I'm new

Hello, I'm a new member just thought I would say hello, I love new order and get pissed off because none of my mates have any musical taste! it was my older brother who got me into them

Welcome to the asylum, Dan - nice to meet you. I was influenced by my brother to get into NO/JD too (at the princely age of 8, no less) and it does stick with you. At any rate, make yourself at home here CTB

To keep this family thing going, it was my older cousin who force fed me New Order as a 6 year old youngster !!

Welcome!

One good thing about NO fans is we dont give a toss what anyone else thinks about 'em!!

Widely acknowleged as one of the most important bands of the late 20'th century yet to this day never really embracing 'mainstream' success like so many other bands have done.

Hope you enjoy yer stay! 'keep the faith' (Barney - Star Test,C4)

Welcome! On the family thing, can't say I was influenced by any relative of mine... but I influenced two of my cousins and lots of friends, ex-girlfriends, you name it!

Goldfish?

Cats?

Humpty, regarding cats jumpin'. I reckon they can jump like long jumpers. They do whilst hunting. They may not jump at 45 degree angles but forwards is in their reportoire.

I've given this some thought.

In order for a cat to maintain balance it must retain steadiness of the eye. Imagine if an earthquake where to hurtle down your street as you were sat nestled on the toilet. As you rise to counter the shaking crapper you ultimately loose balance and on some films would drop down the fresh crevasse given way by the earth splitting through adjustments of various plates and that.

If a cat were to leaps at an angle (we'll keep the long jumper as an analogy as a good example is yet to be found) its eyes could not cope with the rapid adjustment, (reasons can be obtained in various tombs) - it's not that a cat could not perform the adjustment and thus the leap of faith (i.e. it's capacity as an active and able quadruped), but that the cat has evolved not needing this facility ... it's genes decided a long time ago that it did not require this function in order to survive. Based, I assume, on its attack and defence mechanisms.

A cat can leap directly upwards and never sideways ... this is not a discussion, it is a matter of fact.

I know it's difficult to take and I know these revelations will shock some people (helpline currently being developed for counselling) but it is the case. When I first read this I had to re-examine my entire life ... to the extent I threw at least 3 pairs of old underpants away as if they meant nothing to me.

On the same theme, a humming birds eyes are permanently adjusting themselves and scientific theory has it that if the bird was to experience an earthquake (if it was wandering around the lawn searching for scraps of bread and buttered scones i.e. on the ground) it would not be aware that an earthquake was taking place because it's eyes adjust so quickly it is able to re-position itself to tiny movements in the ground (or large movements) ... in other words, it is oblivious to the shakes that are, literally, over him or her.

I can only suggest to deal with it.

So when cats leap forward as in jumping onto for instance a small vole, they actually don't? Or do my eyes re-adjust themselves to make it look like they did? Perhaps they revolve inwards to draw on my memory bank of watching Tom and Jerry cartoons.

I'll give this some more thought whilst I get over the shock of falling down a crevasse without checking my crevice for residual traces, with my trousers still around my ankles.

As I understand it the proposition is that cats can't leap at an angle; that wouldn't bar them from leaping straight ahead.

Just to clarify ... a cat can leap forward toward a small mammal or amphibious craft, but it cannot leap up and forward - like, for instance, how a long jumper would jump en route to a golden medallion.

Example: Fence is situated at the back of a garden. Cat won't leap diagonally up to the fence 'even if the path for its flight is clear', it will walk or run up to the base of the fence then leap upwards at an angle 'almost' ninety degrees. Even if the cat is pursued by a wolfhound or dog.

I will be releasing another amazing fact later today but for now I have to rest.

Originally posted by Patrick As I understand it the proposition is that cats can't leap at an angle; that wouldn't bar them from leaping straight ahead.

Now we are getting somewhere.

Hustler, how many episodes of 'You've Been Framed' did you sit through to figure this out?

Do they have 'You've Been Framed' Statesdide?

It was a book Hank ... its basic premise was to thwart superstition with scientific fact.

Sometimes I watch 'You've Been Flummoxed' but rarely by choice. It stinks.

Originally posted by Huntsman > Originally posted by Patrick> As I understand it the proposition is that cats can't leap at an angle; that wouldn't bar them from leaping straight ahead.>

Now we are getting somewhere.

Note the semi-colon.

I would be keen to hear any of your thoughts on the cat leap situation in the future Hanko. If you have any doubts study the creature. It is an amazing fact.

Feel free to use it in future conversation.

Originally posted by Patrick > Originally posted by Huntsman> > > > Originally posted by Patrick> > As I understand it the proposition is that cats can't leap at an angle; that wouldn't bar them from leaping straight ahead.> > >

Now we are getting somewhere.

Note the semi-colon.

Yes, and also the 'leap/bar' metaphor.

Excellent work.

Tell me, is the semi-colon a separation between the question and the answer followed by the full stop (period) - with the colon being used as a suffix for a list, followed by a full stop?

I mean ... I like them both but I rarely dare to use the semi-colon; it's too tricky to understand.

There must be a small degree of upward elevation in the angle of take off though. If only just to avoid a jump that turned into a multiple forward roll scenario.

What would happen, if as an experiment you put a cat on as island surround by a three foot moat with a three foot wall encircling the moat; Besides it meowing a lot?*

I think I gleaned from these here** pages cats only meow at humans. So for arguments sake, it's a desert island.

*edited in attempt to introduce a semi colon. ** hear became here.

Originally posted by Huntsman > Originally posted by Patrick> > > > Originally posted by Huntsman> > > > > > > Originally posted by Patrick> > > As I understand it the proposition is that cats can't leap at an angle; that wouldn't bar them from leaping straight ahead.> > > > > >

Now we are getting somewhere.

Note the semi-colon.

Yes, and also the 'leap/bar' metaphor.

Excellent work.

Tell me, is the semi-colon a separation between the question and the answer followed by the full stop (period) - with the colon being used as a suffix for a list, followed by a full stop?

I mean ... I like them both but I rarely dare to use the semi-colon; it's too tricky to understand.

Your definition of the proper use for a colon I believe to be correct.

The semi-colon is much more intuitive; it's sort of I know it when I see it. When a period feels too strong.

You might say that what comes after explains what comes before; it's not as tricky as you claim.

A classic example of a 'hijacked' thread....!

bring out the on topic police ;)

An excellent poseur Hank.

I'm going to use a monkey as an example for this dilemma.

If you visit a park which has monkeys or baboons roaming free like chickens in a coop, you will notice one very very interesting thing ... the marsupials are surrounded by water - and not restrictive gates. Now you'd think the monkeys would gather pace and leap to relative freedom but no, the monkey is so scared of water (again down to evolution and gene patterns) it will not, ever, go anywhere near the water and risk a soaking - to them, a soaking equates to death.

The cat, on the other hand, can swim ... so again would not need to leap.

Originally posted by Patrick You might say that what comes after explains what comes before; it's not as tricky as you claim.

Mmmm ... now I did mention an answer to a question.

I think I've grasped it.

Originally posted by Inta-Don A classic example of a 'hijacked' thread....!bring out the on topic police ;)

Don - everything is relative.

Originally posted by Huntsman An excellent poseur Hank.I'm going to use a monkey as an example for this dilemma.If you visit a park which has monkeys or baboons roaming free like chickens in a coop, you will notice one very very interesting thing ... the marsupials are surrounded by water - and not restrictive gates. Now you'd think the monkeys would gather pace and leap to relative freedom but no, the monkey is so scared of water (again down to evolution and gene patterns) it will not, ever, go anywhere near the water and risk a soaking - to them, a soaking equates to death.The cat, on the other hand, can swim ... so again would not need to leap.

Monkeys can jump at 45 degrees though right? If it helps we could revert back to cats and imagine he was going on a date and despite having the ability to swim, didnt want to get his coat wet.

Originally posted by Huntsman An excellent poseur Hank.I'm going to use a monkey as an example for this dilemma.If you visit a park which has monkeys or baboons roaming free like chickens in a coop, you will notice one very very interesting thing ... the marsupials are surrounded by water - and not restrictive gates. Now you'd think the monkeys would gather pace and leap to relative freedom but no, the monkey is so scared of water (again down to evolution and gene patterns) it will not, ever, go anywhere near the water and risk a soaking - to them, a soaking equates to death.The cat, on the other hand, can swim ... so again would not need to leap.

But can a cat leap from a swimming position, so as to get over that three foot wall?

Notwithstanding the fact that the posts have drifted considerably from Dan introducing himself, I'd like to take a chance to point a few things out here from my point of view as a scientist:

1. Cats can probably jump at any angle they wish, they are just arrogant animals which choose not to demonstrate this. I suggest that Felines are generally considered key predators, and as such rarely have use for 'defence'. How many docos have you seen of Lions leaping on the back of a hapless Wildebeeste? Is this not at roughly 45' from the ground?

2. There is no such thing as a "scientific fact". The word fact is avoided at all costs by scientists, as it implies that everything to be known is explainable. Science attempts to understand the world, not dictate terms.

3. Earthquakes, as a form of motion, are percieved by higher vertebrates not only by vision, but by movement. Movement and balance are percieved largely in the inner ear. Also, Hummingbirds are never found on or even near the ground. Unless, of course, they are dead. This puts the slippers into your theory somewhat, Huntsy, however it was eloquently stated.

Sorry to get all geeky on your arse, but I felt it necessary to point these out. CTB

I chose not to point out that humming birds are rarely seen on the ground as it spoilt my amateur scientific examplel.

As a full-on rumble has occurred can I know close the class as I've forgotten most of the best facts (science suggestions) in the book.

Just one last thing, cats can swim but they are conscious of damaging expensive overcoats ... the decision to trash the jacket in search of a better world would depend on the cat. More gregarious cats may chose to 'go for it', whereas milder mannered fellas might decide to stay put and eat greens.

And I cannot see a cat leaping from the sea to land at 45 degrees ... even if I have seen documentaries suggesting otherwise and starring some of the world's best lions.