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(embedded, and not embedded, dependent on how NOOL works for you) Kindly observe at 1 min and 5 seconds.
You've been had guys LOL.
(credit for pointing this out goes to another NOOLer who shall remain nameless until choose otherwise)
I shall not explain, if you don't see it no amount of reason will change your mind.
Uhuh. On stage with the band who wouldn't even mime on TOTP.
He DOES appear to be doubling the fake bass from Gillian's machines at times though.
I thought Bernard said any cock could play Hooky's stuff......dunno WHAT that makes Tom.
(other than the sort of "person" who plays a Pbass :D )
Doctor? wrote: Uhuh. On stage with the band who wouldn't even mime on TOTP.
He DOES appear to be doubling the fake bass from Gillian's machines at times though.
I thought Bernard said any cock could play Hooky's stuff......dunno WHAT that makes Tom.
(other than the sort of "person" who plays a Pbass :D )
Good eye, but your ears might not be *as* good.
Tom's clearly playing a separate bassline, with a new, descending harmony line mid-verse. That doubling of the synth bass does not sound fake. Also, he does play the leads elsewhere, just not in that one chorus.
Is it such a big deal? Watch 511 and Hooky is clearly playing along to a bass backing track on some songs. Them leads aren't that hard to play sans vocals. For 'Round & Round' Bernard probably said Tom should have a go on the backing vocals, and it just so happens that the chorus vocal phrasing is hard to synch with the bass lead at that juncture. Not really offensive they sampled a smidge of it. If that were happening on a lot of songs, that'd be a different story, but from all the video evidence, they're not.
Hooky has played along to DOUBLE TRACKED bass, that's very different. And you can't judge anything from a post produced video, there can be shots from all over the place dropped in (PFD has a few howlers, and there's the deliberate one at the end of TPK video).....which is why, had this been a pro shot and post produced video, I wouldn't have said a damned thing, cos it might not be what it appeared to be.
My ears are fine, his hand goes down, his alleged instrument goes up.
Sorry, but miming on stage is unacceptable.....the "Hooky part" is clearly coming from Gillian, with Tom just dropping in with the bits he can play.
Don't mind him doubling the actual synth bass parts, in fact it's quite cool.
If any fool can play Hooky's parts, that makes this guy a subfool ;)
Still it explains why his bass often sounds like the shitty fretless bass preset from a workstation......it is LOL
Anyway, I am arguing no further. He's a bluffer, end of story.
Some people are SO desperate for New Order to continue they will accept anything.
One day when the only one left is Bernard they'll still be happy to accept it as New Order. I wont.
Doctor? wrote: Uhuh. On stage with the band who wouldn't even mime on TOTP.
He DOES appear to be doubling the fake bass from Gillian's machines at times though.
I thought Bernard said any cock could play Hooky's stuff......dunno WHAT that makes Tom.
(other than the sort of "person" who plays a Pbass :D )
Inclined to call bollocks here - have a look at Hooky on 511 on the intro to 60MPH specifically - I seem to recall those first four notes in the intro (before the drums kick in) are not played by Hooky and are pre-recorded - will check tonight and will amend the post if I am wrong.
Plus, Tom C plays a Jaguar Bass, not a PBass...pretty sure that part is right!
Doctor? wrote: You've been had guys LOL.
(credit for pointing this out goes to another NOOLer who shall remain nameless until choose otherwise)
Seriously Cambo, who gives a shit?
Let.
It.
Go.
Doctor? wrote:
Some people are SO desperate for New Order to continue they will accept anything.
One day when the only one left is Bernard they'll still be happy to accept it as New Order.
Yep! 
NU ORDAH !
If that's the case, how come you can hear duff notes on the officially released and mixed Troxy CD?
Hooky was miming to sequenced bass for the past thirty years : on "World", "Ruined In a Day", "Round & Round". It don't matter a jot.
mark reed wrote: If that's the case, how come you can hear duff notes on the officially released and mixed Troxy CD?
Hooky was miming to sequenced bass for the past thirty years : on "World", "Ruined In a Day", "Round & Round". It don't matter a jot.
Not that I give a shit either way, but the Troxy cd as I have explained before is mixed on the fly by the Abbey Rd studios mobile van, as it happened on the night, swearing, mistakes and all!
Hooky never mimed the bass on Ruined in a day, or World live, he is playing them an octive lower. On the album versions, there is no Hooky bass.
condemnation wrote:
mark reed wrote: If that's the case, how come you can hear duff notes on the officially released and mixed Troxy CD?
Hooky was miming to sequenced bass for the past thirty years : on "World", "Ruined In a Day", "Round & Round". It don't matter a jot.
Not that I give a shit either way, but the Troxy cd as I have explained before is mixed on the fly by the Abbey Rd studios mobile van, as it happened on the night, swearing, mistakes and all!
Hooky never mimed the bass on Ruined in a day, or World live, he is playing them an octive lower. On the album versions, there is no Hooky bass.
I can quite believe that for World but are you sure on RIAD? It sounds like hooky playing bass in traditional style like on Everyone Everywhere.
Ive often wondered why this album has the least amount of Hooky signature bass on it. Was it the band tension and Hooky was left out of the sessions? Or did he have bass parts that were later dropped? Or did Stephen Hague struggle to accomodate them in the mix?
Let's be honest, it's not difficult to see what Cambo is trying to do here. He's homed in on one specific part of a very automated dance track which they've not performed live in almost 20 years in order to do what he loves doing best; slag Bernard to fuck and place Hooky on a big golden pedestal. Partisan is an understatement.
But even here Chapman's not really miming is he? He's simply playing a different bass line to the one the bass geeks expected. So one riff in one song out of about 20 songs the band have rehearsed is played a little differently despite all the others being played well and Chapman is suddenly a "bluffer who's had us"? Would that opinion stand up under proper scrutiny taking the whole gig into account? Would it fuck...
The Troxy live release proves Chapman plays the bass live so the case is closed on that one. Plus if you speak to those who actually attended the gigs so far (Cambo has not) they will vouch that Chapman - like or loathe him - does a very competent job.
This is a non-topic 
They've been miming for years on various parts of various songs. Pre-recorded intros (Crystal, Regret, 60mph to name but three), and various parts within songs. They do play over them sometimes though, which is where we tend to notice the flubs!
Who gives a shite though really? Since they started using sequencers and shit back in 1778. Where do you draw the line?
Tim wrote: They've been miming for years on various parts of various songs. Pre-recorded intros (Crystal, Regret, 60mph to name but three), and various parts within songs. They do play over them sometimes though, which is where we tend to notice the flubs!
Quite - and that includes Hooky...
More interestingly... Is Chapman performing backing vocals in that track? He definitely seems to be singing into the mike but I can't seem to pick them out in the mix.
Skullcrushed wrote: More interestingly... Is Chapman performing backing vocals in that track? He definitely seems to be singing into the mike but I can't seem to pick them out in the mix.
I don't think he is even on stage, I think it is a hologram
It was me that pointed it out to Cambo, I thought I'd point it out to someone that cares, the rest can just go along and enjoy yourselves, each to their own. I give up with all the bollocks.
Jed Stephens wrote: It was me that pointed it out to Cambo, I thought I'd point it out to someone that cares, the rest can just go along and enjoy yourselves, each to their own. I give up with all the bollocks.
There was a small clue...
"can someone explain why at 1:04 we hear a high C being played on the bass but Tom's playing a low C? Mmm... backing tapes?"
I'm impressed that you can spot this - I certainly wouldn't have been able to. But TBH, I don't care too much.
R
He clearly is actually playing the high bass part at 8 seconds in but during the chorus when he is providing backing vocals seems to be when the pre-recorded bass kicks in. Again At 2.28 he is clearly playing the lead bass part so it must be that he is being "helped" during the chorus but at other times during the song he is playing live.
Umm, no one has pointed out that this is a crowd-sourced video. The audio is not clear, and it's in a cavernous hall. The recording could be playing tricks with your ears.
New Order has been using backing tracks for non-sequenced synth parts for at least 19 years, like the harmonies and backing vocals in the chorus of World (Price Of Love) during the '93 gigs. Round & Round has live bass, synth bass, plus synth pads (chords).
It's easy to find conspiracies when you're looking for them.
It's true that when Hooky was in NO some tracks which had more than one bass guitar line (as apposed to one bass guitar & one bass synth) they would have pre recorded backing, or it would be impossible to play, but when there is only one part it just doesn't seem right, this could also have been one of the many problems within the band, Bernard stated many times he had no problems with backing tracks, Hooky prefers to play live.
But as I said, it means more to some than others, I can't be arsed arguing about it, I was just pointing it out.
jeez...too much PEDANTIC-ism here....I'm just way way glad NEW ORDER has decided to tour & def very very grateful with that...and also with Hooky playing JD stuffs, I would never have dreamt been able to hear JD songs live...and it sounds great too (from the UP tour)
