New Order the greatest?
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NO Regret wrote:
Uncle Liam wrote:
NO Regret wrote: Have New Order been the most influential, ground-breaking, consistant, creative, greatest, unique, varied musical styled, trend setting, anti-establishment, soundtrack of our lives band ever?
I certainly cant think of any other band that fits the bill for New Order's lifespan.
Lets get real for a second. And bear in mind i'm not a fan of all these bands:
The Clash - only arround for what 8 years? REM - a good choice. But their music style has essentially stayed the same. Pixies - a good choice David Bowie - I think this guy is awesome in terms of output, reinventing himself, being around since late 60's. Kraftwerk - went off the boil after 81 Black Flag - never heard of Moby - done some decent stuff, done some tosh, not been around long enough to compare The Smiths - 4 year career yet they achieved so much Cocteau Twins - still going? Public Enemy - hugely inspirational but were around for long? Grand master Flash - wasnt around long enough Roxy Music - good choice The Human League - a different league. Maybe Champtionship. Blondie - loved them and comparable Spiritualized - who? I could go on forever....
Although the question is so vague its meaningless. So a big
from me.
I didnt think it was that vague a question.
it could be a whole lot more succint - "most unique" is one criteria that is particularly questionable for instance
NO Regret wrote:
Uncle Liam wrote: You've never heard of Spiritualized?
nope. name me a song?
Ladies and Gentlemen We Are Floating In Space
I'm also quite perplexed as to why you think REM's musical style has stayed the same. I think every album they've done hasa different style and a different theme. Go and compare Green to Document. Then compare automatic for the Peopple to Monster. New Advenutures in the Hi Fi to Up. Reveal to Around the Sun and Accelerate.
And how has Moby not been around long enough? Like I said, released his first album sixteen years ago, and has been a professional musician since 1982. How much longer does he need to be?
not that longevity is a a particularly good, or useful measure for questions like this. Its like what yoyu say about The Clash, around for only eight years. Only? Now i'm no fan of the Clash, but to say they arent one of the most unique, forward thinking and influential bands around is just ignorance.
Uncle Liam wrote:
NO Regret wrote:
Uncle Liam wrote: You've never heard of Spiritualized?
nope. name me a song?
Ladies and Gentlemen We Are Floating In Space
I'm also quite perplexed as to why you think REM's musical style has stayed the same. I think every album they've done hasa different style and a different theme. Go and compare Green to Document. Then compare automatic for the Peopple to Monster. New Advenutures in the Hi Fi to Up. Reveal to Around the Sun and Accelerate.
And how has Moby not been around long enough? Like I said, released his first album sixteen years ago, and has been a professional musician since 1982. How much longer does he need to be?
not that longevity is a a particularly good, or useful measure for questions like this. Its like what yoyu say about The Clash, around for only eight years. Only? Now i'm no fan of the Clash, but to say they arent one of the most unique, forward thinking and influential bands around is just ignorance.
erm....Floating In Space....er....never heard of it.....any others?
I take your point about REM and I concede youre probably right. Theyve done soft rock, hard rock, a bit of electronica, ballads adn some guitar songs.
The Clash also covered many styles: punk, rock, dance, ska to name but a few.
Not sure about The Bloodhound Gang though
To quote international on New Order.
New Order should never have been called New Order.
Bernard Sumner should have never have been a lead singer.
Joy Division's survivors should have never have made dance music.
New Order should never have composed the best selling 12 inch record of all times.
New Order should never have disguised themselves as hard rockers for the Touched by the hand of God video.
US kids addicted to MTV should never have taken it for granted.
New Order should never have earnt a lot of money, only to be bankrupted because of the Hacienda, their club in Manchester.
The Hacienda should never have opened.
The Hacienda should never have closed.
New Order never properly signed with Tony Wilson from Factory Records but followed all the label's history, from the punk debuts to the Acid House ending.
New Order should never have signed in the US of A on Q west, Quincy Jones' soul music label, by Quincy thought that it was "the best Brit band ! Much better than the Sex Pistols!".
Suppose New Order hadn't written Blue Monday, Neil Tennant would never have founded the Pet Shop Boys.
He would still be a journalist.
New Order don't use make up like The Cure, don't dress up like Depeche Mode and don't have haircuts like the Human league.
New Order are a serious band, bu they weren't afraid to compose the official British anthem for the World Cup 1990.
England should never have lost this World Cup, Any World Cup.
New Order can be outrageously cold like hard dance. Never narrow minded.
New Order doesn't dance, but really likes it anyway.
They stood there, without saying a word to their audience. It was cool.
Nowadays they spend most of their time talking & doing encores every night. It's cool.
New Order is a weird band: Peter Hook has a strange way to hold his bass, Steven to use his drums, Barney to dance and Gillian to, uh, well Gillian you know.
If Ian Curtis hadn't commited suicide, New Order would never have existed.
If New Order hadn't played in New-York, they would never discovered Larry Levan's Paradise Garage and John Jellybean Benitez's Fun House.
pretty much sums up that new order is fecking genius, but not the best. Pretty close though.
I do have to say New order are the best dancers. I mean I wish I could pull off that blue monday jig, but sadly I didnt have the technique era substance aid. Therefore i'll hopefully abuse some prescription meds and dance about to confusion till I vomit. Thank you New Order for inspiring me to dance.
New Order is my favorite artist, but to answer the title of the thread i have to say... NO! The question/title is so general and not specific.
Indeed!
The Sub-Cultured Perfect Kisser*!* wrote: New Order is my favorite artist, but to answer the title of the thread i have to say... NO! The question/title is so general and not specific.
Indeed!
Do you really want me to post
- which band is the most unique?
- which band is the coolest?
- which band is the most genre crossing? etc
I do hope not as I CBA!
I don't see what's so hard with this question. You answer this question with logic and with your heart. For most of us, our heart says that their music is the best. There is no other artist's work I like more than New Order and Joy Division. Then you look at it logically. Was the band innovative, creative, diverse, influential? Yes to all. Did they made history? Yes. Did a new genre born because of them? I'd say yes, the term alternative dance practically came up for them and you can't think of post-punk without thinking of Joy Division. Did they contribute to the music industry's evolution? Yes, with their music, but also with their nightclub. That's a lot of ground covered.
There are other great artists out there, but few have touched so many aspects of the music industry and that is why New Order is unique. The only thing New Order don't have is recognition from the mass. While everyone knows The Beatles, U2, Radiohead, etc., few know New Order and those who've heard of New Order only know them as the band behind "Blue Monday", "Bizarre Love Triangle" and "True Faith". New Order is no doubt the best and most influential band that nobody knows.
Canuck21 wrote: I don't see what's so hard with this question. You answer this question with logic and with your heart. For most of us, our heart says that their music is the best. There is no other artist's work I like more than New Order and Joy Division. Then you look at it logically. Was the band innovative, creative, diverse, influential? Yes to all. Did they made history? Yes. Did a new genre born because of them? I'd say yes, the term alternative dance practically came up for them and you can't think of post-punk without thinking of Joy Division. Did they contribute to the music industry's evolution? Yes, with their music, but also with their nightclub. That's a lot of ground covered.
There are other great artists out there, but few have touched so many aspects of the music industry and that is why New Order is unique. The only thing New Order don't have is recognition from the mass. While everyone knows The Beatles, U2, Radiohead, etc., few know New Order and those who've heard of New Order only know them as the band behind "Blue Monday", "Bizarre Love Triangle" and "True Faith". New Order is no doubt the best and most influential band that nobody knows.
Finally, someone sings from the same sheet as me and understands the question.
Thank you lord and thank you Canuck. I was started to lose my faith for a moment.
hibster wrote:
NO Regret wrote:
Uncle Liam wrote:
NO Regret wrote: Have New Order been the most influential, ground-breaking, consistant, creative, greatest, unique, varied musical styled, trend setting, anti-establishment, soundtrack of our lives band ever?
I certainly cant think of any other band that fits the bill for New Order's lifespan.
Lets get real for a second. And bear in mind i'm not a fan of all these bands:
The Clash - only arround for what 8 years? REM - a good choice. But their music style has essentially stayed the same. Pixies - a good choice David Bowie - I think this guy is awesome in terms of output, reinventing himself, being around since late 60's. Kraftwerk - went off the boil after 81 Black Flag - never heard of Moby - done some decent stuff, done some tosh, not been around long enough to compare The Smiths - 4 year career yet they achieved so much Cocteau Twins - still going? Public Enemy - hugely inspirational but were around for long? Grand master Flash - wasnt around long enough Roxy Music - good choice The Human League - a different league. Maybe Champtionship. Blondie - loved them and comparable Spiritualized - who? I could go on forever....
Although the question is so vague its meaningless. So a big
I didnt think it was that vague a question.
it could be a whole lot more succint - "most unique" is one criteria that is particularly questionable for instance
How is something 'most unique'? More one of a kind than something else? Hmm?
Anyway, the question is vague. Music is subjective as all hell, so how could anyone agree?
Anyway, I think they are up there. I don't know of any music so varied, so poetic, so beautiful, so fantastic to listen to. I could listen to 99% of their songs. Have you ever come across anything like The Perfect Kiss? Jeremy Clarkson once said that an Aston Martin was the most beautiful thing ever designed by humans. I think TPK is better.
NO + JD = the greatest bands ever. Simple Formulae for a simple question. But as I also love detroit techno must mention Underground Resistance as the greatest techno label ever. P.s. I liked the Paul Morley inspired post but then again I liked Paul Morley JD book as I've already mentioned elsewhere on this site.
Other best bands Kraftwerk, Drexcyia, Spacemen 3 and Spiritualized, basic Channel, Jesus and Mary Chain but none come close to NO / JD
michael preda wrote: To quote international on New Order.
New Order should never have been called New Order.
Bernard Sumner should have never have been a lead singer.
Joy Division's survivors should have never have made dance music.
New Order should never have composed the best selling 12 inch record of all times.
New Order should never have disguised themselves as hard rockers for the Touched by the hand of God video.
US kids addicted to MTV should never have taken it for granted.
New Order should never have earnt a lot of money, only to be bankrupted because of the Hacienda, their club in Manchester.
The Hacienda should never have opened.
The Hacienda should never have closed.
New Order never properly signed with Tony Wilson from Factory Records but followed all the label's history, from the punk debuts to the Acid House ending.
New Order should never have signed in the US of A on Q west, Quincy Jones' soul music label, by Quincy thought that it was "the best Brit band ! Much better than the Sex Pistols!".
Suppose New Order hadn't written Blue Monday, Neil Tennant would never have founded the Pet Shop Boys.
He would still be a journalist.
New Order don't use make up like The Cure, don't dress up like Depeche Mode and don't have haircuts like the Human league.
New Order are a serious band, bu they weren't afraid to compose the official British anthem for the World Cup 1990.
England should never have lost this World Cup, Any World Cup.
New Order can be outrageously cold like hard dance. Never narrow minded.
New Order doesn't dance, but really likes it anyway.
They stood there, without saying a word to their audience. It was cool.
Nowadays they spend most of their time talking & doing encores every night. It's cool.
New Order is a weird band: Peter Hook has a strange way to hold his bass, Steven to use his drums, Barney to dance and Gillian to, uh, well Gillian you know.
If Ian Curtis hadn't commited suicide, New Order would never have existed.
If New Order hadn't played in New-York, they would never discovered Larry Levan's Paradise Garage and John Jellybean Benitez's Fun House.
pretty much sums up that new order is fecking genius, but not the best. Pretty close though.
There's something similar written in the liner notes for the recent Best Of Joy Division compilation. Why write decent liner notes when you can just write a load of wank?
As much as I want to love Morley's work (and I'm sure some of it is excellent) I read the above and cringe a bit.
The Shadow wrote: But as I also love detroit techno must mention Underground Resistance as the greatest techno label ever.
In terms of Detroit Techno, they were certainly influenced by what New Order (and Kraftwerk) did in terms of electronic music - Derrick May admits to that! 
To throw a few names into the hat (in terms of electronic music influences):
BBC Radiophonic Workshop (Delia Derbyshire et al) Kraftwerk (as has been mentioned before) Yellow Magic Orchestra (not as popular as Kraftewerk, but still influential) Derrick May/Juan Atkins/Kevin Saunderson/Carl Craig
Certainly, Joy Division and New Order have been influential, and still are to bands appearing nowadays.
Agreed New Order influenced detroit techno and Kraftwerk more so. Infact NO were the reason I started going to raves, techno parties and the music. Also agree about D. May and Juan Atkins, although UR are more my time and therefore influence. Delia Derbyshire is an unsung heroine. Dr Who theme still sounds like the future
The Shadow wrote: Agreed New Order influenced detroit techno and Kraftwerk more so. Infact NO were the reason I started going to raves, techno parties and the music. Also agree about D. May and Juan Atkins, although UR are more my time and therefore influence. Delia Derbyshire is an unsung heroine. Dr Who theme still sounds like the future
Yeah, I must seek out some more UR stuff - I definitely like what I hear, and (A Guy Called) Gerald is apparently going to be releasing some stuff on UR shortly... :)
For anyone interested in Detroit techno, check out the film "High Tech Soul" - essential viewing.
And am definitely looking forward to seeing Model 500 live in Barca next month (believe Al's going to see them at the Bang Face Weekender in just over a week) - quality stuff!
Model 500 playing live that shoudl be good!! (thats an understatement) LAso this years Sonar festival Jeff Mill and Mike Banks of UR are playing together for the 1st tiem since 92. There doing the rings of Saturn LP. Not sure if updated stuff or the original album, shoudl be amazing shame I can;t go!
I have to agree that this is a vague question, and a silly one to ask on a new order fan board. I love the band, but definitely not "the greatest" and not the "most influential" in my catalog of music, as that is entirely subjective.
Chris Nash wrote: Velvet Underground.
for influencial purposes: velvet underground. (although they're not really of 'my generation.')
The Shadow wrote: Agreed New Order influenced detroit techno and Kraftwerk more so. Infact NO were the reason I started going to raves, techno parties and the music. Also agree about D. May and Juan Atkins, although UR are more my time and therefore influence. Delia Derbyshire is an unsung heroine. Dr Who theme still sounds like the future
Wrong! UR Were Techno's (in its purest sense)best 'band', but the label wasn't. Too many spin-offs once BANKS fucked off from MILLS - RED Planet, etc.. Best techno label was/is Probe Still got 90% of all UR vinyl ever released. Seawolf, Punisher, Jupiter jazz ..FUCk over all else, even Mayday, Magic Juan. Got to see UR in 91' in the smoke twice. Awesome.
Recently went to see Autechre & Black Dog in Toon'- nice.
New Black Dog album is awesome, Radio Scarecrow very highly recommended to techno lovers on this board. Still think UR is the best label, releasing strong releases again, fav UR track Final Frontier. Nice speaking to fellow New order and Detroit fans
I do enjoy Rupesh Cartel, a newer synthpop group from sweeden. check them out on myspace if your ever in need of a quick synth fix.
My favourites [greatest] bands [without New Order]:
DEPECHE MODE[It's second my idols except NO] THE SISTERS OF MERCY[It's my favourite gothic rock band[except Joy Division], RAMMSTEIN[It's my favourite Industrial metal band] GARBAGE [It's my favourite female singer] JOY DIVISION[It's not the same like NO,Curtis - you are my god of sorror] KRAFTWERK [My gods of electronic] MOBY METALLICA [It's my favourite classic metal band] AC-DC [Rock'n'roll damnation] LIMP BIZKIT [No comments] THE MISSION [One more gothic rock band,that i like it] DAVE GAHAN [Personal jesus of DM] FOJE[The best rock band from my country] ANDRIUS MAMONTOVAS[The best rock male artist from my country]
