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Piracy concerns? Bullshit. Write new songs. Play them live. Set up a rehearsal studio and a tape. Go. Release a new "live in the studio" album - recorded dirt cheap, and on a smallish label. Use that to promote live shows. Tour yer arse off.
if piracy conerns were such a worry, the "Hooky Plays Unknown Pleasures And Some B Sides LIVE!" would never have come out, surely. After all, loads of Light gigs are free on the interwebs.
mark reed wrote: Piracy concerns? Bullshit. Write new songs. Play them live. Set up a rehearsal studio and a tape. Go. Release a new "live in the studio" album - recorded dirt cheap, and on a smallish label. Use that to promote live shows. Tour yer arse off.
if piracy conerns were such a worry, the "Hooky Plays Unknown Pleasures And Some B Sides LIVE!" would never have come out, surely. After all, loads of Light gigs are free on the interwebs.
I'm curious to know how much money you think a limited edition live album, and download only ep release, would derive?
condemnation wrote:
mark reed wrote: Piracy concerns? Bullshit. Write new songs. Play them live. Set up a rehearsal studio and a tape. Go. Release a new "live in the studio" album - recorded dirt cheap, and on a smallish label. Use that to promote live shows. Tour yer arse off.
if piracy conerns were such a worry, the "Hooky Plays Unknown Pleasures And Some B Sides LIVE!" would never have come out, surely. After all, loads of Light gigs are free on the interwebs.
I'm curious to know how much money you think a limited edition live album, and download only ep release, would derive?
Actually, it's a good point - I don't buy the piracy concerns argument either. Hooky loves to tour, and recording is as inexpensive now as it ever has been. OK, so he may not recoup a huge return from sales of a recording of new material, but if it is good material, he could surely tour like a man possessed (as he likes it) and make a healthy living. Also, he wouldn't need to share any royalties with his 'bitterest of sworn enemies'.
Question is, can he pull it off to do something new that is worthy? Touring endlessly on the back of JD covers seems a pretty safe option in this context...
My guess is the live album has made, in terms of profit, less than £5,000.
My point was
a)Record New Stuff and sell cheaply b)Tour it with a greatest hits set profusely for 18 months c)Make a modest living touring with some minor LP profit.
I don't buy download only content. Music is something you feel.
Hooky did write new stuff, or at least a band did. He choose not to try to tour Freebass, but went with the nostalgia tour. Did anyone think the Freebass album would have been worth promoting, epecially after sitting on the shelf for so long? Who actually listened to the Freebass album all the way through?
I would definitley love to hear "Movement"! I have really enjoyed both the 'Unknown Pleasures" and "Closer" shows... :)
Movement is actually the ONLY New Order album I would really LOVE to hear completely rerecorded in a 2011 version (exactly 30 years on). I'd love to imagine what an updated version of this forgotten low key classic would sound like, seriously.
There is potential for something to be redeemed from what is actually a half-baked album which has its strengths but also a lot of weaknesses (the snow-blindness white fog production of Martin Hannett's of course being the main set back)...
If I had one wish from New Order, despite all the adversity, this would be what I would ask for!
:) 
Buzzcocks have done something similar, where they have re recorded all their well known songs, it sounds fantastic as I reckon Movement would.
By 'Eck! My Neck! wrote: Movement is actually the ONLY New Order album I would really LOVE to hear completely rerecorded in a 2011 version (exactly 30 years on). I'd love to imagine what an updated version of this forgotten low key classic would sound like, seriously.
There is potential for something to be redeemed from what is actually a half-baked album which has its strengths but also a lot of weaknesses (the snow-blindness white fog production of Martin Hannett's of course being the main set back)...
If I had one wish from New Order, despite all the adversity, this would be what I would ask for!
:)
Movement is actually the ONLY New Order album I would really LOVE to hear completely rerecorded in a 2011 version (exactly 30 years on). I'd love to imagine what an updated version of this forgotten low key classic would sound like, seriously.
There is potential for something to be redeemed from what is actually a half-baked album which has its strengths but also a lot of weaknesses (the snow-blindness white fog production of Martin Hannett's of course being the main set back)...
I really don't agree at all. I think the production is fantastic, despite the fact that the favoured opinion on here is contrary to this.
A re-recording this album now would be irredeemably shite, whoever does it.
I was also at the signing and asked Hooky the same thing, and received the same answer, however there was a bit of hesitation in the answer. It sounded more like a desire, but not sure if would or could do it?
You can thank me though, Hooky was there cause it was my birthday! 
Met up with Jack, and he had some really gnarly blood blisters on the tip of his first two digits and a his palm was raw... anyone know if he faired well playing the following night?
EdelBrock wrote: I was also at the signing and asked Hooky the same thing, and received the same answer, however there was a bit of hesitation in the answer. It sounded more like a desire, but not sure if would or could do it?
You can thank me though, Hooky was there cause it was my birthday!
Met up with Jack, and he had some really gnarly blood blisters on the tip of his first two digits and a his palm was raw... anyone know if he faired well playing the following night?
We lined it up just for you 
He got over it, too much excitement I think.
Regardless of whether he's going to do it, he seems to want to tour albums and such. This is from page 2 of this article, and it's part of his answer to the last question on there. http://blogs.westword.com/backbeat/2011/09/interview_peter_hook.php
Also, because when we were together in New Order, Bernard was always very negative about Joy Division. He always felt it should be left alone. He never wanted to play any old songs. Nevermind Joy Divison, he never wanted to play any New Order old songs. He really just wanted to concentrate on the future. And I think there's a place for the old ones and for the new ones. But he didn't agree. So it sort of stopped you from doing anything with regard to Joy Division whilst you were in New Order. It was only when I left New Order and got the distance that I was about to see that, as a musician, which I still am and I earn my living and feed my family by playing music, I have to revert to my music. So it seemed logical to go, "Well, why shouldn't I play Joy Divison? Why shouldn't I play Unknown Pleasures? Why shouldn't I play Closer? Why shouldn't I play Movement? Why shouldn't I play Low-Life? Why shouldn't I play Brotherhood?" I think it would be a wonderful thing if I got to play each one of them before I die. I'd be a very happy man when I got to meet my maker.
leather_girl wrote: http://blogs.westword.com/backbeat/2011/09/interview_peter_hook.php
I can see Hooky's point of view that Bernard's ardent "anti-past" attitude proved to be a bit much for him. Focussing solely on the future and ignoring everything about your past is a bit overkill it's got to be said. For years NO fans have been wanting the likes of Dreams Never End, Age of Consent, EGG etc. returned to the set but it never happened. Realistically, Bernard probably vetoed their inclusion at the time.
However, at the other end of the spectrum we have touring 20-30 year old albums one after the other and playing nothing but older music year in year out with no trace of fresh material in the set. As Hooky points out, there's a place for both.
Hate to say it but I always thought Bad Lieutenant - whatever you thought of the LP - struck that balance pretty well at their gigs. They predominantly played a set of new material (say 70%) alongside a couple of JD/NO classics and other Barney collaborations.
"He [Bernard] really just wanted to concentrate on the future. And I think there's a place for the old ones and for the new ones. But he didn't agree. So it sort of stopped you from doing anything with regard to Joy Division whilst you were in New Order."
New Order revisited Joy Division's work pretty frequently between 1998-2006, didn't they? In '98 the Peel session they recorded for Radio 1 included two brand new recordings of Isolation and Atmosphere. They played pure JD sets at both the John Peel Day tribute and the first MvC. The regular gigs almost always featured Atmosphere, LWTUA, Transmission, She's Lost Control as well as periodically Heart And Soul, Isolation, Digital, Shadowplay and These Days. Not to mention Ceremony at almost every gig as well. JD's music was far from being ignored. I remember at the time some gig-goers were starting to moan that there was a bit too much JD in the set and it was preventing lesser NO tunes from being played (!)
That's the only bit of the interview I don't really get.
NotAMod wrote:
leather_girl wrote: http://blogs.westword.com/backbeat/2011/09/interview_peter_hook.php
Focussing solely on the future and ignoring everything about your past is a bit overkill. For years NO fans have been wanting the likes of Dreams Never End, Age of Consent, EGG etc. returned to the set but it never happened. Realistically, Bernard probably vetoed their inclusion.
However, at the other end of the spectrum we have touring 15-20 year old albums one after the other and playing nothing but older music year in year out with no trace of newer songs in the set. It should be a blend. Hate to say it but Bad Lieutenant struck that blend pretty well. They predominantly played a set of new material (say 70%) and played a couple of NO classics as well as the likes of Out of Control. So it would seem that Barney's got the point of past stuff being played live now.
My point is that arguably both anti-past and anti-future approaches are a bit extreme and flawed?
Maybe some of the earlier NO songs might have been difficult for Bernard to sing as he got older, or found a more comfortable singing range. And when NO toured in the past decade, if I look at their setlists, they seemed to have played older NO songs (although mostly the same ones) such as True Faith, Blue Monday, Temptation etc.... so they weren't just playing newer songs from their newly released albums. Perhaps the anti-past attitude regarding JD worked in the earlier days when they wanted to start new as New Order. And I suppose once they were comfortable and had a 'distance' from that, they could finally play older songs, even JD ones. Maybe Hooky felt more comfortable about the past earlier than Bernard and felt that way about Bernard not singing JD songs. NO did play some JD songs live in the 2000s, right? (I remember that 'Digital' was on the Finsbury Park DVD and so on.)
I'm not saying Hooky hasn't got a point though. But that's just my thoughts about that. Not too many people have the energy and want to tour the world in the way Hooky does. But on the other hand, I can understand the criticism about the touring albums situation.
They left JD behind in the 80s and that was the best decision they could have made, there's no way the reconfigured line-up could ever do justice to JD anyway so it's far better left alone in favour of the current material of the time.
JD were brought back post '98, possibly even a bit too much, so I don't believe there was anything more they should have done JD-wise.
I got really bored when NO turned into the JD nostalgia bandwagon. Oh look! Here's "Ceremony" AGAIN. Every NO show I saw, they always did "Love! LOVE! WILL TEAR US APART! YES! Again! COME ON!"
Fucking snooze.
mark reed wrote: I got really bored when NO turned into the JD nostalgia bandwagon. Oh look! Here's "Ceremony" AGAIN. Every NO show I saw, they always did "Love! LOVE! WILL TEAR US APART! YES! Again! COME ON!"
Fucking snooze.
That's harsh. I've always regarded Ceremony primarily as a New Order tune, even though I know they played it as JD, they also played it throughout the 80s and plus I think it has got that classic uplifting NO feel about it.
LWTUA I agree with you on though. I wouldn't care if they never touched it again live.
mark reed wrote: I got really bored when NO turned into the JD nostalgia bandwagon. Oh look! Here's "Ceremony" AGAIN. Every NO show I saw, they always did "Love! LOVE! WILL TEAR US APART! YES! Again! COME ON!"
Fucking snooze.
Sometimes I wonder if you're a fan...
mark reed wrote: I got really bored when NO turned into the JD nostalgia bandwagon. Oh look! Here's "Ceremony" AGAIN. Every NO show I saw, they always did "Love! LOVE! WILL TEAR US APART! YES! Again! COME ON!"
Fucking snooze.
Ceremony is considered just as much a New Order song as it is Joy Division. And I think it's great that a band still played it's debut single. And they had been playing 'Love will tear us apart' every show since 1998, so no surprise that every show you were at, you heard it!
mark reed wrote: I got really bored when NO turned into the JD nostalgia bandwagon. Oh look! Here's "Ceremony" AGAIN. Every NO show I saw, they always did "Love! LOVE! WILL TEAR US APART! YES! Again! COME ON!"
Fucking snooze.
Fancy that, a band playing their best known songs.
Whatever next?
El Jarvo wrote:
|| | ||| 6217|| 8 || 3 wrote: (heck, he's not even playing Low-life or Technique tracks!)
Apart from Love Vigilantes, of course.
EDIT: Or are you specifically talking about Bad Lieutenant, in which case they only play the 'singles' anyway.
and perfect kiss
A little harsh, true. But LWTUA, Atmos, SLC, et. Al. aren’t NO songs. They’re JD songs, and NO are playing covers. The line of connection seemed fairly thin when Bad Lieu are playing them (only the drummer – who wasn’t officially a member of the band at the time – was playing the same parts he did on the original record, as Barney wasn’t always playing guitar).
I’m fine with NO playing a JD song or two, but playing a very static set of very similar songs, in the same places on the set, day in day out, tour in tour out, can get boring. Not everyone saw NO as many times as many of us did, but even for someone who only saw them once on a tour, knowing that it was always going to be BLT/TF/Temptation/LWTUA/Blue Monday could get a little predictable.
I think Hooky doing Movement would be good as:
Not too sure about the other albums though.
Big Mouth Julio wrote: New Order played EGG in 2005. Fantastic moment
Did Phil play guitar or keyboards on it? Do you know?
They only played it twice, right? Shame...
I agree, Movement really has to be the end of the line. I agree that NO still sounded a lot like JD at that point, so Hooky and the Light doing that album is not too much of a stretch. However, anything after that is just not authentic without Barney doing the vocals. Even Temptation would not sound right with anyone else doing the vocals, so I hope they wisely leave it out.
mark reed wrote: But LWTUA, Atmos, SLC, et. Al. aren’t NO songs. They’re JD songs, and NO are playing covers.
Well, technically, yes but its pedantry of the highest level. Is Gary Numan playing covers when he does songs by Tubeway Army?
leather_girl wrote: http://exclaim.ca/News/peter_hook_to_unveil_more_joy_division_new_order_tours_retrospective_books_rare_b-sides
Oh sweet Christ. :(
"New Order has been very bitter, right from the word go, really, if I'm honest. It's going to be a difficult story to tell"
Bring it on. Can't wait for the JD and NO books. I would like Steve to write a book too. He remembers alot of facts.
