Semi-virgin listener seeks advice re. initiation

Hi, first post, thanks for your hospitality...

When an old pal sent me "Get Ready", my ears pricked up, although I realise that it's not considered a "classic" New Order album. I have since got into Joy Division in a bigger way than I have since any other band since The Clash. As JD begat NO, and I know I'll like it, so can anyone recommend my first 3 New Order albums, starting, presumably, with "Power, Corruption & Lies", right? And should I always go for the Rhino re-releases? Any argument for CDs vs iTunes Plus?

Many thanks in anticipation and sorry for this most basic of quesions.

Get Ready is fantastic. Just about everyone here will say low-life should be next, but I'd go Brotherhood, PC&L and then Technique as the next three. I don't think much of the Rhino releases, since there are lots of problems with the remastering as is well detailed elsewhere here.

Great advice, solid info, many thanks.

Barry Isaacson wrote: Hi, first post, thanks for your hospitality...

When an old pal sent me "Get Ready", my ears pricked up, although I realise that it's not considered a "classic" New Order album. I have since got into Joy Division in a bigger way than I have since any other band since The Clash. As JD begat NO, and I know I'll like it, so can anyone recommend my first 3 New Order albums, starting, presumably, with "Power, Corruption & Lies", right? And should I always go for the Rhino re-releases? Any argument for CDs vs iTunes Plus?

Many thanks in anticipation and sorry for this most basic of quesions.

Starting with PCL, you should move onto brotherhood, then lowlife, it's this musical gap between records that makes it amazing. None of them are similar, from pure rock, to electronics in a track to track fashion. Get Ready is varied, it's got its strong and weak points. Nobody has ever wanted to "Rock the Shack", but songs like Close Range and Primitive Notion were a return to form.

Many thanks. Yes, even I had to figure "Rock the Shack" as a bit of a faux pas. It would have been a huge hit for the B-52s (no disrespect to them, by the way...)

I agree with pretty much everyone who's posted so far, but I will encourage you not to forget about Movement, New Order's first LP. Definitely wait for it to be your fourth or fifth NO album to check out, but it's a really interesting listen as it's a stylistic bridge between Joy Division and NO. I actually listen to it a lot and especially like live versions of those songs. After Movement, it might be safe to move on to Republic and Waiting for the Sirens' Call.

If you haven't already, listen to the songs "Ceremony" and "In A Lonely Place" since they comprised the first NO single (before Movement was released). Those two songs were recorded as demos by Joy Division (and Ceremony was performed live), but not formally recorded/released 'til New Order - that, and they're wonderful tunes. Compilation albums (Substance, International, Best Of, Singles, etc.) with the non-album singles like Blue Monday, Thieves Like Us, etc. are worth an immediate listen, too!

Honestly, you can't really go wrong with any of their albums, but I would say leave Brotherhood, Waiting for.., Republic, Singles, Peel Sessions for last.

New Order's unique in that their singles are just as essential as their albums, so Ceremony, In a Lonely Place, Everything's Gone Green, Blue Monday (duh), The Perfect Kiss and True Faith are worth hearing before anything.

I would definitely get them on CD or vinyl rather then iTunes as the cover art is kind of essential.

FtotheDoubleOff wrote: Honestly, you can't really go wrong with any of their albums, but I would say leave Brotherhood, Waiting for.., Republic, Singles, Peel Sessions for last.

New Order's unique in that their singles are just as essential as their albums, so Ceremony, In a Lonely Place, Everything's Gone Green, Blue Monday (duh), The Perfect Kiss and True Faith are worth hearing before anything.

I would definitely get them on CD or vinyl rather then iTunes as the cover art is kind of essential.

Couldn't agree more. New Order singles were never on the albums (until later years) and there are definitely strong tracks there you wouldn't want to miss.

The Mini-album '1981-1982' (FACTUS8 I think it was) is excellent as it pulls together some of the earlier singles.

If you are into Joy Division stuff do "Movement", "PCL" and "Brotherhood" next and avoid "Technique" as long as possible . I still don't like that cheesy album much and I know I'm almost the only one here...

Thanks guys. Great guidance and very good point about the singles.

Get "Technique" ,it's the best album. In fact it's the best album ever!!!

Do avoid the rest of new order, along with shit like Blue Monday '95, as those remixes were generally shit. Save Republic for last, as it is an accquired taste. Retro would be a great way for you to skimp out on international. Though, from the same time period, the mastering is very different. And try to find WFTSC on vinyl, as the CD suffers from "over mastering".

Barry, Just go in chronological order.

If you are a Joy Division fan, you will be intrigued as to how they transitioned out of that sound, as they found dancier and more recreational rhythms in 1982. So, be sure to get those 1982-3 singles like Everything's Gone Green, Temptation, and Procession.

You know you are going to want to hear it all eventually anyway, so just go thru it year by year.... it is a fascinating progression.

Tarbox23 wrote: Barry, Just go in chronological order.

If you are a Joy Division fan, you will be intrigued as to how they transitioned out of that sound, as they found dancier and more recreational rhythms in 1982. So, be sure to get those 1982-3 singles like Everything's Gone Green, Temptation, and Procession.

You know you are going to want to hear it all eventually anyway, so just go thru it year by year.... it is a fascinating progression.

That would be my call as well. Almost envy you being able to go through the releases start to finish without the waiting!!

Pick Brotherhood. Then listen to all the 80's live stuff. Its the only way you will really appreciate that thunderous bass sound.

Ravi Kumar wrote: Pick Brotherhood. Then listen to all the 80's live stuff. Its the only way you will really appreciate that thunderous bass sound.

Yeah, listening to the sound of Hook's bass in JD is the first time I've ever been sufficiently inspired to want to learn the instrument.

michael preda wrote: Retro would be a great way for you to skimp out on international. Though, from the same time period, the mastering is very different. And try to find WFTSC on vinyl, as the CD suffers from "over mastering".

Michael, can you clarify, are you suggesting I get the box set (Retro) instead of, or in addition to, the original albums? It looks like a very well put-together collection...

Barry Isaacson wrote:

michael preda wrote: Retro would be a great way for you to skimp out on international. Though, from the same time period, the mastering is very different. And try to find WFTSC on vinyl, as the CD suffers from "over mastering".

Michael, can you clarify, are you suggesting I get the box set (Retro) instead of, or in addition to, the original albums? It looks like a very well put-together collection...

I would highly recommend Retro, then you could go on for the albums. Retro does give some insight into each period.

Barry Isaacson wrote:

Ravi Kumar wrote: Pick Brotherhood. Then listen to all the 80's live stuff. Its the only way you will really appreciate that thunderous bass sound.

Yeah, listening to the sound of Hook's bass in JD is the first time I've ever been sufficiently inspired to want to learn the instrument.

Do it, get a reasonably cheap bass an amp and a chorus pedal and play along with hooky, you'll have a great time.

make sure you let us hear it too, give a year or two and you'll be annoying people with stuff like this:

michael preda wrote: I would highly recommend Retro, then you could go on for the albums. Retro does give some insight into each period.

Did just that, found "Retro" at Amoeba, virtually the last music store in Los Angeles. It's a fascinating concept for a big compilation. On from there to the albums. I don't do this often but never in half-measures. Last band I discovered belatedly and had to own everything was The Clash.

Thanks for all the sage advice.

Jed Stephens wrote:

Barry Isaacson wrote:

Ravi Kumar wrote: Pick Brotherhood. Then listen to all the 80's live stuff. Its the only way you will really appreciate that thunderous bass sound.

Yeah, listening to the sound of Hook's bass in JD is the first time I've ever been sufficiently inspired to want to learn the instrument.

Do it, get a reasonably cheap bass an amp and a chorus pedal and play along with hooky, you'll have a great time.

make sure you let us hear it too, give a year or two and you'll be annoying people with stuff like this:

Ha, that's great, thanks for the encouragement. I'm sure my wife will be thanking you too!

Barry Isaacson wrote:

michael preda wrote: I would highly recommend Retro, then you could go on for the albums. Retro does give some insight into each period.

Did just that, found "Retro" at Amoeba, virtually the last music store in Los Angeles. It's a fascinating concept for a big compilation. On from there to the albums. I don't do this often but never in half-measures. Last band I discovered belatedly and had to own everything was The Clash.

Thanks for all the sage advice.

You're quite welcome.

The problem you always have with questions like this is opinion....peoples' will always differ.But I think the general consensus of most will be P,C&L,Low Life & Technique,but it's criminally unfair to disregard Brotherhood & Movement,both quality too

Oh,& has someone has already said,get the physical CD's,the artwork makes it the whole package as was intended & is part of the N.O. legacy.Just to have iTunes mp3's of JD or N.O. is soulless & unworthy,heresy even....IMO

Barry Isaacson wrote:

michael preda wrote: I would highly recommend Retro, then you could go on for the albums. Retro does give some insight into each period.

Did just that, found "Retro" at Amoeba, virtually the last music store in Los Angeles. It's a fascinating concept for a big compilation. On from there to the albums. I don't do this often but never in half-measures. Last band I discovered belatedly and had to own everything was The Clash.

Thanks for all the sage advice.

Retro is largely pointless, it's like a CD player set on shuffle. Has many good songs but would not recommend, unless you could get it really cheap. It is hardly definitive, sort of like an expensive sampler.

Tarbox23 wrote: Barry, Just go in chronological order.

If you are a Joy Division fan, you will be intrigued as to how they transitioned out of that sound, as they found dancier and more recreational rhythms in 1982. So, be sure to get those 1982-3 singles like Everything's Gone Green, Temptation, and Procession.

You know you are going to want to hear it all eventually anyway, so just go thru it year by year.... it is a fascinating progression.

Yes, this is the best advice by far, get the re-issues for the singles to get the whole "picture" of the era.

Getting lots of subjective opinions here, all over the place. To choose only one I would get the Power, Corruption, and Lies re-issue. The most timeless to me, and with many great songs like "Age of Consent", "Your Silent Face", and "Leave me Alone" plus the singles of the time "Blue Monday", "Confusion", "Thieves Like Us", "Lonesome Tonight", "Murder" ...this 2 CD set is an excellent example of what defines New Order.

And the good counsel continues to roll in, great community, thanks guys (why so few female devotees, I wonder...?)

Interesting, the CD vs d/l question. I do not buy MP3s as they seem to be very low quality but have you heard the iTunes "Plus" versions of the JD/NO material? These have DRM removed and seem to me to be of amazingly higher audio quality than the pre-"Plus" M4P files...