Cure and Depeche Mode copied NO?

I have heard or remembered reading saying that Cure and DM copied NO or tried to duplicate NO sound.

My question is this true? If it is--how could it be if Cure came out in 76 and DM in 80?

Just wondering.

I can't speak for the Cure, but no DM tracks sound remotely like any of NO's. Two completely different sounds for two completely different bands.

There's a lot of criticisms that Cure's funereal Pornography album, released in 1982 (their real raincoat album : they recorded it in a studio and lived there for a couple of months - Robert Smith built a tent made out of beer cans, apparently...) borrowed heavily from Movement - certainly songs such as "A Strange Day" seem to be an amalgam of the best bits of the Order. The Cure were experimenting heavily with synthesizers and loud rocking drums (a la Killing Joke), eg "The Hanging Garden". It's my favourite Cure LP of all time, but probably because of the overt New Order references.

Oh, and In Between Days, released by the Cure when they cheered up in 1985, doesn't steal the guitar riff from Dreams Never End at all :happytongue:

I can remember Robert Smith used to have the odd moan about New Order in interviews in the mid 80s. I guess he saw them as bitter alternative/indie rivals. (Hey! why can't we all just get along?). But he did lift greatly from "Dreams Never End" for "Inbetween Days" but then New Order have pinched the bassline from "A Forest" for "This Time Of Night" and again! for "Crystal". I've got some old Cure live tape that I remember they start playing "She's Lost Control" riffs in the middle of "A Forest" and it works rather well. The Cure must have a grudging bit of respect as I see they've recently covered "Love Will Tear Us Apart". Not sure about Depeche Mode, I think they got more influenced by Euro/industrial bands as they went on and lederhosen boutiques.

Originally posted by HaciendaThat I can remember Robert Smith used to have the odd moan about New Order in interviews in the mid 80s. I guess he saw them as bitter alternative/indie rivals. (Hey! why can't we all just get along?). But he did lift greatly from "Dreams Never End" for "Inbetween Days" but then New Order have pinched the bassline from "A Forest" for "This Time Of Night" and again! for "Crystal". I've got some old Cure live tape that I remember they start playing "She's Lost Control" riffs in the middle of "A Forest" and it works rather well. The Cure must have a grudging bit of respect as I see they've recently covered "Love Will Tear Us Apart". Not sure about Depeche Mode, I think they got more influenced by Euro/industrial bands as they went on and lederhosen boutiques.

The Cure/Robert Smith are HUGE Joy Division fans. the song The Holy Hour (off of the Faith LP) is actually dedicated to Ian Curtis.

i actually don't see the three bands as particularly related. i SO do not think that The Cure ripped off New Order - except, of course, on Inbetween Days. i mean, The Cure's sound is generally entirely different from New Order's, and i frankly think that it's ridiculous to call them a rip-off of New Order. in all honesty, The Cure's catalogue is much more diverse than New Order's, and there's really no correlation between the two. the only Cure LP that really sounded at all like New Order was Japanese Whispers, which was still entirely different. Pornography sounds more like Joy Division than Movement to me.

and Depeche Mode is still completely different, as well. they're a straight synth pop band, and are unique in their own way.

i think it's ridiculous for anyone to say that any of the three bands consistently "ripped off" either of the other two. they're all very original, excellent bands with fresh sounds that have been very highly influential. New Order is my favorite of the three, but i actually think that The Cure is the most creative, overall.

The Cure and JD/NO are related bands, but I don't think they copy each other, they have just similar approaches to music. What I think they've done is influenced each other. Depeche Mode sound more different.

New Order's music seems much more of a steady progression whereas The Cure radicly changed styles every 2 albums or so. That was probably due in part to their line-up changing so much. "Three Imaginary Boys" sounds nothing like "Faith" sounds nothing like "The Top" sounds nothing like "Disintegration". Mentioning "Japanese Whispers" above did put a light bulb above my head: was "The Walk" not the most obvious rip-off of "Blue Monday" ever? Don't want to slag off The Cure as they were still great despite the occasional rip-off. I saw them on "This Is Dom Joly" the other week and they seem to have lost their way a bit in middle age mediocrity. It really is sad to see Robert Smith still doing the lipstick and hedge-backwards hair at his age but what a great back catalogue.

was "The Walk" not the most obvious rip-off of "Blue Monday" ever?

Absolutely - I was racking my brain last night trying to think what the other obvious rip off was, aside from "Inbetween Days". Yes, "The Walk" came out a couple of months after Monday, and was just Hairy Bob and Mad Bad Lol Tolhurst on keyboards - cracking tune, it has to be said.

And I agree - cracking back catalogue :)

Originally posted by clayts > was "The Walk" not the most obvious rip-off of "Blue Monday" ever?Absolutely - I was racking my brain last night trying to think what the other obvious rip off was, aside from "Inbetween Days". Yes, "The Walk" came out a couple of months after Monday, and was just Hairy Bob and Mad Bad Lol Tolhurst on keyboards - cracking tune, it has to be said.And I agree - cracking back catalogue :)

I think "Just Like Heaven" was a rip off too. Anyone agree?

Originally posted by Marco X > Originally posted by clayts> > > > was "The Walk" not the most obvious rip-off of "Blue Monday" ever?> > > > Absolutely - I was racking my brain last night trying to think what the other obvious rip off was, aside from "Inbetween Days". Yes, "The Walk" came out a couple of months after Monday, and was just Hairy Bob and Mad Bad Lol Tolhurst on keyboards - cracking tune, it has to be said.> > And I agree - cracking back catalogue :)

I think "Just Like Heaven" was a rip off too. Anyone agree? rip-off of what?

Originally posted by film586 > Originally posted by Marco X> > > > Originally posted by clayts> > > > > > > was "The Walk" not the most obvious rip-off of "Blue Monday" ever?> > > > > > > > Absolutely - I was racking my brain last night trying to think what the other obvious rip off was, aside from "Inbetween Days". Yes, "The Walk" came out a couple of months after Monday, and was just Hairy Bob and Mad Bad Lol Tolhurst on keyboards - cracking tune, it has to be said.> > > > And I agree - cracking back catalogue :)>

I think "Just Like Heaven" was a rip off too. Anyone agree? rip-off of what?

The sound!! First time I heard "In Between Days" and "Just Like Heaven" I thought they both were NO until Smith started singing. I thought the same thing when I heard the intro to "Regret". Imagine my surprise when Barney started singing and that it was NO!

Well if your a self-righteous indie-twat wanker (or your an NME journalist) you would agree that The Cure and Depeche Mode were sad immitators of New Order.

Anyways, all 3 are great groups in their own different ways. If you go to a DM forum, you hear the same crap about New Order, and im sure its the same on a Cure forum.

The main common theme between the bands - all contemporaties of each other and all had a fair bit of gloom in their music in the 80s.

Anyways DM are not a straight up synth group - their last 3 albums definitely arent (even if I think the most recent one is no good). But the 2 proceeding it Songs of Faith and Devotion and Ultra, are 2 of the best albums of the 90s IMO.

Cheers ALEX

Originally posted by Alex Jacks WeAnyways DM are not a straight up synth group - their last 3 albums definitely arent (even if I think the most recent one is no good). But the 2 proceeding it Songs of Faith and Devotion and Ultra, are 2 of the best albums of the 90s IMO.CheersALEX

i'm sorry, i should have made it clear that i meant pre-SOFAD Depeche Mode.

i love SOFAD, too. and It's No Good is one of my favorite late 90's singles.

Originally posted by Marco X > Originally posted by film586> > > > Originally posted by Marco X> > > > > > > Originally posted by clayts> > > > > > > > > > was "The Walk" not the most obvious rip-off of "Blue Monday" ever?> > > > > > > > > > > > Absolutely - I was racking my brain last night trying to think what the other obvious rip off was, aside from "Inbetween Days". Yes, "The Walk" came out a couple of months after Monday, and was just Hairy Bob and Mad Bad Lol Tolhurst on keyboards - cracking tune, it has to be said.> > > > > > And I agree - cracking back catalogue :)> > >

I think "Just Like Heaven" was a rip off too. Anyone agree? rip-off of what?

The sound!! First time I heard "In Between Days" and "Just Like Heaven" I thought they both were NO until Smith started singing. I thought the same thing when I heard the intro to "Regret". Imagine my surprise when Barney started singing and that it was NO! hmm. i always felt that the sound on Just Like Heaven and Inbetween Days was very uniquely The Cure's. but i see your point!

Robert Smith actually said that the rip-off that was "In Between Days" was deliberate. He'd heard "Sunrise" - the intro of which is a rip of "A Forest" - and decided to do his own version of a New Order song, "Dreams Never End" as a kind of jokey riposte. Hope that clears something up - but I agree with what you say about "The Walk", and the "Faith" album is a second division "Closer".

The Just Like Heaven rip-off is actually the other way round - NO ripped it off for All The Way. I heard somewhere before that there was a kind of an in-joke going on here - think it may have been Hooky said it. He has openly admitted ripping off the bassline of 10:15 Saturday Night too.

Who cares anyway? All this has given us some great JD/NO music (and Cure music for those who like them), and surely that's what matters most? Dunno where people are getting DM from here though - totally different ballgame.

One person's rip-off is another person's tribute.....

The Cure and Joy Division were treading the same boards in the early days, and have shared an audience to a certain extent ever since.

I don't hear many people accusing the Bunnymen of being Velvets ripoff merchants, Nirvana of being Husker Du ripoff merchants.....

I remember in '89 Steve & Gillian were doing an interview on the old CFNY radio statioin here in Toronto and Steve took a pretty good stab at The Cure for ripping of several New Order songs. I know i have the tape on that interview somewhere, I'll try and dig it out. It was a pretty funny interview.

Originally posted by mh The Just Like Heaven rip-off is actually the other way round - NO ripped it off for All The Way. I heard somewhere before that there was a kind of an in-joke going on here - think it may have been Hooky said it. He has openly admitted ripping off the bassline of 10:15 Saturday Night too.Who cares anyway? All this has given us some great JD/NO music (and Cure music for those who like them), and surely that's what matters most? Dunno where people are getting DM from here though - totally different ballgame.

You could also say that the descending guitar riff in Just Like Heaven is influenced by the guitar lines in Leave Me Alone.

I think "Just Like Heaven" was a rip off too. Anyone agree? rip-off of what?

"All the way" was a rip-off of "just like heaven".

I seem to remember Hooky saying he'd had people come up to him saying "Way of Life" (from Brotherhood) was a rip off of "LWTUA" !!! NO ripping off themselves...

Weird experience on the train today (listened to PCL, Lowlife and first half of Brotherwhood in one go) - there is a tiny tiny scrap of a LWTUA riff right at the end of Way of Life which I'd never ever noticed before : anyone else spotted it !

Perhaps the most controversial of this is that New Order accuses Depeche Mode of plagiarising the 8-beat from True Faith for Enjoy the Silence. Just play the two off and the argument is compelling. Beyond that, while New Order enjoys cred and acclaim from critics, there is bound to be some jealousy about how DM's sound has evolved while New Order's is essentially unchanged.

Beyond that, while New Order enjoys cred and acclaim from critics, there is bound to be some jealousy about how DM's sound has evolved while New Order's is essentially unchanged.

Which explains why Dead Souls, Ceremony, Fine Time and Here to Stay all sound the same.

Originally posted by Spotnick I've never seen that topic discussed here... Well, two bands of their time having similar ideas, just like 80% of the 80's hits sounds like Blue Monday!

Yeah, if you keep relating bands that sound one like the other you will never stop! X band is related to Y band, that was influenced by another band, that copied the idea from the band Z...

I could say BM is as a NO version of Being Boiled, cause they are very similar (IMHO).

Originally posted by cold streets, great town... > Originally posted by Spotnick> I've never seen that topic discussed here... > > Well, two bands of their time having similar ideas, just like 80% of the 80's hits sounds like Blue Monday!>

Yeah, if you keep relating bands that sound one like the other you will never stop! X band is related to Y band, that was influenced by another band, that copied the idea from the band Z...

I could say BM is as a NO version of Being Boiled, cause they are very similar (IMHO).

I don´t think so.

All three bands are as guilty as fuck of ripping each other off - not just through the songs... but also through their one word album titles: Movement, Violator, Faith, Exciter, Disintegration, Pornography, Substance, Technique, Republic...... need I go on? ;)

I think part of the problem here in the UK (especially the music press) is that the moment a band start using synthesizers, they're labelled as "sounding like New Order" or the Pet Shop Boys.

I guess it's cause they were the first bands to really expand on synth-based pop and rocks songs, but its often lazy journalism: no one says every band with an electric guitar sounds like The Rolling Stones, but a lot of influences always come from whatever band did it first.

We have loads of dodgy Indie bands coming and going every few months - most of whom are just another cliched pastiche of what Oasis did almost ten years ago - but no one yacks on about them "sounding like Oasis". I think there's just a slight prejudice against anyone using technology.

In a small way, any band that uses synths, sequencers and guitars is going to have a little bit of Depeche Mode and New Order about them, whether heavily disguised or not, but there are marked differences between all these bands if you look beneath the chord changes they're using or the patches on their synths.

Andy.

Originally posted by Harold Aranda Perhaps the most controversial of this is that New Order accuses Depeche Mode of plagiarising the 8-beat from True Faith for Enjoy the Silence. Just play the two off and the argument is compelling. Beyond that, while New Order enjoys cred and acclaim from critics, there is bound to be some jealousy about how DM's sound has evolved while New Order's is essentially unchanged.

What exactly are you referring to by "8 beat"? I've never notice any similarity in the songs, other than a similar BPM ('Silence' something like 113, 'True Faith' approx 117).

Andy.

Originally posted by clayts There is a tiny tiny scrap of a LWTUA riff right at the end of Way of Life which I'd never ever noticed before : anyone else spotted it !

Yeah, I'd always picked up on that as a little musical reference to Joy Division.

The Cure/New Order ripping off thing just reminds me of those "reply" records that often get done in R&B and rap music - you wouldn't do them unless you liked the original track/artist, as usually the reply record has a musical sample/reference to the original record.

I'm sure The Cure are big New Order fans, and they share a similar sound because the eighties was a time when tracks had lots of digital delay and reverb on them, and producers were using similar tricks on a lot of bands.

Six of one, half a dozen of the other.

Andy.

Originally posted by Mr Discography > Originally posted by clayts> There is a tiny tiny scrap of a LWTUA riff right at the end of Way of Life which I'd never ever noticed before : anyone else spotted it !

Yeah,I head mentioned here before.The guitar notes are the same as LWTUA.I agree with everything you said.

From the standpoint of who the people are...New Order have been very good over the years at writing back to their fans in their own hand writing. I have several replies from them. Now one might say that Cure and DM were on more tours and received much more fanzine mail...but DM & The Cure (which I have all the albums and love the music...except for the last 2 DM's that were quite sad). Okay...the point is that NO and their music is very different, very deep, the fans are very loyal, and I see no real connection to the two bands. One of several reasons I believe this are the fantastic cords of Hooky's bass differ so from DM's (all electronic)and that of The Cures Simon Gallup (and others). New Order is still New Order and prior to that JD, The Cure and DM are not constant. (Okay DM fans...do you know the original DM lineup?) The audiences all vary, even though the "alternative sound" is a constant, NO/JD/Revenge are like old rock and roll...here to stay. The Cure set out to be dark and Goth, DM appealed to the teenie boopers (sorry) and clubbers (great dance tunes).

There is a far far more obvious reason why the very mention of the name Depeche Mode creates such snorts of derision from a lot of purists here - and that is simply because of their early dodgy frilly-shirt lightweight synthypop past. In Britain, that is the sole reason a lot of people have never taken them seriously (inverted snobbery if you like) and then - in these same people's eyes - to start even comparing them with New Order (or indeed the Cure) is basically adding insult to injury.

Okay - so Depeche WERE shite for their first few singles and albums, but at least they started to develop and change their sound, becoming a much stronger band. Some people find it hard to forgive and forget - hence this seemingly petty grudge they harbour against them.

Anyway - who here is going to be checking out Dave Gahan's first ever SOLO stint when he plays Manchester's MOVE festival this coming July at Old Trafford?

All three bands, while sharing a few commonalities, are essentially quite different. i refuse to elaborate, as it could take a while.

All three bands, while sharing a few commonalities, are essentially quite different. i refuse to elaborate, as it could take a while.

Here are the differences: The Cure make decent music, DM makes good music, and NO makes great music. nuff said

Is Dave going to do an acapella show then?

Originally posted by Tristan Jayol > All three bands, while sharing a few commonalities, are essentially quite different. i refuse to elaborate, as it could take a while. > Here are the differences: The Cure make decent music, DM makes good music, and NO makes great music. nuff said

Well, for the sake of personal bias, I'd rate Depeche as mostly decent, NO as largely good, and The Cure as simple greatness. But those are hardly objective differences, right?

Originally posted by Chase Is Dave going to do an acapella show then?

Yes, because all solo artists tour without any accompanying musicians

I can listen to every NO album without cringing. i cannot do that with the Cure or DM. I have every Cure lp and saw them in concert. A great show. But ask me to listen to BloodFlowers again and I'd punch you. My DM collection is small because they aint my cup of tea. A few good tunes--Everything Counts and Route 66 among others--but a lot of shiate.

The real NO thief--Clan of Xymox. Listen to the Stranger. Pure Blue Monday rip off saved only because they are ESL.

Then again, Doubts Even Here is another tune stolen from Xymox or the other way around. I need to check dates.

BKP: Solo artists are usually songwriters at least. Dave didn't even write lyrics (at least up until I stopped paying attention to them). Maybe he was just really frustrated that Martin never let him have a go...

Ronny Moorings was a big fan of New Order and the fact that Xymox sound(ed) like them was at least partly intentional. And Movement predates anything they did by a few years.

Dave has not written anything for a DM album correct. But he has written this solo one.

Cheers ALEX

I think alot of the blame for the comparisons come from American fans. Back in the 80s all these groups like The Cure, NO, DM, would get lumped together because they would be played on the same college stations as one another, usually had the same fanbase, and all three became mega popular stateside at around the same time. I remember a few weeks ago I was talking music with a girl at a party and was discussing how I like bands like NO, The Cure, DM, The Smiths, U2, Echo & The Bunnymen, The Psychedelic Furs, etc. She was like "So you like 80s music." Which is a comment that pisses me off because when you think of 80s music you think of all those crappy hair metal and new wave bands. They're just victims of their time, being great bands that came out in a period full of crap. Also the fact that they all come from the same region in the world, they get lumped together even though most have very little to do with another.

The Cure: Yes. Depeche Mode: No.

Dave Gahan's single is great. Not unlike DM, in fact...

Originally posted by Chris Guevara I can listen to every NO album without cringing. i cannot do that with the Cure or DM. I have every Cure lp and saw them in concert. A great show. But ask me to listen to BloodFlowers again and I'd punch you. My DM collection is small because they aint my cup of tea. A few good tunes--Everything Counts and Route 66 among others--but a lot of shiate.The real NO thief--Clan of Xymox. Listen to the Stranger. Pure Blue Monday rip off saved only because they are ESL.

NO-copyists or not, I love the Clan. Having said that, Stranger only steals BM's drum intro... as 245667 other bands did!

Depeche Mode for me is called : Martin Gore + Vince Clarke, the rest bull sh**

Originally posted by Love Will Tear Us Apart Depeche Mode for me is called : Martin Gore + Vince Clarke, the rest bull sh**

Never heard of Alan Wilder, I take it?

Without Alan Wilder, Depeche Mode would probably still be re-writing "Ring o Ring o Roses" on cheap casio synths.

Who cares? KW1 hardly disguises its origins and if we are looking at "rip-offs", Divines Love Reaction is possibly the best version of Blue Monday in existence.

how many times must we see this here??????????

This is not a rip-off but, perhaps there are some parallels between New Order/Factory, Mode/Mute.

Yes?/No?/I'm a fookin idiot?

Actually my two favourite albums in 1980 were Closer and 17 Seconds, in 1981 they were Movement & Faith. So for me JD/NO and The Cure were certainly related. They were both part of the post-punk movement along with PIL, The Banshees, Killing Joke, Wire, Josef K, The Raincoats, etc. Later on as NO became more poppy and The Cure became a bit of a parody of themselves, it became more difficult to see the link but they certainly diverged from roughly the same area.

Also, 'Alternative' is not an American term, in 1976/77 the charts in the music papers which showed just the good punky type songs were known as the alternative charts. It was effectively the Indie charts before the term Indie was born.

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Originally posted by bLuE oRdEr > Originally posted by bLuE oRdEr> Someone's gonna mention the Pet Shop Boys too soon, just you wait and see. >

Agree also on the Americans classing them all as "alternative" thus humping the Order in with groups who are not really like em (give or take the odd track) I am not blaming Americans here.....well, ok, I am a wee bit - it's mainly down to the music journalists stateside.

Well, Actually...

...I think it's more the radio formats here. Bands that fit into the "alternative format" (NO/JD, Cure, DM) got played on "alternative stations," and nowhere else. What really sucks is that the "alternative" format has changed now, and bands that formerly fit into the alternative format (such as NO) can't get airplay, unless you count Orgy's cover of Blue Monday.

Read more, post less. Good conversation regarding this topic. NO/JD do stand alone when compared to DM & Cure. I'll admit that living here in America the 3 bands were played in the same clubs and same radio stations, but...those that cared to dig into the music still play NO tunes in their cars, at the beach etc...have you heard any mid thirties folks playing DM of late??? think not...

Originally posted by NuOrdrMan Read more, post less. Good conversation regarding this topic. NO/JD do stand alone when compared to DM & Cure. I'll admit that living here in America the 3 bands were played in the same clubs and same radio stations, but...those that cared to dig into the music still play NO tunes in their cars, at the beach etc...have you heard any mid thirties folks playing DM of late??? think not...

Sorry, but I have to totally disagree with this. What was played in clubs and on the radio was both the good stuff: JD/No, Cure, DM, PSB, Smiths, Clash, Echo & BM, etc., and the fluff: Go-Gos, Duran Duran, and ...I forget the rest of them. I don't know anybody who took the fluff seriously, but people who took the other bands seriously still like 'em- even if exciter was really snoozer. I don't know anybody who still remembers these bands who only likes NO.

The truth is, these bands have been replaced by crap, but have cult status by those who remember. I Read an interview by the guy from the Cramps the other day, he thinks music has good periods of about a year and a half, followed by LLOOONNNGG periods of crap. He thinks we're overdue for a good period. I agree. I'm not interested in being stuck in the '80s. But there's a lot of crap out there right now that makes bands like NO, Cure, and yes, DM, etc. really stand out. Their material still sounds fresh, and more creative than anything out there today.

When the Pistols first hit the States, they blew all that stagnant 70's crap out of the water. They made it possible for new music to be heard. The Ramones inspired the Pistols and the Clash, but never got any real exposure until the "outrageous" Pistols came along. Music needs another good housecleaning. Soon. Maybe starting with bypassing the corps who decide what bands get to record, and the corps who decide what bands we'll hear on the radio. Until then, I'll keep listening to my favorite bands, and checking out the new bands to see what's out there.

The Cure and Depeche Mode copied newOrder? never thought of that, but then plagiarism is the greatest form of... well, plagiarism. :D

I have read somewhere that Hooky said that even though his mother has noticed that Cure's bassist was trying to play like him. =)

Although some people usually say this is another useless discussion, I must insist there are a lot of similarities (particularly in New Order X The Cure) and in my opinion they are not mere coincidences. My favourite band is New Order, but probably one has ripped off a little from the each other.

* Blue Monday (1983) X The Walk (1983) * 586 (1981 "Video 586") X The Baby Screams (1985) * Ceremony (1981) X Cut Here (2001) * In a Lonely Place (1981) X Closedown (1989) * Murder (1984) X The Hanging Garden (1982)

You could add many other tracks with a lot of similarities.

Some tracks with Hooky's bass guitar style: * Homesick * Inbetween Days * Just Like Heaven * Pictures Of You * To Wish Impossible Things * Just One Kiss (this one featuring some "Steve's" drums, too) * Plainsong (with added some neworderish synthesizers) .......

In some tracks they even seem to try to play guitar like Barney (How Beautiful You Are).

So, although they claim they "don't care if monday is blue" =), in my opinion The Cure was more influenced by New Order/Joy Division after all. Although I think New Order probably has been influenced, too.

Originally posted by Benny and the Cobwebs One person's rip-off is another person's tribute.....The Cure and Joy Division were treading the same boards in the early days, and have shared an audience to a certain extent ever since.I don't hear many people accusing the Bunnymen of being Velvets ripoff merchants, Nirvana of being Husker Du ripoff merchants.....

Nice post... I get SOOOOOOOO bored and sick of the expression "rip off" - ALL music shares some influence from somewhere. There is nothing new under the sun, the degree of that influence is the only difference. I agree that bands commonly here some song, think "Wow, that's really cool" and then take some of that into their own song. It happens with EVERY band. I am a drummer and when I here something in a song that is sweet, I use it - if you are a musician, the way you express your appreciation is to use something from it. It happens on purpose and by accident. Just let it go people... all 4 of these bands have been in the business for 23 - 25 years, give them the credit and respect they deserve.

Originally posted by NuOrdrMan Read more, post less. Good conversation regarding this topic. NO/JD do stand alone when compared to DM & Cure. I'll admit that living here in America the 3 bands were played in the same clubs and same radio stations, but...those that cared to dig into the music still play NO tunes in their cars, at the beach etc...have you heard any mid thirties folks playing DM of late??? think not...

Speak for yourself. Everyone please ignore the broad sweeping statement made to assume all of us think this way - I still LOVE DM, The Cure, NO, and OMD as much as I ever have. Also, my best friend from childhood still loves them all as well.

Originally posted by Wolfmann > Originally posted by Benny and the Cobwebs One person's rip-off is another person's tribute.....The Cure and Joy Division were treading the same boards in the early days, and have shared an audience to a certain extent ever since.I don't hear many people accusing the Bunnymen of being Velvets ripoff merchants, Nirvana of being Husker Du ripoff merchants.....

Nice post... I get SOOOOOOOO bored and sick of the expression "rip off" - ALL music shares some influence from somewhere. There is nothing new under the sun, the degree of that influence is the only difference. I agree that bands commonly here some song, think "Wow, that's really cool" and then take some of that into their own song. It happens with EVERY band. I am a drummer and when I here something in a song that is sweet, I use it - if you are a musician, the way you express your appreciation is to use something from it. It happens on purpose and by accident. Just let it go people... all 4 of these bands have been in the business for 23 - 25 years, give them the credit and respect they deserve.

Absolutely!

Originally posted by Røbertão I have read somewhere that Hooky said that even though his mother has noticed that Cure's bassist was trying to play like him. =)

Yeah but Hooky is generally a twat, so you're point is invalid, really.