KRAFTWERK

I think basically it has been to an extent. Definitely admired them, and perhaps just being admirable of them was the catalyst of them embracing electronic music so much - but they verged off away from what Kraftwerk's direction and took what they admired and applied their own lack of know how and swath of inspirtaion into making it their own.

I like to put on a comparison test sometimes of how different they sound with albums of the same period - like electric cafe and then following it with brotherhood. You can hear nuances of the sound, but overall they aren't very majorly influenced by their direction.

Hugely. They can't get thru an NO interview without mention of them.

NO interviews generally consist of the following subject matter:

Ian Curtis' death, Hacienda, Blue Monday, Questions on their longevity, Drugs, World in Motion/John Barnes/Keith Allen (on a 4-yearly cycle), Kraftwerk.

Supposedly the 'choir' sound in Blue Monday was sampled from the Kraftwerk track "Uranium". CLIP

Blue Monday is Kraftwerk meets Ennio Morricone meets Planet Rock.

There's a definite krautrock influence in both JD and NO; I know that at least Ian listened to Kraftwerk, also to Popol Vuh and maybe some other krautrock bands too. The krautrock influence is at its most obvious in Hannett's production experiments, also in the doomy keyboard work (on UP, Closer and Movement at least) and in the incredibly precise, machine-like drumming by Steve; I don't know if he actually listened to something like Neu! or Can or wanted to become another Jaki Liebzeit but at least he had his own touch in whatever he played.

The influence of Kraftwerk (Autobahn and beyond) is the most noticeable one though, obviously especially in something like "Your Silent Face". But even if the sequenced bits of that track could have easily appeared on a Kraftwerk record, it still sounds different in many other ways.

I'm surprised Miss Chapman hasn't come down her mountain to speak up on this :)

i'm funny about kraftwerk, there's maybe a dozen tracks of theirs I could listen too over and over forever, and others I am not too fussed on....oddly enough including "the model".

It's a documented fact Ian used to drum Kraftwerk into JD at rehearsals. And Blue Monday's CONCEPT, if not's it's reality was VERY Kraftwerk. i never did get the KW1 thing with YSF...there are several other tracks that sound more KW that that......then againn I've never heard a raw demo of it...has anyone? Much of NO's electronic work is far more punk than anything else....the gate trigger thing they use(temptaion EGG etc) is just "lash it up and it'll fuckin rock", no pissing about.

correct me if i am wrong by all means.....but KW would rather boil in oil than be seen in public with a yamaha RXnn?

Fogface wrote: There's a definite krautrock influence in both JD and NO; I know that at least Ian listened to Kraftwerk, also to Popol Vuh and maybe some other krautrock bands too. The krautrock influence is at its most obvious in Hannett's production experiments, also in the doomy keyboard work (on UP, Closer and Movement at least) and in the incredibly precise, machine-like drumming by Steve; I don't know if he actually listened to something like Neu! or Can or wanted to become another Jaki Liebzeit but at least he had his own touch in whatever he played.

The influence of Kraftwerk (Autobahn and beyond) is the most noticeable one though, obviously especially in something like "Your Silent Face". But even if the sequenced bits of that track could have easily appeared on a Kraftwerk record, it still sounds different in many other ways.

I do remember Steve mentioning a couple of Can albums in the History In Cuttings collection and also mentioning Jaki Liebzeit and John Bonham in a interview done about the time Low-life was due for release(it also mentioned upgrading the DMX/Polysequencer/Prophet 5 combo to the Voyetras, QX1 sequencers and RX11 drum machines and the idiosyncrasies of those beasties).

Sher[gold]GOLD[/gold] Six wrote: QX1 sequencers and RX11 drum machines and the idiosyncrasies of those beasties).

you mean a Yamaha badge right?

To a certain extent is my vote.

Songs like YSF, BM EGG, Thieves Like Us amd TPK are really influenced. Plus, Barney also used Karl Bartos in quite a few songs with Electronic in the mid 90's.

They also talk of Sylvester quite a lot and Patrick Cowley - anyone heard any of their stuff?

Kraftwerk's 'The Models' album is corking but I was really disappointed with 'Trans Europe Express'. Anyone recommend any of their others?

my fave track is actually a modernish one

Expo 2000

not just cos it's lovely, but it truly is sonic perfection...such a good track for shaking down a soundsystem.

*Influenced by* doesn't mean *sounds like*. Everyone's influenced by everything they hear, even if they hate it and end up making something that sounds the absolute opposite. But anyway... Kraftwerk are clearly a sizeable positive influence on New Order.

I've often wondered what other krautrock JD listened to. Steve's drumming is very like Klaus Dinger and especially Jaki L at times. For other Factory bands I'd say that Can were definitely big favourites of ACR and Section 25. The Knife Slits Water bassline is a direct rip-off of a Can track (Aspectacle IIRC), and SXXV’s Key Of Dreams *is* Can, both in the editing-down of hours of jams approach and also the sound itself.

you only have to listen to "your silient face" new orders, tribute to Kraftwerk.

Al Jarvis wrote:

Outoforder wrote: you only have to listen to "your silient face" new orders, tribute to Kraftwerk.

Which, basically, sounds f'all like any Kraftwerk track I can think of!

Yeah, that's what i said, but as I also pointed out.....I never heard a raw 4-track demo or anything..... lord only knows what the original track sounded like.

Al Jarvis wrote:

Outoforder wrote: you only have to listen to "your silient face" new orders, tribute to Kraftwerk.

Which, basically, sounds f'all like any Kraftwerk track I can think of!

To my ears YSF does sound a bit like Neon Lights. Krafty on the other hand sounds nothing like Kraftwerk.

Steve Campbell wrote: my fave track is actually a modernish one

Expo 2000

not just cos it's lovely, but it truly is sonic perfection...such a good track for shaking down a soundsystem.

Detroit - Germany - Were so electro.

I still cant work out what the link is with detroit. I remember hearing that the live version of expo (or Planet Of Visions) was a reworking of a remix by Underground Resistance. Planet Of Visions is fantastic though, & I agree, "the model" is by far and away my least favourite KW song.

I'm sure they did influence NO - but not as much as they did OMD - who are back together.

Fogface wrote: T

The influence of Kraftwerk (Autobahn and beyond) is the most noticeable one though, obviously especially in something like "Your Silent Face". But even if the sequenced bits of that track could have easily appeared on a Kraftwerk record, it still sounds different in many other ways.

I always thought YSF sounded pretty close to Franz Schubert on Trans Europe Express. The story was that the sequencers started playing by themselves on the Kraftwerk track in the style of Schubert, hence the name... The last good thing those guys did was the remix of Radioactivity but that was back in 1991 believe it or not!

Guilty Partner wrote: To a certain extent is my vote.

Songs like YSF, BM EGG, Thieves Like Us amd TPK are really influenced. Plus, Barney also used Karl Bartos in quite a few songs with Electronic in the mid 90's.

They also talk of Sylvester quite a lot and Patrick Cowley - anyone heard any of their stuff?

Kraftwerk's 'The Models' album is corking but I was really disappointed with 'Trans Europe Express'. Anyone recommend any of their others?

Computer World is good to my ears, used to love Computer Love which is now Coldplay's Talk. TEE came out in 1977 and like all their stuff, was 'ahead of its time' - I think the percussion on TEE and Metal on Metal is fab. A good snapshot of their stuff is The Mix, well worth a listen. Karl Bartos' Communication solo cd has a couple of good moments and is indistinguishable from Kraftwerk's stuff.

Clockwork C wrote:

Steve Campbell wrote: my fave track is actually a modernish one

Expo 2000

not just cos it's lovely, but it truly is sonic perfection...such a good track for shaking down a soundsystem.

Detroit - Germany - Were so electro.

I still cant work out what the link is with detroit. I remember hearing that the live version of expo (or Planet Of Visions) was a reworking of a remix by Underground Resistance. Planet Of Visions is fantastic though, & I agree, "the model" is by far and away my least favourite KW song.

I'm sure they did influence NO - but not as much as they did OMD - who are back together.

OMD back together??? Wow that's the first I heard about it! Is it the same line up?

King of Nothing wrote:

To my ears YSF does sound a bit like Neon Lights. Krafty on the other hand sounds nothing like Kraftwerk.

That was my thought exactly. Of all the tracks they've done, how is Krafty the one that reminded them of Kraftwerk?

again....you're talking about the track as WE hear it...not the "here's an idea I had" version. I can hear KW in Krafty...FFS the drums are pure ancient electro.

For me, Neon Lights is one of the most achingly beautiful songs in the pop canon. If any Kraftwerk song influenced YSF, it's surely this one

I put a Kraftwerk tune on at a NYE party this year, cant remember the track, I'm sure it said it was done in '74 on the label. I only noticed it when it stopped, very bland. Still, it must have been good in its time, defo pioneering.

Actually all this stuff about New Order influencing, inventing etc I dont really go for. Apart from maybe '82 to '84 the fookin Bee Gees were probably more influential than NO.

Right, I'm fookin leggin in now......

I don't think they were extremely influenced by them, (otherwise, they might have sounded like a Kraftwerk clone)but I think a lot of bands that used synthesisers that came out in the late 70s throughout the 80s were to some extent influenced by them. Speaking of this thread, though, on this other message board, (not on here; some other site), some idiot preteen who didn't know what she was talking about said that Depeche Mode's new album sounded Kraftwerk-ish. I told her, "WTF?".

Hi Chris mate!

Happy new year to you and your good lady. Give me a shout and we'll go for drinkies.

Ah, the perennial Kraftwerk question. The Dusseldorf genuises are at the very heart of what New Order have always done, along with The Velvets, The Pistols etc. I'd say NO have a less...forensic approach to their music than Kraftwerk do but Kraftwerk's influence on JD/NO and their influence can't be underestimated.

Certainly Joy Division were already taking on board the sounds and approach of Kraftwerk from Trans-Europe Express (77) and The Man Machine (78) and were probably already into them before, Uranium appearing on Radio-Activity (75). There's a long (by modern standards), naked choir sound on there which would've been perfect for sampling some eight years after RA was released.

Bernard used to say in interviews that Ian brought in both TEE and TMM to rehearsals and they'd sit down and listen to the albums all the way through, knocked out by the minimal precision, the clicking beats and the strange, almost cold war feeling of it.

I was watching KW's new live double DVD (their first folks!) the other day and the magnificence of them struck me again after all these years. I've seen them live four times now, including two consecutive nights at Hammy Apollo on their Computer World tour in 81 - man, they blew the place away. Both the Order and Kraftwerk are awesome live but for totally different reasons.

Your Silent Face had the early title of KW1 - Kraftwerk One. Karl Bartos (now ex-member, as he left before The Mix) appeared and co-wrote on Raise The Pressure and Ralf and Florian were amazed at the DMX bass drum on Blue Monday to the extent that they considered recording at the studio where it was made!

Andy McCluskey (of OMD) is a lifelong Kraftwerk obsessionist and sung on Karl Bartos's short-lived Elektrik Musik project album 'Esperanto' on the track Kissing The Machine. The second (four-piece) line-up of OMD are to reform for a series of special gigs when they'll play their 1981 masterpiece album Architecture & Morality in its entirity. They're planning a new album too!

Chris Nash wrote: Apparently, Andy McClusky is very good friends with Kraftwerk's Karl and Wolfgang and has worked with Wolfgang Flur on occasion.

We were standing right near Andy Mcluskey at the Kraftwerk show at Brimingham Hummingbird in 1991.Slighty under the influence i voiced to him my disdain of OMD .I think he was amused actually

I think Joy Division's production is similar to Kraftwerk's in it's use of silence, reverb,echo or whatever to produce a certain type of atmosphere. The same applies to a lot of the New Order stuff around the 'PCL' period, 'YSF' does sound like 'Franz Schubert'. After this time (especially 'Brotherhood')the space seems to have disappeared.

Can I be the first to say I'd like to kick Chris Martin's head in (thought not!), he's ruined one of my favourite Kraftwerk melodies for ever.

Oh yeah, Old Blue is correct about the 'Uranium' sample - I suspect this is a more likely explanation for any Kraftwerk visit to the 'Blue Monday' studio than any bass drum sound.

NO was definitely influenced by Kraftwerk, but Kraftwerk was definitely influenced by Afrika Bombatta(read Planet Rock, Planet Patrol, Looking for the Perfect Beat, etc).

It can go both ways though, Pete. My lad had been singing that melody all the time, so I played him Computer Love. Next thing I know he's knicked the CD off the shelf and is playing it on the stereo we got him for Christmas. He reliably informs me that he prefers the second version of Computer World on the album to the first one...

Isamu wrote: Kraftwerk was definitely influenced by Afrika Bombatta(read Planet Rock, Planet Patrol, Looking for the Perfect Beat, etc).

Please, tell me you are only joking. And if not, go and have a closer look on the release dates of the album covers.

Speaking Kraftwerk, the 5.1 DTS mix of the Minimum-Maximum DVD is currently blowing plaster off my living room ceiling. Kling klang!

:\pimp3:

Steve Campbell wrote:

Al Jarvis wrote:

Outoforder wrote: you only have to listen to "your silient face" new orders, tribute to Kraftwerk.

Which, basically, sounds f'all like any Kraftwerk track I can think of!

Yeah, that's what i said, but as I also pointed out.....I never heard a raw 4-track demo or anything..... lord only knows what the original track sounded like.

The synthy percussion at the start sounds like it fell straight off Computer World.

Steve Lea wrote:

Guilty Partner wrote: To a certain extent is my vote.

Songs like YSF, BM EGG, Thieves Like Us amd TPK are really influenced. Plus, Barney also used Karl Bartos in quite a few songs with Electronic in the mid 90's.

They also talk of Sylvester quite a lot and Patrick Cowley - anyone heard any of their stuff?

Kraftwerk's 'The Models' album is corking but I was really disappointed with 'Trans Europe Express'. Anyone recommend any of their others?

I think the percussion on TEE and Metal on Metal is fab.

Best 13 minutes I can think of

Patrick Cowley is perhaps best known for his 16 (or is it 17?) min remix of Donna Summer's I Feel Love, and his production work for Sylvester. Listen to the synth work on Do You Wanna Funk? Outstanding, and very uplifting in a 'let's get off our heads' kind of way. You can see why he found favour with New Order. He sadly passed away in 1982 to an AIDS-associated illness. Sylvester followed soon after.

New Order for me are influenced by Kraftwerk, but more so by Partick Cowley, Hi-NRG, electro, and in particular, Italo-Disco. Temptation, Blue Monday (which was NOs failed attempt to programme the beat from Klein and MBO's fantastic Italo hit, Dirty Talk), TPK, BLT, Subculture and Thieves Like Us all sound very Italo/Hi-NRG/electro.

Joy Division + Kraftwerk x Giorgio Moroder x Can(Patrick Cowley x Bobby O + Arthur Baker) = New Order

Al Jarvis wrote:

Outoforder wrote: you only have to listen to "your silient face" new orders, tribute to Kraftwerk.

Which, basically, sounds f'all like any Kraftwerk track I can think of!

It's quite similar to Europe Endless isn't it? I think so!

I voted hugely - for me, it was the underlying influence of Kraftwerk that got me into the Order in the first place, having listened to my Dad's copy of 'Radioactivity' as a nine year old (Dad, I stole that album from you - sorry!). Elements of 'Movement' just scream Kraftwerk at me, in particular the drums/synths - pretty much the same goes for the JD albums and 'P C & L'

But I love the way that they can be so different - Kraftwerk for me are just technically perfect and precise, but JD/New Order have that punky edginess to them - but fundamentally, they both have common elements.

Kraftwerk are full of contradictions and that's one of the reasons why I find them fascinating.

Andy McCluskey remembers going to Liverpool (Anglican?) Cathedral to see them in 1975, for what for him was a truly Damascene experience. He said all around him were long-haired bearded hippies sitting cross-legged on the floor when four blokes dressed in smart suits with short hair came on and two blokes appeared to be playing tea trays with knitting needles!

When they played Detroit and Chicago on their 1991 Mix world tour, the audiences were nearly totally black and paid respect by throwing dollar bills onto the stage.

They used to have a dislike for performing and even had this idea that they could stay inside Kling Klang and beam live gigs to thousands of cinemas worldwide instead. They've also said they'd like to send their robots out to do the gigs instead of them so they could sit and watch 'themselves' perform!

By the way does anyone think that the cover for Krafty is reminiscent of the reissue artwork for Autobahn? Just a thought.

Kraftwerk are totally autonomous: they have been with EMI for over thirty years, making them the longest still productive band with the company. Even EMI have no idea of how to reach them on a daily basis: Kling Klang - their studio - doesn't have a phone or even an address apparently. Bernard and Johnny Marr got to know Karl Bartos (former percussionist) and were given a time to call him on his mobile which was precise to the minute. Ralf and Florian insist on mobiles being switched off inside the studio. There is no sound there unless they are making it.

They're very anti-musak and have been known to go around disconnecting the leads that pipe muzak into lifts etc. Ralf is mad into cycling and sometimes cycled up to a hundred kilometres a day. He had a serious accident whilst cycling but made a full recovery.

Florian's dad was an architect and designed Cologne airport. Both he and Ralf are classically trained and come from wealthy families. Despite the perception that Kraftwerk are a quartet, it's only ever been Ralf and Florian, the two others being hired hands, even if long-term ones.

There aren't many Kraftwerk books on the market (I know of three) but former percussionist Wolfgang Flur wrote his memoir "I was a robot" a few years ago and it's a terrific read.

Yes, Your Silent Face has a fair bit of Europe Endles in it in that it has a continuous melodic sequence running all the way through it. You can see why its working title was Kraftwerk One.

leather_girl wrote: I don't think they were extremely influenced by them, (otherwise, they might have sounded like a Kraftwerk clone)but I think a lot of bands that used synthesisers that came out in the late 70s throughout the 80s were to some extent influenced by them. Speaking of this thread, though, on this other message board, (not on here; some other site), some idiot preteen who didn't know what she was talking about said that Depeche Mode's new album sounded Kraftwerk-ish. I told her, "WTF?".

Take another listen to John the Revelator.

Have to add something here, I remember reading an interview with Steven a few years ago - I think it was in Q when London re-released the back catalogue. He talked about Power, Corruption and Lies and said that Your Silent Face was Bernard, "doing his Kraftwerk record". He also mentioned the subtances being consumed at the time and Bernard wearing a lab coat in the studio and hitting people across the knuckles with a ruler! Can't imagine Ralf and Florian doing that, but I've now got an image in my head of them trying to look through the windows of New Order's studio to find out the mystery of the bass drum sound with the robots giving them a bunk up. No substances consumed here either. Also, check out "World" and listen to "The Telephone Call" off "Electric Cafe" - there is a definite influence.

Not fair Al - the truly talented ones left in the late 80's after 16 years with the band. That's hardly 'hired hands'

It is true that Ralf prefers to refer to them as hired percussionists/drummers in a bid to downplay their role over the years. I do think Wolfgang and Karl were more than that but wouldn't ever state that they were the truly talented ones. You can, after all, see who wrote what if you read the sleeves. Was Emil Schult one of the truly talented ones too? Now also uninvolved in the band.

G'day mate!

The hired hands reference was alluded to in Flur's book and also in interviews that Bartos gave after he'd left. Despite the fact that both of them had been at the very heart of what Kraftwerk had been about from Autobahn onwards and yet they were treated badly after they left.

Ralf especially gave them the impression that they were expendible and that Kraftwerk were essentially Florian and himself and always had been. It's a disgraceful way to behave and disloyal in the extreme.

I don't think for a second that Gillian is thought of in any similar way. I think they've collectively got the highest respect for her and what she helped them achieve. She had to stand down because of her and Steve's daughter, not through any disillusionment and she could always return (although I think that unlikely now).

Chemical wrote: Ralf is mad into cycling and sometimes cycled up to a hundred kilometres a day. He had a serious accident whilst cycling but made a full recovery.

I read from somewhere that Hütter went into a coma after that accident and when he woke up his first words were: "Where is my bicycle?"

I don't think they've ever used certain substances to the same extent as NO but Ralf and Florian are apparently both big-time coffee addicts too.

There is something at the heart of Neon Lights that is similar in spirit to Your Silent Face.

And i'd just like to add that this is a great book..

Chemical wrote: Kraftwerk are full of contradictions and that's one of the reasons why I find them fascinating.

Andy McCluskey remembers going to Liverpool (Anglican?) Cathedral to see them in 1975, for what for him was a truly Damascene experience. He said all around him were long-haired bearded hippies sitting cross-legged on the floor when four blokes dressed in smart suits with short hair came on and two blokes appeared to be playing tea trays with knitting needles!

When they played Detroit and Chicago on their 1991 Mix world tour, the audiences were nearly totally black and paid respect by throwing dollar bills onto the stage.

They used to have a dislike for performing and even had this idea that they could stay inside Kling Klang and beam live gigs to thousands of cinemas worldwide instead. They've also said they'd like to send their robots out to do the gigs instead of them so they could sit and watch 'themselves' perform!

By the way does anyone think that the cover for Krafty is reminiscent of the reissue artwork for Autobahn? Just a thought.

Kraftwerk are totally autonomous: they have been with EMI for over thirty years, making them the longest still productive band with the company. Even EMI have no idea of how to reach them on a daily basis: Kling Klang - their studio - doesn't have a phone or even an address apparently. Bernard and Johnny Marr got to know Karl Bartos (former percussionist) and were given a time to call him on his mobile which was precise to the minute. Ralf and Florian insist on mobiles being switched off inside the studio. There is no sound there unless they are making it.

They're very anti-musak and have been known to go around disconnecting the leads that pipe muzak into lifts etc. Ralf is mad into cycling and sometimes cycled up to a hundred kilometres a day. He had a serious accident whilst cycling but made a full recovery.

Florian's dad was an architect and designed Cologne airport. Both he and Ralf are classically trained and come from wealthy families. Despite the perception that Kraftwerk are a quartet, it's only ever been Ralf and Florian, the two others being hired hands, even if long-term ones.

There aren't many Kraftwerk books on the market (I know of three) but former percussionist Wolfgang Flur wrote his memoir "I was a robot" a few years ago and it's a terrific read.

How do you know all this?

Interesting.

It could be that they underestimated just how much Bartos put into Kraftwerk. He co-wrote several tracks on Raise The Pressure remember and not just the drums either, I take it.

How do I know this stuff? Many years of hearing and reading about them I suppose! Been into them since about 78...which is a long time!

Johnny wrote: There is something at the heart of Neon Lights that is similar in spirit to Your Silent Face.

And i'd just like to add that this is a great book..

Maybe the 2nd Edition had a major rewrite, but the first one which I read was pretty poor in my opinion - too many plugs for his solo stuff and too much of his own fanmail I thought and he spends a lot of time saying how shut out he and Karl Bartos were. Something from Ralf and Florian might fill out the missing years though..?

Kraftwerk have obviously been a major influence on New Order over the years...

Whilst we're on the topic of the German techno legends... has anyone noticed that Coldplay's new song has a blatant Kraftwerk rip off on it?? The chorus and the guitar riff sound IDENTICAL to the keyboard riff on 'Computer Love'

DShamen wrote: Kraftwerk have obviously been a major influence on New Order over the years...

Whilst we're on the topic of the German techno legends... has anyone noticed that Coldplay's new song has a blatant Kraftwerk rip off on it?? The chorus and the guitar riff sound IDENTICAL to the keyboard riff on 'Computer Love'

Its listed in the credits on the cd "X5 contains elements of the song Computer Love by Kraftwerk"...

I expect those millionaires in Coldplay are paying Kraftwerk a few quid for it. Are they listing them as co-writers on that song (Talk) or is the note on the sleeve legally all they need to do? I kno that Mr Paltrow and at least one other member are huge Kraftwerk fans (check some of their t-shirts recently, Radio-Activity apparent). It's weird because Coldplay are nothing like Kraftwerk musically.

I remember being in a music store just after X & Y was released - to the usual brown-nosing "most fantabulous record ever made" bollocks that accompanies any album by any band the NME thinks are worthy of their - and our - attention - and it was like being struck by a thunderbolt as Ralf's brilliantly crafted Computer Love melody come out of the speakers...played on a guitar along with an identikit Coldplay-by-numbers beat. I think I just shook my head sadly, thinking "Oh there goes another great riff. Another generation who'll think Coldplay wrote the tune..."

I know Mr Paltrow and his anonymous mates were having real bother writing and recording the album but did they really need to resort to ripping off a classic song to get some badly needed inspiration? Unlike Kraftwerk themselves, the delay on the album actually affected the company's share price apparently so maybe time was tight and inspiration spent...

Bambaataa was sued when Robie ripped off the melody to Trans-Europe Express for Planet Rock and rightly so. It would seem Ralf & Florian are a bit more easy-going these days!

I wonder how Paltrow would feel if someone pinched one of his bits for a song...

Chemical wrote:

I wonder how Paltrow would feel if someone pinched one of his bits for a song...

This is of course assuming anyone would want to nick one of his bits. Imagine having to write "Nicked sample off Coldplay, who nicked it off*insert band here* who are far cooler."

hutter/bartos/schult are added to the writing credits

Chemical wrote: I expect those millionaires in Coldplay are paying Kraftwerk a few quid for it. Are they listing them as co-writers on that song (Talk) or is the note on the sleeve legally all they need to do? I kno that Mr Paltrow and at least one other member are huge Kraftwerk fans (check some of their t-shirts recently, Radio-Activity apparent). It's weird because Coldplay are nothing like Kraftwerk musically.

I remember being in a music store just after X & Y was released - to the usual brown-nosing "most fantabulous record ever made" bollocks that accompanies any album by any band the NME thinks are worthy of their - and our - attention - and it was like being struck by a thunderbolt as Ralf's brilliantly crafted Computer Love melody come out of the speakers...played on a guitar along with an identikit Coldplay-by-numbers beat. I think I just shook my head sadly, thinking "Oh there goes another great riff. Another generation who'll think Coldplay wrote the tune..."

I know Mr Paltrow and his anonymous mates were having real bother writing and recording the album but did they really need to resort to ripping off a classic song to get some badly needed inspiration? Unlike Kraftwerk themselves, the delay on the album actually affected the company's share price apparently so maybe time was tight and inspiration spent...

Bambaataa was sued when Robie ripped off the melody to Trans-Europe Express for Planet Rock and rightly so. It would seem Ralf & Florian are a bit more easy-going these days!

I wonder how Paltrow would feel if someone pinched one of his bits for a song...

Item on MTV News last night saying that Coldplay having acheived critical acclaim and commercial success for their first three albums dont feel under pressure anymore and may surprise their fans with an 'electronic' fourth album....! Well there you go..

Interesting story I remember reading from the late 80's I think, no idea if it's true, but it's what I read....Kraftwerk had been hearing NO's stuff, and wanted to come over to see them in England. When they did, and got talking about samples, sounds, etc, Kraftwerk said they particularly liked a certain drum sample, and asked NO where it was from. NO told them that they'd actually sampled it from a Kraftwerk record it the first place!

We also shouldn't forget that the entire sequence line of Your Silent Face is pretty much lifted from Europe Endless, from KW's Trans-Europe Express.

Maybe Barney's current themes involving travelling stem from KW too (Autobahn, TEE, Tour De France, etc)

The introduction of 1963 (the entire section up until the vocals start) sounds VERY much like The Telephone Call, which, co-incidentally, was released the year before.

I'm not saying NO are ripping off KW, far from it, but it's often clear to see where NO have been influenced by KW's style and sound. Then again, NO have done so much stuff where there is no influence whatsoever, especially their guitar-based tracks. Have KW ever sounded like Sunrise?

In agreement with you Chris, Coldplay bore the shit out of me too! I just cannot understand their attraction.

Ah, Kraftwerk...BEAUTIFUL music: innovation, catchy tunes, quality albums, great shows, what more do you want...?

And Coldplay are unoriginal rip-off artists, who can go fuck their metaphorical mums.

Chemical wrote: Bambaataa was sued when Robie ripped off the melody to Trans-Europe Express for Planet Rock and rightly so. It would seem Ralf & Florian are a bit more easy-going these days!

Erm, one of the remixes of "Don't Stop...Planet Rock" (from 1992) by Karl Bartos:

Planet Rock (Classic Mix) (9:16) Remix - Elektric Music

More info here

Chris owen wrote: Interesting story I remember reading from the late 80's I think, no idea if it's true, but it's what I read....Kraftwerk had been hearing NO's stuff, and wanted to come over to see them in England. When they did, and got talking about samples, sounds, etc, Kraftwerk said they particularly liked a certain drum sample, and asked NO where it was from. NO told them that they'd actually sampled it from a Kraftwerk record it the first place!

We also shouldn't forget that the entire sequence line of Your Silent Face is pretty much lifted from Europe Endless, from KW's Trans-Europe Express.

Maybe Barney's current themes involving travelling stem from KW too (Autobahn, TEE, Tour De France, etc)

The introduction of 1963 (the entire section up until the vocals start) sounds VERY much like The Telephone Call, which, co-incidentally, was released the year before.

I'm not saying NO are ripping off KW, far from it, but it's often clear to see where NO have been influenced by KW's style and sound. Then again, NO have done so much stuff where there is no influence whatsoever, especially their guitar-based tracks. Have KW ever sounded like Sunrise?

A likely source for the drum intro for "1963" is "It" from Prince's Sign 'o' the Times album. The two intros sound exactly the same .

Fogface wrote:

Chemical wrote: Ralf is mad into cycling and sometimes cycled up to a hundred kilometres a day. He had a serious accident whilst cycling but made a full recovery.

I read from somewhere that Hütter went into a coma after that accident and when he woke up his first words were: "Where is my bicycle?"

I don't think they've ever used certain substances to the same extent as NO but Ralf and Florian are apparently both big-time coffee addicts too.

The quote Fogface refers to above is from a biography called Man, Machine And Music by Pascal Bussy that came out in 1993. I was lucky enough to score myself a copy of this at the same time I picked up Touching From A Distance while in the UK in 1995. Dunno if it's been reprinted/updated since; the ISBN on my copy is; 0 946719 098.

Chemical wrote: Interesting.

It could be that they underestimated just how much Bartos put into Kraftwerk. He co-wrote several tracks on Raise The Pressure remember and not just the drums either, I take it.

How do I know this stuff? Many years of hearing and reading about them I suppose! Been into them since about 78...which is a long time!

I read an Electronic interview done about the time that Raise The Pressure came out where Johnny Marr mentioned Karl walking into the studio, taking off his coat, throwing it over the computer and saying "let's jam"; there was also a brief mention of him being a good guitarist and for those fortunate enough to have a copy(or had a copy made)of the Prozac doco featuring Barney, you can actually spot Karl doing some keyboard stuff in the recordings done for RTP.

Great story!

I remember seeing that Prozac documentary. I wish I still had that somewhere. It must have been weird for them meeting Kraftwerk's members the first time. Andy McCluskey said that being asked to jam with Kraftwerk once was "like being asked by God to come into heaven".

Apparently around the time they were writing and recording Computer World, they didn't have a computer! They were writing about something they had hardly any experience of and so must have been writing whilst they imagined what impact computers would have on their music. They said that the album was about the effect that computerisation was having on the world at the time and would in the future, hence the "Time, travel, communication, entertainment" speech on the title track.

Another thing: it was thought at the time that Radio-Activity was a hymn of praise for the nuclear industry but that occurances like Three Mile Island etc changed their views on it and so it's been "Stop radioactivity!" since The Mix in 91.

Chemical wrote:

Bambaataa was sued when Robie ripped off the melody to Trans-Europe Express for Planet Rock and rightly so. It would seem Ralf & Florian are a bit more easy-going these days!

I think that law-suit might have had something to do with the fact that Mr. Bambaataa and that nice Mr. Baker "neglected" to ask for Kraftwerk's permission...

Actually, Karl said "right, we won't be needing this"

Barcaboy99 wrote: NO interviews generally consist of the following subject matter:

Ian Curtis' death, Hacienda, Blue Monday, Questions on their longevity, Drugs, World in Motion/John Barnes/Keith Allen (on a 4-yearly cycle), Kraftwerk.

So... do we need more interviews?

To an extent which progressed over time.

You can hardly call Warsaw and Gutz Kraftwerk inspired.

Thi is an example of musical experience, they keep the same style of music during theerteen years,without pantomime on the backsatge,it's just A MODEL,but there is a question in my spirit,it's this one,if a leader killed him self because he don't like a song "TEA FOR TWO"what can happen to the rest of the group?

Virtual One definately has a distinctive posting style.I'll give him that

virtual one wrote: Thi is an example of musical experience, they keep the same style of music during theerteen years,without pantomime on the backsatge,it's just A MODEL,but there is a question in my spirit,it's this one,if a leader killed him self because he don't like a song "TEA FOR TWO"what can happen to the rest of the group?

I was listening to the Steve Morris and Gillian show on revolution on sunday ( a great station by the way, hooky has done a few shows and the lunchtime clint boon show is a must!) They played lots of Kraftwerk and other Krautrock so its a fair guess to say its had a big influence on them.