60 years ago the Americans were liberating us from Nazism and Fascism, giving freedom and future to Europe and basically saving the whole world. The Marshall Plan was totally essential in the reconstruction of Europe. And now, what do we have to see? What will happen next time something really serious happens to an area involving dozens of millions of people, I mean not just Louisiana? What's happening in New Orleans shows a frightening weakness of the Western civilization. The world can't count on the protection from the USA anymore. They can't even bring some fookin bread to some poor hurricane survivors in their own country. I mean, hospitals have no water and no electricity. Do you understand? Get people outta that fookin hell now! It's a real shame, which can only be cancelled by getting rid of that cunt as soon as possible. If this was a fair world, Americans should protest on strike every day until Bush resigns. When you can't protect your own people, you have failed. He just hates poor people so much. I bet he's thinking he's just getting rid of some expenses for the welfare state. Cunt!!! (and he can push the nuke button too, bring him away!) What's really frightening is we're not seeing some Third World country here, but an American state, what happens there could happen to anyone living in America, every American should be involved and feel Bush not helping the people in New Orleans is the same as if he didn't help people in Los Angeles, Chicago or New York. You could be there in the place of those poor people. You must have some dignity and defend them and defend yourself too.
New Orleans...wtf?
Archived163 replies · 3,092 views
twist wrote: If you needed a new roof on your house and you knew that the next time it rained all your possessions would be ruined you would do what was necessary. So you go to your bank and they either turn your loan request down or do not lend you enough money to fix your roof. What do you do now. Ignore the problem and pretend it will go away or do you take ownership of the situation and seek the funds somewhere else? New Orleans and the State of Louisiana chose the first option, ignore the situation. As many dumb ass frat boys that go there every year and drunken college girls that flash their titties every Mardis Gras for Girls Gone Stupid videos I think the city could have been creative in finding a source of revenue. A band measure or an increase in the alcohol tax or a stick it to the tourists plan could have made up for the lack of federal fundage.
Even more important, what did the Governor and the Mayor have planned? Did they call GreyHound to ask for bus to help evacuate those lacking the means to leave? What about all the public school bus sitting there in 3 feet of water? Why were they not mobilized to help move people out? Was there a written disaster plan? Or was this a city such a welfare entrenched society that they could not think for themselves except to complain.
And why would Bush want to fuck this up? This could have been a political goldmine. Big brother on white horse rescuing the unfortunates of New Orleans. Politicians love this shit. Hates minorites?? He has been kissing the Hispanic vote since Day One. Has a very genetically diverse staff. He made gains in the black vote and could still, if he can bullshit his way through this, get even more. Rudi G was on his political deathbed before 9/11. Now look at him as a potential presidential contender.
This is not Florida where despite getting whacked five times in one year where people dig out and the only crime is from drunken roofers and where the damage is geographically limited to a much smaller space. This is a major US city majorly flooded and that failed to evacuate and having an obvious very low form of life (child rapers ect). Florida also has tougher building codes (planning ahead). But I guess New Orleans had different values. Prevention of a major disaster was not one of them.
I sthought money for flood defense was a federal thing, I stand corrected. So, broadly, you're saying...."they brought it on themselves and partied away their money, let em die" Well, now I know bush isn't the VERY last person I want in the whitehouse.
I just want to know what the governor of LA and mayor of NO did to prevent or alleviate this tragedy. Easy to sit back and blame Bush. But when I see all those public school buses sitting there wasted I begin to think that something more could have been done on the local level to get people out before the shit hit the fan. Obviously the looters (those taking items other than those required for survival) were going to stay. But many others could have been evacuated. the buses could have been moved to higher ground and brought back for rescues.
I am so sick of this blame others when one could do things for oneself.
The problem is not who has the ultimate responsibility. The President, when something so serious happens, has responsibility anyway and it doesn't matter other people you can blame, he is the first to blame. No president or king can see people without food, water and emergency medicines for four days and claim he's not to blame. It doesn't matter he's a Republican, I'd say the same if he was Kerry, and I don't think such a shame would have happened under Eisenhower... You can do many mistakes as a President: having a blowjob from a secretary who will then tell everything to the medias (as if we really cared), send people to war saying the enemy has weapons of mass destructions when in fact he hasn't... but you can't committ the crime of seeing your own people in your own country abandoned without basic aid for days. When Americans liberated Europe they brought food and aid for everyone just as they came... 60 years later they can't "liberate"... New Orleans! Not even Alaska or the Hawaiis... New fookin Orleans, you know what I mean? If I was Bush I'd just bury myself for the shame, whether I'm really guilty or not. My people are dying because no one helps them, it doesn't matter who should have helped them, I should have anyway, I'm the head of the nation, I deserve the fookin guillotine. That's all. Power has its price. Come on, Bush. Discover dignity. Resign. Now!
Are there any numbers of how many dead people are there? Didn't anyone assume more than 10.000? I wouldn't wonder if they (government) lie about the amount of corpses... Oh fook what a sad shit this is...
Bere wrote: Are there any numbers of how many dead people are there? Didn't anyone assume more than 10.000? I wouldn't wonder if they (government) lie about the amount of corpses... Oh fook what a sad shit this is...
we don't know the number of dead and, as after the tsunami, many of the bodies will never be found. the conservative estimate is 2,000 in new orleans at the moment, but that's a very conservative estimate. another conservative estimate is around 200 in mississippi. one red cross worker who worked in indonesia after the tsunami said that the destruction to the gulf coast was the worst she had ever seen--including the destruction after the tsunami. this is destruction to property and land, and does not reflect the destruction of human life; the tsunami victims had no warning, which is why the death toll was so high in the indian ocean region.
i don't think the government can lie abut the number dead nor do i think they will, as family members know who are dead and missing, and the numbers don't lie as they are broadcast via various media sources and word of mouth. lying about the numbers will only make things worse for the government agencies involved (from local to federal)--and it can't get any worse for them right now.
I heard rumours that they (gov) don't want help from other countries... Looks like a sign that they want to shade the full horror in front of others... But like I said that's rumours...
Bush doesn't have anything to lose. He can't be elected again either way...
Bere wrote: I heard rumours that they (gov) don't want help from other countries... Looks like a sign that they want to shade the full horror in front of others... But like I said that's rumours...
Bush doesn't have anything to lose. He can't be elected again either way...
true. at first condi rice said any help would be appreciated. now bush is saying they would consider who is sending the help and what help is needed. castro even offered to help. i'll bet bush turns down that one. what a stupid grudge!
You say you are tired of Bush getting the blame.
You are completely misunderstanding the division of labor in this country.
The U.S. Amy Corps of Engineers is the federal partner for local flood control efforts in this country. There is a federal partner because local government can't afford the cost of flood control. Just like local government can't afford the cost of building highways or mass transit or cops on the street or keeping the water clean. There are a lot of Government responsibilities that local Government needs help with because they'd have to jack up taxes to astronomical levels to provide those services without federal assistance. Some communities can afford to jack up their taxes; some can't. That's why the federal Government helps out-- so we don't end up with paved highways in Atherton, California and dirt roads in East Palo Alto, just a few miles away.
So the federal Government is a partner in local flod control efforts.
When Bush first took office, FEMA presented him with a report that outlined the 3 U.S. cities most vulnerable to a disaster. Those potential disasters were: (1) a terrorist attack in New York City; (2) A hurricane in New Orleans, and (3) an earthquake in San Francisco. We-- the world-- have all seen that Bush did absolutely nothing about a terrorist attack in NYC until after it happened. While Osama bin Laden was preparing to fly jetliners into NYC and DC, Bush was too busy vacationing at his ranch in Texas to bother responding to the urgent inelligence reports. He didn't do jack about Al Qaeda until after the fact. His response was to launch his family vendetta in Iraq-- a country that wasn't involved in the attack on NYC. Osama bin Laden is still out there, plotting his next attack.
In New Orleans, the plan-- THE PLAN you keep asking about in post after post-- has always been to make the needed repairs to the levees. That was the local plan, the state plan, and the federal plan. Bush and his Republican asshole cronies in Congress took the federal money designated for New Orleans flood control work and sent it to fund his family vendetta in Iraq instead. You ask about the plan? The plan was undermined by Bush and the Republican chickenhawks in Congress. You say it isn't fair to blame Bush, because the City and the State should have had a plan-- the City and State did have a plan, until Bush came along and took their funding every single year since his family vendetta in Iraq began.
There was still one more piece of the flood control plan intact until Bush came along-- the wetlands and barrier islands that serve as natural flood protection. Bush opened those up to development. No wetlands, no barrier islands, no natural flood protection.
And you say it isn't fair to blame Bush?
The flood control work wasn't the only part of New Orleans emergency planning. The National Guard is an integral part of that planning. Only the Louisiana National Guard-- along with their amphibious vehicles-- are in Iraq, not Louisiana. So if the State plan is to have the National Guard and their amphibious vehicles available, and Bush comes along and FUBARS that plan as well, why do you think it's unfair to blame Bush?
The City plan was to evacuate the City. They did that. The people left behind were the poor, the elderly, the sick. You think it's unfair to blame Bush-- what City resources should the Mayor have used that he didn't use? The schoolbuses? The schoolbuses that are underwater? Perhaps they should have been moved to higher ground before the hurricane. Do you have any spots in the City in mind where they could have parked all those buses? Do you have any suggestions about who would have been available to move all those buses as the hurricane was bearing down on the City?
The State's plan is to have the Naional Guard on duty. If the National Guard is in Iraq instead, what is the Governor supposed to do? Create new units post-disaster?
The City and the State had a plan-- it was flood control, the National Guard, and FEMA. Bush fucked up every single aspect of the plan, and you say it's not fair to blame Bush. So you blame the poor, the sick, and the elderly, the Mayor, who did everything he could with his resources, the Governor, who did everything she could with her resources-- anybody but the man responsible for the disaster.
The federal Government is a partner with local Government precisely because local Government doesn't have the resources to do everything that needs to be done. Local Government did everything it could with the resources it had. Bush took their funding and National Guard, and sat on his ass in Texas while the poor, the sick, and the elderly died.
And you think it's unfair to blame Bush?
bLuE oRdEr wrote: You say you are tired of Bush getting the blame.
You are completely misunderstanding the division of labor in this country.
The U.S. Amy Corps of Engineers is the federal partner for local flood control efforts in this country. There is a federal partner because local government can't afford the cost of flood control. Just like local government can't afford the cost of building highways or mass transit or cops on the street or keeping the water clean. There are a lot of Government responsibilities that local Government needs help with because they'd have to jack up taxes to astronomical levels to provide those services without federal assistance. Some communities can afford to jack up their taxes; some can't. That's why the federal Government helps out-- so we don't end up with paved highways in Atherton, California and dirt roads in East Palo Alto, just a few miles away.
So the federal Government is a partner in local flod control efforts.
When Bush first took office, FEMA presented him with a report that outlined the 3 U.S. cities most vulnerable to a disaster. Those potential disasters were: (1) a terrorist attack in New York City; (2) A hurricane in New Orleans, and (3) an earthquake in San Francisco. We-- the world-- have all seen that Bush did absolutely nothing about a terrorist attack in NYC until after it happened. While Osama bin Laden was preparing to fly jetliners into NYC and DC, Bush was too busy vacationing at his ranch in Texas to bother responding to the urgent inelligence reports. He didn't do jack about Al Qaeda until after the fact. His response was to launch his family vendetta in Iraq-- a country that wasn't involved in the attack on NYC. Osama bin Laden is still out there, plotting his next attack.
In New Orleans, the plan-- THE PLAN you keep asking about in post after post-- has always been to make the needed repairs to the levees. That was the local plan, the state plan, and the federal plan. Bush and his Republican asshole cronies in Congress took the federal money designated for New Orleans flood control work and sent it to fund his family vendetta in Iraq instead. You ask about the plan? The plan was undermined by Bush and the Republican chickenhawks in Congress. You say it isn't fair to blame Bush, because the City and the State should have had a plan-- the City and State did have a plan, until Bush came along and took their funding every single year since his family vendetta in Iraq began.
There was still one more piece of the flood control plan intact until Bush came along-- the wetlands and barrier islands that serve as natural flood protection. Bush opened those up to development. No wetlands, no barrier islands, no natural flood protection.
And you say it isn't fair to blame Bush?
The flood control work wasn't the only part of New Orleans emergency planning. The National Guard is an integral part of that planning. Only the Louisiana National Guard-- along with their amphibious vehicles-- are in Iraq, not Louisiana. So if the State plan is to have the National Guard and their amphibious vehicles available, and Bush comes along and FUBARS that plan as well, why do you think it's unfair to blame Bush?
The City plan was to evacuate the City. They did that. The people left behind were the poor, the elderly, the sick. You think it's unfair to blame Bush-- what City resources should the Mayor have used that he didn't use? The schoolbuses? The schoolbuses that are underwater? Perhaps they should have been moved to higher ground before the hurricane. Do you have any spots in the City in mind where they could have parked all those buses? Do you have any suggestions about who would have been available to move all those buses as the hurricane was bearing down on the City?
The State's plan is to have the Naional Guard on duty. If the National Guard is in Iraq instead, what is the Governor supposed to do? Create new units post-disaster?
The City and the State had a plan-- it was flood control, the National Guard, and FEMA. Bush fucked up every single aspect of the plan, and you say it's not fair to blame Bush. So you blame the poor, the sick, and the elderly, the Mayor, who did everything he could with his resources, the Governor, who did everything she could with her resources-- anybody but the man responsible for the disaster.
The federal Government is a partner with local Government precisely because local Government doesn't have the resources to do everything that needs to be done. Local Government did everything it could with the resources it had. Bush took their funding and National Guard, and sat on his ass in Texas while the poor, the sick, and the elderly died.
And you think it's unfair to blame Bush?
I neglected to mention the BIGGEST piece of City and State planning: The local partnership with the federal government through FEMA-- the Federal Emergency Planning Agency. The City and the State plan in EVERY community is to partner with FEMA for coordination of disaster relief, because the federal government has resources local communities don't have. So where was FEMA-- an agency under the control of George Bush-- in all of this? Where was FEMA-- the City and State plan for emergency relief-- when people were dying? While George Bush sat on his vacationing ass in Texas, FEMA did jack fuck-all after the hurricane-- and FEMA is under George Bush's command. Something the rght-wing blabbermouths are undoubtedly trying to discount right about now, because we wouldn't want to blame George Bush for anything that happened under his watch, now would we?
Yeah, let's blame the poor, the sick, the elderly, the Mayor-- anybody but George Bush.
Many thanks Blue Order for the excellent explanation and Steve for appreciating my post. Even if all the responsibility was on local level, when the leader of a nation is going to face such a huge disaster, should check if everything is ready and ask himself some questions and find some basic emergency solutions. For example: "Hey George, this Katrina hurricane is going to do quite some damage, but no problem, it's Louisiana which is in charge of everything... anyway, after that hurricane there will be corpses in the street, and people needing water and food. Is Louisiana ready for all those difficult tasks?" "Erm, no." "Well, I better move my own ass then. If Louisiana isn't ready we're doing something at federal level. At least send some food and someone to bury the bodies otherwise they'll rot in the streets for days. THEN we'll see how to punish the local government which hasn't prepared as it should have". But his stupid greedy little brain has never been able to think such simple things. So, now, first Bush should resign. Then, the next President will also look if the governor of Louisiana and the mayor of New Orleans have their faults. But first Bush must go. I know he won't though.
Bourbon Street bar stays open in spite of Katrina:
http://news.yahoo.com/s/afp/20050904/ts_alt_afp/usweatherbar_050904183549
Can't say I blame 'em, it's been a hell of a week to put it mildly :beer2:
well ok im a brit and maybe i dont have the right to comment on what happens in america,but what the hey ill dip my toe in (god help me). ive read the posts that mick and blue have made in both the topics on this forum and feel inclined to agree with them both,but i do feel that to lay the blame so to speak at the feet of bush no matter how much i may feel hes a knob. is a bit unfair,ok ill agree that the shifting of funds from the sea defences was short sighted but that is only with the benefit of highndsight,and wouldnt the reaction have been the same no matter whom was in the whitehouse???. as someone whom has travelled and lived all over the globe the level of poverty in the state has quite litterally shocked me,to think that many thousands of people in new orleans couldnt even afford the gas money or bus or train fare to get out of town is quite frankly alarming. and personally think that it is the failure of many administrations over the years clinton ect included,as is usually the case in the uk on such occasions of national emergency. my heart goes out to all of those affected and hope that things get better mighty fast for them,and that the politicians that took them for granted for so long both local and national finally learn something from all this. goodnight and godbless from uk.
They had helicopters in there pulling people out withing 48 hours. Boats too. Too much reliance on FEMA by the administration. Why the fuck the army did not invade immediately I do not know why. Obviously not prepared for the anarchy, violence and crime. Human nature is never predictable. This is an unprecedented disaster, no examples to follow. 9000 square miles. Never fast enough. They said the same thing about the tsumani.
But obviously all of you are Bush haters, not that I really care for him, and are too intolerant of other views and opinions. Perhaps this is why Agent Wood was going to quit.
Fare the well.
One last post for Blue concerning bikes when I find the thread.
twist wrote: They had helicopters in there pulling people out withing 48 hours. Boats too. Too much reliance on FEMA by the administration. Why the fuck the army did not invade immediately I do not know why. Obviously not prepared for the anarchy, violence and crime. Human nature is never predictable. This is an unprecedented disaster, no examples to follow. 9000 square miles. Never fast enough. They said the same thing about the tsumani.
But obviously all of you are Bush haters, not that I really care for him, and are too intolerant of other views and opinions. Perhaps this is why Agent Wood was going to quit.
Fare the well.
One last post for Blue concerning bikes when I find the thread.
FFS Twist, I for one hope you stick around.
And I do despise Bush because I despise his policies, his values, and his politics. There's nothing of human redemption in the man.
That shouldn't be a reason for anybody to leave, though.
I hope you stick around. 
The latest local twist. Ossie victims and their rlatives are angry at Australian diplomatic staff for not doing more for them ie coming and getting them. Especially when they saw Aussie media there. Yes there were some 60 plus aussies there. Not all accounted for.
It really is like looking under the big rock of bullshit that usually eminates from America. If others are going to paste rethoric, then so will I. This is much better articulated than I could usually put it:
Race, Class and Hurricane Katrina
September 4, 2005
CAPITALISM’S COLLATERAL DAMAGE: TO BE POOR, BLACK AND DYING IN NEW ORLEANS
In the wake of Hurricane Katrina, the suffering in New Orleans and along a 400-mile stretch of the Gulf Coast has shown the world the searing realities of race and class in the United States. The life-and-death divide along skin color and wealth is being discussed on the front pages, on news broadcasts, and in local responses to the tragedy. An additional truth, so familiar it goes unrecognized, is the fact that the U.S. poor are overwhelmingly women of color, their kids, elders, and people with disabilities. These are the people who felt the brunt of the storm, the poisonous flood waters, and the unfeeling disdain of the Bush administration. Far from being an isolated calamity, the disaster in New Orleans and the Gulf Coast is the direct result of capitalism’s pursuit of the almighty dollar at the expense of those judged disposable by virtue of their race, gender and earning ability.
Hard times in the Big Easy The overwhelming majority of those unable to escape New Orleans before Katrina hit were poor and Black. The city is one of the most impoverished in the U.S.: nearly a third of the population lives in want. The city is wracked by corruption, with police brutality, low-paying jobs, unemployment, rampant racism, failing schools, and high levels of violence against women. More than two-thirds of New Orleans’ inhabitants were African American, many of them descendents of the slaves who built the city. In the Lower Ninth Ward, a neighborhood that was one of the hardest hit, more than 98% were Black.
After the storm subsided, TV cameras showed wrenching images of thousands in New Orleans trapped on rooftops, searching for food and water amidst the devastation, or starving and thirsty in putrid “shelters.” News watchers were horrified by the images of the dead lying for days in the streets or floating in the waters submerging the city. The number of those who died in Katrina’s aftermath is still unknown, but presumed to be in the thousands.
Despite the outrages, the frustration, injuries, illness and mounting, justifiable anger, the survivors showed a tremendous amount of compassion and solidarity. Reports of heroism and selflessness have filtered out. A TV news story told of several mothers who put their 17 children in a rowboat and asked a man to row them to safety, while they stayed behind in the rising waters. A Canadian reporter countered the stories of chaos in the streets with the testimony, “What I see are young people taking care of old people, the relatively healthy caring for the sick, people sharing their paltry supplies. It’s true there’s crime and violence, but tempers are terribly frayed, and feelings of hopelessness overwhelming.” (Toronto Star)
Too little help, too late Officials’ lack of concern for the people in harm’s way was shown as the storm approached when Louisiana governor Kathleen Blanco told residents to “pray the hurricane down” to a Category 2, while refusing to mobilize transport for those who had no way to leave the city.
President Bush and federal agencies responded callously, sluggishly, and inadequately. Rapper Kanye West spoke the feelings of many African Americans when he said on national television that the U.S. is set up “to help the poor, the Black people, the less well-off as slow as possible.” He added: “George Bush doesn’t care about Black people.”
Bush additionally insulted the survivors with his pronouncements about getting tough with looters. The media whipped up hysteria about “armed thugs” creating lawless mayhem. When people of color fought for the food and supplies they needed to survive, police were ordered to stop looking for survivors in order to guard Wal-Marts.
Numerous killings by police are receiving little media attention. But unsubstantiated and inflammatory stories about wholesale violence and rapes are getting international play. White supremacists are having a heyday decrying rape and assault against whites by Black “brutes.”
Though food, water and transportation trickled in, the oil industry took care of itself fast. Over 10 major refineries were knocked out of commission in the Gulf region, but many of them were back operating within the week. Bush released federal oil reserves, but oil companies took the opportunity to jack up gas prices to a criminal level. Unabashed speculation was the name of the game across the nation, but especially in the worst hit areas where gas topped $5.00 a gallon. Bush also moved quickly to loosen environmental safeguards to allow more pollution by gasoline producers. All this while the four largest oil companies— ExxonMobil, ChevronTexaco, RoyalDutch/Shell Group and BP Group PLC—had profits of nearly $100 billion in the last 18 months.
Capitalism kills While politicians wring their hands over the “natural disaster,” they ignore the fact that its lethal impact was a result of their own policies. This avoidable tragedy points out the deadly priorities of the capitalist system, which puts profits above human life.
The political establishment had plenty of warning that New Orleans, below sea level and virtually surrounded by water, was vulnerable to catastrophic flooding. Planners knew that massive evacuation of residents would be required someday. Many reports and scientific papers laid out the precise Katrina scenario. They warned that unbridled development along the coast had done away with millions of acres of wetlands that buffered coastal communities from storms. Scientists have shown that the increased intensity of hurricanes is associated with global warming and rising surface sea temperatures in the Gulf of Mexico. In other words, unchecked U.S. emissions are creating stronger hurricanes. But to address this means tackling politicians’ corporate sponsors.
For decades, the federal government – under both Republicans and Democrats -- has consciously refused to adequately maintain or strengthen the levees that protect New Orleans. Hurricane and flood control has received the steepest federal funding reductions in New Orleans history— down 44.2% since 2001. As Walter Maestri, emergency management chief for Jefferson Parish, Louisiana, told The Times-Picayune in June 2004: “It appears that the money has been moved in the President’s budget to handle homeland security and the war in Iraq, and I suppose that is the price we pay.” Requests for an additional $250 million for Army Corps of Engineers levee work in the delta went unmet. The message was clear: why fix levees or relocate housing for poor and workingclass people when the inevitable catastrophe is likely to happen on someone else’s watch? And when there is a killing to be made in expanding U.S. oil interests in Iraq?
As the storm waters swept across the Gulf states, more than a third of the Mississippi and Louisiana National Guard were fighting in Iraq. Their equipment, including generators, water purification systems and other needed life support and disaster preparedness supplies were overseas as well. Precious hours and days were lost as the bureaucratic machinery leadenly moved equipment from other parts of the country.
Nothing more clearly shows the fact that this is a capitalist-made tragedy than the real-life example of how the workers’ state of Cuba handled a similar situation. Barely a month before Katrina, on July 14, 2005, Cuba was swept by Hurricane Dennis, like Katrina, a Category 4 hurricane. Though impoverished by the U.S. embargo and lacking the vast resources the U.S. has at its disposal, the Cuban government was able to limit the death toll to 16, by smoothly relocating over 1.5 million citizens. Surely the richest nation on earth has the technical ability to do the same. But ability and will are two different things.
A socialist relief plan Hurricane Katrina displaced over 500,000 people in the Gulf Coast region. Now the government is faced with the mammoth job of reuniting these refugees with their loved ones, and finding them clothes, food, medical treatment, homes, jobs, schools and more. George Bush will utter pronouncements about refugees pulling themselves up by sheer determination and religious faith. Halliburton and other corporations are sidling up to the feeding trough for lucrative contracts that will maintain the South’s non-union, racist, sexist labor norms.
Public pressure is needed to prevent this despicable scenario. Demands should include:
l. Insure immediate housing, food, medical care and childcare for all who need it through government facilities and supplies. Turn the Washington, DC national mall, Bush’s ranch in Crawford, Texas, military bases, and Camp David into emergency shelters.
Institute a massive public works program and start building housing immediately. Hire the displaced at union wages, and provide relocation allowances and training.
Restitution for poor and working people who lost homes, personal property and jobs.
Cancel credit card debts for everyone affected, and void all debts on destroyed automobiles.
Put a national price cap on gasoline, diesel, heating oil and natural gas, at a rate that slashes corporate profits by at least 75%.
Bring the National Guard and all troops home from Iraq and Afghanistan now. Divert money from war to social programs. President Bush asks for donations to help hurricane victims, while spending public tax money for war—let’s reverse this equation.
This crisis should bring the downfall of George Bush and the entire Republican and Democrat supported capitalist system. It’s time to get serious about saving lives by eliminating the exploitative, discrimination- driven profit system and replacing it with a planned, cooperative economy run by the workers for the benefit of all regardless of race, gender, physical ability, sexual orientation, or age.
Freedom Socialist Party Statement on the Hurricane Katrina Tragedy
A perfect example of why the left will never govern in America. They make a bold statement of mostly valid critiques, but shoot themselves in the foot in the end.
First, what is the point of denying that people-- women and children-- were being raped and mugged? I haven't heard any reports of racially-motivated crimes in the aftermath of Katrina, but what is the point of denying that in America, being the wrong color in the wrong neighborhood at the wrong time can mean trouble? They veered from critique to ideology here, and they lose whatever credibility they gained by pushing an ideology that flies in the face of reality.
Second, following a powerful critique of the so-called relief effort, they laid out a mostly nonsensical 6-point plan. The first point-- refugee camps on the mall, at Bush's ranch, and at Camp David-- is absolutely not going to happen. It's just rhetorical posturing, so they are left with absolutely no realistic plan about what to do with several hundred thousand refugees. The second point-- hiring the displaced to rebuild at union wages-- assumes that (1) the displaced are unemployed, (2) the displaced have the needed construction skills, and (3) that there is a shortage of construction workers. The third and fourth points-- restitution and the cancellation of debt-- are more posturing. Who's going to restore their property and wages and cancel their debts? The Government? Private companies? Every American will be asking the same thing I'd ask-- "What about my debts?" What is the Freedom Socialist Party plan-- who's going to do what, for how long, and at what cost? The Fifth point is more rhetorical posturing. What are they proposing-- a national price cap, or a cap on profits? What happens when the price of a barrel of oil exceeds the price of the gasoline refined from that barrel? Or, what happens if the oil companies decide they can make more money investing their cash than they can in producing gasoline? Is cheap gasoline even a good idea, given the global warming implications? The sixth point-- bringing the troops home-- would free funding for domestic spending. So would stopping the tax cut welfare program for the wealthiest Americans. But it's not going to happen unless they have the support of the public. Posturing, posturing, posturing.
The American left can produce nonsensical non-programs like this because they have the freedom that comes with having absolutely no responsibility. They have no responsibility because they are not in elective office, and have no chance of winning elective office. That makes them undisciplined. In Europe, where the left actually wins elections on occasion, the left could never afford to be so undisciplined as to alienate the electorate with this nonsense. In America, the left plays at revolution, and assiduously avoids the responsibility of governing.
Took me a long time to work out what was up with the US left. Could never figure why liberal was a dirty word to right wingers.And was never sure why you kept electing crazy religious whackos... But I've seen a few things lately that scared me, all i can says is....I know why most of y'all can't be arsed voting, I feel the same way here.....I refuse to waste the ink to endorse a single one of the wankers on offer (here than means various species of nazi and the local sewing circle).
TBH, this aint one for point scoring. Headscractching and futureproofing would be a beter pursuit.
Steve Campbell wrote: Took me a long time to work out what was up with the US left. Could never figure why liberal was a dirty word to right wingers.And was never sure why you kept electing crazy religious whackos... But I've seen a few things lately that scared me, all i can says is....I know why most of y'all can't be arsed voting, I feel the same way here.....I refuse to waste the ink to endorse a single one of the wankers on offer (here than means various species of nazi and the local sewing circle).
TBH, this aint one for point scoring. Headscractching and futureproofing would be a beter pursuit.
blue, your response was eloquent and pragmatic. i'd like to add one other thing:
regarding point 1: washington, DC is one of america's poorest cities; tourism is a vital source of revenue for the city. turning the mall, the centerpiece of washington DC, into an emergency shelter would send the city into even greater debt and add to the already crushing poverty facing the city. it's not worth harming the poor of DC in order to make a political statement.
Americans always get punched in the face before they learn their lesson. War of 1812 (why is the truth about this war not taught in public or Christian schools), uncontrolled stock markets (Depression), Pearl Harbor (ignoring obvious military threats), Viet Nam (still working on this one), 9/11 (Muslim fanatics hate the threats of Western decadent democracies) and now New Orleans vulnerability to hurricanes. Of the latter we now know that if your city is surrounded by a lake, a large river and an ocean and if your city sits below sea level your city and state officials better have a feasible plan to save lives in case the shit hits the fan. The Federal government better be able to get the calvary there ASAP. Sending people to an unprepared sporting arena and waiting for FEMA is not a plan. FEMA's plan obviously was not enough nor fast enough in this situation. Relying on a system of levees, dikes and pumps designed for lessor hurricanes is not a good plan either. Having every Administration including Carter take funds away from these levees is bad planning.
This event is unprecedented in US history, perhaps in modern world history. Something like 9000 square miles whacked hard and the most densely populated area underwater makes rescue and recovery that much harder. Trucks drive faster on dry roads.
Never fast enough. Remember Andrew? It took over three days to get the supplies "trickling" in to Homestead Florida after Andrew. A full week before those supplies were being handed out to a large degree, and even longer than that to provide shelter for everyone affected. Oh, and most of Homestead was populated by whitey (for you black racists and white apologists). And Andrew was considered the biggest natural disaster to date with over 250,000 people homeless, without food, water and electricity.
WHat should the US do? Probably need a full division of US Army to be able to respond and get into disaster zones within 24 hours after winds stop. I bet NO has set a new precedent for urban crime. (GTA NO out next year) Raise the standard. This probably requires that the US finish the mess it created in Iraq. Either kill all the insurrgents or pull out and let the Shiites kill all the Sunnis. Pulling out of Viet Nam did not destroy the US. I'd prefer that the US would not leave Iraq in chaos but it's time to face reality both camps really hate each other.
Second. Every city needs to know how they are going to evacuate their people and where these people will go in case something like this occurs. This also means get the hospitals cleared out. The sick and infirm should not be left to die. 400 buses are sitting under water right now. They could have been used. I saw a dispatch yard full of big trucks now swimming. Look at how many cars and SUVs are drowing downtown. And please have some clue as where these people are going to go.
Every city needs to have at least a four day supply of food, water and medicine to help their people hold out until the calvary arrives. FEMA is quite clear when they tell States and cities that it may take some time for them to get there in force.
Other federal and state officials pointed to Louisiana's failure to measure up to national disaster response standards, noting that the federal plan advises state and local emergency managers not to expect federal aid for 72 to 96 hours, and base their own preparedness efforts on the need to be self-sufficient for at least that period. "Fundamentally the first breakdown occurred at the local level," said one state official who works with FEMA. "Did the city have the situational awareness of what was going on within its borders? The answer was no."
Rebuild the levees to withstand the worst case storm. This one was built for the average storm, not the once in 200 year storm. Do it right once and for all. Restore the wet lands. Let Mother Nature help protect.
Finally the US must rebuild New Orleans. Too much history. So many people call this home. The American Spirit requires it. Dresden, Berlin, Tokyo, Volgagrad, Leningrad, Hamburg, Chicago, San Francisco, Seattle...all rebuilt. As for businesses and employment if the US can bail out the greedhead bastards of the airline industry I think we can help NO employers and businesses.
FEMA NO AND LA dropped the ball
Levee scued from the start and Carter, Reagan, Bush, Clinton and Shrub stole its funding
Steve Campbell wrote: Took me a long time to work out what was up with the US left. Could never figure why liberal was a dirty word to right wingers.And was never sure why you kept electing crazy religious whackos... But I've seen a few things lately that scared me, all i can says is....I know why most of y'all can't be arsed voting, I feel the same way here.....I refuse to waste the ink to endorse a single one of the wankers on offer (here than means various species of nazi and the local sewing circle).
TBH, this aint one for point scoring. Headscractching and futureproofing would be a beter pursuit.
It's of course everyone's right to abstain from voting, but when people do this en masse the extremists get in and scary things happen.
I think elections should be declared invalid and re-run if less than 75% of people vote (or maybe people should be compelled to vote).
Theres a whole brace of minority parties which are there for the minority opinion, but if everyone voted some of these smaller parties would have more influence.
I'm a pragmatic leftie... I voted Labour (Democrat) normally, but when they upset me by doing things like invading Iraq, I vote Green...
Gotta remember but, that in NI we are banned from voting for the Govt. we're only allowed to chose between our own, which as I said, is varying types of nazi and the sewing circle.
I have voted once, the only time it mattered, on the referendum on the good friday agreement (Somethig I have to be grateful to Clinton for I suppose) ,and that was only cos the shinners were getting dead people to vote no, and the other lot were sending buses to old folks homes, taking them all to vote and saying "Now that nice Mr Paisley says you'e to vote no". Figuring that it may be nice if the future were decided by someone other than the dead and dying, I voted.
I was just thinking, never mind how much harm this has or has not done shrub.....it's really buggered your reputation, I mean before we just thought you were all gung ho and a bit reckless.......now we're thinking "ineffectual and incompetent" as well. Next time you try to take some international thing over, I ca see you getting a harder time..."errrr no thaks guys, we'd like this to work"
I think elections should be declared invalid and re-run if less than 75% of people vote (or maybe people should be compelled to vote).
I believe that in the former USSR voter turn out was very high although only one Party was on the ballot. Compelled by AKM (Autovat Kalashinkov Military, the AK47 not frontline weapon for years nor the AK74).
Choosing not to vote sends a political message. But it would be nice to have someone to vote for instead of someone to vote against like the last US election. This is why Kerry lost--"vote for me because I am not him."
