best/worst producer for New Order?

Who's the best and worst producers that New Order have ever worked with?

I'd say Hannett as best, John Robie as worst.

See, I wouldn't put Hannett as best, because his work is uneven. If you said JD/NO, then I would concede that Hannett was probably the best, if only for Closer.

NO themselves produced PCL and Technique, didn't they? Those records are their most lively albums. Of course I guess they also produced Low Life and Brotherhood, both of which sound slightly submerged here and there.

As far as Bernard goes, I would say Stephen Hague was a good match for him. It sounds like he really made Bernard get disciplined about the vocals, word for word, phrase for phrase.

best: the band themselves worst: Stephen Hague

Foreign F**kwitt wrote: best: the band themselves worst: Stephen Hague

Agree completely.Robie was just passing thru',but they let Hague back for a second go!!! Hague in,Hooky's out.Bad.Very bad.Look at Republic for fucks' sake!!! Someone tell him there's only room for 1 PSB....

Wouldn't mind hearing Rick Rubin producing the stuff, or Liam Howlett.

John Robie was the dog's bollox wasn't he?

Arthur Baker just beats hannet i think, Especially lonesome tonight.

Hannet was good for the more miserable stuff, butI don't think he could have done up tempo stuff like baker.

John robbie should be locked up, and the let the bugger mess up twice, don't forget shelshock!

Hague wasnt bad but as commented above, not enough hooky.

I like all the stuff the produced themselves, remember technology has come a long way since low life and brotherhood, and they didn't the experience and genius of Hannet.

conclusion: AB = Best JR = Worst

just putting my flame proof jacket on in preperation of being shot down in flames by old hannet fans!

[brown]Ally[/brown] wrote: Everyone naming Hague as their worst producer must really hate Regret, True Faith and 1963! Not to mention Ruined In A Day and Everyone Everywhere

What god awful songs they all are erm, yeah.

Hague produced and co-wrote some of NO's best work so he's my favourite producer, Robie the worst for pretty obvious reasons.

The only decent tune I think Hannett did with New Order (he was untouchable with JD's stuff) was Everything's Gone Green and maybe Dreams Never End. The rest didn't make any sort of impression on me I.e. the bulk of Movement.

i have to agree that regret is one of the best NO songs, but the rest of republic just doesn't have enough hooky and i prefered AB's remix of 1963 (more hooky!)

i liked john leckie for his work with the stone roses, and krafty had a really nice crispy sound to it when i first heard it. hague, as a whole, is an awesome pop producer while price is an awesome dance music producer. whether these all translated well for new order's music, depends i guess.

i vote for hannett, just because he comes across as a mad scientist, but strong mentions to the band themselves.

Did Hannett produce all the singles leading up to PC&L?

Anyway, I'd probably have to go with the the bands themselves are my favorite producers.

Hague and Baker had some good stuff.

Regret and True Faith puts Stephen Hague in first spot for me.

Best: Arthur Baker Worst: John Robie

Robie. No if's no buts. Anyone remember the "John Robie Must Die" shirts?

Best... ah, that's a lot harder. New Order.

Best : New Order Worst : Robie

I think at this stage in their career New Order need a complete change of direction as they are getting a bit stale.

I think the next album should be an Instrumentals Only Soundtrack for the film "Control" played in the style of Joy Division (but not the actual Joy Division songs). Someone like Brian Eno would be a great producer for a project like this. Just listen to the instrumental tracks of "Atmosphere", "The Eternal" or even "Elegia" and imagine how good a new album of this kind of stuff might sound.

I'm afraid with the band now all aged around the 50 mark it is
getting a bit embarrassing with them doing teeny pop numbers like "Jetstream" etc. Time to move on I think.

Best: Stephen Hague, Martin Hannett, Arthur Baker Decent job: Stuart Price Worst: John Robie

Adam Tate wrote: I think the next album should be an Instrumentals Only Soundtrack for the film "Control" played in the style of Joy Division...Time to move on I think.

Talk about moving on! Joy Division was 30 years ago. An album's worth of instrumentals done in the style of music they wrote when they were just starting out would lead to me instantly writing the band off for good. That is a totally lame idea.

I know Jetstream doesn't get much love in this forum but it's got a decent hook and you have to admit that feeling strongly about it (positive or negative) is better than having no reaction at all. At least it got them radio play and brought them to a wider audience. An album of Joy Divisionesque instrumentals would be commercial suicide.

£50 Note wrote:

Talk about moving on! Joy Division was 30 years ago. An album's worth of instrumentals done in the style of music they wrote when they were just starting out would lead to me instantly writing the band off for good. That is a totally lame idea.

I know Jetstream doesn't get much love in this forum but it's got a decent hook and you have to admit that feeling strongly about it (positive or negative) is better than having no reaction at all. At least it got them radio play and brought them to a wider audience. An album of Joy Divisionesque instrumentals would be commercial suicide.

Yes but surely at this stage of New Order's career I'm sure massive sales figures are not that important either to us the fans or even to the band (how many yachts does Barney need?).

OK your correct in that Joy Division style instrumentals would not sell to Joe Public - but what is more important sales or doing something with a little integrity?

Adam Tate wrote: but what is more important sales or doing something with a little integrity?

Trying imitate the classic Joy Division sound shows zero integrity for a band 30 years removed from that time. Not only would it not sell, but as a fan I'd take it as a big insult and a strong indicator that the band needs to call it quits.

£50 Note wrote:

Trying imitate the classic Joy Division sound shows zero integrity for a band 30 years removed from that time. Not only would it not sell, but as a fan I'd take it as a big insult and a strong indicator that the band needs to call it quits.

I'm afraid a song like "Jetstream" - where a record company executive suggests roping in Ana Mantronic to boost sales - does have zero integrity. This is not the kind of thing I would expect of New Order.

The "Control" soundtrack idea would be a one off project. I for one would much rather have a "Control" soundtrack featuring sensitive interpretations of Joy Division music by New Order rather than some corny remake of LWTUA by U2 or Coldplay etc.

I am not suggesting New Order go back to sounding exactly like Joy Divisiom 30 years ago - that would be lame. However, maybe with the help of a new producer they could take elements of the Joy Division sound to forge a modern, forward looking style. I'm sure I am not the only fan, who if they are honest with themselves, has been a tad bored by the last 2 or 3 New Order albums.

[brown]Ally[/brown] wrote: Everyone naming Hague as their worst producer must really hate Regret, True Faith and 1963! Not to mention Ruined In A Day and Everyone Everywhere

What god awful songs they all are erm, yeah.

Hague produced and co-wrote some of NO's best work so he's my favourite producer, Robie the worst for pretty obvious reasons.

The only decent tune I think Hannett did with New Order (he was untouchable with JD's stuff) was Everything's Gone Green and maybe Dreams Never End. The rest didn't make any sort of impression on me I.e. the bulk of Movement.

You do have a valid point,& I've said before,how the fuck Hague gets a writing credit for Regret is beyond me considering how the rest of Republic turned out.What did he do,just let Hooky have one track so he didn't feel left out?? & altho' TF & 1963 are perfectly good pop N.O.,it's a very untypical N.O. sound,too lightweight & too PSB.

[brown]Ally[/brown] wrote:

mark kelly wrote: You do have a valid point,& I've said before,how the fuck Hague gets a writing credit for Regret is beyond me considering how the rest of Republic turned out.What did he do,just let Hooky have one track so he didn't feel left out?? & altho' TF & 1963 are perfectly good pop N.O.,it's a very untypical N.O. sound,too lightweight & too PSB.

He got a writing credit for it presumably because he wrote some of it!

I think you're oversimplifying it by saying Big Bad PSB Man Hague© came in and told Hooky to fuck off while he faded out the bass guitar. I actually agree the production on Republic could've been beefier in places but for what the man managed to squeeze out of New Order at the time (remember they all despised each other) into an album, even a half-good album, is ruddy impressive.

I really reckon Republic's weak points are more to do with the band hating each other than Hague taking control and ruining things. He proved with True Faith/1963/Regret he had the potential to bring out nothing but good things in the band.

The Sound On Sound article where Hague was interviewed regarding the True Faith/1963 sessions was really interesting and he came across as just a nice unassuming bloke. It's just a pity for Republic he got his hands on a New Order where they all hated each other and didn't want to work in the same room...

Imagine what he could've done with them in another set of circumstances?

Agreed.Very good argument & well put.I did soften to the guy after hearing him on the 2-part Radio 1 int.,& wasn't questioning his credit on Regret,obviously he must of wrote some of it,it just doesn't seem to to fit with the rest of the album or his usual production,& I think it probably has more to do with how much I love the song too.

BEST PRODUCERS: Martin Hannett, New Order WORST PRODUCERS: John Robie, Stephen Hague (except on "True Faith")

Luís Angelo Aracri wrote: BEST PRODUCERS: Martin Hannett, New Order WORST PRODUCERS: John Robie, Stephen Hague (except on "True Faith")

I agree.

Best: Martin Hannet

I saw an interview with Hook where he said they couldn't work with Hanett anymore because of his drug problem, so they basically just ripped off his production style. His words, not mine! I believe it, too - if you listen to Everything's Gone Green/Procession then Temptation/Hurt the production is very similar.

Arthur Baker gets a good mention too.

Worst: Steve Osbourne, New Order circa Brotherhood

I can't believe nobody's mentioned Get Ready. The album as a whole is alright but the production really grates with me. I think Get Ready is their most overrated album. And New Order's production on Brotherhood is quite flat and grey.

Stephen Hague - he's produced some of their best and worst work, so ...? The production on True Faith and 1963 is brilliant, especially the endings.

I don't have any hate for John Robie really, his mix of Subculture takes what is really a pretty crap song and makes it quite gorgeous.

Who produced Such a Good Thing? The production's great!

Who Produced the track Brutal? I'd say that's one of my fav's as far as overall sound goes.

This is probably going to be considered blasphemy, but I'm not exactly sold on Hannett's production on the original Ceremony. I've only the Singles master to go by, but the mix is a bit uneven. And I don't think Temptation or Hurt or any of that stuff sounds like Hannett.

People rag on Hague, and though he may share songwriting credit on Republic, the fact is, that album sucks because the band weren't writing good songs at that point. Technique and Electronic were massive efforts from Bernard, and I think he was a bit dry as were Hooky, Steve, and Gillian. I'm not trying to exceedingly defend Hague, I just think he's been unnecessarily demonized.

Despite the fact that I think he's really good (and some of hsi remixes are great), I always thought Jacques Lu Cont was a bad choice for producer for NO. It's well documented that he is a massive fan, and I don't think this did them any favours. Also, it did seem a bit of a token "well we better get some dancier songs on there" gesture.......I'm not sure I'm getting the message I wanted across, but anyway.....

But in general I think the production on most NO albums works well - even the much maligned brotherhood has it's charm. I guess the only album that as a whole disappoints me production-wise is Low Life, and that's just because of the kind people on here who've made storming live versions of Face Up/Sooner Than You Think/Subculture, songs which I never thought really worked on the album.