RESEARCH - HELP NEEDED

To whoever can help;

I am currently doing research on the connection between Nazi Germany and modern music. Can anybody help me with the following, if indeed they apply to this rock group:-

Is there any connection between Nazi Germany's 'New World Order' and the name of this rock group?

If so, are any of the groups songs / lyrics connected to Nazi ideals, i.e. Anti Semitism, Homophobia, Fascism etc.

Are they many right wing followers of the band?

Who chose the name and why? (and do they know what it means)

Do the group or their followers promote / preach any of the Nazi ideals?

Any information would be most appreciated. I am sorry if this particular band have nothing to do with the right wing extremists and I apologise in advance to anyone who may be offended.

All replies will be gratefully accepted.

Regards

Jerry Murphy Tampa, Florida, USA.

Rob Gretton took there name from a newspaper headline he saw "new order of cambodia" if my memory serves me correctly (unlikely!)

Im sure this can be elaborated on by fellow orders :)

although the neo-nazi link is very teneous and frankly a bit old hat now.

Their were also always this kind of talks about thename Joy Division. Apparently that was the name for a certain part of the concentrationcamps where the Nazis could have a go with the Jewish females. But indeed an old hat.

And if there are any Nazi-supporting New Order fans: fuck all of them!!

Originally posted by Mario Herlaar And if there are any Nazi-supporting New Order fans: fuck all of them!!

damn fucking right!! no need for that bullshit.

everyone should just chill the fuck out and have a

Hi Jerry, welcome to NewOrderOnline.com first of all - this is not really what I would call you doing research. You have chosen the easy method (fair play to you on that count), by asking other people their opinions. Research to me, starts by reading things and forming your own thoughts and opinions on the matter. Only after that should you then go forth into the world, and seek other people's difference viewpoints on things. But I guess (or at least hope) that you have already done that.

Made up Quote by (Twat) Anthony H Wilson - Joy Division/New Order have never been, are not, and never will be associated with anything related to Nazi-ismness

Ho ho ho ho Merry Christmas

now we are talking.... I'd like to griond these Nazis to powder and sniff em for breakfast any time, horrible cunts!!!

Time for me to head off to the pub now prior to watching MCFC beat the crap out of Wolves and see The Goat add to his fine tally of 20plus goals this season (hopefully)

You are really wasting your time here, Jerry. Apperantly there is a lot of Nazi crap on the internet, but you won't find it here.

I have a shaved head and i listen to new order.... does that make me Hitler?

in response to the initial question: Look for a book called Tape Delay. It's a collection of interviews from 80's bands and NewOrder's interview focuses on their early Nazi charatarization. Their interview is the last in the book and pretty interesting to anyone interested in the band. I found a copy at Barnes and Noble tonight.

To those who replied thank you some helpful information, I checked out Joy Division and the link between the name and the nazi camps. I find it very strange that the band who wanted to dis associate themselves from the nazi link should tehn choose a name like 'New Order' - but I guess the band have their reasons (personally I think there may be some hidden agenda).

Anyway thank you all

ps This site is littered with bad language there are some many wonderful words in the English langauage, there is no need to use such foul words on this website.

Yours Jerry

Originally posted by Jerry Murphy To those who replied thank you some helpful information, I checked out Joy Division and the link between the name and the nazi camps. I find it very strange that the band who wanted to dis associate themselves from the nazi link should tehn choose a name like 'New Order' - but I guess the band have their reasons (personally I think there may be some hidden agenda).Anyway thank you allps This site is littered with bad language there are some many wonderful words in the English langauage, there is no need to use such foul words on this website.Yours Jerry

Hidden agenda my ass! Taking the piss out of those who tried to label them as nazis more like!

Yeah Jeff, let's do the cunt good and fuckin proper!!

So many beautiful words etc...Christ whats he on about. The most beautiful words are the most offensive

Originally posted by Muffy Yeah Jeff, let's do the cunt good and fuckin proper!!

theres no need for that language Muffy

you could have chosen so many beautiful alternatives

Originally posted by Seb Briggs > Originally posted by Muffy > Yeah Jeff, let's do the cunt good and fuckin proper!!

theres no need for that language Muffy

you could have chosen so many beautiful alternatives

It'll do the little jessie good!

Jerry, I friend of mine interviewed Hooky in 91 for her G.C.S.E's and asked him that actual question. His response was that they are in no way or form involved in Nazism. Unfortunately I only listened to the interview once and that was 11 years ago, so sorry for not being more specific.

When worlds collide! What kind of school does this boy go to? That's almost the funniest incident since Peregrine Underhill or whatever his name was. This is not a typical American specimen that we have here.

Ich Bin ein Kraftwerk.. schnell schnell auf wiedersehn pet vorsprung dursch technik.

etc..

He must attend Texas Christian University or Baylor. Religious freaks congregate at both of these schools. Another reason Texas should be sold or annexed. My guess is he's either really religious or he's my mother. She's the only other person who let's people know when their language could be a little nicer. Good luck on your paper about nazi's. fine subject for a person afraid of a few choice words.

Just remembered something to help out your research. Go to morrissey-solo.com, access the forums, and ask if morrissey is a nazi. that should keep you entertained for at least an hour.

I think Jerry's got a hidden agenda all his own....could be an imposter (Research my ass!). At any rate, what is the Internet for if not for cursing?.....

Dear all,

Thank you for some choice and frank words. I will not be dragged down to your level but i have had a private email from one of your members which states the following:

Can you expalin why the original 12inch cover of the UK release of 'Confusio' sometime in 1983 that if you read between the graphics it says F U C K O F F J E W. Thankyou to the individual who sent me that information I will not reveal their name.

If anybody can email me a picture of this album cover I would be very grateful.

As you people like to leave quotes mine is "All men are equal in the eyes of God"

Thanks all

Gee, who's the rasicist now? Attention Seb and Nic, this is how the destruction of my beloved Atmosphere began. This guy is a fake, I'm sure of it

You've got a level ,Jerry??? confusioncover:if that is what peoiple want to read in it , feel free . i dont think our 4 heroes have got anything to do with that. BTW have you ever read the Bible backwards, upsidedown,in reverse AND in japanese??You'll hear the complete speeches of Adolf. Come on Jerry, go to the seaside and get gangbanged by 40 sailors. Bye bye

Jerry, how do you then explain that Arthur Baker, their good friend and producer is Jewish? Also they played an anti-apartheid bill (didn't they?). On one Electronic song Bernard Sumner sings "It's like the colour of your skin, it doesn't mean a thing."

So where exactly does the secret agenda fit in?

Also if you order ANY CD from the HMV net page, the confirmation message states Order status: new order

Does that make HMV a bunch of nazis too?

Yep, religion. I knew it. he must be working on a paper for his Theology class. Just what we need another FUCKING preacher to tell us how to live our lives. Show me a picture of God and I just might believe in her/him/it. You're wasting your time in Tampa. If you want some fun check out the Salvador Dali museum on mushrooms. Talk about your religious experiences.....!

Mario, in case you didn't know, the USA has a corner on the military gangbang rape thing so unless Jerry is himself involved in the US military, he wont be included in any multiple partner activities. US service men like to take advantage of the women (and probably the little boys too) where they are stationed away from home. God bless our dirty rotten disgusting no good for nothing but killing soldiers. Friendly Fire. The only path to peace.

Originally posted by Jerry Murphy Dear all, Thank you for some choice and frank words. I will not be dragged down to your level but i have had a private email from one of your members which states the following:Can you expalin why the original 12inch cover of the UK release of 'Confusio' sometime in 1983 that if you read between the graphics it says F U C K O F F J E W.Thankyou to the individual who sent me that information I will not reveal their name.If anybody can email me a picture of this album cover I would be very grateful.As you people like to leave quotes mine is "All men are equal in the eyes of God"Thanks all

You absolute tit.

Btw thanks to you jerry i now have 400 posts! "all men are equal in the eyes of god"?Fuck off.

whoo yeah i like it. Yesterday there was an asshole called piontdexter now it is jerry. Are you two in any way related?You filthy badlanguage using sob.

Jerry, if that is indeed your real name, I am a champion of free speech, I believe you have the right to state your opinion. Why everyone is slagging off you is that you go and present your opinions under the guise of "research" then proceed thru that to spew the very rascist BS you espouse to be researching. You have an agenda, it's not that well hidden, and you're a nusciance because of it. if you had just come out and said, "i don't like Jews" or "How do NO feel about minorites because I don't care for them much myself", I'd have a bit more respect for your honesty. I would still say you were wrong, but you'd have earned some bonus points by being open. Instead you hide behind the cloak of your original post, trying to antagonize the regulars of this site. i've seen it done before, and i don't appreciate it. Whatever your belief system may be, we are all equally shitheads until we die, and the best we can do is try to get along just a little better than the previous generations. Fuck off, jerry, you're not welcome

Originally posted by Keeper Of The Major Key > Originally posted by Jerry Murphy> Dear all, > > Thank you for some choice and frank words. I will not be dragged down to your level but i have had a private email from one of your members which states the following:> > Can you expalin why the original 12inch cover of the UK release of 'Confusio' sometime in 1983 that if you read between the graphics it says F U C K O F F J E W.> Thankyou to the individual who sent me that information I will not reveal their name.> > If anybody can email me a picture of this album cover I would be very grateful.> > As you people like to leave quotes mine is > "All men are equal in the eyes of God"> > Thanks all> > >

You absolute tit.

Took the words out of my mouth Keepsy.

New Order, and their associates, aren't Nazis.

End of.

Originally posted by Jerry Murphy ps This site is littered with bad language there are some many wonderful words in the English langauage, there is no need to use such foul words on this website.Yours Jerry

Bad Language? Perhaps it's because I'm Dutch and do not understand everything (I learn it from a book), but I learn a lot of new wonderful English words on this forum, like cack, pants, bollocks, tosser; to name but a few (from Martin's posts). I wonder what it all means ?!??!?

Jerry, if that is indeed your real name, I am a champion of free speech, I believe you have the right to state your opinion. Why everyone is slagging off you is that you go and present your opinions under the guise of "research" then proceed thru that to spew the very rascist BS you espouse to be researching. You have an agenda, it's not that well hidden, and you're a nusciance because of it. if you had just come out and said, "i don't like Jews" or "How do NO feel about minorites because I don't care for them much myself", I'd have a bit more respect for your honesty. I would still say you were wrong, but you'd have earned some bonus points by being open. Instead you hide behind the cloak of your original post, trying to antagonize the regulars of this site. i've seen it done before, and i don't appreciate it. Whatever your belief system may be, we are all equally shitheads until we die, and the best we can do is try to get along just a little better than the previous generations. Fuck off, jerry, you're not welcome

It looks like Mr. Murphy himself is a fucking filthy nazi recruiter. Obviously he will gain nothing here.

One thing he got right - He really needs help

Everything I've ever read or heard regearding the Nazi Connection basically assers that the imagery, not the ideas, were attractive enough to merit such attention. if you ever read England's Dreaming by Jon Savage, it's dead obvious thta most punk groups were far more explicit in their use of Nazi imagery than JD. But people continue with the JD thing, why? Because they wore dark trenchcoats? C'mon Jerry, give it a rest

Ian, paticuarly was obviously interested in the dark and evil, hence songs like Atrocity Exhibition. It's lazy and stupid to suggest that this affected his own, or the other band members own beliefs.

Its kind of ironic that this guy is called Jerry, innit?

i don't see the connection between Ian's interest in the dark and evil and nazism.

Originally posted by Jerry Murphy To those who replied thank you some helpful information, I checked out Joy Division and the link between the name and the nazi camps. I find it very strange that the band who wanted to dis associate themselves from the nazi link should tehn choose a name like 'New Order' - but I guess the band have their reasons (personally I think there may be some hidden agenda).Anyway thank you allps This site is littered with bad language there are some many wonderful words in the English langauage, there is no need to use such foul words on this website.Yours Jerry

Who the fuck, who the fuck, who the fucking 'ell are you?

On second thoughts Jerry why don't you ask Quincy Jones what he thinks?

didnt martin say something about livening up the forum? martin is this your way of getting everyone riled? i bet youre jerry you cheeky beggar....if so, good one.

Naah, cant be Martin.No way. THis is not his style,i hope.

Originally posted by Taboo # 7 Jerry, if that is indeed your real name, I am a champion of free speech, I believe you have the right to state your opinion. Why everyone is slagging off you is that you go and present your opinions under the guise of "research" then proceed thru that to spew the very rascist BS you espouse to be researching. You have an agenda, it's not that well hidden, and you're a nusciance because of it. if you had just come out and said, "i don't like Jews" or "How do NO feel about minorites because I don't care for them much myself", I'd have a bit more respect for your honesty. I would still say you were wrong, but you'd have earned some bonus points by being open. Instead you hide behind the cloak of your original post, trying to antagonize the regulars of this site. i've seen it done before, and i don't appreciate it. Whatever your belief system may be, we are all equally shitheads until we die, and the best we can do is try to get along just a little better than the previous generations. Fuck off, jerry, you're not welcome

Tabsy, i'm sorry but I kinda like the little cunt!

Can you explain why, exactly, Muff-man? Is it because he caused a stir?

Originally posted by Mario Herlaar i don't see the connection between Ian's interest in the dark and evil and nazism.

exactly

Dear all,

I can't seem to understand why I am being picked upon here, look guys one of your members sent me an email about that record with visual subliminal message in it. How would I know about it? I hadn't even heard of New Order I mean they have never been a successful band here in the States.

I can see that this site means a lot to y'all and that your pop band is very close to all your hearts so I can understand the intenseness of your replies and the sincerity of them (even if the langauage is disgusting and offensive).

I would just like to say that I downloaded some New Order songs from Kazaa (check it out guys its the new Napster) and I was pleasently surprised! I was expecting heavy rock ala Metalicca or even a Heart / Bon Jovi vibe but instead I was greeted by elctro pop! Excellent, as a fan of the brilliant Depeche Mode I can relate to synth pop / rock. Not bad but I'm afraid your guys will never beat the best British band in Depeche Mode. I'm sure you guys like DM - the album Violator was one the greatest of the last 20 years.

Anyway thanks for all your help and have a holy and peaceful Christmas.

Jerry Murphy Tampa, Fl. USA

Now you've really done it, Jerry. Still, best wishes.

You like DM but have never heard of NO...strange. Fair do's Jerry, just vague hints at suggesting our fave band are a bunch of Nazi's (with alterior motives) probably isn't the best way to endear yourself. Or coming on to a board and criticising the content/language. Nevermind, good luck with your project anyway.

Originally posted by Patrick Can you explain why, exactly, Muff-man? Is it because he caused a stir?

Yes!

Originally posted by Muffy > Originally posted by Patrick> Can you explain why, exactly, Muff-man? Is it because he caused a stir?>

Yes!

Just as I thought!

I think Jerry's a rascist Depeche Mode website owner, judging by his "oh, they'll never be as good as DM"

I still say the guy ain't legit, the whole "someone e-mailed me Fuck Off Jew" sounds like crap, so I will not wish him a merry Xmas (though I wonder if he'd take it from a Nazi music-loving Storm Trooper like myself, seeing as Jesus was a Jew, after all)

I seem to think New Order have had SOME success here, otherwise there would be no websites etc devoted to the pioneers of Manchester (they were crafting Blue Monday the same time that DM was still pissing around the bottom of the charts)

Come on Beavis, that was uncalled for. I listened to DM up to Violater. Black Celebration - Violater is pretty decent stuff. Not that i would be caught dead listening to them now, but at the time it was pretty good. Jerry sounds like a decent guy writing a bad paper. You actually bought your roommate some hideous cd (brittney/nsync i cant remember). i refuse to let that shit into my house. you should have bought her low-life instead. i suppose when you like country, your standards have been lowered. now early country from the 30's-50's is not bad. I'm sure you've done the boot scootin boogie a few times right?

beavis said fillie.

huh, huh, hu-hu-hu-hu, huh snarf

sad thing is, you actually have to talk to those girls. what the fuck would you talk about? how'd you squeeze into your jeans or is that latex paint?

Originally posted by Jerry Murphy Dear all, I would just like to say that I downloaded some New Order songs from Kazaa (check it out guys its the new Napster) and I was pleasently surprised! I was expecting heavy rock ala Metalicca or even a Heart / Bon Jovi vibe but instead I was greeted by elctro pop! Excellent, as a fan of the brilliant Depeche Mode I can relate to synth pop / rock. Not bad but I'm afraid your guys will never beat the best British band in Depeche Mode. I'm sure you guys like DM - the album Violator was one the greatest of the last 20 years.Anyway thanks for all your help and have a holy and peaceful Christmas.Jerry MurphyTampa, Fl. USA

Jerry, the band do look like Bon Jovi though, check out the video Touched by the Hand of God.

Though I do have a sneaking suspicion that this is a wind-up.