent. nobody who hasn't had training can spend a week, a month, or even a year in the US and fool an american with their 'american' accent! same goes for the UK, australia, new zealand, etc.

edit: BTW, you're right. my travel experiences aren't 'normal' for an average american. but that's just fine with me. my experiences are my own--whether i'm american, british, or bloody mongolian.;)

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The next Ian...?

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The next Ian...?

Gawd.. I hope not. Spider-man just doesn't seem to make a good Ian. Unless he goes spastic, dances and stops web-spinning, wall crawling.

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Ronald Kirsch wrote: from personal experience. almost nobody can tell that i come from Germany. i usually get south africa, on new zealand, both yuck....

For an Aussie that's like the pot calling the kettle black, seeing as strine is so easy on the ear

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shot bru wrote:

Ronald Kirsch wrote: from personal experience. almost nobody can tell that i come from Germany. i usually get south africa, on new zealand, both yuck....

For an Aussie that's like the pot calling the kettle black, seeing as strine is so easy on the ear

i prefer the educated oz form of speech. i may be a bit biased, but of all the english accents it is probably the most pleasant form of spoken english. i agree with you on strine though. i don't want to start some debate on which ist the best form of english out there. this is just a personal opinion.

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[orange]depthcharge[/orange] wrote: Plenty of bit parts in Series One. A lot of the background stories were supposed to be located in Aus but clearly weren't. Several actors made a complete hash of the accent. Couldn't work out why they wouldn't fly a few Aussie actors out to Hawaii or wherever it was being filmed.

Not an expert on Lost, but you're right. Didn't the Hobbit have a brother in the series who appeared to be born somewhere between Kings X, London, and Kings X, Sydney. Accent all over the shop.

The point I was making about accents, is that Curtis has a regional accent. He's not a Cor Blimey Cockerney. He's a Norverner. Have American actors perfected such accents in any way?! The only example I can think of in living memory is Northern Bint Daphne Moon having a Mockerney barra-boy bruvver in 'Frasier'. Luv a duck.

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isn't every accent a 'regional' accent? the man who played daphne's brother on those embarassing episodes of frasier was playing a cockney; that's regional. sarf london--regional. sloane ranger--regional (if that's the word for it). i have a regional accent--or at least i used to. when i moved to boston, people knew i was from 'out west' even though i was oblivious as to the subtleties of my accent. the only thing i knew was that i said 'pop' while everyone else said 'soda.' now i suppose i have the multi-regional 'generic american accent.'

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Think 'regional' dialects and accents have fairly specific meaning in the UK.

As you mention, there are different accents across London, but true regional dialects are more distinct in their boundaries outside of the South-East.

There have been movements recently trying to preserve 'regional dialects' from being diluted out of existence by the 'Estuary English' of the South-East.

Down here, you'd only delineate between the generic Australian spoken in most capital cities and the 'regional' variants in a few rural areas.

:\pimp3:

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Al Jarvis wrote: Not an expert on Lost, but you're right. Didn't the Hobbit have a brother in the series who appeared to be born somewhere between Kings X, London, and Kings X, Sydney. Accent all over the shop.

All over the shop and he wasn't the worst of them. Having re-watched the first series recently, it was cringeful stuff. Air hostesses, police commissioners, relatives and fortune-tellers all managed to sound like Shane Warne's Saffer cousin living with a roomful of boozy Kiwis in Hackney. But the worst accent crimes were committed by an old duck who was supposed to be shacked up in Kalgoorlie, of all places. Where the 'Strine twang should be as thick as two planks. Instead she sounded more Afrikaaner than anything else identifiable.

Just downloading the final few episodes of series two now and things have improved a little. Not as much action set in Aus this time around!

:\pimp3:

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[orange]depthcharge[/orange] wrote: Think 'regional' dialects and accents have fairly specific meaning in the UK.

they do here, as well. boston, new york/northern new jersey, chicago, minnesota nice, louisiana cajun, smooth georgia drawl, texan, philly, SoCal, etc.

the worst butchering of an aussie accent on lost that i noticed has to be claire's friend (the one who took her to the fortune teller). appalling.

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Yes, Sam Riley as in 10,000 THINGS.

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Sam riley isn't American, he's a Yorkshire boy and he is (apparently) doing a very good job.

Here is the link to the working website, which is updated as filming commences. There are links to someones blog which has pictures of the filming process on there:

http://members.aol.com/lwtua/these.htm

Here is the link to the actual website once the film is finished:

http://www.controlthemovie.com/

and the picture on the homepage is of Sam Riley... a pretty good likening I think.

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the mcphun wrote:

Here is the link to the actual website once the film is finished:

http://www.controlthemovie.com/

and the picture on the homepage is of Sam Riley... a pretty good likening I think.

I'm pretty sure the picture is actually of Ian isn't it?

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Yeah it is. I have used to have that on my wall.. as a youth..........

:bag:

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There's a picture of Sam Riley as Ian in this month's Mojo magazine...green raincoat, red shirt etc.

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Ok, it probably is then, but I was informed otherwise.

I know there was a load of promo shots done of him mimicking Ian, so I just assumed that would be one of them.

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lampkin wrote: Yes, Sam Riley as in 10,000 THINGS.

Welcome Sam! How's the filming going so far?

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