2015 Vinyl Reissues/Remasters - Republic/Get Ready/WFTSC/Singles

Republic, Get Ready, and Waiting For The Sirens' Call are out Stateside now. Amoeba in San Francisco has a big display of them alongside Music Complete and the 12" of Restless.

They do not come with downloads.

I picked up Get Ready, as it's the only one I didn't already have on vinyl. It sounds nice and clean, but it's very quiet. It really should have been spread across two records to improve the fidelity, as 51 minutes is about 9 minutes longer than what can comfortably sit on one slab of vinyl.

They look great. They obviously still have the original artwork files, which has been a problem for many vinyl reissues. You can tell when something like, say, Disintegration by The Cure had to be scanned from an old copy and the vinyl reissue looks a little murky.

Really looking forward to Singles!

almanso wrote: I'm sure these remasters are DDA, anyone?

Those codes don't quite work these days. They don't seem to allow ADA.

The answer is:

Republic is digital from the start, until put onto an analogue medium (vinyl).

Get Ready started life on analogue tape, then moved onto digital (pro-tools etc) for the rest.

WFTSC was similar to above.

almanso wrote:

Johnny James wrote:

almanso wrote: I'm sure these remasters are DDA, anyone?

Those codes don't quite work these days. They don't seem to allow ADA.

The answer is:

Republic is digital from the start, until put onto an analogue medium (vinyl).

Get Ready started life on analogue tape, then moved onto digital (pro-tools etc) for the rest.

WFTSC was similar to above.

So basically if they wanted to do it, they could do a whole analogue tratment on GR and WFTSC from the original tapes (since Republic is digital it wouldn't be any difference, am I right?) for the vinyl reissues. But since it seems to be cheaper to master from digital to analogue medium not many are doing the analogue step-by-step in order to have a proper vinyl reissue and remaster... thoughts?

Not really, the multitracks are analogue, but then it went digital for all subsequent production/mixing/editing (in pro-tools).

So, to remain analogue you'd have to mix, produce and edit the whole thing from scratch again.

This is never going to happen (unless you're The Beatles and it's relatively simple).

almanso wrote: understood. so now I wonder what's the point in releasing these reissues then. I mean, just for the object? they won't sound the same so why bothering buying them?

Same as what?

They were originally done the same way, this time however you get to remaster them and produce a 24/96 master to cut from (they would have been done from 16/44.1 back at the time).

Don't forget they were all unavailable with originals selling for loads of money, in this rejuvenated vinyl era. It's obvious that they should be reissued on vinyl.

FWIW, the previous five albums all exist as analogue masters and the 2015 remasters (on digital shops currently) are from those. Obviously they are now digital as they haven't been put onto an analogue medium as yet.

I think you'd all spot the difference with some of those btw, Movement and Low Life, in particular, are much improved.

Any idea why the remaster of Get Ready hasn't seen a digital release (unless I've missed it)?

Grant Halliday wrote: Any idea why the remaster of Get Ready hasn't seen a digital release (unless I've missed it)?

Long story, but I think that the problems locating the correct and final master, plus the very long vinyl lead-in times, meant that time ran out.

Johnny James wrote: I think you'd all spot the difference with some of those btw, Movement and Low Life, in particular, are much improved.

Looking forward to trying those out, in particular. Do you happen to know whether the original LL CD release had the 'pre-emphasis' flag incorrectly set in the subcode? I read Stephen Morris say something about a pre-emph mastering cock-up on the LL release that has finally been straightened out but I wasn't sure of the specifics. Thanks

Jonathan wrote:

Johnny James wrote: I think you'd all spot the difference with some of those btw, Movement and Low Life, in particular, are much improved.

Looking forward to trying those out, in particular. Do you happen to know whether the original LL CD release had the 'pre-emphasis' flag incorrectly set in the subcode? I read Stephen Morris say something about a pre-emph mastering cock-up on the LL release that has finally been straightened out but I wasn't sure of the specifics. Thanks

I'm not sure about the details of what they did previously.

There is a weird (and now obsolete) noise reduction system used on the Low Life masters, that could've be the reason.

Does anyone have some news about the re-issue of "Singles" compilation in the format of a boxset with 4 heavyweight vinyls? Does it was cancelled?

Jonathan wrote:

Johnny James wrote: I think you'd all spot the difference with some of those btw, Movement and Low Life, in particular, are much improved.

Looking forward to trying those out, in particular. Do you happen to know whether the original LL CD release had the 'pre-emphasis' flag incorrectly set in the subcode? I read Stephen Morris say something about a pre-emph mastering cock-up on the LL release that has finally been straightened out but I wasn't sure of the specifics. Thanks

I have two versions of "Low-Life" on CD from the 80s, one which is the original Factory Records pressing, then another from Quest Records (USA). The Quest Records pressing sounds the best, but it's lacking a little high end. The Factory pressing is the completely opposite: very bright, thin and lacking in low end. It's almost like the low EQ is completely cut out. I'm not sure what the deal with the "pre-emphasis" mess up was, but it definitely sounds like something is off on the Factory pressing. A buddy of mine has a version from London Records and I remember it sounding identical to the Factory version.

As for the 2015 remaster, it sounds great. The drop-out error on "Sunrise" which was on the 2007 remaster has been corrected and overall it sounds less thin than that version. Overall, all the new 2015 remasters sound great with the exception of "Technique." There's actually three errors I've noticed on the album which sound like the master tape suddenly jumps up in speed for a split second. There's one toward the end of "All the Way," another at very beginning of "Round & Round," then a third I can't remember unless I listen to the whole album again.

Moderne Decay wrote:

Jonathan wrote:

Johnny James wrote: I think you'd all spot the difference with some of those btw, Movement and Low Life, in particular, are much improved.

Looking forward to trying those out, in particular. Do you happen to know whether the original LL CD release had the 'pre-emphasis' flag incorrectly set in the subcode? I read Stephen Morris say something about a pre-emph mastering cock-up on the LL release that has finally been straightened out but I wasn't sure of the specifics. Thanks

I have two versions of "Low-Life" on CD from the 80s, one which is the original Factory Records pressing, then another from Quest Records (USA). The Quest Records pressing sounds the best, but it's lacking a little high end. The Factory pressing is the completely opposite: very bright, thin and lacking in low end. It's almost like the low EQ is completely cut out. I'm not sure what the deal with the "pre-emphasis" mess up was, but it definitely sounds like something is off on the Factory pressing. A buddy of mine has a version from London Records and I remember it sounding identical to the Factory version.

As for the 2015 remaster, it sounds great. The drop-out error on "Sunrise" which was on the 2007 remaster has been corrected and overall it sounds less thin than that version. Overall, all the new 2015 remasters sound great with the exception of "Technique." There's actually three errors I've noticed on the album which sound like the master tape suddenly jumps up in speed for a split second. There's one toward the end of "All the Way," another at very beginning of "Round & Round," then a third I can't remember unless I listen to the whole album again.

Thanks for the update. That glitch on Sunrise always annoyed me. Always have had to remember to sub in the version from the box set as needed.

Been using Spotify to compare some of the tracks from these new remasters from the last batch, and I can't tell any meaningful difference to be honest. Maybe if I was using a turntable and a really expensive set of speakers I could hear it, but they sound virtually identical to me. I presume Republic will be the one that benefits most, seeing as it wasn't part of the remasters last time around.

Andy wrote: Thanks for the update. That glitch on Sunrise always annoyed me. Always have had to remember to sub in the version from the box set as needed.

That glitch on "The Him" which was on the 2007 version of "Movement" has been corrected on the 2015 remaster as well. I seem to remember it being right at the very end of the song. My favorite of the 2015 remasters is definitely "Brotherhood." It sounds like lots of stereo emphasis was used, so you can hear all the different layers of guitar and backup vocals with much more clarity. The original CD pressings sounded very muddy and dense, so it's huge improvement. It's almost like hearing a whole new album when listening to it with headphones.

Moderne Decay wrote:

As for the 2015 remaster, it sounds great. The drop-out error on "Sunrise" which was on the 2007 remaster has been corrected and overall it sounds less thin than that version. Overall, all the new 2015 remasters sound great with the exception of "Technique." There's actually three errors I've noticed on the album which sound like the master tape suddenly jumps up in speed for a split second. There's one toward the end of "All the Way," another at very beginning of "Round & Round," then a third I can't remember unless I listen to the whole album again.

I'm interested to know exactly where these Technique issues are, timings etc. Are you listening to mp3 versions?

Johnny James wrote:

Moderne Decay wrote:

As for the 2015 remaster, it sounds great. The drop-out error on "Sunrise" which was on the 2007 remaster has been corrected and overall it sounds less thin than that version. Overall, all the new 2015 remasters sound great with the exception of "Technique." There's actually three errors I've noticed on the album which sound like the master tape suddenly jumps up in speed for a split second. There's one toward the end of "All the Way," another at very beginning of "Round & Round," then a third I can't remember unless I listen to the whole album again.

I'm interested to know exactly where these Technique issues are, timings etc. Are you listening to mp3 versions?

It's the V0 vbr mp3 version which was purchased from Amazon's US website. They don't offer Flac versions of the download as of yet, but I can confirm it's not just bad mp3 encoding because the songs are also available on New Order's YouTube page and Spotify to stream for free and both have the glitches as well. Two of the glitches I can remember, but the last one wasn't so obvious. I'd have to listen to the full album to remember the last one.

The first one is on "All the Way" right at 2:51. It's very abrupt, but it's like the tape jumps in speed for a split second.

The second is one is during the very first second of "Round & Round." It's difficult to hear without headphones, but you'll hear this weird squeak sound, which again, sounds like the tape speed is slightly sped up for a split second. I've compared it to the original CD I have and it's not present there, nor the 2007 remaster.

So the third glitch I've noticed is on the track "Guilty Partner," but I just checked the original Quest CD I have from the 80s and it's on there as well. I'm pretty sure it's just how the original mastering tape is, so I wouldn't consider it new error. It just sounds clearer to hear on the new 2015 version, which is probably why I never noticed it throughout all these years.

At 4:11 on the song "Guilty Partner," Bernard says "I'm not some kind of foolish lover" and you can hear weird some kind of glitch right on the word "kind." It sounds like the guitar strings being scratched, but it actually effects his voice for that split second, so maybe there was a tape splice in the vocal track or something during the mixing process.

So yeah, that's all of them. I hate to seem like I'm being OCD or something, haha, but I grew up listening to these album a hundred times over, so these little changes really jumped out at me.

Sorry for a bit of a bump, here. I was just revisiting this thread to note down which reissues I want to pick up in the new year. I was particularly interested in the older albums (movement thru brotherhood) but it seems that the 2015 remasterings have been released only as digital so far. Does anyone know / has anyone heard rumours of whether there are plans to press vinyl from these remasterings? TIA

Truly essential purchases.

A related question, am I right in thinking that any digital copy for sale atm - in particular iTunes - would be the 2015 remasters? The Amazon ones are marked explicitly as such, but iTunes isn't (and iTunes is slightly cheaper for a higher quality file). The Brotherhood cover is not the 1986 original which suggests as such, but I'd like to be sure...

https://us.7digital.com/artist/new-order/albums

NotAMod wrote: . These new 2015 ones do sound really good it's got to be said. The music has a warmth and depth to it noticeably absent on the tinny treble 80s masterings; PC&L, Low-life and Brotherhood particularly benefit although Brotherhood is still a really harsh sounding album at the best of times.

Never been too fussed about buying remasters before but i'm a bit tempted now .Interested to hear PC&L, Low Life and Brotherhood remasters.

Thanks for your helpful answers NotAMod. I have all the NO albums on CD originally purchased in the early noughties and I've often thought "something" was odd about Low-Life thru Technique, but I was never sure what, possibly the mastering. So I am keen to try something that has been reworked. Those albums (and republic and get ready) have been significantly underlistened to by me relative to the earlier ones and WFTSC (and Substance) and it's time that they get a bit more love. I only have up to PC&L on vinyl. I've always loved "Love Vigilantes" but never got into LL as an Album, as a whole, in it's own right. Only really recently rediscovering Brotherhood too ("All Day Long" a recently rediscovered favourite)

As a side-note, I find "digesting" albums that were originally vinyl LPs much easier when they are thought of in that format: the whole "sides" thing is lost when on CD/digital, so things like Brotherhood being divided into a guitar side and a synth side is kind-of lost, or the Bowie albums with all the instrumentals on one half, or U2's Joshua Tree which has all the good shit on side A and the dross on side B... but understanding the split is a key part of understanding the album as a whole IMHO

As for where to buy 'em: I've got two options. I have some gift vouchers from a reward programme at work that I can get as either Amazon or iTunes (but sadly not 7digital or qobuz who would/could offer lossless downloads). I'll almost certainly go that route. The other option is if I can part-ex some records for credit at some local record shops, and if the LPs (which are not the 2015 masters!) have download codes, the downloads are likely to be the 2015 ones. It's a bit of a long-shot, and I doubt I'd get much credits fro the stuff I'm trying to flog (90s trance/dance, remixes, white label stuff etc.) as nobody seems interested.

Aside #2: we're deep into a 80s revival at the moment. It's almost embarrassing at times. I'm wondering whether we'll get a full on 90s revival, with people paying hundreds for Fat Boy Slim 12" remixes and what-not. If so it's probably at least 5 years off, and I don't think I can be bothered to sit on this stuff that long on the off-chance. There's also *so much* stuff from that period. It seems like every second person did a bootleg remix of a top 10 tune and pressed it on a one-sided white label. Perhaps it will always be considered junk and never have its second-time in the sun. As for why I've got boat loads of this shit? A friend moved house and had to clear his attic out.

Aside #3: I'm also waiting for the 'analogue synth' revival thing to pass and for the 'unashamedly digital' synth revival to start, things like the Casio CZ series, http://www.vintagesynth.com/casio/cz1000.php , synths that weren't shackled to their analogue past and tried to fully embrace the possibilities of digital. Once we're finally over this love affair with fake-analogue, who knows what might be possible...

Egads I've written an essay. In closing:

NotAMod wrote: This is a bit trainspotter-ish...However when the JD/NO catalogue was remastered in 2007-9 Warners didn't seem to bother discontinuing the CentreDate versions. Even today someone could walk into HMV in 2016 and pay 6 quid or whatever for a 1986 mastering of Low-life whereas the album has been remastered twice since then.

If there's one place on the Internet where NO fans can or should be a bit trainspotterish, surely this is the place! And given the mess that the re-issues have been for the last 10 years (as you say, the standard issue albums in most shops now being the original 80s masters, and the 2008-era reworks being a total cock-up, and it being pretty damn hard to tell whether a given 2008-era deluxe ed is one of the knackered or fixed editions, having to go by serial numbers on a post deep in the old forums on this here site...) it's surprisingly hard to get a reasonable good quality copy of the albums. Much more effort than should be necessary for a band of NO's stature.

Aside #4: A really interesting series of blog posts from a Ryko record exec on the subject of Bowie's back-catalogue: great stories about archive-diving etc. https://jeff-rougvie-1f6j.squarespace.com/bowie-blog/

my iTunes vouchers finally arrived so I bought the remastered "Movement". WOW what a difference. Truly worth it.

Jonathan wrote: my iTunes vouchers finally arrived so I bought the remastered "Movement". WOW what a difference. Truly worth it.

Cool - is it obvious from the packaging that it will be the most recent remaster? (having spent a bit on the 2 CD Collector's Editions a few years ago only to find those have been subsequently remastered too!)