England V Macedonia

Deserves its own thread really.

Never seen so much shit in my life.

Bear in mind, this was Macedonia, who are the only team to be beaten by Andorra in a competetive international. And they totally outplayed us.

Again, there was no organisation at set pieces, either when we were attacking or defending.

We gave the ball away cheaply far too many times.

Jermaine Defoe yet again proved to be completely useless when he came on.

Gerrard, who was supposed to play on the right, spent most of the time trying to clear up the mess that McClaren Jr, sorry Stewart Downing was making on the left.

We were exposed defensively on numerous occasions, this being a team of journeymen.

Bascially, it was the biggest crunk of shit i have seen in a good while. it was of course, sadly predictable, as anyone who watched the previous Macedonia game and the 2nd half against Greece would have noticed.

McClaren is clearly out of his depth, and doesnt have a clue what to do. As demonstrated by the events of the last week, it is clear the players dont respect him, after a mere three games in charge. And with performances like this, how long before the idiot press turns on him. What he needs to do is stop going on all these silly PR courses and actually spend time working out what is best for the England national team.

We will most likely get beat on Wednesday and will struggle to qualify from what is easily the easiest qualifying group.

And remember, Scotland can beat France at home. Northern Ireland can beat Spain at home. So why, with much better players, do England somehow fail to beat Macedonia at home?

Uncle Liam wrote: Deserves its own thread really.

Never seen so much shit in my life.

Bear in mind, this was Macedonia, who are the only team to be beaten by Andorra in a competetive international. And they totally outplayed us.

Again, there was no organisation at set pieces, either when we were attacking or defending.

We gave the ball away cheaply far too many times.

Jermaine Defoe yet again proved to be completely useless when he came on.

Gerrard, who was supposed to play on the right, spent most of the time trying to clear up the mess that McClaren Jr, sorry Stewart Downing was making on the left.

We were exposed defensively on numerous occasions, this being a team of journeymen.

Bascially, it was the biggest crunk of shit i have seen in a good while. it was of course, sadly predictable, as anyone who watched the previous Macedonia game and the 2nd half against Greece would have noticed.

McClaren is clearly out of his depth, and doesnt have a clue what to do. As demonstrated by the events of the last week, it is clear the players dont respect him, after a mere three games in charge. And with performances like this, how long before the idiot press turns on him. What he needs to do is stop going on all these silly PR courses and actually spend time working out what is best for the England national team.

We will most likely get beat on Wednesday and will struggle to qualify from what is easily the easiest qualifying group.

And remember, Scotland can beat France at home. Northern Ireland can beat Spain at home. So why, with much better players, do England somehow fail to beat Macedonia at home?

Your just annoyed because The mighty hatters tanked your lot today

If Macedonia had been more clinical they could of won comfortably.

Only Crouch, Cole and maybe Gerrard played decently, everyone else were pretty poor. Lampard, Downing, Carrick, King were all wastes of space.

As for Mclaren, how come he didn't try to change things when we were clearly playing shit? SWP brightened things up a bit when he came on, but why bring on Defoe-he's SHIT!

Uncle Liam wrote: Your just annoyed because The mighty hatters tanked your lot today

Just smashed!

But, England, always really shit, don't you think? Same old story, whatever manager, although I hear what you are saying, mostly.

Only plus point was having time to do the crossword...

Snorri xxx

The thing is though, despite what the likes of Ian Wright will tell, we're not always really shit.

Under Sven, we didnt win a total of FIVE qualifiers. In what was pretty much 3 qualifying campaigns, thats pretty good going. Apart from the first four minutes today, we never even looked like winning. Frankly, we were lucky to draw.

Like i said, its a good thing we've got a relatively easy group. And why have we got an easy group? Very simple, our qualification record under Sven. Back in the dark days under Keegan, Hoddle, Taylor etc, it was touch and go if we'd qualify. Now we just expect to qualify for major tournaments! Listen to what Hansen said before kick off today.

The days of facing a play off against Scotland (which we lost the 2nd leg!) are gone. Or the day when we need a team to slip up away at Poland and we need to score x goals are gone, because we're seeded and now get easier groups.

But Sven, he was foreign, so therefore bad. But the man who spent millions at Middlesborough and finished 15th his last season there, can do better. PASSION~! So they say. Look, he's shouting and pointing lots.

Uncle Liam wrote:

But Sven, he was foreign, so therefore bad. But the man who spent millions at Middlesborough and finished 15th his last season there, can do better. PASSION~! So they say. Look, he's shouting and pointing lots.

Sven was shit-the fact is he had players like Rooney, Gerrard, Owen, Terry etc to save his arse (well, most of the time). When it came down to the crunch, he was tactically lacking.

It'll be exactly the same for Mclaren, except that when he's bombed out of the job El Tel might take over! Rock and fuckin roll!!!

Exactly the same for McClaren? Clearly you didnt see the match day programme from the Greece game, and I quote Steve McClaren from the front cover:

It's going to be completely different!

And it will be different. We will struggle to qualify for major tournaments. If, and its a big if, we qualify, we'll get bombed out in the first round because we'll come up against genuniely good teams. Remember, in the Euros, you cant get by by defeating crap teams in the first round. Every team is at least well organised and has some threat up front. And, you are guaranteed to be put in a group with at least one team of genuine quality who has a realistic chance of winning the tournament.

So is Big Ron your solution for all this, then, Liam?

Snorri xxx

Papa Bendi wrote: If Macedonia had been more clinical they could of won comfortably.

Only Crouch, Cole and maybe Gerrard played decently, everyone else were pretty poor. Lampard, Downing, Carrick, King were all wastes of space.

As for Mclaren, how come he didn't try to change things when we were clearly playing shit? SWP brightened things up a bit when he came on, but why bring on Defoe-he's SHIT!

Cole played decently? He was shit! Only Ledley King had a decent game. Wright-Phillips looked sharper than many people expected, but apart from that they were total dross from start to finish. Union man Gary Neville should hand his match fee back after that performance, and Gerrard suffered badly from the "Tim's put money on him to score the first goal" syndrome. Downing's no more an international standard player than I am.

Hmm...

Dont think we are giving enough credit to Macedonia.

Weren't they two nil up at half time in that game in Southampton four years ago?

Also I believe they were one nil up at half time in the return fixture in Skopje then too; when it has been alleged they conspired to play badly in the second half, according to one or two shady Macedonians.

And besides.. We had an off day; something anyone who's watched England for the last twenty years will be entirely used to.

As for Maclaren, he's still not conceded a goal yet, and I'm delighted he's still refusing to consider Beckham getting back in the team. I still think the Sven/Beckham alliance a major factor for our dismal negative WC performances. At least the team is looking a lot less static now, excepting today's display, but this maybe more down to the Venables effect than we will ever know.

With Gerrard suspended for the Croatia game and Hargreaves and Lennon crocked, should McClaren call up Beckham?

Still think McClaren made a big mistake dropping Beckham and don't think he's man enough to change his mind before it's too late!

Never watched the game today decided to watch Scotland v France at least their coaches pick the best players available for the squads.

duroc wrote: With Gerrard suspended for the Croatia game and Hargreaves and Lennon crocked, should McClaren call up Beckham?

Still think McClaren made a big mistake dropping Beckham and don't think he's man enough to change his mind before it's too late!

Never watched the game today decided to watch Scotland v France at least their coaches pick the best players available for the squads.

Nope DB is not in the queue. He may be proven, because he was an automatic choice some way beyond his sell-by date. But thats the main point; he's doesnt do a lot apart from dead ball kicks. Real are even keeping him out.

I think its time to properly blood a new midfielder such as Scott Parker, and use Wright-Phillips (who looked great today in his brief appearance) and continue with Michael Carrick.

Maclaren needs to stay firm, and not pick him unless he shows outstanding form for his club. Bit difficult when you cant get a game.

Parker, maybe, but your man Wright Phillips can't get a game, for his club, either. Would he last a full 90 mins? Still leaves a dilema as to who to replace him with if he doesn't last.

not a good display by the England and deserved feck all out of it.. fair result..

I went to the match yesterday - not worth the £42 it cost me. Neville missed an easy chance, Lampard should have scored. The only bright thing was SWP coming on. Thats all I can be bothered to say really

Burt Reynolds wrote: Hmm...

Dont think we are giving enough credit to Macedonia.

Weren't they two nil up at half time in that game in Southampton four years ago?

Also I believe they were one nil up at half time in the return fixture in Skopje then too; when it has been alleged they conspired to play badly in the second half, according to one or two shady Macedonians.

And besides.. We had an off day; something anyone who's watched England for the last twenty years will be entirely used to.

As for Maclaren, he's still not conceded a goal yet, and I'm delighted he's still refusing to consider Beckham getting back in the team. I still think the Sven/Beckham alliance a major factor for our dismal negative WC performances. At least the team is looking a lot less static now, excepting today's display, but this maybe more down to the Venables effect than we will ever know.

Credit to Macedonia? They LOST to Andorra.

We've now had an off day in the last 3 and a half games under McClaren. Quite frankly, its not good enough. And you know what, its not in the least bit surprising.

in all fairness though England are still undfeated under Mclaren and have they conceded a goal? i'm not too sure but i don't think they have.

If you stop and think about it,England have not improved for ten years or so.We have'nt loked like winning anything closely resembling silverware.

If you stop and think about it,England have not improved for ten years or so.We have'nt looked like winning anything closely resembling silverware.

Sorry but as the song goes...."If Downing plays for England so can I, if Downing plays for England so can I....."

Look lost without Hargreaves and you wouldn't have said that a year ago. Well done to the Jockstraps though

And for Eire, Steve Staunton

Why don´t you try with this team ???

Peter Shilton, Paul Parker, Stuart Pearce, Des Walker, Mark Wright, Steve McMahon. Platt, Paul Gascoigne, John Barnes. Gary Lineker, Steve Bull.

fuck England

how bad is Dirk Kuyts injury?

Michael Carrick- what they said:

'Supposed to be playing the holding role in midfield in the absence of the injured Owen Hargreaves. But he failed to give any protection to his defence and hardly made a tackle all match. England cannot afford him to be so off the pace again in Zagreb' - The Sun.

'Without him it is hard to fathom what Michael Carrick brings. He is, without question, a graceful footballer but he does not seem to be an international-class tackler or an organiser and, along with his Ecuador cameo, this is now the second high-profile match in which he has failed to make an impression' - The Independent.

'Even Michael Carrick, preferred to Scott Parker for the holding role normally occupied by Owen Hargreaves for his ability to deliver the killer balls, succumbed to this epidemic of an inability to make a simple pass' - The Sunday Telegraph.

'None is thoroughly convincing and nor is the idea of persevering with Michael Carrick in the holding role...What we were not sure about in only his second competitive start was his ability to impose himself, particularly under pressure. He started well enough but as the size of the challenge grew, he shrunk' - The Times.

'We're stuck in a cul de sac having accused Owen Hargreaves of being Sven-Goran Eriksson's love-child in May so we've got to keep up the pretence that Michael Carrick is football's equivalent of the second coming and that he actually produces something of note even though he can't even tackle. So, before asking Ian Wright whether Shaun Wright-Phillips should be in the England team, we are going to fawn over Carrick, including a clip at half-time showing him with not one but both arms in the air, apparently asking for the ball, and just hope that none of our viewers will spot that he is actually hiding behind a Macedonia player' - Yours helpfully, the BBC Punditry Team.

hope we lose on Wed.

Venables???

thank fuck Stevies out.

If Ledley King gets dropped, its a disgrace.

I dont hope we lose. I just hope McClaren gets sacked.

Of course, I dont expect us to win.

Uncle Liam wrote: I dont hope we lose. I just hope McClaren gets sacked.

Of course, I dont expect us to win.

The Croats haven't lost a proper home game for 12 years.

Stuart Downing is useless. He can't get past anyone. He's weak. No muscle. He's not quite in the Nicky "Worst Winger in the World" Summerbee mould yet, but he's getting there. An embarassment to the Lions.

Man Yoo fans will soon find out, if they don't know it already, that Carrick just isn't good enough.

But football being the funny old game that it is, we'll probably scrape a win.

i wasn`t suprised,the formation is shite,mcclaren is a wanker,and as usual the papers did a great job of bigging them up for a fall. rooney is about to explode? yeah right!