D Mode vs New order

I think they also did themselves no favours naming themselves after a French magazine. Depeche Mode is a loose translation of "Hurried Fashion" and I suppose it's quite apt in the context.......mind you the French audiences were very wary of them when they first emerged mainly cos of the name - when they found out they were lily-livered Essex boys from a suburban London backwater their suspicions were justified.

However, they really should have changed their name when Vince Clarke - their founder member - buggered off to link up with some big burly Dr Feelgood-obsessed female brickie from Southend.

They should have re-named themselves Depressed Toad.

;)

Why, if you're into NO, aren't you allowed to be into DM or The Cure? That's an attitude I've never understood. Can anyone explain? (And yes, this is a serious question!)

To be honest, I don't mind enjoying all three myself. Though of course NO/JD figure most prominently throughout whereas with the Cure and Depeche Mode its only a specific period of their work that I have much time for really.

I only enjoyed the Mode's stuff between 1987 and 1994 whilst the Cure should have stopped making records after their best pop album Head On The Door cos everything they have done since is retreading the same tired old formula (but then, aren't NO as guilty of this as fat Smith & co?).

Jonathan wrote:

Christopher Owens wrote:

Jonathan wrote: I think Dm lyrics are suitable for boy bands especially their early stuff. Its makes me deeply uncomfortable when people mention NO and DM in the same breath.

What about the lyrics to World in Motion?

You may have a point but i thought keith allen wrote it. I shouldnt said that some of the Dm lyrics are retarted boy band material. I cant say it for all their songs. here's an example: Somebody I want somebody to share Share the rest of my life Share my innermost thoughts Know my intimate details Someone who'll stand by my side And give me support And in return She'll get my support She will listen to me When I want to speak About the world we live in And life in general Though my views may be wrong They may even be perverted She'll hear me out And won't easily be converted To my way of thinking In fact she'll often disagree But at the end of it all She will understand me

I want somebody who cares For me passionately With every thought and With every breath Someone who'll help me see things In a different light All the things I detest I will almost like I don't want to be tied To anyone's strings I'm carefully trying to steer clear of Those things But when I'm asleep I want somebody Who will put their arms around me And kiss me tenderly Though things like this Make me sick In a case like this I'll get away with it

© 1984 Martin Lee Gore

I could puke with these lyrics.

when i was about 13, my friends and i used to sit around in our dorm singing along to this song and talking about how deep and romantic it was. :o

I started off listening to Depeche Mode and New Order a fuck of a lot once I started getting into 'real music'.. (don't even ask what I did before that), but you know, DM have really worn on me over the years, their songs are starting to sound samey, formulaic, and not really.. varied enough. They don't seem to have the kick to them that makes me want to listen to them like a good round of Temptation, or Round & Round, or virtually any of New Order's catalogue..

Yeah, I've really gone off DM. Admittedly I like the piano riff off this new single, but apart from that it's quite bland. Was buying something in Virgin and the DJ said "I could play this 70 times if I was allowed to, brilliant track" and I felt like screaming. Argggh.

I think the secret of DM's success in the US is not only the music,but the lavish stage sets they took on tour.It's the old "if you're gonna do big..do it bigger". With the word of mouth about the "Music For The Masses" tour in the US,it was inevitable that they'd fill the likes of the Rosebowl,boosting whatever record sales they already had. By the time the "Devotional" tour came out,armed with great visuals by Corbijn,they just blew out every electro live band out of the water. New Order on the other hand,they're success in UK relies on our love for the music,no trimmings.What you see is what you get.

Al Jarvis wrote:

hibster wrote: i still don't understand why the order get lumped in with dm & the cure in america.

You might when you meet the American New Order fans! :(

Why did I just picture you describing Chruchy there?

Seriously, it's because they were played on the same radio stations, and radio in the US is segmented beyond belief, and there's a small subset that likes to flog the next best thing from the UK, whether it's the British Invasion, New Wave, or the lastest round of what seems to happen about every 20 years...

Gotta agree about the lyrics to "Somebody", but those were from 1985, what about some of the stuff that NO wrote more recently, like J.E.T...or Rock the shack...etc etc

The Happy One wrote:

Al Jarvis wrote:

hibster wrote: i still don't understand why the order get lumped in with dm & the cure in america.

You might when you meet the American New Order fans! :(

Seriously, it's because they were played on the same radio stations, and radio in the US is segmented beyond belief,

That has been my impression of US radio whenever I've been there (repeating myself from pet peeves thread). There's something really incredibly annoying about it, the way everything is so cynically demographically targeted.

Even when they are playing stuff I like (e.g. some self-conciously 'alternative' station like Q101) I find myself missing the innocent naffness of Smashie and Nicey. I'd rather they occasionally played something I hated, poxy Bon Jovi or something, rather than be pandered to in such a cynical way. At least then there'd be a chance they'd play something good I didn't know, rather than just playing my own cd collection back to me. Plus their catagories are all fouled up anyway (e.g. DM and NO lumped in together).

Anyway, even though I agree DM aren't remotely in the same league as NO, and Gahan's bad lyrics are an altogether higher level of awfulness than Barny's occasional lapses ('land of meat'??? 'you can't shaft when you are alone'???). I still am a bit bemused by the near panic some self-conciously cool types display whenever anyone hear mentions the former. Its all just pop music ultimately, no?

Feel free to slate me for this, but as a fan of both bands, I think that Depeche Mode have been the more adventurous, creative and consistent over the years. New Order started off with some fantastic, innovative music and descended into poppier territory, whilst Depeche Mode did the opposite. I think it's pretty much a certainty that Depeche Mode have sold more records than New Order ever have or will... still, New Order's finest work beats most of Depeche Mode's.

The one thing that both groups have in common is that they both make some fantastic dance music.

I always heard that Depeche Mode wasn't as big in their native England as they were in the U.S., or even continental Europe. I remember reading something about how they were considered sell-outs for especially catering to the Americans and trying to break it big.

Still, DM is one of my favorite bands. Actually, second fave behind the Order, but I don't necessarily think they are too alike in their respective genre.

Al Jarvis wrote:

DShamen wrote: Feel free to slate me for this, but as a fan of both bands, I think that Depeche Mode have been the more adventurous, creative and consistent over the years. New Order started off with some fantastic, innovative music and descended into poppier territory, whilst Depeche Mode did the opposite.

Isn't this just a mass of contradictions?! Depeche Mode have been more adventurous but also consistent?! And yet New Order have been innovative. Er, but poppy?! Whilst Depeche Mode have done the opposite?!

Are you a politician?!

Forgive me for having a few beers last night... what I meant is that Depeche Mode are NOW the more creative of the two I feel, whilst New Order have basically produced the same sounds for the best part of 15 years. Depeche Mode seem to take more risks now than New Order do, I can't see anything being particularly mind blowing on the new album... I hope I'm wrong.

Err... Sorry already for this, but just hearing the new Depeche album through the radio today and I can't help feeling that it's not too good I'm afraid... I already felt a bit lost with the previous one, so... In my little humble opinion 'Ultra' was the last excellent proper album. In regard 'WftSc' is much better even if it's quite vintage.

DShamen wrote:

Al Jarvis wrote:

DShamen wrote: Feel free to slate me for this, but as a fan of both bands, I think that Depeche Mode have been the more adventurous, creative and consistent over the years. New Order started off with some fantastic, innovative music and descended into poppier territory, whilst Depeche Mode did the opposite.

Isn't this just a mass of contradictions?! Depeche Mode have been more adventurous but also consistent?! And yet New Order have been innovative. Er, but poppy?! Whilst Depeche Mode have done the opposite?!

Are you a politician?!

Forgive me for having a few beers last night... what I meant is that Depeche Mode are NOW the more creative of the two I feel, whilst New Order have basically produced the same sounds for the best part of 15 years. Depeche Mode seem to take more risks now than New Order do, I can't see anything being particularly mind blowing on the new album... I hope I'm wrong.

as much as i would like to disagree with you, i think you might be right , WFTSC was good but not groundbreaking, NO in the past were always groundbreaking and innovative, now they're great but dont break new ground, DM nowadays whilst not being great, at least try to be innovative,...

How can you answer seriously to an absolutely ridiculous question. They are simply not comparative. New Order are New Order yes? They have not, as far as I can see (who likes lots of different music) really made any steps to conform to 'what Joe Public' want at all. I personally love WFTSC but I used to like the old DM stuff in their day. Depeche Mode have conformed and badly. This latest is the most drab boring repetitive dross I have ever heard as is much else in the charts - although I am coming round to Supergrass! Depeche Mode were always about a synth and a hairstyle. Still are. It's like trying to compare W H Auden to Shakespeare. Or Enid Blyton to Shakespeare come to that..... If you like both, fine, but please don't try to compare... Take a carrot and a cucumber for example; there's a thought!

Wino wrote: How can you answer seriously to an absolutely ridiculous question. They are simply not comparative. New Order are New Order yes? They have not, as far as I can see (who likes lots of different music) really made any steps to conform to 'what Joe Public' want at all. I personally love WFTSC but I used to like the old DM stuff in their day. Depeche Mode have conformed and badly. This latest is the most drab boring repetitive dross I have ever heard as is much else in the charts - although I am coming round to Supergrass! Depeche Mode were always about a synth and a hairstyle. Still are. It's like trying to compare W H Auden to Shakespeare. Or Enid Blyton to Shakespeare come to that..... If you like both, fine, but please don't try to compare... Take a carrot and a cucumber for example; there's a thought!

i understand what your saying, i love NO - always will do, but i'm concerned that nowadays they try to be 'poptastic' and appear with the bird from the scissor sisters etc. WFTSC was a good album but not great and definetely not cutting edge like technique and low life were. At least DM are trying to be innovative nowadays - but they'll never be on a par with NO...

poptastic

I don't think they are at all.When I first heard the album, some of the tracks made me smile purely because they had a certain 'old' feel to them - look how the single has dropped in the charts. I hate to admit but we have Radio2 on at work all day; they played it for about a week once a day and that was your lot. DM is played constantly and I stand by my case here, it is dull, lifeless and hopelessly awful. DM seem to be under the illusion that the music doesn't count anymore - all head for the salon!! "Make up" "Cameras, light, action" oh, don't bother everyones gone to sleep.

Wino wrote:

poptastic

I don't think they are at all.When I first heard the album, some of the tracks made me smile purely because they had a certain 'old' feel to them - look how the single has dropped in the charts. I hate to admit but we have Radio2 on at work all day; they played it for about a week once a day and that was your lot. DM is played constantly and I stand by my case here, it is dull, lifeless and hopelessly awful. DM seem to be under the illusion that the music doesn't count anymore - all head for the salon!! "Make up" "Cameras, light, action" oh, don't bother everyones gone to sleep.

your probably right, DM are shit! i'm just concerned that NO arent as cutting edge as they used to be and that saddens me..

Let's sum it up in a sentence or two.

DM are generally disposable, but attempt to be edgy to grab the gothy/poppy crowd.

NO are generally more durable, but do sometimes edge towards the indie/NME style crowd to gain a bit of attention. Or maybe that's entirely unintentional, or at least on part of the band themselves!

i'm not familar with the new Depeche Mode record or who produced it, and New Order has really given up on trying to be cutting edge or experiemntal, that is true... but to me its absurd to call Depeche Mode more experimental, because their last few albums have been a produced product, not much different from Madonna (just throw some money at a producer to give them a sound, to make a washed up has-been sound superficially modern)... and Depeche Mode's personality has stayed the cliche course to meet their fans expectations.

At least New Order is a real working band (if well past their peak creatively) and has tried many different things over the last two albums, most people have complained about some of these New order "missteps" but at least the guys seem to be having fun.

You can check out the new album here

http://www.myspace.com/depechemode

((((e))))

is it mandatory?

Wino wrote: is it mandatory?

yes!!!

OK - it's saturday night, and for once I've got nothing better to do, so .... come back to you.